Linson

Buck Nasty - the $2600 '98 Camaro SS Donor Car.


as raggedy as the car exterior looks (its plasti-dipped, poorly) and as shredded as the interior is, the engine looks really clean. the car runs and drives with no [engine] problems to report. its got 124k on it - just barely broken in, some would say.

Linson

INTENTION: street driven car. will likely never see a race track, mainly because there isnt one where i live. intend to humiliate the occasional late model Mustang, Camaro, Challenger, LS1 GTO, 4th gen (rare).

PERFORMANCE GOAL:
ideally, upwards of 400, up to 450 rear wheel horsepower, with fairly inconspicuous idle and a focus on preservation of low/mid range torque for the street.

INITIAL QUESTIONS:
replacing my 7k mile engine on my 37k mile car with a 124k mile engine, goes against my every instinct. yet, there are some who say that i ought to just put a top end on that motor and run it. thoughts?

when it comes to top end, i have been looking at this:
the 220/224 cam seems pretty streetable. i've seen it at idle on YouTube and it sounded fairly inconspicuous, and that was through an open cut-out. this kit runs like $3200 and i would still need to buy a FAST 90mm intake.

how close can i get to my goals, and for how much cheaper by going with "LS6 stuff" (243 heads, used LS6 intake (still not that much cheaper than a FAST from what i've seen)

a tuner near me recommended a later model ECM (said the '98s were kind of "dogs.") that could be had for cheap, i'm sure.

what is this **** i'm hearing about some '98 blocks being no good for builds due to some holes or oil passages that cause cracking?

Kingtal0n

http://ls1tech.com/forums/new-ls1-ow...ml#post1740880''

http://ls1tech.com/forums/racer-s-lo...-bodies-2.html

indebt

iTrader: (1)

Now buy a Procharger

QwkTrip

iTrader: (22)

You can make power with or without a stroker kit but the stroker will be more drivable. Strokers tend to be incredibly snappy with instant throttle response.

IROCZ1989

iTrader: (1)

124 in a truck is differnet than 124 in a camaro. Just broken in is funny. Its still 124,000. Plus in a camaro its hard miles Im sure of it. I still think you are leaving alot on the table with your tpi and crappy tunes. Why not call tpis? Id use a company that actually has tuned alot of these. For what you have, correctly running, your swap motor wont touch it.

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

124k Was pretty much where both of mine where when I unloaded them.

I've got a LS motor in the shop right now with about the same miles. Ran really nice, but has very very low compression.

But if he's gonna rebuild it anyway, why not.

-- Joe

Zach/90\irocZ

iTrader: (6)

100k Lsx motor depending on history of care are very good ones I've seen at least and people pop in cams no issues

But if your cracking open the engine mightest well rebuild keep in mind that there very little room for machining cylinder wall once it's done pretty much won't be able to hone again especially if cylinder wall gets damage another reason to go 99+ Ls1 is that there's more room for machine work

Also ls6 top end is best bag for buck and if you have extra take 243 heads to AI for some CNc porting and to honestly take advantage and get most out of your setup you can spend a little more and get Cam spec on for your needs or can go off the shelf it's up to you

Go over on to ls1tech you can find many deals on there

And talk to pat g and or predator pat g have to pay small fee to spec out and or recommend cam and predator does it for free as long you post results on ls1tech I had my cam spec out by EPS and can ran like stock but big power and easy on valvetrain etc

But your thoughts on right track


Not alot 383 due to the fact you can get a 6.0 or 6.2 blocks for same price or tad more and more room to grow

Granted if your just building one time then forget and leave it 383 could be a option if you want more cubis but I can't justify the price for power gain honestly and would just get larger block

Zach/90\irocZ

iTrader: (6)

http://www.superchevy.com/how-to/eng...-engine-build/

98 block can be honest out to maximum of .005 and 99+ .010 maybe tad more don't quote me on this have to find my book I had to verify 98 cylinder walls are thinner and oil passages are different in the rear aka smaller

Zach/90\irocZ

iTrader: (6)

http://ls1tech.com/forums/generation...y-mistake.html

http://www.hotrod.com/articles/max-o...for-ls-blocks/
Has pic comparison of rear oil passage

Linson

Thanks for that input, Zach.

