Gallileo60

I know a bunch of you guys have swapped LT1's into your thirdgen, do you like it?? Any running good 1/4 mile times??? Anyone not like there swap??? Pro's?? Con's........Lets here some bragging, or some hate, either way..Thanks in advance.Tom

Im thinking of replacing my hi mileage 305 TBI with an Lt1 motor..Bad thing is I have alot invested in the little 305...Was planning on doing a 350, or 383 SBC, and using some of the 305 parts, headers, dizzy, etc....

diablizzard

iTrader: (8)

I hope I like the swap I'm doing, especially with all the time and money spent. your headers will work on the LT1

chevyowner02

iTrader: (3)

I like mine you can make some decent hp with it, but for what I have put in the lt1 I could have built a ls with double the hp.

KiLLJ0Y

iTrader: (1)

i love my LT1 swap... SOOO glad i got rid of that TPI.. i'll never do a TPI again, you really have to heavily modify the TPI to flow air to make power.

Carlos773

iTrader: (3)

Im in the same boat. LT1 over l98 but if i could do it over... 6.0 all the way.

cprmn14

iTrader: (3)

Sometimes I wish I would have went LS, but then again I like that I took the road less traveled by. LT1 swap is pretty up front and easy. Keep stock pan/accessories/intake

89rs454

Though i'm 90% done with my swap and haven't got to put many miles on her yet, i can honestly say i'm in love all over again with my car. It is now what it was supposed to be from factory lol.

kukerdan

iTrader: (1)

agreed.. when i finally lock the rear end down with a sick torque arm relocation/tranny crossmember setup, a posi, and sfc's i can finally floor it !... i dont know where the top is on this thing... it never stops pulling

BlueZee28

iTrader: (30)

You can keep stock third gen serpentine setup on an LT1??

rickyzZ28

iTrader: (4)

I think he may have been talking about stock LT1 accessories. I was always happy with my LT1 swap, but I was in search of more power and my dad just happened to buy a 91 vert so it was perfect for me to get rid of the LT1 stuff and start building a cammed LS1 for now. We are almost done with his swap and over the winter we are going to bolt on a supercharger he bought on the dump rack at summit for $1000 bucks.

kukerdan

iTrader: (1)

happy happy happy... gotta lock that rear end down

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

Yes and no, honestly depends which way you go with it....

Nice....

FSTFBDY

iTrader: (33)

Like mine. but if I t wasnt built like it is Id have went with a 40x cub LSx on boost.
When / i this lt1 dies Thats the way Im gonna go next build.

Z28 MeTaL HeAd

Overall, i'm pretty ecstatic, but I went the road even far less traveled by most when it comes to LT1 swappers.


Carb converted LT1 in an early 3rd gen with T56.


I modified an Edelbrock Victor Jr SBC intake to accept the LT1 head to intake bolt pattern and then dropped an HEI distributor in the back.

Here's my list of mods and what my car has ran so far.

-1995 F-Body LT1 stock shortblock
-hand ported my stock '643' casting heads myself
-Victor Reinz 0.26" head gaskets
-Lloyd Elliot Custom Grind cam 228/236 .595/.595 110LSA
-Comp 977 valve springs & 10* Titanium locks and retainers
-Comp chromemoly 1-piece pushrods
-Comp pro-mag 1.6" roller-tip rockers
-Holley 750DP carb
-Holley 'blue' electric fuel pump and dead-head regulator
-Hedman 68460 1 5/8" 3rd gen Long tube headers
-Custom 2.5" to 3" y-pipe
-Magnaflow 3" catback
-Stock T56 from 95 F-Body
-Stock LT1 flywheel
-Spec 3 clutch
-LS1 aluminum driveshaft
-4th gen PBR 10-bolt disc rear-end w/ 4.10 Richmond gears
-Lakewood boxed LCA's w/ poly bushings
-BMR LCARB's
-Stock torque arm w/ Poly bushing
-Eibach Pro-Kit springs


I went 12.4 @ 114.2MPH with a mediocre 1.8 60'. I was taking it easy on the launch and the car was running PIG rich. Id liek to also note that my Camaro has NO weight reduction, full interior, stock K-member, ALL the accessories...Im still running stock crank pulley and stock LT1 mechanical water pump.

