Tony89GTA

iTrader: (7)

Well I been looking at ways to fix my belt problems and to work on ways to stiffen the bracket or make a new one all together and in my research I found this pretty cool video. Found it on a corvette forum but really shows how much the belt stretches, check out the movement on the tensioner!

Quote from the website
"Hey Everone,

Here is a video of a 2004 GTO A4 with a 383 stroker and a P1SC on the dyno. This video shows you how far the Tensioner travels.


Ian"

Tony89GTA

iTrader: (7)

This was something I tried to do years ago but the tensioner would twist and I gave up on it after the belts kept coming off. Looked good in theory, I might give this another go with one of the procharger tensioners I see on the newer cars, I'm sure they can be ordered separate from the kit. After seeing that video it makes me want to make this work.

This is what the stock bracket looks like.


The tensioner I had ordered




basically I drilled on hole in the bracket for the tensioner location nub


Mounted


In the car

Tony89GTA

iTrader: (7)

Here is a pic of the tensioner off a mustang 5.0L coyote kit, think this one would work lot better then the one I had and wont twist I don't think.

tom86iroc

iTrader: (1)

WOW that tensioner travels a ton!!!! I'm in the process of doing a cog setup like some other guys have done on here just need to make up 1 more bracket stiffener like larry makes

DIGGLER

iTrader: (1)

i would love to see your cog setup when completed! i am working on one as well. its a 30mm cog on a vortech ysi. 72t lower, 30/28t upper. i am hoping it will live awhile, but i am told the belt will be maxed out at this level.

Tony89GTA

iTrader: (7)

I ordered up the tensioner setup now, there is multiple part numbers since it doesn't come as one unit. When it comes in I'll make sure to have plenty of pictures and a write up.

Part numbers for the 2011-2014 5.0L mustang tensioner system, should be for a 12 rib setup and could be also used for a 8 rib no doubt:

DM003I-007 Tensioner $129
DC004A-012 Pulley $112
WA08I-16-255 Tensioner washer
Had to order two shafts, since the guy didn't know which one is the proper size.
DM002I-045 Pulley Shaft $6
DM002I-014 Pulley Shaft $6

tom86iroc

iTrader: (1)

i'm in the process of making those 2 anti flex brackets that larry @ASSC made same exact setup a lot of these guys used here years ago the belt is 50mm wide I have an 80mm crank and 50 mm charger to start then i'm going 40mm for max boost and this is on an F1A

Tony89GTA

iTrader: (7)

Got my tensioner in, must say this thing is lot a bigger then I expected and really beefy, took me 3 hours trying to figure out how I'm going to fit it. I figured out is best to just reuse the upper idler pulley once you remove it, it's 2.25" compared to the 3" one that they sent. So that's one piece you wont need to order if this all works out I hope lol! You will also need a 2.25"x1/2" diameter bolt for mounting the pulley to the tensioner.







Looks like this can be used either way


This is where I'm probably going to put it, it's going to have to be put on after the main bracket is bolted up unfortunately. Still need to check the final fitment little more though.


One of my main problems is going to be dealing with the fan bracket, I decided to mount it on the opposite side of the rad bracket if it works out.

Tony89GTA

iTrader: (7)

Well this is a bummer, I had the tensioner almost installed then I went to see how much spring pressure there is and the bloody thing has very little play. It rotates halfway between the first and second marks. So disappointed right now cause this thing is so solid. So I took it apart to see what's up and it looks like the springs that are binding.

Guest

^^^Hey is your car still tpi? Pics of the setup, mods, psi and pulley size?

tom86iroc

iTrader: (1)

that sucks !!!! could you cut a loop or 2 off each spring? to give you a little more adjustment ? Just not sure how much tension it would loose by cutting the coils

Tony89GTA

iTrader: (7)

Mods are in my sig but this is what she looks like now, also I'm runing a 3.7" pulley with 10psi boost at around 6100rpm.

Tony89GTA

iTrader: (7)

I was thinking that but not sure how many coils I would need to hack off to make it work, maybe there is another spring I could put in there too. I'll have another look to see what could be done but thinking this idea might be a right off. Probably going to look into another tensioner from a 18 wheeler or something.

tom86iroc

iTrader: (1)

she's PURRRTY

TransAmGTA88

Have you tried calling procharger to see if they recommend a different set a springs based on our application? Sounds like you are on the path...interested to see how this plays out.

I also noticed in one of the pictures of the mustang how they have the inlet pipe (with the filter) almost touching the firewall...it would be nice to try and come up with some type of inlet pipe that would work for a cowl hood so a person isn't pulling header heat into the motor all the time.

Tony89GTA

iTrader: (7)

No I haven't, I kind of gave up on the procharger one and I ordered a dayco 89401 from eBay. The dayco one is probably going to need a spacer and new pulley but should fit better, hopefully it doesn't twist.

