Awsome bang for your buck.
10-26-2003, 09:42 PM
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Engine: L98 5.7
Awsome bang for your buck.
post is kinda long so if ur lazy, the combo is....
- Sony XM-D400P5 amp
- into 1 12" JBL power series sub (p1200)
- in a 4th level bandpass box, 4" port, 1" thick walls, all lined with 1" thick fibre fill xcept the subwoofer side of the box inner sealed box. (u can download the .pdf file on the subs for exact specs)
-As is, this combo is too loud, and its with only one sub.
If u wanna know why....read on.
Hi all im new here. A little about myself, im really into cars (Iroc's), and im even more into sound. I pretty much buy everything and anything i can that involves sound. Now why this matters to you? simple, i've come across and awsome combo for subs, and for really cheap.
Get this, the whole set up costed me 350$ canadian (like 10 bucks US, well more like 250 US) I picked up 2 JBL P1200 (power series, 12", 5ohms) subs for 100 bucks off the buy and sell (think classifids) and a Sony XM-D400P5 (250 bucks canadian after bargaining with the guy at futureshop)
Now at first glance you would think this system would suck, i certainly did, only reason why i bought it is for my friends, 2 of my friends just bought cars and they want subs, so i was going to buy/build/perfect the box/amp/sub combo for them, and sell it at a small profit. (This is what i do with my friends, im sort of the know a bit about anything kinda guy who's good with tools. Im a Go-To guy)
But let me tell you why i would even consider this. I was reading the October issue of Performance Auto and sound www.pasmag.com Volume5 issue4. Any they benchmarked the Sony's new P5. Normally i wouldnt even consider sony but i had no expiriance with the new p5 series (im more a JL guy) but after the mag gave such a promising review i had to buy it and test it for myself. Apparently, its WAY under rated (400watts rms@ 2ohms 800max) but that's at 12V, someone messed up, most cars run well over 12V (when turned on), most are 14.4 or higher (i run 15.5 into my amp, the manual says is safe upto 16V) at 14.4V the amp is _550_ watts @2ohms RMS! (1100WATTS PEAK!) , You'll never find an amp that powerful RMS for this cheap. (sure, 1% THD, but in SUBS, its almost impossible to tell the diff between 1% and .1%, mid and high range speakers sure but subs, forget it. It gets worse, these jbl subs are 5ohms, which means im not even running even close to what the amp is capable of. I currently have 1 in bandpass (discribed above) and it sounds like i have a trunk full off subs. The stupid part is if i run the second sub in parrallel (sony has even gone as far as even having a second set of connectors right on the amp that is ALREADY in parrallel, wonderful feature) then ill be running at 2.5 ohms, AKA, double the SUBS and the Power, im not even at 1/4 of what this little diamond in the rough is capable of. I cant even have the gain turned up all the way cause my passengers complain about all the bass! and its not a bad bass, its nice a clear, crisp and strong. It just Dwarfs all my other speakers. (that and i pulled all by 2 speakers for my IROC, so in my honda CRV , people sitting in the back only hear throbbing.
Oh, and by the way, these subs, 5ohms, 280watts RMS, 25hz-2khz. These numbers wont impress you, but these speakers were made in 98', before all the sound companies were competing for the highest WATT ratings (higher Max WATT doesnt mean better, just means more inefficient, ive seen dozens of 250 Watt subs pound on 800 watt subs as if they didnt even run an amp. Lately all these companies just want to boast higher numbers then their competitors so sway the laymen looking for a good value system. WATT ratings are almost meaningless now. (some not all). But i promise you, these subs POUND more then their fair share of weight and do it clearly. (not to mention cheaply)
As for the amp, im simply in shock, i would have NEVER, EVER, EVER thought sony would do something as decent as this. Sony is really turning a new leaf with this P5 series things, plus, they look cool, intigrate EASILY into ANY system (both RCA inputs AND high-level imputs, AKA, plug u stock speakers wires in the amp strait from the deck (as if the amp was a stock speaker) and it brings it down to a managable level then amplifies it into the subs. And ofcoarse 2 sets of sub connecters (running in parrellel internally) so u can easily set up two subs without having to do makeshift wiring, nice professional style install made easy)
Personally my system will consist of JL3004 and JL10001 Amps, and 2 10" SWR1041D Alpine subs (maybe not, dont like em too much, might go with a W7) 2 infinity reference 6X9...and more, but after this discovery i might have to reconsider my system....but dont get my wrong, the sony/jbl setup will never match the JL setup but its plenty enough for me after this trial. Maybe ill save my money for a later date and keep the subs and amp for now...
JBL p1200 12" subs.