Anyways i always took it easy off the line, like 2500-3000k clutch dumps at the most because i was worried i would grenade the 10-bolt...but one day we trailered my car to the track and I let her eat on ET Street from almost 5k...lifted the front left tire off the ground and then power shifted into 2nd and KA-BANG. LS1 driveshaft twisted like a pretzel...10-bolt broke...dented the rear floor and smashed up the magnaflow 3" I-pipe.


Needless to say, it would've been an easy 11 second pass, but other things broke.

freaky

z28 metalhead thanks for posting . i been considering doing exactly what you did with the carb an dizzy . you have inspired me to continue with that plan in the spring .

Z28 MeTaL HeAd

Awesome man. You will have fun and love every minute of it, I'll gaurantee you. I have lots of videos and track experience with my car and I can offer a lot more info too.

Just FYI, I had the LT1 in my car without the ported heads and a much smaller cam before too.

Originally I had a 100% stock LT1 longblock with nothing nothing more then a comp cams SBC roller cam. It was a Comp XR270 218/224 @0.50 .497/.502 lift on a 110lsa. Heads were never off the block, stock everything else with the exception to the valve train to accommodate the cam and of course my custom modified Victor Jr intake and a smaller 650 double pumper carb along with 3.42 stock gears.

With that setup my car laid down 341rwhp and 347rwtq cometely untuned. My AFR's were pegged at 10.0. I went to the track and ran an extremely traction limited 13.2 @ 112mph with a BEST 60' time of 2.6.

I later popped one of the stock head gaskets and when I tore it down I decided to port the stock heads myself (more so port matching the intake runners and smoothing out the casting imperfections then anything) and put the bigger LE custom grind cam in and slap the 4.10's in the rear.

I'll note that I went 13.2 @ 112 with the small cam and stock longblock in the extreme cold of last October here in Toronto Canada then I ran 12.4 @ 114 this summer in the high heat and extreme humidity, so Im sure when I go back in a couple weeks the car will trap 116-118mph with this better air.

freaky

sounds great very good info . is your suspension stock still ? what if any problems did you encounter switching over to this setup ?

cprmn14

iTrader: (3)

Yes I meant LT1 acc., sorry for the confusion Blue

Z28 MeTaL HeAd

I listed my suspension in the list of mods. But here's the list of just the suspension pieces I had on the car when i ran the 12.4 @ 114.2.

-Eibach Pro-Kit lowering Springs
-Monroe Sensa-Trac OE replacement shocks in front
-4th gen 'DeCarbon' shocks in rear
-Lakewood boxed LCA's with poly bushings in Lowest hole on the relocation brackets
-BMR LCA Relocation Brackets
-Hotchkis double adjustable panhard bar
-36/24 Iroc-Z Sway bars
-Iroc-Z Wonderbar
-Stock torque arm w/ Energy Suspension poly mount
-Energy Suspension poly sway bar mounts and end-links front and back
-UMI Subframe Connectors


The only "problem" I encountered was with the alternator. I have aftermarket 'bowtie' valve covers and the stock alternator would not fit up high on the passenger side's stock location. Stock LT1 valve covers have a notch cut into them from the factory on the passenger side to allow clearance for the alternator so what I did since my car is factory Non-AC, as I mounted the alternator down where the stock LT1 A/C compressor would be. I trimmed the accessory bracket to allow the alternator to come as close to the bracket as possible and then bolted on a piece of angle iron on the top side to use as the alternators top mount. Then i picked up a stock replacement tensioner pulley and bolted it to the bottom bolt hole mounting location for where the stock alternator mounted too.

If you do this, it's easy to get serpentine belts too. A stock Honda S2000 belt fits, so will a stock E46 BMW M3 belt. Either will work but the S2000 belt was almost $10 cheaper for some reason?

