FormulasOnly

OK This one isn't about my Firebird... I have another project car.... it is stripped down to just the body and minimal suspension. I want the inside and outside all the same color, there is nothing to remove or mask. It has minimal body work to be done. I can not find anyone who will paint it.. I'm in the market for a $5-7K paint job... I'm not going to SEMA with it... Not going to Santa Barbara Concours... Be shot down at 6 paint shops now, of all types.

Is it because theres no menial taping and trim removal they can charge for?

Am I saying the wrong thing when I walk in?

scottmoyer

A body shop has a paint booth for a reason...to paint cars. There has to be something you aren't telling us. Is the minimal body work really minimal? Are you super picky and tell them that? I can guarantee you that if I was willing to spend $5k plus for a paint job, that every body shop in the area would be interested.

I've had only one shop ever tell me that they won't work for me, because I'm very picky and, I want it done to perfection and they didn't want to be held to that level.

FormulasOnly

I'm not that picky... Thats the first thing I thought... the common denominator was me... I've got a crease in a rear quarter panel about 2ft long and some filler work on a replacement roof panel..
This is going to be a driver, its going to get road chipped, dirty, breathed on wrong all that normal driving stuff.
The car has already been media blasted and epoxy sealed... One place didn't want it because it doesn't drive, he at least gave me a reason.
I feel like I'm gonna end up painting it myself or just end up at MACCO...

scottmoyer

The only other thing I can think of is the condition of the car. If there's any previous body work or a potential substandard primer, the shop won't want to paint it for fear that the paint could flake or not adhere. Unless you're a professional body person, they don't want the liability of any previous work.

FormulasOnly

Just wish they'd say that or give me a price... I used the media blaster shop that all of the local paint shops use..

DynoDave43

iTrader: (11)

Wow, must be nice to live in that area as a car guy.

My neighbor used to paint cars in his home garage/paint shop. Mostly rods, some collision work. If only VERY minimal prep (very light filling, blocking, priming) were required, this would be a $5-$6k paint job from him 10 years ago. Have no idea what he's getting for his work today (he moved away). And he had one job after another lined up at that price. Most "professional" shops were $10k to start. And we're talking nice, not show winning paint. This was using Omni products, or at least clear.

So depending on the market, yes, a self-imposed $5-$7k cap could be an issue. For the same number of labor hours put in, they can make more money on insurance/collision work.

FormulasOnly

Yeah i kind thought the insurance work was easy and more profitable..... at $10K I'll rent booth and shoot it myself I guess... Its just yellow no metallic no anything....

ZsTransAm

My shop won't paint anything that someone else did the bodywork on. A non professional doesn't know how to do it correctly, the welds may not be strong enough, the metal could rust, the filler could crack, ect. I've seen it a few times. Bodywork done by a non-bodyman won't be up to the bodyshop's standards. If the bodywork is done poorly it will reflect badly on the shop that painted it. A non-professional might apply the product wrong and it could fail. Also if I don't know what primer is on it, it might react badly with the sealer. It could wrinkle up as soon as you spray it on, or it could fall off in a year. Plus PPG doesn't want us to spray its product over any non PPG primer so it can't be warrantied.

Also, people who aren't in the profession aren't great at gauging what 'minor bodywork' is. The guy I bought my car from told me it had a minor dent on the door. and the fender. It turned out to be waaay worse than that. If you have a 2 foot crease in the quarter you need moderate to major bodywork.

If you walked into my shop tomorrow I wouldn't be able to tell you any of this. I'd be afraid of sounding rude, of you taking it the wrong way and telling people about your bad experience. I'd bet thats why your just getting the short answer and being shooed out the door.

dmccain

iTrader: (2)

Wow 2500-4k around here with some body work.

roadthrills

You need to find the local body supply store and go ask those guys who to contact. They deal with a lot of guys that do side work in their personal garage/shop and they will know. You will also need to tell them exactly what brand/type of primer is on the car AND you need to expect there will be no warranty because of the already finished work.

