liquidh8

Hey all, did a search, but I must not be entering the right terms. I was wondering if there is a complete listing of all the broadcast codes/bins for the gm tbi? You know, somehting that has the code/bin and what vehicle it was on? If someone has one, or the link to one, it would be greatly appreciated. i am converting my brother-in-laws b-body buick wagon to tbi, and want to get a caprice wagon bin for it.

RBob

iTrader: (1)

Does it matter which ECM the BIN is from? Not sure if the wagons ever used the '8746, but they did use the '6965 ECMs. I have some PROMs here that I can read for the BIN.

RBob.

liquidh8

Well, I am using the 7747 for this build, I had a few laying around. And if anything crazy happens in the future, i can add the EBL to it. So it will be a $42 mask, in a 7747 ecm. If I can transfer the timing/ve table from a caprice bin of a different ecm, that is fine too. I appreciate RBob.

Fast355

iTrader: (2)

I've been looking for the memcal based BCWW which is a 1993 Cadillac Brougham 350 TBI/700r4 for some time.

RBob

iTrader: (1)

The '7747 was only used in trucks, not going to find a Caprice BIN for it. Here is the AYKC BIN. It was used in at least the '92 Caprice/Roadmaster wagons. MaskID of $62. Interestingly enough was used in both the 16136965 and 16135320 ECMs. Must have been a change in the ROM code.

It is for the 5.7l engine. I thought I had more BINs for the wagons.

RBob.

liquidh8

Thank you sir, I appreciate it. I know the 7747 was for trucks, the 7746 was the car version? Anywho, I am putting the tbi in an 88 buick electra wagon, actually, a hurse. My bro likes death, lol. It has the buick 307 in it with the CCC system, emissions and all. I plan on retaining this stuff. I have been looking for a wiring diagram for the old CCC ecms, this way I can splice into the factory wiring for the brake switch, power, check engine light, etc.

I'll use this 350 bin, and change the things I need to put it on a 307.

Any other possibilities are appreciated.

RBob, as always you've come through!

Fast355

iTrader: (2)

I did a 1988 Cadillac, but there is little that can be retained from the CCC Setup. Other than the VSS. The check engine light works off of a light driver, that inverts the signal, it must be eliminated from the circuit for the SES light to work properly with the TBI ecm.

The 307 is an Oldsmobile engine BTW.

You can re-use the existing CCC Distributer, you just need to change the spark latency correction tables to match the large cap HEI, or the timing will be off at various RPMs compared to the small cap.

I would start with a 305 .bin. I have one that I used for my 307 hanging out somewhere, for the 6965 ECM though. The 6965 even controlled the factory A/C compressor cut-out relay and air divert solenoid.

This setup was not mine, but mine was very close. I used a 4.3 TBI unit (on a factory big block 454 TBI adapter), 305 ECM, and DIY tuned it.

jwscab

I may not have the BCWW mask, but i do have a couple of ecms from fleetwood/roadmaster 5.7L engines, with memcals. I'll have to check. The caddies use a different ecm, BTW, has brown connectors on it, can't recall the number right now. PM your email, I'll pull the images off and send 'em to you.

It's funny, I'm in the middle of a similar project right now. 82 'bu wagon getting a fleetwood 5.7l with a '747(for now). I actually wanted to use the fleetwood ecm, but there is not much info out there for them. If you have any, I'd like to see what you've got.

Fast is right, you have to modify the SES circuit, and take out the driver module. VSS is re-used. You might have to trace out the IP connector in the electra, but I might have some CCC diagrams you can use. The nice thing is only few wires changed in the IP connector, and the colors were mostly the same, so it's not that much work to figure out. The hardest part is trying to remember where that SES driver module is.

one nice thing, BTW, if you find a caddy with the TBI, the fuel lines are nice, they run to the passenger front, and have a fuel pressure gauge fitting on them, it's a nice thing to use with a hybrid swap. Stainless too.

one other thing, as far as a G body goes, I dunno about the electra, a Chevy van harness uses the same firewall grommet that the old CCC does, so it drops right in, no cutting or anything. the harness ends up being flipped over, and about 9 inches longer than needed, but I just looped it behind the dist on top of the bellhousing. I'll snap some pics for you....

liquidh8

Thanks guys for the replies. Your right fast, had a brain fart on the 307, it's not a buick , I need to proofread my posts, .

Glad you mentioned that because I would have taken forever to figure that one out.