Anyways, thats what I did, and doing it this way you dont need the LT1 A/C Delete bracket/pulley setup AND you get to clean up the front of the motor. I no longer have that big nasty looking alternator sitting up top of the engine. Everything else is wired exactly like a regular SBC would be wired in a 3rd gen.

freaky

thanks again for all the info .

Firebat

iTrader: (7)

Mostly happy with everything. Stock optisparks are ok and a lot last well over 100k miles. However, I don't like the location of the optispark along with the fragile rotor that is held down by tiny bolts. I would have went a LS1 computer system but it required changing parts in my older 4l60e, and without updating the 4l60e the cost and complexity was already high. Here is a preview of my TPI distributor with an optispark disc and sensor. About 85% done in the photos. I'll post more photos and information when I get it finished.

Z28 MeTaL HeAd

That looks incredibly ingenious...

Curious though, aside from the location change (being in the standard SBC location and not under the water pump) how would this be any more reliable then an original optispark setup?

Pocket

iTrader: (24)

Odd

If using a dist, why not keep the stock 4x behind the timing cover and use a stock SBC vortec dist for the cam pick-up. No fabbing (aside from cutting a hole in the intake) and same end result (LSx PCM). The Opti's high/low resolution signals from the cam sensor are not compatible with LSx systems anyways. Whats wrong with your old 4L60E? 94's did not have PWM which is simply a cell change in the tune to disable codes and commands related

Firebat

iTrader: (7)

It is possible to make the optispark sensor compatible with LSx but a custom lasercut optispark disc would have to be made. However, I'm not trying to do that:
http://ls1tech.com/forums/lt1-lt4-mo...dded-opti.html

The 96+ 4L60E has a different kind of 3-2 solenoid than the 95. The 3-2 solenoid can't just be swapped, other parts that work with it must also be swapped to 96-97 such as the valve body, separator plate, and internal wire harness. The LSx PCM can run a 4L60E before 96 but the 4L60E might eventually have problems. It seems risky to not swap these parts. It's a newer and questionable issue that has surfaced with LSx computer conversions.

http://ls1tech.com/forums/lt1-lt4-mo...estions-2.html
http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/lt1-lt...questions.html

Only the 96-97's had the 4x reluctor along with a timing cover to hold the 4x sensor. Not hard to install but could never run a double roller timing chain in the future unless I wanted to buy the expensive aftermarket machined timing cover because the reluctor takes up some space. Also would need the 96-97 hub because its a different length than the 93-95.

With the LSx-vortec dizzy pcm setup-
-buy all those 96-97 LT1/4L60E parts and install
-open up my built transmission and swap parts out of it
-buy a 0411 pcm and buy a basic tune
-rewire/repin about 100 wires
-install rear distributor
-might need an aftermarket balancer with timing marks just to double check timing?
-buy an optispark timing cover plug and bolt it on in place of the optispark.
-The Cons: costs me twice as much as my modded opti setup, requires more down time on the car for the install, more difficult to install, could not run a double roller timing chain in the future with stock timing cover

With the modded opti TPI dizzy setup
-also install a rear dizzy
-also buy an optispark timing cover plug and bolt it on in place of the optispark
-buy an aftermarket balancer with timing marks and install
-Fabricate the distributor internals but once it is done then would just install it. The parts inside the distributor cost next to nothing but take time to make
-The Cons- It won't gain the benefits of the LSx pcm, still has the opti internals, takes time to fabricate the distributor.

Location is what makes it more reliable. The rotor would be a better part but that's kind of location related. Could say that the billet dizzy is better than the stock plastic-dummy-shaft for the oil pump gear but that's more making the LT1 engine more reliable, not the optispark.

Pocket

iTrader: (24)

So its a refitted opti in a different location. Gotcha now

Thanks for the info. I havent heard any of the 4L60E issues, even from LSx guys using LT1 trannys. Mkos did the same and I havent seen any issues from him. Ill look into it further

New2Chevy

iTrader: (11)

I am happy to be doing an LT1 swap. I'll be happy when it's DONE. It's my first V-8 project ever.

