MonteCarSlow

Thanks to Craig, there is now a supply of the 4kb nvsram expansion modules for the P4 ecms. You can use this module as extra ram for custom code, or you can use it as an emulator for the $8D AUJP or AXXC code masks.

Craig has been super about offering a DIY kit at the same cost of the first version:
NVSRAM Module Kit

If you'd rather buy it assembled:
NVSRAM Module Assembly

In time, I think Mangus will be able to add support to TunerPro R/T for my $8D realtime "emulator". If anyone cares to use this module as an emulator, there is available now the tools to do it at the side of the road (kinda like 'flashing' a PCM but being able to it with the engine running...)


Historical threads on this subject matter:
https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/diy-...ion-board.html
https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/diy-...ack-based.html
https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/diy-...emory-via.html

dkedrowitsch

I just ordered one of these kits (unassembled) and can't wait to give it a try. I've been sitting on the fence between this and the Ostridge but I like the idea of "updating" through the ALDL...less cables.

I currently use AUJP. It's an automatic 4x4 pickup with a stock L98 and 19lb Bosch/Ford injectors and decent exhaust so the majority of the tuning was in timing (stock L98 was too aggressive for a 4400 lbs truck). A Trickflow headed 355 is in the works so I have my work cut out for me later. Still need to pick a mild 4x4 suited cam...I may stick with stock L98 cam or just move up to an LT1 cam I already have.

Anyway, since I use AUJP I just wanted to make sure the modified AUJP bin in the posted file "beta_aujp_for_4kb_nvsram_board.zip" is the one to use or is there an updated one floating around I haven't found yet?

I have to admit I'm surprised this doesn't get more attention than it does. It deserves a lot! Does anyone know if there is TunerPro RT support planned for this little gem or will we have to stick with the cute little GUI program? I know you said Mangus would be able to support it but couldn't find anything stating he was planning on it.

Great job MonteCarSlow and thanks to Craig Moates for distributing it.

I'll be sure to post a success story once I get the kit and assemble it.

MonteCarSlow

To be sure you have a bin that works, use this one.

I mailed Mangus a module to play with. Maybe one day we'll see support in TunerPro R/T for it....

dkedrowitsch

Monte: Thanks for the new file. What's the difference between this one and the beta?

Just to make sure I understand this, any calibration changes I "flash" to the NVSRAM with your utility will stay there unless for some reason I change the EEPROM, correct? Then once I reach a drivability/performance milestone I should fire up the burner to update the EEPROM?

MonteCarSlow

There shouldn't be any...

Any changes you 'flash' to the nvsram will stay even if you change the eeprom. The eeprom will only over write the nvram if it finds a bad checksum in the nvram during boot up. This is strictly a fail safe mechanism.

Yes, you should update your eeprom once you've reached a specific milestone. You don't have to mind you... but it would be wise to have a known good baseline be populated into nvram should it get clobbered somehow.

dkedrowitsch

Awesome. You rock.

Mangus

Received, thanks! As soon as work resumes on TunerPro I'll look into getting this working.

junkcltr

iTrader: (1)

MonteCarSlow,
I noticed that the NVSRAM module is not on the GM emulator page on that website. The NVSRAM module description does say that it is an emulator so it doesn't make sense. I guess the $45 emulator looks out of place with the $325 emulator.

Can the NVSRAM module still be bought directly from you?

Thanks,
Junk

Mangus

I assure you that's not the issue, so let's not get ahead of ourselves. Keep in mind that Craig is building and distributing these for Monte as a favor. I'll mention to Craig that the item should be moved.

junkcltr

iTrader: (1)

OK. It is true the NVSRAM module will not cover as many ECMs as some of the emulators out there so I kind of understand. It is still an emulator though.

Craig Moates

Fixed. It's on the Emulator section now. Sorry, hadn't considered the omission.

ty1295

I have one on order myself, but in order to emulate you need some custom code work which I think is only done so far for 1 ecm, am I correct?

junkcltr

iTrader: (1)

The NVSRAM module is a good thing. I am sure you will be happy with it. The coding possibilites are endless using it. MonteCarSlow did an excellent job designing it. It is great to see that Craig is getting it out to the end users. I think it will cover more BCC masks in time.

dkedrowitsch

ty1295:

It is my understanding that this module is for the 730/749 and variants. At this point the BCCs supported for emulation are AUJP and AXXD (automatic and 5-speed V8).

Craig Moates

Yes, the more the better. MonteCarSlow has a good thing here. Very good work. Be glad to support it however I can.

dkedrowitsch

I received my NVSRAM module kit from Moates yesterday morning. It only took about 30 minutes to assemble. I used one of Craig's low profile ZIF sockets soldered directly to the PCB and the ECM lid clears perfectly.