Pro's = above average sub, cheap, plenty of power
con's = pretty ugly (black spraypaint baby), high resisitance (aka, need more of em to get every last ounce outta ur amp....which is kinda a good thing....) and not produced anymore.
Sony XM-D400P5
pro's = dope look,simple design, awsome bang for buck,intigrates with ANY system stock or otherwise, pretty clear, Huge power, WAY WAY under-rated (well its correctly rated if ur car is turned off and ur running soley from the battery, and if u respect your car, u wont do this, poor alternater....poor battery).....so take advantage of it. Oh, and they dont move very fast off the store shevles so go to ur local commission earning sales rep and bargain the price down!
Con's = not many features (only bass boast, filter frequency and input level sensitivity, but its all u need really anything else is really just smoke up the wrong end of a goat), bad sony rep (but this might change a few minds), some might like its look, (i do, anything that isnt ordinary is cool by me)
oh, one last thing, even more importaint then your subs or amp is the box you put it in, i spend over 100 dollars on ever box i build (candian dollars) but there is a reason that i can make crap sound good, because i read up on the equipment and i make boxes to exactly what the manifacture recommends for THAT EXACT DEVICE, EVERY speaker/sub needs different thickness, shape, port size, insulation thickness (most people dont even USE INSULATION!!!!) crossover settings, power settings and most of all location in the car, (that sony/jbl system sounded like dog waste untill i found the exact sweet spot in the car, then u get out some 8 inch long concrete screws, pre-drill, and make sure that sucker doesnt move so much as an inch come hell or high water....(j/k 3/4" will do just fine)
if ur too lazy to research (Admit it, u are) follow these rules, no wall should be a multiple of another wall (a box thats 10 X 20 X 12 is bad, a box thats 15 x 15 x 15 is bad, a box thats 16 x 13x 10 is great) low power 10" subs and below, 1/2" mdf may be just fine, 3/4" tis better tho, High power 10" subs or 12" and larger subs should be 1"thick MDF MINIMUM. Always use insulation of one form or another (1inch fiberfill or fiberglass on all walls but the sub wall, or lously pack fiberfill/glass filling the box, (check with OEM to be sure whats right for u). ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS know how many CuFt u need in the box, every sub is diff, so again, look it up, these jbl's like 1.5cuft each. If u have a port, make sure the the outter width of the port (4.5" on a 4" port) is the minimum distance away from any interior walls. MAKE SURE u know recommended guage and dont consider anything else (i dont care if the guy at the circit city said he'll throw in the 10 guage install kit for free, if your amp wants 4 guage then 4 guage it will have no matter how good the deal (well take the free kit and sell it). Always connect Amps strait to the battery (dont splice wires, the stock fuse probably wont support the amp anyway and if u replace the fuse with a bigger one u risk a fire) wire the amp strait to the battery with an inline fuse as close to the battery as possible (the sony p5 uses 2 X 30amp (60amp total) fuse on the amp, but it wants a 4 guage wire hooked up strait to the battery with an inline 80Amp fuse. i couldnt find one, so i wired a 4 x 20AMP (total 80amp) fuse in parrellel in a small quad-fuse, fuse box. From canadian tire (about 3 bucks to make). And remember heat kills ur cars engine....and it also kills ur cars amps, so make sure to have plent of ventillation for ur system.
please excuse all the spelling mistakes and slang such as "u" and "ur", i havent slept in 2 days. im trying to get into a NORMAL cycle...any questions, send a privet message, or send an email, but i get way too much junkmail so i miss real email occationally, but i will reply every email if i actually recive it so dont be afraid to send it twice javascript:smilie('
')
later all, ps, CAMAROS ROCK!
- Sony XM-D400P5 amp
- into 1 12" JBL power series sub (p1200)
- in a 4th level bandpass box, 4" port, 1" thick walls, all lined with 1" thick fibre fill xcept the subwoofer side of the box inner sealed box. (u can download the .pdf file on the subs for exact specs)
-As is, this combo is too loud, and its with only one sub.
If u wanna know why....read on.
Hi all im new here. A little about myself, im really into cars (Iroc's), and im even more into sound. I pretty much buy everything and anything i can that involves sound. Now why this matters to you? simple, i've come across and awsome combo for subs, and for really cheap.