Didn't know that either, but then again I don't have a schematic for the car yet so I would have figured it out. I will be re-using the VSS, the SES light at least, make the circuit work. We ended up with a painless harness, with another harness for the emissions controls, I don't have that one in hand yet though so... I would like to take a look at than bin/xdf if you have time to email it to me.

I may have to go back to the jy to get the AIR pump control valve for the ecm to control.


jwscab, it would be grat if I can get those diagrams, I don't think the b-body is so different from the g-body in wiring pin-outs, beings they used the same engine/tranny combos. Have any pics of that bu wagon progress, mine is on my cardomain site, hehe


email here----->liquidh8@hotmail.com

GUYS!

jwscab

Yeah, my brother has been keeping a picture log of the progress so far. I've check out your site, since I noticed you have a wagon....very cool....nice job on everything. I have to see if he is putting them on a log or something.

I'll get the diags. as soon as I can. It's been pretty busy these days, so bear with me.

liquidh8

Thanx man, it's a work in progress. I have been feeling out suspension, engine, steering, etc. for the past 2 years. I've changed a few things numourous times. I wanna try out some turbo's the end of the year. I may even go LSx motor. But next year it is all coming apart for a frame off redo. I'd like to see your progress when you get a chance to upload your picture diary.

jwscab

Hey guys,

Fast, you are in luck, I have BCWW and BFYU, I'll pull the images off and add them here, unless you think it's better to just email them to you.(not original content of thread, really).

Liquid,
Hopefully, I can get the schematics today, they are at the shop, I'll be there tonight.

RBob

iTrader: (1)

Liquid, you may find some items of interest in this thread:

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/diy-...-diagrams.html

RBob.

RFmaster

You can re-use the existing CCC Distributer, you just need to change the spark latency correction tables to match the large cap HEI, or the timing will be off at various RPMs compared to the small cap.

Fast - can you kindly provide a bit more information on this subject (spark latency and what it should be) . In my conversion I changed over from small size hat to full size CCC sourced dizzy, but made no other timing related changes. It may explain why have excessive knock detection between 1800 and 3200 RPM. (6965 with EBL)

//RF

liquidh8

Thanks guys.

RBob, I'll check out that thread later tonight.

RF, I plan on using the stock big cap dizzy, just gonna change the tables.

I also posted a new thread about the SA latency tables, and how they work. I noticed a tuned port small cap bin had a different SA latenct table then a small cap tbi bin. But a BBC tbi small cap had a different table then a SBC small cap bin. But they use the same dizzy??? I've been searching the web for 2 days now, more then a few hours, and can't find anything about it. Liek is there inprovements to be made moving those values up or down? If so, what does making the numbers bigger/smaller mean?

jwscab

These are for Fast355, these are the two caddy masks mentioned above, BCWW, and BFYU.

if you are using them and have any TP definitions or anything available, I would love to see them.

jwscab

These are for Fast355, these are the two caddy masks mentioned above, BCWW, and BFYU.

if you are using them and have any TP definitions or anything available, I would love to see them.

aristotle

I know this is an old post but I came across in my search for definitions. I have converted a 360 Chrysler Marine engine to efi using a TBI system from a 1993 Buick Roadmaster with a 16136965 ECM using an AYKC Mask. The conversion was done last year and the boat operated reasonably well for that season but when I tried to exceed 3600 RPM, at about 70% throttle, the engine faltered. In preparation for this season, I have been canvassing the possibility of tuning the TBI system and have invested in a PROM reader and TunerPro. I have reviewed a number of bins using the AYKC mask and $62, including the one included in RBob's message. In all cases, the BPC in the constants has been in the range of 120 to 140 and the fuel tables have been robust with entries in all conbinations of load and rpm. I recently read the PROM (AYKC) from the ECM in my engine and found that the contents contained a BPC of 12 and that many of the entries in the fuel tables were 0's and table 2 contained only one entry. Is such manipulation of the BPC a device to 0 out the fuel tables by GM and thereby reduced the number of calculations? Will I find, when I can launch my boat again that an AYKC mask like the one contained in this thread will perform like the mask currently residing in my PROM? I am hoping to increase the fuel pressure on my system to get around the 3600 RPM problem and hope to tune out the enrichment at lower speeds. Can I acheive this by simply adjusting the BPC appropriately or will it require acutal adjustments to the fuel tables at the lower ranges?

Ronny

iTrader: (1)

Clearly the BPC of 12 is incorrect. can you locate another definition file and or stock .bin? See craigmoates website under downloads.

