355sleeper

iTrader: (4)

this will be the official thread where i post all my pictures and progress. the build will be over the next couple months, if i wasnt buying a house now it would go a lot faster.

the motor will be powered by twin t70s so i have room to grow in the future as well. it will be ran on e85 and im shooting for around 600 to 650 to the rear tires.

i ordered my bottom end today and already have the motown 220 heads and victor jr intake. im waiting until i get the pistons to see where they sit in the bore before i order headgaskets.

things i need to pick up

a1000 pump and regulator
ignition set up
blow through carb- will be carb shop
turbos, intercooler and bonnet
lastly a custom solid roller cam

the rest is odds and ends that i wont bother to list, but i know they will add up quickly.

i will be posting up pics of the motor teardown and buildup as well as pics of the car.

somewhere during the process of the build the car will be getting paint(crimson red metallic).

my goal for the car is to run at least bottom 10s and be very streetable.


i just finished the front suspension. it is 100% new parts including, poly bushings, new center link, idler arm, tie rods, sleeves, ball joints, calipers, s10 steering box, lakewood 90/10s, and moroso trick springs. the suspension is no longer spongy and easy to push down. im hoping i wont have traction problems when its all together.

stay tuned!

FSTFBDY

iTrader: (33)

should be nice. and surpass your HP goals.
I seen the title and thought ohhh someone gunning to Justins car.. lol

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Good plan so far. Could try the newer magnum t67's for that goal. Spool abit faster. If you do 70's for 600's whp, run a tight a/r housing. Should be in full boost by 4000 rpm and spooling by 3200 lol have fun

Make sure the block checks out at the machine shop for cylinder wall thickness. Keep rpms fairly low, no more than 6000 or so and it will live for abit. 600 whp need to be careful with factory blocks

355sleeper

iTrader: (4)

for a min i thought you were talking about me as my name is also justin lol

also im not worried about the factory block the 14:1 406 got revved to 9200 rpms when i sprayed 250 lol

355sleeper

iTrader: (4)

Stripped the engine to the bare block tonight, glad i did because the engine bearings had some pretty bad grooves in them. So i will wait to order bearings until its all machined.

Second pic is how it sits now and third is how it looked before i pulled the 355

355sleeper

iTrader: (4)

ordered some other stuff today, oil pan, oil pump, main studs(originally going to use bolts) and the 10an oil drain kits(vibrant not ebay)

on a side note if anyone is interested in the cam that came out of the motor, pm me

link to old cam

http://www.lunatipower.com/Product.aspx?id=1992&gid=290

355sleeper

iTrader: (4)

just ordered the weld els, 2.5 pipe, t4 flange, and tial 38 mm wastegate flange to make the driver side header. i will be cutting off and welding shut the crossover pipe provision on the bbs header.

im about to order the turbos also, are these 2 ok?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/T70-TURBO-TU...70766880859%26


this is all i will be ordering for a little while then. aside from machine work and a cam i will have everything to get the engine built!

also what rear gear should i use? i will be running a pg w/ brake and a 4k stall

fast82z

iTrader: (1)

I'm guessing your 9,200rpm said above is a typo since that cam would've nosed over 2000rpm before that. For the money a new cam would cost, I'd just use the one you have. The only stipulation would be to run turbos with fairly large turbines. The ebay link you have posted is for a 56.2mm compressor, not the 70mm you might think by the t70 they call it as. The turbine is also a t3 with an exducer of 58.3...too small.

Main things to look for is t4 turbine flange, 64.5mm or larger turbine exducer, a/r of .81-1. For your goals, any compressor attached to that spec of turbine will be more than enough, and I wouldn't bother with something any larger than a 72mm inducer. The specs of the motor you're posting should make it around mid-low 11's, so the turbos won't need to do much and that means you're going to need lots of wastegate. I'd say twin 44mm gates should be your minimum.

I've been working with a very similar setup as you're planning, but with a goal of being able to run an 8.50e.t. I have yet to achieve that, but I've learned along the way many things that don't work. This comming season is looking like victory.

355sleeper

iTrader: (4)

i didnt say i used that cam to rev that high, i used a different cam. as you can imagine leaving at 5500rpms with a th400 and 4.88s it wound up pretty quick. off spray it was shifted at around 8k or so. on a 250 shot the car ran a best pass of 8.59@161

i would think that being a 406, and having a compression of 9.2 or so(have to wait to measure how far they are in/out of the hole they are) and running 20psi on e85 will net me better than low 11s. if its the turbos that will hold me back i will gladly spend the extra money.

fast82z

iTrader: (1)

How that should've read is that your motor specs, not including the turbos, should get you mid-low 11's. The turbos will then take it from there. Running 20psi on the engine you have planned should be easy low 9's if not faster.

355sleeper

iTrader: (4)

how about 2 of these then?