for the path that i'm seeing, it may not matter about the year of this car/engine/ECM:
[A.C. Nutter] Nutter Race Engines (NRE) of Vancouver, WA, for $5,750 will sell me a complete rebuilt LS1 with '99+ ECM. he will give me a -$1,400 credit for my '98 LS1 core, putting me at $4,350. he will sell me an LS6 intake and 243 heads (with valve job) which he has on hand for fair market value - say $500 each, putting me up to around $5,350. ......$5,800 with tax.
included in that $5,800:
Rebuilt LS1
228/236 cam
LS6 heads
LS6 intake
[purportedly a consistent 475 crank horsepower combination]
tuned on an engine dyno (included)
tuning (for idle) once engine is in the car (free)

NRE is a very well renowned engine builder.
$5,800 doesn't sound "cheap" considering that there is more to be done: wiring, transmission, peripheral conversions. but it does sound fair for what seems like a good 400 rwhp. i am wondering how smooth of an idle can be had with that cam though.

thoughts?

Zach/90\irocZ

iTrader: (6)

Pretty average Cam size so idle will be smooth and it's all in the tune for idle as well

Price sounds pretty good and as far as ls engine builders you get what you pay for but that's around average for ls1 build and is prob on cheaper side look at Texas speed for there short blocks and or long blocks

My cam I had spec was around that size



Idle on my cam excuse dirty was sitting when I was deployed and started working on her when I got back

Zach/90\irocZ

iTrader: (6)

Your getting alot for the price IMO

for transmission are you staying auto or going t56 if staying auto and If doner is a auto I would just rebuild the trans for now I rebuild it myself and it's not that bad honestly same as a 700r4 as far rebuilding and would save up if you want to do a 6 speed swap later down road money Dave can get yourself a small stall converter and other parts for swap

Linson

I have a 2800 stall Vigilante on the 700R4 that's on the car. Precision Industries will change the stall on it for free. AFAIK the converter is interchangeable between a 700R4 and a 4L60E.

Zach/90\irocZ

iTrader: (6)

Ls1 4l60e converter is slightly different than sbc 4l60e converter which is same as 700r4 minus electronics

You probably know this but spec stall on converter depending on cam choice I had 3600 stall on mines

https://m.summitracing.com/parts/sum...FZQbgQodnloPpA

http://ls1tech.com/forums/conversion...questions.html

Z28FAST1

If i had that $6k engine budget I would buy a LS3 crate engine: http://www.jegs.com/i/Chevrolet-Perf...01358/10002/-1

LS376/480 376ci / 6.2L Engine
495 HP @ 6200 RPM
473 ft/lbs TQ @ 5000 RPM

GM Warranty

Engine Includes:
• Fully GM assembled long block
• Ignition Coils, Plug Wires and Spark Plugs
• Oil pump, pick-up and Camaro oil pan
• Exhaust Manifolds
• Intake, Injectors and Throttle Body
• 14” Auto Trans Flexplate
• Harmonic Balancer
• Front timing cover
• Aluminum Water Pump
• Oil Filter
• Passenger Side RH Oil Dipstick and Tube


Just a thought.

Also, I picked up a zero mile H/C LS1 longblock for considerably less than $6k. Just have to browse the classifieds for deals.

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

I'd do a quick paint job on the 4th gen, sell it, and buy a blower for the thirdgen.

But what do I know.

-- Joe

Zach/90\irocZ

iTrader: (6)

Valid point z28fast.

Texas speed has good deals to and includes Cam of choice for long block can swap ls1 stuff over and sell his short block as well either way he be happy with what ever he decides but I'll lean towards lsx tho lol

https://www.texas-speed.com/c-3189-e...t-to-suit.aspx

Linson

So it begins...

Just put a deposit on my LS...

No, not an LS1

No, not an LS6

No, not a stroker...

Going with an LS3 from Nutter Racing Engines in Vancouver, WA

$8250.00 - less $1400.00 for Buck Nasty's LS1 core.

$6850.00 - here's what I get:

Brand New LS3 - new block, new intake, new everything

Dyno Tested 550 HP combination - wouldn't tell me the exact specs on cam, but the intake duration in in the low 230's

Free idle tuning once engine is installed in the car

Price includes ECU

Price includes wiring harness - which makes the LS3 a cheaper proposition than the LS6 stroker.

It all sounds like a really good deal to me, and A.C. Nutter's reputation is impeccable.

QwkTrip

iTrader: (22)

That's going to be a street thumper!
It is only parts hoarding if you don't use the parts.

Zach/90\irocZ

iTrader: (6)

Hopefully a t56 or atleast upgraded auto not 700r4 and higher stall lol

not bad deal for what you getting

Made a wise decision my friend once complete you will have big smile feeling like the joker

Z28FAST1

Great choice.