Linson

so, I'm thinking of buying a TTA that is in my area. i normally don't concern myself with resale value, but in this case I am thinking of this car as a "fix it and flip it" type deal.

the car has less than 20K on the odometer and has perfect interior and practically perfect exterior as far as i can tell. problem is that the car has sat for 10 years (covered, in a garage) and will probably need some work.

also, he says the car has had some paint work done to remedy some clear coat issues.

i know that (in working order) a car like that could have an asking price of north of $20K. but are people really paying that much?

does anyone have any insight into how quickly TTAs sell, and what they're actually being sold for lately? examples of recent sold prices?

Thanks.

TTOP350

iTrader: (8)

http://www.turbotransam.com/forums/index.php

sailtexas186548

iTrader: (2)

about tree fiddy!

kymmee

Reality is, it's only "worth" what someone is willing to pay, but prices seems to be going up from when I bought mine (2010). Several were sold recently at Barrett-Jackson and you can always reference ebay for sold cars.

The unknown is how much you will have to put in it, since it sat for 10 yrs, which is no good for any car.

Linson

thanks for the link. But the website is garbage: it wouldnt let me register (never sent me a link via email) and now it recognizes my user name but doesnt let me post or open images. Ive sent three queries and have not received any response from a moderator or whoever.

Going to see the car tomorrow.

82tarecaro

iTrader: (4)

I wouldn't characterize it as garbage. The software might be a tad bit old, but if you contact the admin I am sure he could fix it up for you.
As far as TTA values, they have been on the rise for a few years. Just don't expect to make a killing. Anything south of 20K for that car, assuming it is in the condition you described is probably a good value. Not sure how much money you would make after servicing her and putting her back up for sale. Right off the bat, she probably needs a set of tires. That's probably 600 for a good set mounted and balanced. Plus your time to drain and replace all fluids, tune her up and getting her running right. Not to mention, a good detail to get the paint nice and shiny.
Collector cars don't sell overnight and I can think of a few people who had their TTA's for sale for months(maybe years) before they sold. Plan on tying your cash up for a bit to find the right buyer. If you get discouraged, you can wind up losing money. The guys who sold recently with nice cars who were able to hold out the longest got the best money for their cars.

TTOP350

iTrader: (8)

It has been having issues, hang in there. Its a good site, I've been on it for many years.
There has been talk of a server upgrade and new look because of said server issues.

Linson

thanks for the input.

and the three queries (now four) that i sent were to an/the Administrator (i'd assume). still nothing.

im gonna go see the car today. i'll report on the condition and price etc.

Javier87z28

iTrader: (1)

do let us know how it turns out man, always love seeing when someone picks up a tta

86TA355SR

iTrader: (1)

What ever a seller and buyer are willing to agree too...is what it is worth. Not trying to sound like a smart @ss or anything.

Just for reference, I drove 4 hrs last yr to look at a TTA with 18K miles. Guy was trying to move it, price was $18K. It sold before I got there, seller called 2hrs into my drive to tell me. I was disappointed to say the least. Someone beat me to it. Just one of those deals I guess. Didn't really need 4 Trans Ams anyhow.

Be careful using E-bay as a price reference. Best bet would be to have your max that you'll pay for a TTA and walk away if it goes over that. Trying to flip it you'll need it as cheap as possible. If it has sat for 10 yrs, it'll be full of surprises, I'd plan on at least another $1K-$1,500 into it. Been through this before-tires, battery, fluids & filters, belts, hoses, gaskets, injectors and fuel pumps add up fast. I remember your car, you've been through this before also...

Dont' let anyone tell you these cars are rare, desirable: yes-they're always listed on e-bay and other places. At any time, you can find 3 or 4 different ones. For example, last fall there was one on CL with 28K miles for $15K. Another situation with someone having to sell it. It was nice also, already had headlight motors done and new fiberglass wing.

Good luck, interested to see how this turns out!

