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History / OriginalityGot a question about 1982-1992 Camaro or Firebird history? Have a question about original parts, options, RPO codes, when something was available, or how to document your car? Those questions, answers, and much more!
Last night I dug into the archive a bit... For 1991, on the Firebird, GM used three different batteries. Catalog #601 in the L98, #730 Std LH0, L03, LB9, #731 Opt L03, LB9. Per the GM/Helm 1991 Firebird Service Manual.
Also poked around a bit in the 1991 Firebird owner's manual. Now aside from the fact that the pictures contained in the manual are a mix of earlier Firebirds, Camaros, etc there are at least a few photos of batteries, and some of them look to be in later Firebirds (1990 or later). Those photos show the labels with the yellow warning block to the left as shown throughout this thread.
What was interesting to me is the variety of batteries used. I've always assumed that a group 75 Delco Freedom was a group 75 Delco Freedom, but there's a little more to it...
Now I have to wonder why some Delco's have the catalog number and specs on a separate tag, while others have it as part of the main tag. I seem to remember all my OE Delcos having the single label...
Chazmans 89 battery is 570 cca 280 load test
My 89 formula 350 battery is 630 cca 310 load test
The battery in the OPs 1st post came from a 92 GTA with a 305 tpi auto and its the same as Chazmans (I parted it out, sad)
Maybe the decals were done that way to set them apart for quick identification on the line?
I do know a guy on the TTA board posted a pic of his original battery and it had the dual decals like my 89. My formula also has the big alternator for the year. 140 amp I think ?
Chazmans 89 battery is 570 cca 280 load test
My 89 formula 350 battery is 630 cca 310 load test
The battery in the OPs 1st post came from a 92 GTA with a 305 auto (I parted it out, sad)
Maybe the decals were done that way to set them apart for quick identification on the line?
I do know a guy on the TTA board posted a pic of his original battery and it had the dual decals like my 89. My formula also has the big alternator for the year. 140 amp I think ?
And my battery was the optional heavy duty battery. It lasted 11 years.
Well.. Sorta... From 87-up they're all based on the CS design. Notably the 87 (V-belts) uses a different mounting tab position than 88-92. Then TBI cars used a 100amp alternator, vs the 105amp in the LB9/L98.
Now where it gets really interesting () is that 88-89 the 105A has the same part number, then 1990 is completely on it's own, and 91-92 have a third part number. Knowing that the serpentine brackets didn't change from 88-92 (aside from supporting brackets and belt routing) a person has to wonder why there are three part numbers.
BTW there are different physical sizes of CS alternator. The dimension of the stator dictates the model. The standard thirdgen V8 uses the CS130. The bigger CS144 was used on some Caprice or Cadillacs with the same bracketry setup by using a bolt on adapter. Some other applications used a smaller version, CS121, IIRC. Makes it fun when you're bolting on a junkyard part and one bolt won't line up by about half a hole.
Last night I dug into the archive a bit... For 1991, on the Firebird, GM used three different batteries. Catalog #601 in the L98, #730 Std LH0, L03, LB9, #731 Opt L03, LB9. Per the GM/Helm 1991 Firebird Service Manual.
Interesting...
Originally Posted by mantaguy
Check your RPO code it will list what alternator you car has.My RPO code is K90-108 Amp.
Are they all (105A CS130's) marked F8? I was thinking there was another code used. I just restored this pair a couple weeks ago, new bearings mostly, lots of clean up, they both could use the stamp.
We need a thread for recreating all the paper number tags on the vacuum lines, hoses, etc next.
Drew..after seeing your pics of the alternators, (nice job by the way) and the suggestion about a thread about tags, I had remembered from back when this was started by okfoz (John). Neat info in that as well.
Another thing I noticed, is the nuts and washers were painted black after they were installed on the pulley.
This is madness! I just finished squinting and zooming 640x480 photos of my 91 RS from back in the day, and looking the low mileage cars on Ebay, and I'm not sure. Both of these alternators were remans, one Remy, the other some off brand with plated fan/pulley. I'll have to dig my RS out of storage and see what it's got... Oh well, if all I need to do is some masking and carefully squirting some paint, that's easy enough to fix. I assume the end of the shaft was painted too? I'll have to look into it a bit more and see what I come up with.
The Original Decals thread shows some of the markings, but not all. I'm sure I'm not the only one that has removed the remains of a damaged tag because no tag looks better than a trashed one. Most of the tags on the AIR injection hoses, vacuum lines, etc should be easy enough to reproduce assuming a matching font can be found. Trouble is finding good examples of each tag to copy, and making sure the details match the correct year. Our cars haven't ever really garnered the attention needed to document this kind of thing, but it seems like a few more people are interested now than a few years ago.