The only real clearance issue I had was with what looks like a metal oxide varistor (surge protector) inside the ECM. Once installed, the MEMCAL rests on it but it doesn't appear to be under any significant pressure when the ECM is assembled so I'm not worried about it. The ECM I installed it in is some no-name reman unit I pulled from a junked Corsica, so it may just be the way the ECM was "remanufactured" that makes the varistor stick up so high from the PCB. I plan to move the NVSRAM module into my Delphi Reman unit sometime later this week so maybe it’ll fit a little better in there.

A quick burn of Monte's hacked AUJP with my truck's calibration and it started right up and worked perfectly on the first try. The little GUI utility looks like it works good. For a quick test I downloaded the .bin from the running truck, edited the P/N RPM ADDED TO IDLE value to add 300 RPM (I normally keep it at 0), and uploaded it while the truck was running. About halfway through the upload, the RPM jumped up 300 RPM just like I expected!

The during the upload there was a quick stumble and check engine light came on, but I'm not sure if that's normal or not and the truck did continue to run. I removed the added 300 RPM and reuploaded the .bin and the idle came back down, just like it should. The SES light remained on until I shut the truck off and started it back up. No SES, ran great.

All in all I'm VERY happy! Highly recommended!

dkedrowitsch

More pictures

dkedrowitsch

Lid clearance...perfect.

MonteCarSlow

Yeah, I have various models of the P4 and noticed that too. Doesn't hurt anything...

Not normal to get an SES light during uploading, but I'll admit to ocassionally stalling the TPI-LG4 in my wife's T/A during an upload. If you do it again, can you check which malfunction code was set? Perhaps it was due to the 300 rpm jump you put it...

MonteCarSlow

dkedrowitsch: Since you choose not to install the eprom socket with it's built in 0.1uF capacitor, there is now no decoupling capacitance for the eprom/nvram. I highly recommend you install a 0.1uF cap on the bottom side of your nvram socket between pin 1 and 32.

dkedrowitsch

Monte: In regards to the the decoupling cap on the EPROM socket, I myself was wondering about that. The socket included with the kit didn't have one built in like the two TTL sockets. The NVSRAM socket doesn't have one either. I figured you or Craig felt it wasn't nessessary so I didn't worry about it. I'll be sure to add one when I move the module over to my Delphi ECM.

Also, I just looked at this morning's Datamaster log to see if the code was still set from last night's test. It was Malf 42: EST Monitor Error.

I'll do another upload test this afternoon on my lunch break with some small changes to timing or fan speeds to see if it causes another malf to set.

EDIT: Now that I think about it I'm not 100% sure the EPROM socket didn't have a cap. I'll double check tonight.

dkedrowitsch

I just wanted to follow up with the results of my second test.

I made some changes to (hopefully) disable my CCP since it's not currently hooked up. For the test using the little GUI tool while the truck was idling I downloaded the current bin, modified the CCP settings in TunerPRO, and uploaded the new bin. The truck didn't skip a beat and no SES or codes thrown.

To verify the changes were applied and running, I re-downloaded the current bin and compared it to the modified bin I uploaded and they are identical.

So my NVRAM module works 100% as expected!

dkedrowitsch

I got home and double checked the EPROM socket and it did not have the built-in cap.

I added a .1uf capacitor to the underside of the module as you suggested.

ashman5

just a note...my nvsram kit did not contain the cap on the eprom socket either. i will add one.

drb930

My kit did not come with the capacitor either.
What does the disconnect do?
I asked Craig at Moates about that capacitor and he said it was not needed?

Thanks,
Dave

Six_Shooter

iTrader: (2)

Well since this thread was brought to the top...

I have searched for this but can't find any difinitive information.

To downlod and up load the bin, What equipment (hardware) is used to connect the lappy to the ALDL port? Just the standard ALDL cable, such as the Moates ALDL Extreme, 2 trans, serial MAX232 based cables? I would assume this to be the case since there is no mention of any specific cable or cable modifications needed.

From what I read there is no "real time" tuning available with this, like I have with my Ostrich 2.0.

It sounds like I would need to go through several steps to make a change (single or mutliple at the same upload), that would include opening and closing programs to interface with the ECM and to make the changes to the bin.

This sounds only marginally better than the old chip burning only technique, well marginally is a bit harsh, it is better than that in that it would definatly be much quicker to make those changes and upload the bin without the need to shut the vehicle down, but the changes still require several steps from what I undertsand.

Is there no way for TP RT (or other program) to incorporate the GUI, to have the com port work for both datalogging AND emulation at the same time? From what I've read it seems to be that the com port can only be used by one program at a time, and that to change the (same) com port from one program to the next is by shutting down that program, or would possibly going in to and changing the preferences of each program that assigns the com port do the same thing? I know, more steps than closing and opening again, but just a thought/question to understand how this works more clearly.