There were two guys in the past on here that used the cowl area for drawing air. I believe they even had a intake box and everything, looked pretty slick. I'm thinking of ideas to do the same with maybe a power buldge hood like on the formulas, or even cut in some sort of hood vent to draw air from. It definitely needs something if you looked at my intercooler post, I have all the temps showing.

tom86iroc

iTrader: (1)

on the sbc carb kits from Procharger they have a belt tensioner setup like what you are showing maybe that would work better

Tony89GTA

iTrader: (7)

Is this the one they use? I believe it would stick out to much from the looks of it if that's the case.

Tony89GTA

iTrader: (7)

Well I think I got something figured out with a dayco 89401 tensioner. I haven't had a chance to really test it other then in the driveway but if I rev it to 5k and the belt didn't come off.

Some pics for you guys.






The pulley is little to small for my 12 rib belt


Swapped it with the other pulley off my gates tensioner

tom86iroc

iTrader: (1)

NICE!!!!!!! hope that one works out for you. and yes that other procharger tensioner was the one I was talking about

Tony89GTA

iTrader: (7)

Judging from the construction of this dayco one I'm thinking it might, I don't see how this can twist like the gates one I bought. In a day or two I'll be able to ring her out and we'll see what happens, fingers are crossed...

TransAmGTA88

Awesome, can't wait to hear your results.

Tony89GTA

iTrader: (7)

SUCCESS! Third times a charm lol! I was able to pull 15-16 psi no problem with the 3.4" pulley. I even looked at my pre intercooler boost reading and it must have been 18-19 psi judging how far the needle went past the max reading of my 15 psi gauge.

I never could run the 3.4" pulley before without major slip, even with any of the pulleys getting past the 10-11 psi barrier was hard. Think for the $63 tensioner and $40 pulley plus shipping, this is a amazing fix!

Setup I bought off eBay:
Dayco 89401 tensioner
Dayco 89102 46mm wide pulley

The pulley I just ordered now for the tensioner to replace the one I'm using (same width), it's a more solid piece but you can use whatever you like. The 12 rib belt is 42 mm wide and the dayco pulley is 46 mm. If you have a 8 rib belt I think the pulley that comes with the tensioner would work just fine with a spacer to bring it closer to the main bracket. Just remember you are going to need to drill 2 new holes in your main bracket for the tensioner, its pretty simple.

Movie showing both before and after intercooler psi on a 3rd gear pull

gta324

Great to hear!

Looks alot like my previous set up

Now I have modified my setup a little more to gain more beltwrap at the blower and it works even better seen here https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/fabr...r-bracket.html

Tony89GTA

iTrader: (7)

The more belt wrap the better for sure, you see it with other setups and they are able to get high boost with even smaller rib belts. I was thinking of adding 2 more pulleys for that but for now it seems to be working alright. I might also sand blast my 3.4" pulleys face to give a little more grip like I've done in the past, it worked before fairly well.

Guest

We need a ride along video, 1 gear ALL the way threw 3rd gear: FOOT-TO-FLOOR.

tom86iroc

iTrader: (1)

that guage was still moving when the video stopped lol GREAT to here it worked for you and I'm sure many other guys running that setup

85Iroc-Z

iTrader: (4)

I plan on buying a procharger set up this winter. Those final 2 part numbers that you listed are all that I need then? Simply just swapping them in over the procharger ones eliminates all tensioner issues that the factory one has? Thanks

Tony89GTA

iTrader: (7)

I'll let you know about the pulley once it gets here but ya that's pretty much it. You could probably use the pulley that comes with the tensioner if your getting a 8 rib setup, just space it out with some washers. I also have a extra brace to the procharger main bracket that I made myself to help stiffen it up some too.

85Iroc-Z

iTrader: (4)

Where about do you have to drill the 2 new holes in the bracket?

Tony89GTA

iTrader: (7)

If you look at my bracket I made it flush to the top and all I did was make sure the tensioner didn't touch the washer and bolt that mounts to the head. Those 2 lines in the pic are where the belt sits when there is tension on it. I did that to see where I wanted to place the tensioner pulley, I would have prefurred to have the pulley above that line but my bracket had to many holes from experiments before I'vd done so that was the best place I could fit it. Plus I was worried about that spring sticking out of the tensioner cutting into the belt if it was rotated to much.

Also I did end up getting that new dayco 46mm pulley and if fits good with a small washer spacer, just make sure to locktite the bolt in.

Another pic showing the placement, just watch out for the main bracket bolt and washer.

85Iroc-Z

iTrader: (4)

Thanks for clearing that up. So which belt are you using and do you have a part number on that new pulley? I'm just trying to get this all figured out now so that I'm ready when it comes time to install the set up.

Tony89GTA

iTrader: (7)

Well for belt sizes with the stock 7.65 crank pulley I use these.

Pulley - belt size
3.4 - 64"
3.7 - 64.5"
4.0 - 65

On post #23 I have the part number for the new idler pulley but here it is again. I got mine off eBay along with the tensioner.