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/tnt-11226

sorry, i misunderstood completely lol, thanks for clarifying

sorry, this will help more so

http://turboneticsinc.com/store/inde...&product_id=80

fast82z

iTrader: (1)

If those heads are iron, you're probably good staying around mid 9's for compression. I have aluminum heads running e85 and am in the process of making it 10.5:1, and have seen some go into the 11's while still boosting.

They're a bit overkill as twins, mostly because of the turbine side being larger than most, but search for a "gt45 1.05". I've had these a few years, and there still doesn't look to be any better of a deal out there. There would be no problems launching against a 4000 stall. This is another fighting point of mine since I really like the tightness of my 3200 stall.

If you'd like something that spools faster, then something like that turbonetics would be better but would also not be as capable on the top-end. Cxracing or Cxmotorsports sells 67mm and 72mm turbos at a good price that work well also. Your motor would be more happy with a .81 or .96 a/r on them instead of the .68 they more often list with those, but none of those options would make a drastic difference.

For gears you'll probably want something like 3.0-3.5, maybe a 3.7 if you're running 30" tall tires.

355sleeper

iTrader: (4)

sounds great, i will definetly be buying a thinner gasket then. i am not really in a rush to but it together but since i have it all tore apart id like to get it back together asap to avoid surface rust. so i will be ordering the turbos in the next 2-3 weeks. i will probably go with those t67s and not look back

after realizing this will make WAY more power than i am anticipating i just ordered a set of eagle h beams and will talk to dad about giving me his callies crank and splayed 400 block

project89

iTrader: (1)

those turbos are the same size fasteddi started with on his v6 way to small

355sleeper

iTrader: (4)

Now i have to pull another engine as im now using a callies magnum crank and a splayed factory block w/ billet caps. It is as close to a dart block as i can come without spending the money on one

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

What motor is that, 350 block based?

355sleeper

iTrader: (4)

No factory 400 block 4.155 bore and 3.75 stroke w/5.7 rod

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Oh ok. Sounds good. Bottom end is more than enough for your goals

355sleeper

iTrader: (4)

Im hoping so, i dont want to have to worry about it. I would have been second guessing myself with the eagle i beams

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Eagle h beams have held 1200 hp

355sleeper

iTrader: (4)

thats good to hear, the EXPECTED ship date on the pistons are the 19th of this month. thats a ways away.

before i have the heads drilled for steam holes, i want to make sure, do i need them drilled on a forced induction engine?

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

I believe on any factory 400 block you do but others should chime in on that.

What pistons you order?

355sleeper

iTrader: (4)

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/dm...5/applications

these pistons

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Hmmm never heard of DSS. Should work i guess

355sleeper

iTrader: (4)

they are mostly mustang parts, i was shocked when i seen they started selling chevy pistons. they are very reputable and are the go to place for sbf stroker engines

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

That would explain it. I know nothing of ford parts lol

fast82z

iTrader: (1)

Sounds like they say they work, but I think most prefer 2618 alloy. Those have quite a dish on them, probably gotta do all you can to get back some compression. I know mine hasn't worked well at all running 8.5:1

355sleeper

iTrader: (4)

assuming zero deck and .040 gasket it will be 9.25 static

355sleeper

iTrader: (4)

are these headgaskets what i need for bore size?

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/sce-s11154

or do i need ones that are a 4.160 bore to have some void?

also instead of a glide i will be running a th400 and the same 4k stall.

355sleeper

iTrader: (4)

also i decided to go with the 7268 turbonetics, should i go with the .81 or .96 housings? and would there be much difference in spool time vs top end performance on the two housings?

thanks,
justin

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Generally dont want the head gasket to overhang the bore and also not overfil the head chamber area. 4.155 should work. 4.160-4.200 also could work. 4.155 sounds like a good fit tho. I believe i ran 4.160 on my 4.125" bore and everything worked well. Nothing overhang and it sealed well.

If you go 7268 for twins, id go .81 ar or even smaller. For your hp goal they are way overkill. That should be enough for 1000 whp. I run .96 ar and dont see full boost by 4500. Its all top end and is abit laggy with my low stall. .81 would be better for me but not available. .68 would criple top end too much. A 400 passes alot of air over 6000 rpm. .96 is best for 7k rpm operation imo. Seen them work well up that high on big inch motors. 600 whp like my old combo used .68's and spooled in the low 3000 rpm range and was in full boost by 3800-4000. Near instant spool and i shifted by 5500 lol

355sleeper

iTrader: (4)

since the bottom end is no longer a concern i will have no problem revving to 7k, i will stick with the .81 housings then

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Make sure you size everything else for the power levels now. Fuel pump carb or efi, etc. make sure the converter can handle it. I wouldnt rev factory block that high making that much power and expect long term use out of it. You can make 9 sec power under 6000 rpm lol thats alot easier on the mains but still tough on a factory block.