Don't take this as a bash on this product, it's VERY intriguing, ESPECIALLY for the price. I would like to consider using this in one of my vehicles, with code 59. I haven't looked into what source code changes are needed exactly, and would even begin to profess to understand exactly what is being changed, but I'm trying to learn.
I'm going to look into this part a bit more before I even begin to ask specific questions about it.

If on the fly real time emulation could be implimented and it's just your average everyday serial ALDL cable that is needed to make the bin swaps, I could use this to go completly wireless with my vehicle tuning with the use of a Cable Blaster, that uses incrypted wi-fi communication from serial devices.

JP86SS

iTrader: (1)

You are correct in that the RT4 tools are the only way to upload the "changed" bin.
It is not "real time" emulating but enables you to swap bins while the engine is running.
Make edit, save bin.
Open GUI and upload.
Reopen logger and begin logging.

Its better when you have several (already modified) bins you want to try out.
Easy to change them out without shutting off the car to swap chips.
I have my laptop setup so all the applications use the same comm port (the one connected to the ALDL).
You can only have one program open at a time because any software wants exclusive control of the port to perform its fuction.

drb930

First thanks for all the help here.

I am just learning to use the NVSRAM, but love the idea of it and the
product.

If it can be worked out to get the data log working while the NVRSRAM is installed i think that it would be perfect. I dont have a problem loading bin files, not a big deal considering that the computer does not need to be taken out.

The product is supposed to support data log, but there seems to be a glitch for some of us.

Thanks,
Dave

Six_Shooter

iTrader: (2)

That's what I had come up with and glad that I have understood it correctly.

So am I also correct in that the "hardware" needed (besides the NVSRAM) is a common ALDL cable to use with this to upload and download the bin file?

drb930

Is there anymore of these available?
They are not on the Moates.net site anymore.

Is there something better out there now for these computers?

daferris

iTrader: (8)

i am using RBob's DynamicEFI.com P4 system and very happy with it...

Tuned Performance

iTrader: (92)

Theses on on eBay

http://m.ebay.com/itm/1227730-ECM-Moates-NVSRAM-Kit-Assembled-/132008868261?hash=item1ebc5779a5%3Ag%3Abb0AAOSw4GVYMUQZ&_trkparms=pageci%253Af0c677f0-c6ce-11e6-bbe8-005056b68985%257Cparentrq%253A1d0056ed1590a2a737bdc4a1ffd37492%257Ciid%253A1

Vanilla Ice

Is there a parts list to DIY one of these? I saw one but the parts mentioned are either wrong numbers or obsolete.

I'd be able to build one if I had a parts list.
SOMEBODY needs to keep these going every once in a while.

Tuned Performance

iTrader: (92)

Moates use to have a diy kit iirc it was $45 with the parts.
http://m.ebay.com/itm/1PCS-NEW-BQ4013YMA-85-BQ4013YMA-85E-Manu-TI-Encapsulation-DIP32-IC-/282241590949?hash=item41b6e8e6a5%3Ag%3AMagAAOSwMVdYGWaQ&_trkparms=pageci%253A7b4c0a95-c6da-11e6-b370-74dbd1800198%257Cparentrq%253A1d4bf9ad1590a2a203364035ffd6f7f1%257Ciid%253A6
http://www.mouser.com/Search/m_Produ...omppCy9Q%3d%3d
http://www.mouser.com/Search/m_Produ...TMypNfUg%3d%3d

http://www.mouser.com/Search/m_Produ...xNj4BeMw%3d%3d
2) 102k ceramic caps not necessarily needed

Vanilla Ice

There's six components and you linked three... But one is obsolete.

Tuned Performance

iTrader: (92)

You mean dip p/n ?
I'd look at Aries dips and teka use to make double row headers. The header need to add up to 66 pin.
I linked a benchmarq 85ns nvssram the ti is obsolete.
http://www.arieselec.com/products/da...let-socket.htm
http://www.tekais.com

Tko 35254 534 maybe a special order header idk.

drb930

Can anyone out there burn a prom for me to get this car going again till I figure out what I am going to do for running this 7730 computer?

JP86SS

iTrader: (1)

If you are using this board the chip is not needed to hold any program.
Its only used for a reset loading if there is a major fault.
Upload your bin to the device and change VATS.
Good to go.
Burn your chip when you get a good tune.
Mine has never actually been reset since using the board unless I did the reset from the software.
Jp

JP86SS

iTrader: (1)

I misstated the operation here.
A program is needed and the CAL section gets changed as needed on the fly.
Any previously loaded chip will be a starting point, needs to have the comm routines of the main program there to enable data on the ALDL port.

I did see some notes that when the power is low to the NVSRAM chip, writing may become locked. could be why your having trouble using it after the battery is dead.
Since I like using mine, As time permits I'm looking into keeping it alive with possible replacement part.

drb930

Thanks JP,

You have always been the most helpful guy with the NVSRAM on here :-)