Linson

went and saw the car today. took a lot of pics, mostly of potential problem areas. here are several pics:



condition of carpet in trunk area:

pass side door vent thingy off - not sure how or why:

rear seats very good. found: one pass side door vent thingy:

brown "oil looking" spots throught carpet, otherwise in fair condition. would have expected better for < 20,000 miles.

plastic moulding between rear glass and headliner. cracked from overtightened screw:
sag in driv and pass side door pannel cloth section:

passenger seat perfect. minimal amount of wear on driver seat bolster:

early stage separation. something hot was there:

Linson

nominal amount of wear on steering wheel:

other than the cobwebs, all four tires are like-new Goodyears:

the car has been painted. the look of this area surrounding the tail light on the pass side concerned me:
is the door handle supposed have a "blank white" strip?

T-Top area looked good. some scratches on glass roof. mirrors, windows, and headlights work:
some kind of "deal" was screwed into the side of the console:

obligatory engine pic. no issues really with the top end:

drain plug seems to be the source of the oil leak:

rest of undercarriage including factory exhaust was excellent:

engine bay paint a little dinjy:

battery tray wasnt bad all things considered:

and it has the black box. has the cassette (never opened) but missing the owners manual:

Linson

other issues:

the car was painted. the VIN number on the hood doesnt match the rest of the VIN numbers on the car. so thats wierd. makes me wonder. current owner says previous owner had paint work done to fix "clear coat issues."

needs a new rear wing. $1000 hit for Hawks fiberglass wing w/ part, shipping, and paint.

a few mouse turds on the upper intake.

could have been after effects from the car cover, but generally the car smelled a little bit like cat ****.

also, the radio is stuck on "Loc." dont know if the power antenna works. wouldnt be suprised either way.

my buddy and i got the car running. a new battery (paid for by owner) and a shot of starter fluid is all it needed. i drove the car and it ran and shifted great. a blast to drive in fact. TTAs are no joke. i took a couple videos of the car idling. will see if i can find a way to post them up.

Linson

so overall, the interior and exterior were not as nice as i expected. but, the amount of work needed to get the car driveable was less than i expected, so its a bit of a wash.

it really was fun to drive and i can see owning it. but whether i would wind up keeping it or selling it, it still needs to go from its current state to a $20,000 car. discuss: what do you guys think it would take to make this a $20,000 car?

OrangeBird

iTrader: (1)

.

kymmee

Is the spoiler cracked?
Do the power antennae and hatch pull down work properly?
Is the engine stock or stock appearing?

These are things that you would expect to be correct for a 20k car.

The owners kit is definatlely a plus

eseibel67

This car emits mixed signals. Overall it's very good with expected issues such as the spoiler, door panels and console foam seperation.


20k is of course is very low mileage for a 25 year old car. It seems to me that this car was regularily driven the first few years (stains, console accessory, repaint & new hood) without regard for long term preservation. Next it was used sparingly or mothballed and here you are.

Overall, it has more issues than you would normally expect at that mileage, but they all seem to be things that can be dealt with. The only thing that would concern me is the repaint. If you decide to move on it, have it inspected by a body expert that can confirm that it was repaired properly.

Good thing that it runs strong if you are thinking flip. Potential trans or fuel pump issues would be a unwelcomed PIA to deal with.

No comment on value because I don't know, but I would speculate that TTA would have a pretty fairly broad appeal that I don't expect will decline.

The radio on these go into "LOC" mode every time the battery is disconnected. Unlock by pressing the MUTE button on the steering wheel.

Great preesentation of potential purchase by the way, this is a template of how it should be done.

Good luck!

scottmoyer

This was a $30k car when new. I find it odd that the owners knew these were "rare" and special cars, but they screwed into the console, probably for an '80's style cell phone. The carpet also has me questioning the 20k claim. The steering wheel shouldn't have the amount of wear that this one is showing. I wonder if the car the hood came from was totaled in the rear and someone replaced the instrument cluster with a lower mile cluster when they replaced the hood. You don't replace the hood for due to paint or clear coat issues. If the price of the car is a steal, there might be a good reason. And don't trust carfax to disclose anything.