If you have two VE tables then yes some of us zeroed out the VE table 2 <3600 RPMs(or left a min value of say 5) I recall to aid in making fuel changes off BLM. I think I left 400 rpms alone however due to advise given. That value in table 2 was then added to table one >3600 left alone in table 2.

aristotle

Thanks The BPC of 12 was acutally in the stock BIN contained in the the PROM of the factory ECM and worked. I expect I will modify the AKYC mask that RBob provided in this thread to start my tuning.

RFmaster

Aristotle

What Ronny is saying that TunerPro definition (.XDF) used to interpret EPROM image (bin file) into human readable format may be erroneous. There are several $62 mask XDF definition, the old ones contained a lot of errors and were incomplete (2 or 3 years ago). Tuner-Pro contains latest versions of XDF files. Give them a try.

//RF

aristotle

Thanks I will do that.

EagleMark

To the origanal question here is a BCC lookup!

aristotle

Thanks for that, very interresting. Just to clarify, I have used the latest definition file from TunerPro for $62 (.xdf) to interpret the bin contained on the factory PROM that existed in the ECM(which was labeled as AYKC) and the AYKC bin provided by RBob in this thread and the TunerPro $62 bin. The TunerPro and RBob bins make sense (that is the BPC is consistent with the 5.7 l GM engine) but the Bin on the acutal PROM that was factory installed in the 5.7 l car had a BPC of 12. The question is whether GM has modified the BPC constant in its AYKC bin so that it might make the fuel tables less complex. Clearly a BPC of 12 is not correct of a 5.7l engine.

EagleMark

There were lots of updates to proms as factory service recalls, so your chip may have been changed... I have a Snap-on book that lists service engine bullitens. To look it up I need the chip BCC and a Scan ID. The Scan ID is the internal PROM identifacation number transmitted in the ECM data stream and displayed by the scanner as ECM PROM ID.

aristotle

Thanks, I will check it tonight and advise tomorrow.

EagleMark

The book says that a chip BCC of AYKC had several improvements and the latest chip for that vehicle was BCC BATK Scan ID 5911

So why start with a chip that has been updated by GM for
TCC Chuggle
Idle Surge and/or detonation
Driveability improvements.

I have found in doing conversions that starting a tune with the latest update GM offered is much easier than trying to tune AND fix what GM already has.

aristotle

Thanks again. It turns out that I have a BATJ mask taken from a factory PROM which is presumably the earlier iteration of the BATK you mention. I will look for a copy of the BATK image before I start my tuning. Again, the BATJ mask taken from the PROM, in TunerPro, with the latest definition file, has a BPC of 12 and strange, incomplete, fuel tables. I am using an autoprom to read the bin images from the PROMS. I am either making some error with the autoprom or the bins crated by GM are modified by them and are using an artificial BPC number to simplify calculations. The AYKC mask that was provided by RBob earlier in this thread, contrary to my factory AYKC mask has a reasonable BPC and there is lots of information in the fuel tables to adjust. I am just trying to understand the difference. Sorry for repeating myself. I have attempted to attach a copy of the BATJ bin image that I got from the PROM using the autoprom and TunerPro.

EagleMark

BATJ was next to last, so chances are it was very close to the ending chip BATK.

FYI the chip letters are the BCC Brod Cast Code.

not sure how to answer your other questions and concerns maybe someone else knows...

EagleMark

I downloaded the BATJ bin you attached, then went to TunerPro for the $62 mask and opened them both in TunerPro V5 and nothing looks right?

EagleMark

Just for kicks I opened the AYKC that Rbob had posted earlier and it looks correct. So I would think the $62 on TunerPro is fine but the BATJ you posted is corrupt. Maybe something went wrong when you read the chip?

aristotle

Thats what I found as well. Perhaps I should get in touch with Moates support and see if I have done something wrong with the autoprom. As I noted, the engine did operate acceptably with those BBC's so it is hard to believe that the PROMS had corrupt bins. Thanks for all the help.

RBob

iTrader: (1)

Here is BATJ & BCDU

BATJ is for the 5.7l engine
BCDU is for the 5.0L engine

If I can find the big box of PROMs I'll see if BATK is in there...

RBob.

aristotle

Thanks very much.

burgessb

I followed the link, looked up my rpo codes, and i cant find my truck!My vehicle has some aftermarket chip that makes the truck nearly undrivable.

Ronny

iTrader: (1)

Thread is 4 years old. But members are likely still active.

liquidh8

I am still active, though this project wend dead. He changed his mind and is running the carb still.