Dayco 89102 46mm wide pulley
Dayco 89401 tensioner

85Iroc-Z

iTrader: (4)

Thanks.

TransAmGTA88

Well I'm going to bite the bullet in get the tensioner. Hope this stops the belt slip!

Tony89GTA

iTrader: (7)

Well if you look at the first video you can see what happens when you rev her up, the belt stretches a lot. So after seeing this video it got me motivated again to work on the spring tensioner idea. For me going past 10-12lbs was always a problem with belt slip no matter what pulley I went with, now that the slack is taken up things are working much better. Hope it works out for anyone else that does this.

86Z

iTrader: (4)

Tony, nice job, there was an older thread with someone using that tensioner, i bought it years ago and still haven't installed it, i need to as i get belt slip around 10psi now

TransAmGTA88

Got the tensioner in. No more belt slip!

Tony89GTA

iTrader: (7)

Looks good, glad it's working for ya! I see yours came with the aluminum cover too. How much boost you're pushing with it so far? Also did you reuse the one idler hole?

TransAmGTA88

Well I've had a string of bad luck with alternators. My old alternator always had a loud noise coming from it when I would first start it up, but would go away after the car would warm up, sounded like a bearing or something. So during this process I thought I would go out and buy a new alternator. So I get the tensioner on and the new alternator on....go out and drive it down the country road step on it (3/4 throttle) looked over and i had 13 pounds of boost, but my lights and everything went dim. Brand new alternator is now junk.

So i haven't had a chance to really open it up yet, here in two weeks there is a B.O.P. event (Buick, Olds, Pontiac) at my local track that I'm going to bring the car down to and throw some 112 fuel in it and see what the results are. Hoping to get to 16 or 17 pounds of boost.

Tony89GTA

iTrader: (7)

Sounds good so far, get that alt fixed up and keep us posted. I like to see how this setup works on a 8 rib.

Tony89GTA

iTrader: (7)

Yeah I think the Dayco brand is the way to go, the ones posted before though we're facing the other way around. Probably not a big deal but I wanted it this way so the tensioner pulley was closer to the procharger pulley for little more belt wrap. Plus it seems to fit good with my 12 rib setup, and you might be able to reuse the idler hole, I'll look into that a little more.

86Z

iTrader: (4)

i'll keep you updated, i'll begin this project in a few weeks or so

85Iroc-Z

iTrader: (4)

There is a difference in height where you guys your tensioner mounted. How do you know exactly where to mount it so that there isn't too much or too little tension on the belt?

articwhiteZ

iTrader: (56)

Huuumm..

Tony89GTA

iTrader: (7)

Well if you look at my pics you can see where I have mine mounted to give you a idea, and honestly the tension is feels pretty even for the whole rotation.

TransAmGTA88

All I did was make an outline of where my belt was with relation to mounting plate (orignally). After that I put the new tensioner in a vice and got an idea of how much travel I had to work with. I still left the orignal tensioner that came from procharger in the car so that I could adjust the location not knowing exactly how much travel I would need or had. The idea being that I could still change the position on the new tensioner.

Hope this makes sense...I could take some more pictures with some more description if needed.

Went from 10lbs of boost with belt slipping to 16-17lbs of boost after installing this new tensioner. Burned up a band in my transmission shortly after that tho

Procharged GTA

We bought this Dayco tensioner and wide pulley for our 12 rib D1SC setup in our 1986 Trans Am street car (converted to 88-92 style accessory brackets).
It is a 383 with AFR 195 heads
NX274 hyd. flat tappet, 230/244 dur@.050,.491" lift, 113* lobe seperation
9.3 compression
Scat H-Beam rods
Eagle 4340 crank
single key balancer+ PINNED
CSU blowthrough carb/Extreme Velocity bonnet
Procharger D1SC 7.65"crank/3.70" blower pullies 12 rib 64.50"belt
NON-INTERCOOLED
2004R transmission w/billet internals
Continental custom 3000 stall 10" converter
Ford 9"rearend 3.50 gears

We cant wait to get this tensioner setup put on to see the difference, sine the factory ATI tensioner setup for our cars are virtually junk, IMO anyway.... the most boost we have seen so far with current combination is 9-10 lbs, but thats Non-Intercooled, so I think there is quite a bit of power to be had. I have read people with different bracket/tensioner setups on very similar 383's with identical heads making 12-13 lbs with the pulley combo we have at the same 6500 engine rpm, and thats Intercooled! Us not being intercooled should see a bit more I think.... Anyway, I cant wait to see how it improves!

Brian

85Iroc-Z

iTrader: (4)

A few other pictures would really be helpful. Thanks

dennisbernal91z

iTrader: (2)

i have an f1 with a lot of belt issues. looks like I have my solution! I will order one of these tensioners too. if people have more pictures, that would be great!

on another note, it's everyone here running a mechanical or vacuum advance dizzy?