7k rpm with cam big enough to hold hp peaks in that range will likely make 800 whp on 14-15psi with decent heads. Thats a stout motor

355sleeper

iTrader: (4)

The block is the least of my worries that car that ran 8.59 above used a factory 2bolt main 400 and used stock main bolts revving past 9k rpms. This was in a 4k pound "street car." The motor held together for 5 years before a hg let loose and the main and rod bearings were perfect. Now that same block has been splayed and will be used in this build.

Anyways 600whp was just a conservative goal, if it makes 800 to the wheels i wont be dissapointed and if the block cracks i will go aftermarket. I wont be out much. As far as converter i will be using a converter with ballooning plates

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Thats the highest hp stock block i ever heard of. Lol


Thats the thing with turbos.... Leaves you wanting more boost more power and its just a turn of a **** away. I do not know ANYONE who has done a build and not increased their boost and hp goals over their original plan

TTOP350

iTrader: (8)

Make sure they are the New design, (they should be) the older sbf stuff had slots (instead of the drilled holes) in the oil ring lands and we had a BUNCH of supercharged, turbo motors crush them and ruin motors befor they fixed the pistons.

355sleeper

iTrader: (4)

Thanks ttop350 ill check into when i get the


Justin let me rephrase that, the block was all stock, but had callies crank,eagle h beams and je pistons. Main bolts and block were only stock

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Oh i understand that part but the block and main caps are still oem which surprises me. I know my buddy's 406 with 700 hp from nitrous turning 7000 rpms for 5 yrs finally let go. Cracked the block down lifter valley. Still was running tho and went into the 9's before pulling for dart block. Even with 4 bolt splayed aftermarket block is still showing signs of caps walking. Figured factory block would die quick at 9k rpm and enough hp to shove 4000 lbs into the 8's. Only car i know that heavy running 8.6's put down 1200 whp. Would never imagine a prepped factory block to hold.

If it does thats awesome. It would hold for you at lower power as long as tune is spot on

355sleeper

iTrader: (4)

Im hoping it holds, ur making me doubt it now lol. Dad had another 406 that the internals came from and it blew a hg(ran VERY Agressive timing with n2o) and we didnt catch it because it ran well still, by the time we pulled heads between cylinders 3 and 5 was a hole burned through from crossfiring. Also trashed the head

355sleeper

iTrader: (4)

My one buddys uncle had a 502 that was using a stock.454 block and ran high 7s in a monza, he pulled the intake off and the block fell apart. Also cracked down the lifter valley

355sleeper

iTrader: (4)

well parts will be on hold for a while, i am putting a deposit on a house thursday. it sucks living in a place thats less than 800 square foot with my girlfriend and our 2 kids. it will be a nice change going to a 2k plus square foot house.

my local machine shop is pretty slow also so it will be at least a month before i see the short block

355sleeper

iTrader: (4)

Getting a lot in the mail lately waiting on the pistons to take it to the machine shop.

To save a little more money i will be using the 5500 converter. I will not take it that high on the stock rear. I will set 2 step much lower.

Anyway, im going a different route with a house so that frees up some money for me. I stopped at jegs in columbus today and got everything to finish the motor minus bearings and camshaft. Also picked up the jegster subframe connectors. I have to say they weigh quite a bit.

Justin, i will take your advise and go with the 67s in the. 81ar. It will still be plenty fast and i want it to hold together without having to dish out 2500 for a dart little m.

355sleeper

iTrader: (4)

Crank and splayed block

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

You will love that combo

355sleeper

iTrader: (4)

Got my headgaskets in the mail and i got a tracking number for the pistons, they will be here monday and everything will be going to the machine shop on Wednesday and i will be ordering my cam next week followed shortly by the turbos

The headgaskets have a nice thick metal ring that sticks up quite a bit. I shouldnt have to worry about these blowing at all

TTOP350

iTrader: (8)

Nope, you'll melt a piston b4 those let go. If everything is perfectly assembled.
I switched and use cometic gaskets these days.

355sleeper

iTrader: (4)

What do you guys think of the msd 7531 box and a standard pro billet distributor?

How can the box control the timing of a mechanical advance distributor. I realize there are stop bushings for the advance but how would it add timing?

355sleeper

iTrader: (4)

Got my pistons today and as you can see they are drilled not slotted

355sleeper

iTrader: (4)

took the short block and heads to the machine shop yesterday. today i put the subframe connectors on and i cant believe how much more rigid they made the car. i made it easy on myself and put it on the lift drilled all the holes and left all the bolts loose, lowered the car then tightened them all while the car was on the ground.

the machine shop told me that id have everything done within 1-2 weeks.

does anyone know how much it is to have a jones cam ground? it will be a retro fit solid roller.

then all i will need is turbos, ignition and fuel system and i can start it!!!!

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Hyd rollers were 312 and i think solid is about same depending on the core used.