Get this, the whole set up costed me 350$ canadian (like 10 bucks US, well more like 250 US) I picked up 2 JBL P1200 (power series, 12", 5ohms) subs for 100 bucks off the buy and sell (think classifids) and a Sony XM-D400P5 (250 bucks canadian after bargaining with the guy at futureshop)
Now at first glance you would think this system would suck, i certainly did, only reason why i bought it is for my friends, 2 of my friends just bought cars and they want subs, so i was going to buy/build/perfect the box/amp/sub combo for them, and sell it at a small profit. (This is what i do with my friends, im sort of the know a bit about anything kinda guy who's good with tools. Im a Go-To guy)
But let me tell you why i would even consider this. I was reading the October issue of Performance Auto and sound www.pasmag.com Volume5 issue4. Any they benchmarked the Sony's new P5. Normally i wouldnt even consider sony but i had no expiriance with the new p5 series (im more a JL guy) but after the mag gave such a promising review i had to buy it and test it for myself. Apparently, its WAY under rated (400watts rms@ 2ohms 800max) but that's at 12V, someone messed up, most cars run well over 12V (when turned on), most are 14.4 or higher (i run 15.5 into my amp, the manual says is safe upto 16V) at 14.4V the amp is _550_ watts @2ohms RMS! (1100WATTS PEAK!) , You'll never find an amp that powerful RMS for this cheap. (sure, 1% THD, but in SUBS, its almost impossible to tell the diff between 1% and .1%, mid and high range speakers sure but subs, forget it. It gets worse, these jbl subs are 5ohms, which means im not even running even close to what the amp is capable of. I currently have 1 in bandpass (discribed above) and it sounds like i have a trunk full off subs. The stupid part is if i run the second sub in parrallel (sony has even gone as far as even having a second set of connectors right on the amp that is ALREADY in parrallel, wonderful feature) then ill be running at 2.5 ohms, AKA, double the SUBS and the Power, im not even at 1/4 of what this little diamond in the rough is capable of. I cant even have the gain turned up all the way cause my passengers complain about all the bass! and its not a bad bass, its nice a clear, crisp and strong. It just Dwarfs all my other speakers. (that and i pulled all by 2 speakers for my IROC, so in my honda CRV , people sitting in the back only hear throbbing.
Oh, and by the way, these subs, 5ohms, 280watts RMS, 25hz-2khz. These numbers wont impress you, but these speakers were made in 98', before all the sound companies were competing for the highest WATT ratings (higher Max WATT doesnt mean better, just means more inefficient, ive seen dozens of 250 Watt subs pound on 800 watt subs as if they didnt even run an amp. Lately all these companies just want to boast higher numbers then their competitors so sway the laymen looking for a good value system. WATT ratings are almost meaningless now. (some not all). But i promise you, these subs POUND more then their fair share of weight and do it clearly. (not to mention cheaply)
As for the amp, im simply in shock, i would have NEVER, EVER, EVER thought sony would do something as decent as this. Sony is really turning a new leaf with this P5 series things, plus, they look cool, intigrate EASILY into ANY system (both RCA inputs AND high-level imputs, AKA, plug u stock speakers wires in the amp strait from the deck (as if the amp was a stock speaker) and it brings it down to a managable level then amplifies it into the subs. And ofcoarse 2 sets of sub connecters (running in parrellel internally) so u can easily set up two subs without having to do makeshift wiring, nice professional style install made easy)
Personally my system will consist of JL3004 and JL10001 Amps, and 2 10" SWR1041D Alpine subs (maybe not, dont like em too much, might go with a W7) 2 infinity reference 6X9...and more, but after this discovery i might have to reconsider my system....but dont get my wrong, the sony/jbl setup will never match the JL setup but its plenty enough for me after this trial. Maybe ill save my money for a later date and keep the subs and amp for now...
JBL p1200 12" subs.
Pro's = above average sub, cheap, plenty of power
con's = pretty ugly (black spraypaint baby), high resisitance (aka, need more of em to get every last ounce outta ur amp....which is kinda a good thing....) and not produced anymore.
Sony XM-D400P5
pro's = dope look,simple design, awsome bang for buck,intigrates with ANY system stock or otherwise, pretty clear, Huge power, WAY WAY under-rated (well its correctly rated if ur car is turned off and ur running soley from the battery, and if u respect your car, u wont do this, poor alternater....poor battery).....so take advantage of it. Oh, and they dont move very fast off the store shevles so go to ur local commission earning sales rep and bargain the price down!