Just one of those crazy details.. I just looked at some pictures of 013 Hawk and the alt code on it is either UT or JT. Shaft, nut and washer are black.
Aside from the $25 reproductions on ebay, has anyone seen any sources for Delco battery decals lately?
Also wondering if anyone has come up with any kind of definitive guide to which labels were used on which cars. For all the low mileage cars out there, it's surprising how difficult it is to find clear pictures of this kind of thing.
Get me the dimensions and photos of the battery you are looking for and I can probably put a decal together for you.
Charlie, I got this one from Farm & Fleet . . . but Walmart's Ever Start is a nice flat top too
The Walmart battery is a decent look-alike, they're made by Johnson Controls. The support tabs for the carrying handle are a bit different, as are the molding ribs on the outside of the case, but they look close enough. Your Farm & Fleet flat top has more accurate +/- markings, the Everstart are much larger.
Originally Posted by Polo Z03
Get me the dimensions and photos of the battery you are looking for and I can probably put a decal together for you.
I'm not entirely sure if my 1991 Formula should have a 601 battery with a single decal or the two decal version. The Delco Freedoms I remember had the single label, but then they didn't come in this car. I Photoshopped together kind of a mismatch of the single decal label and the proper specs for the 601. I just need to decide for myself if I want to go with a label that might not be entirely accurate, or one I know is a clever fake. I figure it IS a reproduction, and it IS enough different due to details I can't control, that I can go a little off the tracks on the decal without worrying too much. But I do appreciate the offer, and might get back to you on it at some point.
I Just ordered this decal from the Ebay vendor mentioned above for $20 plus $3 shipping. I'll see how it looks on my current battery otherwise I'll pick up a walmart flat top and put my old one to use somewhere else. The wife thinks we're all nuts!
I Just ordered this decal from the Ebay vendor mentioned above for $20 plus $3 shipping. I'll see how it looks on my current battery otherwise I'll pick up a walmart flat top and put my old one to use somewhere else. The wife thinks we're all nuts!
Yes we are all nuts . . . I bought that decal as well . . very nice heavy vinyl, graphics are fuzzy and the cutting could be better, but in a pinch it works great.
Very happy I've figured out how to do myself and get it exactly the way I'd want it.
HI, I have two 88 and one 89 any chance you could tell me where to buy the materials and send them to you for printing>>>
Thanks
Cat, the battery just need s nice 75 series flat top, I just shopped around to find the cheapest to be completely honest, I got mine from Farm and Fleet. Walmart Ever Start works well too.
The only info I'd need from you would be photos of what you want replicated.
I want to thank skylark for sending me the Green Eye
I put those decals on a NAPA Legend 75,nice smooth top also.
Although my decals aren't correct for the 86 year,they'll have to do for now until someone produces the correct ones.Up until now,no ones noticed them yet at the car shows
I want to thank skylark for sending me the Green Eye
I put those decals on a NAPA Legend 75,nice smooth top also.
Although my decals aren't correct for the 86 year,they'll have to do for now until someone produces the correct ones.Up until now,no ones noticed them yet at the car shows
I Just ordered this decal from the Ebay vendor mentioned above for $20 plus $3 shipping. I'll see how it looks on my current battery otherwise I'll pick up a walmart flat top and put my old one to use somewhere else. The wife thinks we're all nuts!
I've been doing that stuff for years with my cars. Wife doesn't hardly bat an eye anymore. Last year when I scored my gray valve stem caps I showed her with all my excitement & all I got was an "Oh brother" & a weird look. Yea, she's used to it but doesn't get it.....
I think I got the decals finalized on the battery. Added a hydrometer eye and the outside plugs. All that I have to do now is paint the sides of the case white.
07-16-2016, 09:01 AM
) is that 88-89 the 105A has the same part number, then 1990 is completely on it's own, and 91-92 have a third part number. Knowing that the serpentine brackets didn't change from 88-92 (aside from supporting brackets and belt routing) a person has to wonder why there are three part numbers. 
I just finished squinting and zooming 640x480 photos of my 91 RS from back in the day, and looking the low mileage cars on Ebay, and I'm not sure. Both of these alternators were remans, one Remy, the other some off brand with plated fan/pulley. I'll have to dig my RS out of storage and see what it's got... Oh well, if all I need to do is some masking and carefully squirting some paint, that's easy enough to fix. I assume the end of the shaft was painted too? I'll have to look into it a bit more and see what I come up with.
