Starter issues
09-12-2015, 12:25 PM
#1
Junior Member
Thread Starter
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Overland Park, KS
Posts: 58
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Car: 1992 Z28 Z03
Engine: LB9
Transmission: 700R4
Axle/Gears: 2:73
Starter issues
I've searched the forums, and searched Google but could not find much information that mirrors what I'm experiencing. Since I've owned my '92 Z28 2 years ago, the car starting seems to get a little bit worse each month it seems. Turn the key (and hit the push button start I wired in), and I hear one 'click'. That's it. I highly doubt the push button start is the issue because this problem was happening a year before I wired it in. Anyway, sometimes in the morning it starts right up no issues, and sometimes I have to turn the key several times for the starter to engage. I have a newly refurbished Corvette LT1 starter, new Optima battery as of February, and new starter relay in the car as of today. Having said that I can likely rule all of those out as causes, but not eliminate them yet. VATS is likely not the issue because I see the "Security" light turn off after a few seconds. Starter is getting 12.5V, and the battery reads 12.5V sitting. Alternator was checked at Advance Auto and is said to be good. I even tried bypassing the starter relay by joining the thick yellow and green wires, but got nothing. When I hold the starter relay in my hand I feel it click when I try to start the car.
This starting issue does seem to be intermittent as sometimes it will start right up after driving for a while, sometimes it has to sit for an hour, sometimes after a few key turns it'll engage and fire up.
Now, if I get the one 'click' syndrome, *every time* I jump start it with another car it fires right up no problem. Every time. I do notice that when it does start up with no 'one click' problems the first time, the volt meter on the dash reads around 14V before I turn the key to 'start'. When I do get the 'one click' syndrome, the volt meter reads slightly below 13V. To me I'm thinking the battery isn't getting charged all the way up and doesn't have enough power to engage the starter, correct? I've checked and cleaned both ends of the cables to the starter and battery, although they looked good without corrosion before I cleaned them. When I'm driving, after a while I will notice the volts on the dash meter drop from 14-15V to ~13V, and that's when I know I'll have a starting issue next time I try to start it.
Should I pull the alternator and get it further tested? Loose/shorted wire somewhere?
I'm pretty confused here . . .
This starting issue does seem to be intermittent as sometimes it will start right up after driving for a while, sometimes it has to sit for an hour, sometimes after a few key turns it'll engage and fire up.
Now, if I get the one 'click' syndrome, *every time* I jump start it with another car it fires right up no problem. Every time. I do notice that when it does start up with no 'one click' problems the first time, the volt meter on the dash reads around 14V before I turn the key to 'start'. When I do get the 'one click' syndrome, the volt meter reads slightly below 13V. To me I'm thinking the battery isn't getting charged all the way up and doesn't have enough power to engage the starter, correct? I've checked and cleaned both ends of the cables to the starter and battery, although they looked good without corrosion before I cleaned them. When I'm driving, after a while I will notice the volts on the dash meter drop from 14-15V to ~13V, and that's when I know I'll have a starting issue next time I try to start it.
Should I pull the alternator and get it further tested? Loose/shorted wire somewhere?
I'm pretty confused here . . .
09-13-2015, 09:36 AM
#2
Senior Member
Re: Starter issues
Sounds like the armature is hanging up in the starter....smack the starter a few times with a hammer the next time it gives you the one click and no start....then it will start most likely....if it does, well...you know what to do next. If it doesnt, I would look at the fusible links right at the starter....should be three of them.
09-13-2015, 09:45 AM
#3
Senior Member
Re: Starter issues
After re-reading your post, I would START with the fusible links... I would just go ahead and replace them, and then inspect them when the job was complete. Ive seen replacing those fix many issues!
09-13-2015, 10:50 AM
#4
Supreme Member
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Canada
Posts: 1,221
Received 149 Likes
on
122 Posts
Car: '91 Firebird Formula
Engine: SP383 Deluxe FIRST® TPI Intake
Transmission: Tremec T56
Axle/Gears: Moser 9" Eaton Truetrac Motive 3.89
Re: Starter issues
Sounds like a current issue. Some connection somewhere is restricting the current. Voltage variation is normal. The problem occurs when the voltage is under a certain threshold. Check all the grounds on the body. There is one near the battery that is screwed to the front near the radiator. Check for corrosion, blackened contacts and loose connections.
Best of luck!
Best of luck!
09-14-2015, 04:22 PM
#5
Supreme Member
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Mooresville NC
Posts: 3,341
Likes: 0
Received 10 Likes
on
10 Posts
Car: LOWERED ♦ CRIMSON METALFLAKE
Engine: ► 400 KUBES ◄
Transmission: 765R4
Axle/Gears: EATON POSI 4.56
Let’s Get Started
After verifying the grounds are OK connect a voltmeter across the M terminal of the starter and ground.
Make the leads long enuff to take the voltmeter into the cockpit.
Under normal circumstances, when cranking you will see about 9 volts on the meter.
On the occasions the starter fails to crank note the voltage.
The voltage will tell you what direction to turn.
If it’s about 12 while you are trying to crank, but the starter is not turning - the problem is in the starter.
If it’s under 8 while trying to crank - the problem is excessive resistance in the starting circuit.
Therefore if it is in the starting circuit you can move the probe you applied to terminal M at the starter, to the positive terminals at the solenoid, then keep moving up the line till the problem shows itself VIA increased voltage.
