When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network.
Today i bring you an interesting problem. The story goes. The previous owner of this car had modified the cylinder lock position to be in such a neutral spot that you dont "EVER" need to use a key to turn the ignition lock. I know this sentence sounds crazy, but i will provide pictures.
I was dealing with this problem for roughly 6 hours yesterday. I was looking at the book and to be honest i still don't understand what the previous owner has done. To clear things up what i want to do is that:
1. Previous owner has modified the car so that its a keyless system.
I WANT to put the system back to the original state. You have to use a key to turn the ignition lock cylinder, not that you can freely move it.
2. I want to remove the push-to start button that is shown on picture 2. There is a button, but we will deal with that later. I want to adjust the cylinder lock neutral position to its original state.
It is quite an interesting modification. I have 2 thoughts. He has either changed the plastic cover where you insert the cylinder lock so that its in an awkward position (possibly another cars one).
OR
There is some kind of modification in the locking mechanism of the cylinder lock. To be fair, currently when i looked at the mechanism, i suspect that he didnt go so far to change that, but who knows.
Can you help me with this interesting problem?
*EDIT* - If you guys want, i can make a video and post the link here, how it is currently working to clarify things.
The red ring in the picture is the starter button. You just turn the ignition lock cylinder (without a key) and press the starter button (shown in this picture). No key required.
I would suspect that there is something not quite right with the lock cylinder itself. I'd pull that our and inspect it.
I see your profile shows you have an 89 car. If that's the car you are working on then it may have the wrong lock cylinder. That chrome one in the pics is certainly a replacement from the original. Did it originally come with the VATS key lock cylinder? If it did and somebody tried to install a non-vats lock cylinder, that there may be your problem. Although a non-vats key lock cylinder will fit into the housing on the column, it will sit deeper than the VATS key lock cylinder and may not function properly as a result.
I would suspect that there is something not quite right with the lock cylinder itself. I'd pull that our and inspect it.
I see your profile shows you have an 89 car. If that's the car you are working on then it may have the wrong lock cylinder. That chrome one in the pics is certainly a replacement from the original. Did it originally come with the VATS key lock cylinder? If it did and somebody tried to install a non-vats lock cylinder, that there may be your problem. Although a non-vats key lock cylinder will fit into the housing on the column, it will sit deeper than the VATS key lock cylinder and may not function properly as a result.
Believe me it is not the lock cylinder itself. It is a 3rd one i am trying... I swapped the original, because it broke (but it still was sitting the same way). I tried a 2nd one from a GM jeep (because there wasnt any replacement parts), the sitting was the same. Then i now bought a 3rd one which is OEM certified and same problem. It is not sitting right.
3 cylinder locks, all not sitting the right way. I don't believe it's the cylinder lock. Plus when the cylinder lock is in, i can't take the key out. It feels like it can't move like a little bit back, like something is blocking it.
Believe me it is not the lock cylinder itself. It is a 3rd one i am trying... I swapped the original, because it broke (but it still was sitting the same way). I tried a 2nd one from a GM jeep (because there wasnt any replacement parts), the sitting was the same. Then i now bought a 3rd one which is OEM certified and same problem. It is not sitting right.
3 cylinder locks, all not sitting the right way. I don't believe it's the cylinder lock. Plus when the cylinder lock is in, i can't take the key out. It feels like it can't move like a little bit back, like something is blocking it.
My point was that you may be using the wrong lock cylinder. How do you know the original one is actually the correct one for that column? The previous owner could have swapped it with an incorrect one and you'd never know. If you car was originally equipped with a VATS lock cylinder and you now have a pre VATS cylinder in there (or 3 in your case) then that may be your problem. My car is a 91 VATS car. I rebuilt the column just 2 weeks ago. My original lock cylinder is wobbly so I decided to try a non-vats GM lock cylinder since they are only in the $20 range at AutoZone. It fits into the column, but it sits down in there deeper than the original. The VATS original has a longer collar on it. It kinda worked, but the selector locking points on the new cylinder would not work. It just rotated in the column freely. So I put the original back in and everything was back to normal...albeit a bit of a wobbly key.
The only other thing that could be amiss is the ignition switch itself. It's operated by linkage between the plastic gear that rides on that slide mechanism that you see in your photo and the ignition switch itself which is located further down the column. But I'm pretty sure the key positions are governed by the lock cylinder itself. Sure they have to line up with contacts in the ignition switch, but the stops for each position are in the lock cylinder. So that brings us back to - are you sure your are using the correct lock cylinder for your year column?
Notice the difference in the collar, which affects the overall length of the lock cylinder. The non-vats one is shorter and will push too deep into the column. Like I said. I tried this. It appears to fit, but does not function properly. If you car is an 89 then it probably originally had the VATS key. The VATS system has more than likely been bypassed in your car by a previous owner, but you may still need to use the VATS lock cylinder. I know I did.
Notice the difference in the collar, which affects the overall length of the lock cylinder. The non-vats one is shorter and will push too deep into the column. Like I said. I tried this. It appears to fit, but does not function properly. If you car is an 89 then it probably originally had the VATS key. The VATS system has more than likely been bypassed in your car by a previous owner, but you may still need to use the VATS lock cylinder. I know I did.
Okay i'll raise your bet. Then why can't i turn back with my pliers? No cylinder lock inserted. I just turn the "Bar" or cylinder bar with my pliers and i still can't do the backward motion. I can turn forward to ready, start with pliers, but still i can't turn back to "LOCK" position.
*EDIT* You know what, i will make a video, so i can explain what is going on.
Get under the dash and take off the ignition switch. Or better yet, remove the column from the car and do it on a bench. Then do your plier test again. If it still won't move far enough then you have something binding the linkage between the "cylinder bar" and the switch. If it does move to where you think it needs to be then the switch has something wrong with it. The rod linkage that leads to it is metal and the switch is mostly plastic. So it could be damaged plastic or a bent or binding rod.
But I still think once you sort that out you may find that the key does not operate as it should without knowing that you are using the correct lock cylinder for your year.
That little metal lever next to the key is the "key release".When they key stops, push that lever & it will allow the key/ign to rotate to off/access positions.
As for the starting w/out a key, that's probably a whole other issue.
07-29-2016, 01:04 AM