Linson

VinDecoder.com
(BODY)
MARK
Pontiac
MODEL
Trans Am
VERSION
ULTRA RARE
TYPE
Coupe
PRODUCTION YEAR
1989
GEARBOX
Automatic
FUEL TYPE
Gasoline
(HOOD)
MARK
Pontiac
MODEL
Trans Am
PRODUCTION YEAR
1989
GEARBOX
Automatic
ENGINE
3.8L TURBO
FUEL TYPE
Gasoline
WHEEL DRIVE
RWD



CarFax

· Vehicle:1989 PONTIAC FIREBIRD TRANS AM/GTA SE (BODY)



· Vehicle:1989 PONTIAC FIREBIRD TRANS AM/GTA SE (HOOD)




VIN DECODER.NET


BODY


Model: Firebird

Type: Car

Make: GMC, Pontiac

Model year: 1989

Manufacturer: General Motors Corporation

Manufactured in: United States (NorthAmerica)

Plant: Van Nuys, CA

Sequential number: 245722


Body style: HATCHBACK 2-DR

Body type: 2 Door Coupe

Consumption in the city: 17 miles/gallon / 13.8liters/100 km

Consumption on the highway: 26 miles/gallon / 9.0liters/100 km

Curb weight: 3519 lbs / 1599.5 kg

Doors: 2

Driveline: FWD

Engine capacity: V6, 3.8L; Turbo

Engine series: V-6 3.8L

Engine type: 3.8L V6 TURBO

Fuel tank: 15.50 gallon / 58.7 liter

Fuel type: Gasoline

Overall height: 49.70 in / 126.2 cm

Overall length: 191.80 in / 487.2 cm

Overall width: 72.40 in / 183.9 cm

Safety restraints: Manual-Active Belts

Standard seating: 4

Steering Type: Recirc

Tires: 245/50ZR16

Trim level: GTA coupe

Turning Diameter: 38.50 in / 97.8 cm

Vehicle type: Passenger Car

Wheelbase:101.00in / 256.5 cm

HOOD

Model: Firebird

Type: Car

Make: GMC, Pontiac

Model year: 1989

Manufacturer: General Motors Corporation

Manufactured in: United States (NorthAmerica)

Plant: Van Nuys, CA

Sequential number: 245728


Body style: HATCHBACK 2-DR

Body type: 2 Door Coupe

Consumption in the city: 17 miles/gallon / 13.8liters/100 km

Consumption on the highway: 26 miles/gallon / 9.0liters/100 km

Curb weight: 3519 lbs / 1599.5 kg

Doors: 2

Driveline: FWD

Engine capacity: V6, 3.8L; Turbo

Engine series: V-6 3.8L

Engine type: 3.8L V6 TURBO

Fuel tank: 15.50 gallon / 58.7 liter

Fuel type: Gasoline

Overall height: 49.70 in / 126.2 cm

Overall length: 191.80 in / 487.2 cm

Overall width: 72.40 in / 183.9 cm

Safety restraints: Manual-Active Belts

Standard seating: 4

Steering Type: Recirc

Tires: 245/50ZR16

Trim level: GTA coupe

Turning Diameter: 38.50 in / 97.8 cm

Vehicle type: Passenger Car

Wheelbase:101.00in / 256.5 cm

Jersey89GTA

iTrader: (1)

All minor things, easy to fix. But I too am suspect of the mileage. But hey it is pretty clean underneath, if it runs good - buy it, especially if you are getting a deal on it. But check mileage if you can.


Nice car.

Linson

soooo, as eseibel67 was saying, this car does emit mixed signals.

1. the hood has a slightly different VIN number, BUT it appears to belong to a TTA according to at least two different VIN decoders.

2. the car was re-painted, and the engine compartment paint is a little dingy for a car with < 20K original miles. HOWEVER, the undercarriage looks practically new and devoid of road grime and wear that would indicate a car with > 20K original miles.

3. the interior has what appears to be oil spots, etc. on the carpet, showing signs of carelessness, BUT the seats and the carpet show very little signs of wear.

4. the mechanic I brought with me is very competent and spotted the signs of the repaint, but saw no signs of structural damage or replaced panels (other than the mis-matching VIN number on the hood.)