86 Money Pit

I am running into a similar situation here in Kansas. I am helping a friend of mine finish a hot-rod 1954 Studebaker that was her late husband’s project car. Luckily we are getting some help from a local race car chassis shop here in town. The owner of the shop has taken us under his wing with this project. He has an impeccable reputation and has been incredibly helpful steering us to other shops in the area that do good work at reasonable prices. We are about ready to put the body back on the frame and roll this bad-boy out for paint. We are getting quotes from the few shops in the area that will even do this work of $6K to $10K. The shop we are working with hypothesis is that the dent and collision shops like the insurance work and have enough work to make ends meet, this work is quick (in & out) and the customers do not expect perfection like a car aficionado does. I don’t know this to be fact but, given his reputation I am buying into his theory until I hear a better explanation. This does scare me a bit because my 1886 IROC will need paint sometime in the future (once I get a laundry list of other projects completed on it first) and I don’t have $10K to spend on my weekend cruiser.


I like both roadthrills and dmccains suggestions, just keep looking around until you find someone that will do this for a price you are comfortable with. Good luck.

Ron U.S.M.C.

Here's at least what to expect for a $3,000.00 to $5,000.00 paint job.
I say that because I received a $5,000.00 paint job for $3,000.00.
Link = https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/body/543541-prep-paint-photos.html

Night rider327

iTrader: (13)

There are your 4 reasons.

My dad was a bodyman for years and I know from him a crease is one of the hardest things to fix and get right... Even worse if it's across a body line

Owner done filler work on a roof is bad, as the roof is a large mostly flat surface that can be seen really well and picks up the sun glare first. If the body work is not done spot on, it will show once painted.

Owner bringing in a car that's been blasted and primed. Painter does not know how well the car was cleaned or prepped during those stages, or what product is on the car.

As one guy mentioned on here... A shop will not point out these things to you for fear of being "rude" and ticking off a customer, and having customer take to facebook and the likes and telling people how X shop said this or that and was rude to me.

FormulasOnly

Pretty sure I'm gonna go your route... If it even comes out close to that I'll be ecstatic... I'm thinking being in SoCal is hurting me too.

monkey-leader

Typical. Same answer you get for using knock off parts. Mine are better because I say so.

Do it yourself. A lot of paint jobs come out looking sharp without a paint shop or "professional". Also, you might learn something about painting cars.

You can also fix a lot of paint defects with a buffer wheel and the right compounds. A lot of body shops don't like you knowing that you can fix their 1000$ paycheck for the cost of a orbital buffer and some compounds/sealers (like 300$) and some elbow grease. Also, you get to keep the buffer.

rusty vango

and people wonder why folks just give up and shoot it with rustoleum

ZsTransAm

No, my bodywork is better than a yours because I have years of training and thousands of hours of experience. Its the same reason you pay a carpenter to build your cabinets or a dentist a dentist to fill your cavities instead of doing it yourself. Thats not obvious?

FormulasOnly

I got an estimate and a drop off date for this week... Started at $6K which I was fine with... Then he changed his mind a couple days later and hit me with $10-$12K. I'm guessing something else came in. One of his employees told me on the side that it was way too high and didn't know why the owner didn't want it....

Seems like the only cars anyone wants to do bodywork and paint on, are cars that have never been touched, washed or breathed on wrong....

Back to shooting it myself....

monkey-leader

Whatever you say man. I've built cabinets too. If you want to call my work ****, go ahead. I honestly don't care what you think.

Maybe I don't know as much about paint, but you're not fooling anyone. Its not rocket science. Its paint > sand > repeat...

TLDR; You can be googled out of a job...


If you've got the time, go for it. Post some pics of how it goes...

ZsTransAm

If you're painting, then sanding, then repeating.. well.. you're doing it wrong. I'd tell you to look it up but I wouldn't want to be googled out of my job

I probably shouldn't be too worried. If my 3 paragraphs was 'too long / didn't read' then maybe internet research isn't for you.