Keeping the fuel injection. Ditching the rotor in the optispark and going LTCC ignition. Going with a built T56, 4.10's, beefed up 4th gen 10-bolt with posi, until it breaks, Dyno Dons Headers, new torque arm and crossmember setup, and Lloyd Elliott heads and his cam recommendation (244/254 with + .6" lift and 110 lobe sep)--stroked to 383 cubes and 12.4ish to 1 compression.

I'm hoping it all works well and really puts some power down to the ground.

It should be a tad more fun than the 305 tpi I had in there before.

Z28 MeTaL HeAd

So I said I would post Engine bay pics of my car but I haven't gotten around to taking pictures....but here's a little walk around video of my carb converted LT1 swapped 1984 Camaro Z28.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xiKtVuo-ARA


Specs:

-95 LT1 Shortblock 100% stock
-643 LT1 heads ported myself
-LE Custom Grind cam 228/236 110LSA .595/.595 lift
-Comp pro-mag 1.6" roller rockers
-Edelbrock Victor Jr SBC intake manifold self-modified/drilled to accept LT1 bolt pattern
-Holley 750DP carb
-Holley 'blue' external electric pump and regulator
-Alternator relocated to where the A/C compressor is on LT1's
-Hedmen 68460 Long Tubes w/ Custom y-pipe
-Magnaflow 3" Catback
-T56 6-speed
-Spec 3 Clutch
-1LE Driveshaft
-Moser 9" w/ 3.75 gears, 31 spline axles and Spool
-BMR Extreme chassis mounted TQ arm

I ran 12.4 @ 114 w/ the 10-bolt that had 4.10's in it on a soft launch. First time i tried to really launch the car the DS and rear end broke at the same time.

New2Chevy

iTrader: (11)

Nice video man. I also watched your dyno video. I am still a firm believer in fuel injection, but hey power is power. 347 torque is pretty nice on a stock LT1 with a carb. Nice job!

I am frickin' DYING to get my LT1 finished and dynoed just for fun. One day.

Z28 MeTaL HeAd

Yes sir, but that dyno was at the beginning of the summer before I blew a head gasket. It was with the stock Heads and a small cam.

She should be in the 420rwhp range now with the compression bump (Victor Reinz .026" head gaskets) and the ported heads and this LE cam.


Im also a fan of EFI and I had everything to convert my car to LT1 EFI but I ended up taking the car to a different direction. I dont regret it one bit.

Next time however I will build a LSx EFI setup...but for now this will do. The car should be good for some 11 second passes N/A and 10's with a little shot.

New2Chevy

iTrader: (11)

Yeah an LSX swap would be nice, too.

Yep, power is power. 11 seconds would be just fine....plenty fast.

Oh ok so the "specs" section is the NEW setup? I just now figured that out...duh.

You have a better rear end and that's good.

Also, are you sure you wouldn't rather just have the heads milled down, rather than increasing compression with just a head gasket swap? I know it's cheaper just to swap gaskets, but I think milling the heads is the way to go.

That's just my rookie opinion....he he he.

Either way, I look forward to seeing what she puts down with your changes, and I am curious about how that Spec clutch will hold up. I'm going with a RAM clutch on Bruce Hawkin's recommendation

KiLLJ0Y

iTrader: (1)

you'll like the LT1 even more when you do an LTCC, i finally finished my swap last week, been working on the body... it cured a 5200rpm hiccup ive had, thing ran smooth and sweet to 6400 where i set the soft rev limit..

LT1 swap is very under rated in my book and its very cheap compaired to the new LSx's. Would i want an LSx over the LT1? sure, who wouldnt?? but its a very nice upgrade..

I look at the LT1, as a mini-rammed reverse cooled SBC.. (which in reality thats exactly what it is) and it came with aluminum heads.

Z28 MeTaL HeAd

No no, I think you might be confused slightly. I'm explaining to you what I have done to my car already since that dyno video. The dyno day my car had the following...

-Stock 1995 LT1 Long block
-Comp Cams XR270 Camshaft for OE Roller SBC's

I never even had the heads off the block. I put that cam in because that's what I had laying around. Aside from that cam, the motor had 100% stock internals, only that cam and valvetrain was upgraded to handle the cam.