Con's = not many features (only bass boast, filter frequency and input level sensitivity, but its all u need really anything else is really just smoke up the wrong end of a goat), bad sony rep (but this might change a few minds), some might like its look, (i do, anything that isnt ordinary is cool by me)
oh, one last thing, even more importaint then your subs or amp is the box you put it in, i spend over 100 dollars on ever box i build (candian dollars) but there is a reason that i can make crap sound good, because i read up on the equipment and i make boxes to exactly what the manifacture recommends for THAT EXACT DEVICE, EVERY speaker/sub needs different thickness, shape, port size, insulation thickness (most people dont even USE INSULATION!!!!) crossover settings, power settings and most of all location in the car, (that sony/jbl system sounded like dog waste untill i found the exact sweet spot in the car, then u get out some 8 inch long concrete screws, pre-drill, and make sure that sucker doesnt move so much as an inch come hell or high water....(j/k 3/4" will do just fine)
if ur too lazy to research (Admit it, u are) follow these rules, no wall should be a multiple of another wall (a box thats 10 X 20 X 12 is bad, a box thats 15 x 15 x 15 is bad, a box thats 16 x 13x 10 is great) low power 10" subs and below, 1/2" mdf may be just fine, 3/4" tis better tho, High power 10" subs or 12" and larger subs should be 1"thick MDF MINIMUM. Always use insulation of one form or another (1inch fiberfill or fiberglass on all walls but the sub wall, or lously pack fiberfill/glass filling the box, (check with OEM to be sure whats right for u). ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS know how many CuFt u need in the box, every sub is diff, so again, look it up, these jbl's like 1.5cuft each. If u have a port, make sure the the outter width of the port (4.5" on a 4" port) is the minimum distance away from any interior walls. MAKE SURE u know recommended guage and dont consider anything else (i dont care if the guy at the circit city said he'll throw in the 10 guage install kit for free, if your amp wants 4 guage then 4 guage it will have no matter how good the deal (well take the free kit and sell it). Always connect Amps strait to the battery (dont splice wires, the stock fuse probably wont support the amp anyway and if u replace the fuse with a bigger one u risk a fire) wire the amp strait to the battery with an inline fuse as close to the battery as possible (the sony p5 uses 2 X 30amp (60amp total) fuse on the amp, but it wants a 4 guage wire hooked up strait to the battery with an inline 80Amp fuse. i couldnt find one, so i wired a 4 x 20AMP (total 80amp) fuse in parrellel in a small quad-fuse, fuse box. From canadian tire (about 3 bucks to make). And remember heat kills ur cars engine....and it also kills ur cars amps, so make sure to have plent of ventillation for ur system.
please excuse all the spelling mistakes and slang such as "u" and "ur", i havent slept in 2 days. im trying to get into a NORMAL cycle...any questions, send a privet message, or send an email, but i get way too much junkmail so i miss real email occationally, but i will reply every email if i actually recive it so dont be afraid to send it twice javascript:smilie('
')later all, ps, CAMAROS ROCK!
10-26-2003, 09:57 PM
#2
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Car: 1986 camaro
Engine: 383 sbc
Transmission: th-400
Axle/Gears: 4th Gen 10 bolt/Detroit TrueTrac 4.
well get ready to hear a lot of this...SONY's SUCK DUDE...but i am glad that YOU like your system. i got lucky myself. i found a pair of new type r 12" for 80 bucks at a yard sale, the dude worked for alpine. the only thing i really splurged for the the headunit which was 325 bucks.
10-26-2003, 10:09 PM
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Engine: L98 5.7
if u read my post, u'de know the system wasnt for me and
dude, i totally agree with you on the sony sucks this, that why i was so shocked, for the past 2 years ive been using only Infinity, alpine, kenwood and JL (amps) for everything, they make awsome stuff and it serves sony, but for the price, u wont find anything better.
most systems i build are near comp level, for example, my head unit, is Aplines CDA9815, thats like 630 buck retail, my head unit before that was sony's 5dI (thats over a grand, and dont worry, theres no amp or anything, its just a faceplate with a cd drive in it and digital out , i have a PPI decoder/reciver that does all the sound filtering and decoding, then the signal goes to my JL5001 (IMHO one of the best amps of all time, at about 850 a pop)
trust me in not new to the sound game, thats why i was impressed by the P5
dude, i totally agree with you on the sony sucks this, that why i was so shocked, for the past 2 years ive been using only Infinity, alpine, kenwood and JL (amps) for everything, they make awsome stuff and it serves sony, but for the price, u wont find anything better.
most systems i build are near comp level, for example, my head unit, is Aplines CDA9815, thats like 630 buck retail, my head unit before that was sony's 5dI (thats over a grand, and dont worry, theres no amp or anything, its just a faceplate with a cd drive in it and digital out , i have a PPI decoder/reciver that does all the sound filtering and decoding, then the signal goes to my JL5001 (IMHO one of the best amps of all time, at about 850 a pop)
trust me in not new to the sound game, thats why i was impressed by the P5
Last edited by Verviticas; 10-26-2003 at 10:18 PM.
10-27-2003, 05:29 PM
#5
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Join Date: Sep 2001
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Car: 1986 camaro
Engine: 383 sbc
Transmission: th-400
Axle/Gears: 4th Gen 10 bolt/Detroit TrueTrac 4.
yup, at first i was like i cant spend all the money i just made right now but then i was like damn...wrap 'em up!
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