NufNuffZ28

iTrader: (10)

Generally speaking(I have used several body guys) they don't like jobs like yours(OR MINE). They want quick and easy jobs. Doing an "insurance claim" where they replace a headlight, hood, and respray them for $2500 is a couple hour job and the profit is large. Do a couple of those in a very easy day and they are making more than your job total, that will take them many hours to get right.

I'm not saying they are right, just telling you what I've experienced first hand. I've literally loaded my car primered because the painter didn't stand by his word and I have another painter who has had a cowl hood to paint for me 3 years!

GOOD PAINTERS ARE TERRIBLY HARD TO FIND!

monkey-leader

Paraphrasing....

Did you want a how to in a sentence?

scottmoyer

I've never painted a car myself, but my neighbor paid to have his Camaro painted by a Mercedes body shop guy. The car was delivered to the Mercedes dealership and the painter painted the car after his shift. Before the car went to paint, I helped my neighbor remove the ground effects, the door handles and locks, the headlight assembly and taillight assemblies, etc. The repaint cost about $3k at the time. It came back and had excessive orange peel down the middle of the roof and hood. It was hard to see a good reflection in those areas.

My neighbor brought the car to my house, and we wetsanded the entire top surfaces, removing all of the orange peel and haze. we then compounded and buffed the car to a beautiful shine. So, having the buffer, sand paper, time and compounds, we made a crappy finish look good. I'm under the assumption that using a spray gun and doing the work yourself, you might not have a perfect finish, but with the buffer and compounds, I agree, that you can make it look fantastic.

Ron U.S.M.C.

WOW...
That's a Beautiful car.
Shines like glass.
Is that a synthetic polymer/sealant on there ?

scottmoyer

Meguiar's NXT

ZsTransAm

What I want is for you to read a post before replying to it. Glad to see you made it through my last response. I tried to keep it short and not use any big words.

Speaking of big words, you don't know what paraphrasing means

Ron U.S.M.C.

I can tell.
I use Meguiar's Ultimate Paste Wax. It says wax but its 100% synthetic polymer.


The front lower valance is not the one that was on there when it was painted. This one I use for daily driving.

FormulasOnly

I'd be ecstatic if mine came out even close to that...

rusty vango

is it not ironic , that you can build an entire car cheaper than you can get one painted ??

btbcustoms1

if you close to iowa we could do it for you. im incredibly particular, but thats necessary in this business. you just have to know what many don't realize... It takes a tremendous amount of time and sometimes money. on top of that, many guys who first mention that they arent picky or dont want a show finish, are actually deep down hoping for a show finish for a minimal price. It could be how you present yourself and the project that may be a turn off..??

rusty vango

i went to several paint shops around my area. i wanted to do all prep work. sanding , taping ect. i just wanted them to spray it . the ones that would listen to me . quoted a price of $2,600 . and that was for flat black single stage ! i cant justify such a thing ,when i have a little less than that in a new engine

FormulasOnly

This mess with paint has completely convinced me the "Built not Bought" is a joke... I'm gonna have $35k in this car, half of which will end up being paint.... For a car I could have just bought for $14K... and been driving it this whole time...

FormulasOnly

I seriously am just looking for "driver" quality. This car is not gonna be a show car or concours car... Of course I hope it'll turn out better but I'm realistic. About 7 years ago I used a coupon to get a 73 Dart painted at Earl Scheib for $375... 2 day turn around and I thought it looked fantastic... at least for the 2 years I had it.

monkey-leader

Picky, prep, time, hidden costs. Sounds like a good scam...

rusty vango

when the cost of paint outstrips your total investment . its time to re evaluate

monkey-leader

2600 for a mat painting. Unreal.

google roller paint job. Lol.

rusty vango

im going to spray mine with rustoleum , and call it a day.