About 1 month after the dyno day, my driver side head gasket blew. Instead of just replacing the 1 head gasket and calling it a day, i took it a step further. I picked up another set of '643' casting LT1 heads and I ported them myself in my Garage with my dremel. Then i picked up the LE cam from a member on LS1tech for a deal I couldnt pass up. I spoke to Lloyd and he said this cam should work really well with a stock short block LT1 with a slight compression bump and it'll be hit or miss as to how well it will work though depending on how my port work turned out.

Considering I did the porting myself and Im not a pro, you tell me. My car ran 12.4 @ 114mph with my homemade ported heads and that cam with the 10-bolt with 4.10 gears. And that was in the dead heat of the hot and humid summer in July. Im sure the car will trap ~118mph now in this cold air and a low DA, i dont doubt that for a second. Not to mention when i went to the track last time my AFR's were ~11.0-11.4 WOT...i have since leaned it out a bit and i WAS seeing 12.4 WOT now...

New2Chevy

iTrader: (11)

I edited my posting after you quoted it...I realized that you already changed some things.

I leave my porting to Lloyd, so I know it'll work great. Your portwork may provide better flow, but I don't know for sure.

You'll still make more power than you are now, though.

New2Chevy

iTrader: (11)

I agree with you! The only problem with the LT1 is the optispark. This is why I purchased LS1 coils and the LTCC box and harness.

I won't have to worry about spark.

I am frickin' dying to get my engine and tranny done and get my car running. I'm waiting and waiting.

Still gotta pay Lloyd for my heads and Hawks for my T56 rebuild.

Z28 MeTaL HeAd

I see that..

I prefer A.I. for porting to be honest. Just about every LT1 w/ A.I. ported heads seem to make the numbers and perform exactly like they advertise. I can't say the same for LE setups as they seem to be hit or miss, HOWEVER, I am a big fan of his cam grinds and he offers great advice.

In terms of portwork though...I think what my car has ran speaks for itself. Hand ported stock castings and my car trapping 114+ MPH is pretty impressive in itself I'd say. A lot of LE2 heads/cam stock bottom cars are posting similar times. A guy on my local Fbody forum has LE2 heads with an even bigger LE cam then mine and he ran the exact same time as me, both 6-speed.

v10viper04

What was your compared trap speeds? Trap speeds show a car's potential. 1/4 mile time shows how well you can drive...

New2Chevy

iTrader: (11)

I was going to use AI but it sucked trying to get ahold of them and they are more expensive than Lloyd.

I never saw any complaints about LE heads.

It's just gonna be a fun street car so I'm sure I'll be happy.

v10viper04

I love how this is the common view on the LT vs LS. The LS is a great engine but it's not going to make "Double" the HP. Also I have no idea where you guys get the idea that LS1's are cheaper. They are horrendously expensive to build. (Unless its a 5.3 or 6.0) Then i'm sure it would be about even with a 350 sbc. I have seen many LT1 cars run with LS1 cars with similar mods. Considering all the cocky LS guys out there I will do my best to stay away from that platform and be the underdog. Plus I love the look of the LT1. It's also been argued there is no aftermarket support for the LT1 which is COMPLETELY untrue. It's a gen-1 bottom end so those choices are literally endless, You can get get just about anything else you want for it. The LT1 intake manifold is da** good stock so whats the point in replacing it. The factory heads can be ported out to flow very very well. Not as much as the LS heads but it's also a newer generation of motor I would hope it could... Also the Optispark is not as bad as everyone says it is either. The last optispark I changed lasted me 150k. ORIGINAL unit and cap & Rotor. They are also not as hard to change as everyone thinks or as I once thought. I can change my opti in an hour or two, MAX. I do see the LS as a superior engine yes but for the price difference I will not be going LS1. 6.0 if I ever do decide to go that route. I LOVE my LT1, pulls all the way through the RPM band and doesn't die up top. Love it, Love it, Love it!