5. the engine is rebuilt. the owner has thousands of dollars in receipts for an engine rebuild he says he had done when he bought the car (2004) because it was burning oil. there is only 500 miles or so on the motor. the story of the car as best as I can tell it according to the current owner is

he bought it in '04 for who knows what from God knows who. it was burning oil so he had the engine overhauled. a lobe on the new cam went flat so he had it overhauled again under warranty (car now has a slightly bigger than stock cam and a Terry Houston down pipe.) he then noticed a mysterious valve train ticking whenever the vehicle would reach operating temperature (my mechanic and I noticed no ticking problem.) he got discouraged/his daughter was born and so put it away and it has sat in his garage for the last 9 or ten years. it was actually last licensed in 2006. he also has a rare Grand National which is his baby.

PS. he just texted me. the power antenna works. thanks, eseibel67 for the tip about the radio "Loc". made me look smart. also, to answer an earlier question, yes, the hatch pull down works.

Linson

FWIW, I can get the car for $10K.

other notes: car is equipped with a ScanMaster. I guess those are not too uncommon on TTAs.

the guy says it needs some sort of different motor mounts or spacers because the Terry Houston Down Pipe is so big that it knocks against the frame when you get on the gas, causing the knock sensor to retard timing.

Linson

check the dates on these posts from TTA Forums.

sounds like the current owner might be on the up and up.

http://www.turbotransam.com/forums/showthread.php?t=966

The car in question is # 1119

82tarecaro

iTrader: (4)

The car could have been neglected and shows more wear then usual. My 27K car does not show as much wear, but it appears to have been garaged and babied its whole life. With that said - 10 grand is not a bad price, if it runs good and is mechanically sound. The owners kit alone is worth over a grand. You can find the manual on Ebay for not much money. As long as the paint work seems OK, and you just have to spend a few grand on minor cosmetics, then I don't think you can go wrong with the price.
Did you try to get a Carfax on it to verify mileage? They are not completely accurate but if it went for an inspection or changed hands to a new owner, mileage should have been reported unless the state does not require it where it was titled. It is worth a check.

82tarecaro

iTrader: (4)

Just to answer your question - the door handle is supposed to have the white strip.
The drain plug is incorrect - should be an allen headed bolt.

TTOP350

iTrader: (8)

Even with the "issues" I'd grab it for 10k.
I see overspray on the wires by the battery and fresh non matching white paint on the core support right by them. I'd like to see some more under hood pix.
The seam sealer in the tail light area is normal factory stuff.
The hood VIN is kinda weird. Do the fenders have the correct VINs?
I'm wondering if it was a factory vin decal messup on the hood or what? Do the hood bolts have a factory finish on them or have they been chipped up like they have been removed and replaced? I see the lower hinge bolts have chipped paint.
Looking at the carpet (soda/coffee?) stains, screw holes and minimal wear on pass seat, I'm guessing that was a cup holder screwed 2 the console, could of been for a phone to tho.
I bet someone stripped out the allen pulg on the pan and stuck a normal pan bolt in it.
New tires at 20,000 miles? This car was enjoyed.

82tarecaro

iTrader: (4)

I don't see the overspray. The hood definitely was removed. The bolts holding the hinges have chipped paint.

Just based on the condition of the body and the lack of rust, I would say it is worth the money. It's all there too. Even the turbo appears original, as well as the air ducting. Hard to find those parts when a PO modded the hell out of it.

TTOP350

iTrader: (8)

Hard to see but on the bottom right of the battery tray, it "looks" like there is overspray on the wires by the frame rail core support area. Maybe some thing else? Hard to see.

1989GTATransAm

iTrader: (3)

Looks like a pretty good deal to me for 10K. The clear coat on these cars tends to go bad.

85ttopsz28

is it a 5 digit odometer??

Linson

I don't see the overspray either. the hood was removed twice by the current owner - the two times he removed the engine.

I think the hood thing could be a PAS ****-up (seeing as how both the hood VIN and the body VIN appear to come back as to a TTA. I wonder if there's another TTA out there with xx722 on the hood and xx728 on the body.