Whenever I put in a pushbutton start, I don’t just throw a pushbutton across the wiring which sounds like what you did based on your description.
I add a relay and thicker wiring, along with a separate RUN toggle.
With my upgrade the starter solenoid and starter motor will engage even if the battery is “dead” (very low).
The starter will crank slower and slower with the “dead” battery, but never will not click and not try.
If your dash voltmeter is accurate when it reads “only” 13, with a properly wired starter system, the starter would work FAST.
Why are you turning the key with a pushbutton start?
It’s true you still need the key to turn off VATS and unlock the column, however with a real pushbutton start system you’ll never want to use the wimpy turn-key-to-start again.
Reminds me of rent-a-cars.
Battery:
I use Optima batteries.
You might receive some negative comments about them.
I never had a problem with any of them.
▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬
DonW►If he had a blown Fusible Link in series with the solenoid circuit the engine would NEVER start, he would not have an intermittent problem.
◙◙◙◙◙◙◙◙◙◙◙◙◙◙◙
Happy Racing !
◙◙◙◙◙◙◙◙◙◙◙◙◙◙◙
The Next Time I’m In The Sand Trap, Let It Be Golf, Not My Car
Make the leads long enuff to take the voltmeter into the cockpit.
Under normal circumstances, when cranking you will see about 9 volts on the meter.
On the occasions the starter fails to crank note the voltage.
The voltage will tell you what direction to turn.
If it’s about 12 while you are trying to crank, but the starter is not turning - the problem is in the starter.
If it’s under 8 while trying to crank - the problem is excessive resistance in the starting circuit.
Therefore if it is in the starting circuit you can move the probe you applied to terminal M at the starter, to the positive terminals at the solenoid, then keep moving up the line till the problem shows itself VIA increased voltage.
Originally Posted by sahlomonic
push button start I wired in
I add a relay and thicker wiring, along with a separate RUN toggle.
With my upgrade the starter solenoid and starter motor will engage even if the battery is “dead” (very low).
The starter will crank slower and slower with the “dead” battery, but never will not click and not try.
If your dash voltmeter is accurate when it reads “only” 13, with a properly wired starter system, the starter would work FAST.
Why are you turning the key with a pushbutton start?
It’s true you still need the key to turn off VATS and unlock the column, however with a real pushbutton start system you’ll never want to use the wimpy turn-key-to-start again.
Reminds me of rent-a-cars.
Battery:
I use Optima batteries.
You might receive some negative comments about them.
I never had a problem with any of them.
▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬
DonW►If he had a blown Fusible Link in series with the solenoid circuit the engine would NEVER start, he would not have an intermittent problem.
◙◙◙◙◙◙◙◙◙◙◙◙◙◙◙
Happy Racing !
◙◙◙◙◙◙◙◙◙◙◙◙◙◙◙
The Next Time I’m In The Sand Trap, Let It Be Golf, Not My Car
09-14-2015, 08:05 PM
#6
Senior Member
Re: Starter issues
My money is still on fusible link. Mine was hanging on by a thread...litterally and giving power to the rest of the car but not the starter until it cooled... Was a long time ago but an experience I wont forget...so yeah, its possible
09-20-2015, 06:30 PM
#7
Junior Member
Thread Starter
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Overland Park, KS
Posts: 58
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Car: 1992 Z28 Z03
Engine: LB9
Transmission: 700R4
Axle/Gears: 2:73
Re: Starter issues
Thanks for all the help guys! I was able to figure out what was causing the issues, and it stemmed from a shoddy wiring job from an aftermarket car alarm the previous owner put in.
Simply put, a roughly 7" length of 14 ga wire was spliced in to the ignition wire - which is 10 ga. Took me awhile to find it since it was taped up in the bundle, but that was certainly the culprit.
Repaired the wire by splicing in a length of 10 ga, and re-wired the push button start to run parallel with the key, and it fires up every time.
Simply put, a roughly 7" length of 14 ga wire was spliced in to the ignition wire - which is 10 ga. Took me awhile to find it since it was taped up in the bundle, but that was certainly the culprit.
Repaired the wire by splicing in a length of 10 ga, and re-wired the push button start to run parallel with the key, and it fires up every time.
Trending Topics
09-20-2015, 07:15 PM
#8
Supreme Member
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Canada
Posts: 1,221
Received 149 Likes
on
122 Posts
Car: '91 Firebird Formula
Engine: SP383 Deluxe FIRST® TPI Intake
Transmission: Tremec T56
Axle/Gears: Moser 9" Eaton Truetrac Motive 3.89
Re: Starter issues
Thanks for all the help guys! I was able to figure out what was causing the issues, and it stemmed from a shoddy wiring job from an aftermarket car alarm the previous owner put in.
Simply put, a roughly 7" length of 14 ga wire was spliced in to the ignition wire - which is 10 ga. Took me awhile to find it since it was taped up in the bundle, but that was certainly the culprit.
Repaired the wire by splicing in a length of 10 ga, and re-wired the push button start to run parallel with the key, and it fires up every time.
Simply put, a roughly 7" length of 14 ga wire was spliced in to the ignition wire - which is 10 ga. Took me awhile to find it since it was taped up in the bundle, but that was certainly the culprit.
Repaired the wire by splicing in a length of 10 ga, and re-wired the push button start to run parallel with the key, and it fires up every time.
Ohh Lord!!!
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
TheTraut88
Engine/Drivetrain/Suspension Parts for Sale
1
09-07-2015 05:22 PM