KiLLJ0Y

iTrader: (1)

Umm FYI, the lt1 block is a gen II block with reverse cooling, not the same as an sbc gen I, the crank and rods are the same though if that's what you were getting at.

v10viper04

Ummm FYI I know that. I never stated anything other than the bottom end was gen-1 sbc. Reverse cooling is another factor that actually quite positive about the LT1. Yes that's what I meant.

KiLLJ0Y

iTrader: (1)

Hahaha calm down little camper, didn't state that as though you were stupid or dont know what you're talking about, some people on here actually think the blocks are the same

v10viper04

Sorry man, a lot of people on here think everyone is stupid. Kind of a natural reaction for me. haha Yea I know what you mean. For as many people there are smart on here there are twice as many who have no idea what they are doing but talk like they do and spread bad information. Didn't mean to lash out, just protecting my intelligence. haha I still love my LT1 though!!!

New2Chevy

iTrader: (11)

I'm sure I'll be happy with mine.

KiLLJ0Y

iTrader: (1)

When mine was drive able, it kicked ***. Now that I've torn into the interior and sanded the paint I'm dying to drive it again.

Might I make a suggestion to people thinking about the LT1, if you are going that route, do a cam change before install, doesn't have to be a donkey dong cam, seal you GM opti with silicone, replace your rear main seal, and for love of all that's holy, don't waste your money on a 58mm Tb.

Pocket

iTrader: (24)

It wouldnt hurt to do all the timing cover seals while its out. They're loads of fun to replace in-car

chevyowner02

iTrader: (3)

Did not mean really double.
But I'll admit the LS mod for mod will have the upper hand.

v10viper04

Slightly but yes. haha Depends on the mod really. Certain things do more on the LT1 than the LS1 and vice versa.

evilemokid94

iTrader: (6)

ah seeing these post make me really excited to be doing an lt1 swap this year or next year!! i cant wait

evilemokid94

iTrader: (6)

what are some of the better/best mods for these? im going to do a complete tear down and rebuild

New2Chevy

iTrader: (11)

Well Evil emo dude, here is what I am doing with my LT1:

-All forged 383 rotating assembly-Howards Cams Track Smart forged 4340 steel crank (best crank $560 can buy and made in the USA by Callies)
-Keeping the pistons .010 in the hole and using a .030 head gasket
-12.4:1 compression with Mahle 5cc flat tops
-Compstar forged 6" rods
-LE2 heads with 55cc combustion chambers, Manley Street Flo valves, Patriot Gold springs, Scorpion Aluminum 1.6 roller rockers (self aligning)
-LE Intake
-LE cam (Comp grinds them for him) 244/254 .608 .608 110
-LTCC ignition conversion
-Johnson Heavy Duty ("anti pump up") Hydraulic Roller Lifters
-studded two bolt mains
-Pioneer "keyed" balancer hub (so the balancer won't slip)
-Rev limiter set at 6800ish
-No A/C, no egr, no emissions crapola
-custom tri-y headers
-All in front of a built T56
-410 gears and tru track posi for the rear (contemplating doing a custom 8.8 inch rear though)

That's basically it. I still have my doubts about the reverse cooling and aluminum heads being able to "compensate" for the 12.4:1 compression on pump premium, but both Lloyd Elliott and AI told me don't worry about it--they see it all the time with no problems. We shall see. Plus I am running the LT4 knock sensor It should pull like a freight train though. That's what I want.

I was talking to the guy at AI once, and I told him I wanted 11.5:1 compression, and he said, "If you're wanting to build a low compression engine, you might as well knock it down to 10:1 and look into getting a supercharger or some turbos for it." ha ha ha "OK, 12.4:1 it is then." I said.

It's no LS1 but I am looking forward to smoking guys in town who are always bragging about their LS1s and they're not even modded LS1s about which they are bragging either, which makes it even more fun. If my LT1 were stock, that'd be a different story. A stock LS1 will outperform a stock LT1, assuming both engines are running top notch.

That darn drive bearing for the water pump drive gear/shaft is a pain to find.. My builder says he can find one so he can press in a new one, since the engine isn't built yet and I might as well use a new one. Yeah LS1s are better, but I won't care that my engine is an "LT1" when I push the gas pedal.

Phew!! No more typing for me tonight.