Linson

nope. 6.

019234.7

of all the issues with this car (which seem pretty minor) I don't think odometer fraud is one of them. I think most of the wear and tear on this car was done before the current owner. if you reference the link to the 10 year-old link to the TTA.com thread, what he was saying then, is what he's saying now. it matches up.

so, my feeling is that a misrepresentation of the mileage, while not impossible, seems highly unlikely.

Linson

okay. I see it now. had to zoom in on the pic on my phone. looks like it could be, but it is hard to tell.

since me and my buddy got it running (owner had convinced himself that it wouldn't run) and I am the first serious customer he's had, he's going to hold the car for a week or two for me.

told my wife that if I bought the TTA and kept it, I would sell my Formula, but I can't see doing that. head to head the Formula will always look sexier. I could sell my 5.0 for a few Gs maybe to offset the cost of the TTA. and I have that 67 rolling chasis w/new paint and body, but I don't really like the idea of not owning a 67 Firebird. then again, could always try and flip the TTA for a profit, but it would be nice to keep too. decisions...decisions.

86TA355SR

iTrader: (1)

I wouldn't doubt it...

Run VIN through BMV, that'll tell you mileage last time it was registered. Not the best, but gives you a starting point.

Honestly, it all looks like little things wrong. Keep us posted!

85ttopsz28

it appears to me that it was just somewhat neglected during its life but still worth it.

TTOP350

iTrader: (8)

I'll have Jan comment on this thread, he goes indepth on these cars and hes on that TTA website.

82tarecaro

iTrader: (4)

Jan might even have some history on the car. He had some on mine, including the name of a previous owner.

Linson

yes, please do have Jan give his input. i would appreciate that.

maybe he might also have some insight as to why user name Linson is not authorized to post on TTA.com.

t-top89

iTrader: (3)

For $20K.......Run.
I have owned many of these cars. Take my advise and save your money. If your patient, you can find really good deals. This is not one.

TTOP350

iTrader: (8)

I sent him a PM, I think he can get things done 4 ya.

Linson

back to what i was saying before though, i know that this is a good price at 10K. whether i were to re-sell it or keep it, i'd have to fix it up. what do you guys think it would take to make this one a 20K car (a car that one could reasonalbly expect to get 20K or thereabouts for a private sale?)

automatically it would get:
tuned up and serviced (fluids etc.)
thorough cleaning and detailing
new carpet
poly motor mounts
fiberglass Aerowing

Linson

what about for $10K?

t-top89

iTrader: (3)

I dont fully understand. Hes willing to take 10K now? Thats hard to believe.
If I were seriously looking at the car to flip...12-13k..maybe a little more to keep.
I wouldnt waste my time only making a couple grand with a 17K investment tho.
That car wont bring 20k when done. Not with a rebuilt motor and repaint along with a shakey past.

82tarecaro

iTrader: (4)

He's not the administrator over there. I will see what I can find out. They don't seem to be around that often lately.

Linson

it was always 10K. the asking price was $10,500. i'm not sure where you got 20K from unless you misconstrued me mentioning that i wanted to get 20 for it if i were to fix it and flip it.

thanks for the other input though.

t-top89

iTrader: (3)

Ok. I read all of the posts. You better jump all over that for 10k!!!!
I sold an 80k mile TTA for 10,500 and a TTA with 130k for 9k . I would pull the trigger on it without hesitation.
And sorry for confusion. Good luck man!

TTOP350

iTrader: (8)

No he isn't but he knows them fairly well (IIRC)

Speed Racer X

I'd buy it, enjoy it and leisurely fix it for $10K. Flipping it, not so sure. Damn tails are a profit eater.

Grey89GTA

Linson you said you mite sell your 5.0. What is it?

Linson

'89 Mustang LX

BBK SFCs
SSBC 4-wheel disc brakes
3.55 Gears
Built AOD, B&M torque converter, B&M Hammer console shifter
BBK CAI
BBK Equal length shorty headers
BBK ORHP
Flowmaster Force II cat-back