Steve Mack

iTrader: (5)

If you do the prep work you can get a pretty good paint job from Macco.Go into a new car show room ,Like Chevy or ford.Look close at the paint.You will see orange peel bumps in their paint.I was shocked at the quality of some of the factory paint on new cars.I believe it's because they have to use water based paint because of the EPA regs.You want a good tough long lasting paint job?Google paint your car with boat paint.You can spray it on ,use a paint brush,or use a paint roller to apply it.It's self leveling meaning it will look like it was sprayed on by a professional.

beths91camaro

iTrader: (35)

My hubby doesn't like painting over other's body work for a couple of reasons.
1. the way it's done
2. this is big- if body work is crappy, then it shows in the paint. People never ask who did body work, and who did the paint. They see the flaws in the body work, and wrongly assume that he was also responsible for the body work, not just the paint.

He restores cars to show quality- lazer straight. This is the last one he did- before it was sanded and buffed out.

beths91camaro

iTrader: (35)

Oops- here's the car.

monkey-leader

Sounds like body shops want to do the time consuming work to up the bill. Not that that's the case for any of you. Of course not...

Steve Mack

iTrader: (5)

That is one nice paint job.And yes it does take a lot of prep work to get a really nice paint job.Not to mention the cut and buff work it takes to get a super smooth and glossy paint.I have a friend who painted his truck metallic blue.I came buy the next day to look at it.He asked me how I thought it looked.I couldn't tell him it looked like crap.But he could tell by my eyes That i thought something was wrong.He simply said come back after he was done with the cut and buff work.I was amazed it was beautiful.

monkey-leader

It's true, the finishing is huge.

ZsTransAm

If you were happy with an Earl Scheib paint job, then you should be happy with a Maaco paint job. Its not going to be perfect by any means, but from what I've heard they'll take almost anything and let you do the bodywork, disassembly, ect and should come in well under your budget. Don't know if that chain is out by you but I'd look into it.

TylerSteez

iTrader: (3)

interesting read. My dads been a body-man for his whole life, me and him did the body work on my TA together and he shot a nice epoxy primer on it. We've since moved from the old house and don't have a garage anymore which REALLY sucks. I've been thinking about bringing my car to a shop to have them shoot the color and clear coat on but after reading this it seems they'll most likely turn it down.

I'd even be willing to agree to and sign something that says they wont be liable to any issues that may arise after its finished as I could set up a tarp booth in my driveway and have my dad re-shoot a panel if something happens. I'm guessing they wouldn't touch my car with a ten foot pole?

Ron U.S.M.C.

Some Maaco paint shops can do a good job .


This my mother received for $700.00.
Totally faded and clear was pealing badly.


Not a smear , over spray or run on it.
It still look good even after 4 years now.

monkey-leader

They paint so many cars that I bet they are pretty good for the money...

ZsTransAm

Totally depends on the shop. The good shops in my area stay busy with insurance work and probably wont want to do it. Then there are a couple hole in the wall old shops that can barely keep their doors open. I'd bet a couple of them would take it as long as you fully assume liability. It also helps that a pro bodyman did the work.

Depends on the shop and the prepper / painter. They hired a couple guys I went to tech with. I remember the help wanted add said "think you can prep a car in an hour? We want to talk to YOU!" That shop closed down a year after it opened due to multiple lawsuits. I don't know for sure but I'd bet it was over paint jobs that went bad almost immediately. 90% of the work is in the prep, you can't skip over that....

That was just one shop though, each shop is run independently and some have a decent reputation. I'd try to find one thats been in the area for years and does acceptable work.

Night rider327

iTrader: (13)

If you was happy with an Earl Scheib job, and like you said it's just a nice driver. Go with macco or Earl Scheib or anybody like that and be done with it.

There is a small paint shop that runs ads in our local newspaper every other week.
Econo auto painting and body works.
Enamel deluxe, complete exterior, 1 year guarantee $219

Poly finish, 2 year guarantee $289

Poly supreme 3 year guarantee $359

Budget places are out there, you just have to look for them

scottmoyer

I don't understand the price increase over 3 years for the same paint. If you use good paint, it should be guaranteed to look good, with proper maintenance, for longer than 3 years. What that tells me is they spend more time when they need to guarantee it longer. Also, what quality do you really get for those prices?