TheExaminer

Put in new shocks yesterday, went to do the struts today and no dice. Can't get the two lower nuts to budge. I don't know if these are OE or not, hard to say. The bolts don't look super rusty, they just won't move. The struts themselves, functionally, are shot to heck and look like they came over on the Mayflower, so who knows. I don't have an air wrench. Any tips or am I prisoner to the local garage? Would a small blow torch like you get from a parts store loosen them up enough? What do you think? The top shock nuts were so tight I had to cut them. This might work on the bottom strut nuts, but it's tighter quarters and they are much bigger. 24 mm to be exact.

sofakingdom

iTrader: (1)

Longer breaker bar...

The torque spec on those is something around 150 ft-lbs, can't recall the exact number. In other words, EFFFING tight.

TheExaminer

Wow, that much? Next time I'm going to jack the entire front of the car up at once, and put jack stands under the lca's. I think the torquing of having only one corner of the car lifted didn't help matters, and I don't like twisting the frame doing that anyway. My breaker bar is maybe 18" long or so. May have to get a piece of pipe. Funny thing is, I was able to get the top nut on the passenger side off, but not the lower, and neither on the driver side. I didnt take the calipers off either, might help to do that next time also.

1985camaroBB

if i'm not mistaken the bolt that goes through the strut and knuckle is splined, so you have to remove the other side bolt then tap the bolt out with a punch. well thats how it is on my 1985 z28.

TheExaminer

Really? Not sure. Looked a a pretty standard bolt, just real big and on real tight. Mines a 92, could be a little different. I was able to get one nut off--er, well, you know what I mean.....

-=Z28=-

iTrader: (3)

Make sure you clean the threads with a wire brush before you back the nut off. If you leave the crap on the threads it will make it so you have to fight it all the way. Also. some lube goes a long way and make sure you are trying to loosen the nut... not the bolt. you can try a little heat or put a socket on the nut and hit the socket with a hammer. this causes a shock to travel through the nut and bolt which helps a lot in breaking stuff loose. remember what way the bolt goes threw for re assembly. good luck!

TheExaminer

Thx, but yeah, it was the nut that wouldn't move, at least 3 of 4. I'm going to go at it again next week or maybe week after. I have to replace PSP and water pump next week. I kind of hope 1985 is right and they are splined. That'll make getting that nut off a little easier.

-=Z28=-

iTrader: (3)

spray some penetrating oil on them for the mean time. just to be clear, you want to pull on the nut, not the bolt. obviously you will need to hold the bolt so it doesnt move. they will come. bigger breaker bar.

novaderrik

get a bigger breaker bar or a pipe to make the one you have longer and put all your weight/muscles into it.. make sure you are using a nice short socket and no extensions, otherwise the probability of the socket slipping off and you taking a fall goes up a lot.

gt4373

Check This Vid,If All Else Fails Use Heat.

TheExaminer

Interesting video. He had the linkage disconnected, hope I can get by without that. But the steps were about what I figured, just gotta get those nuts loose.

Barlow8869

iTrader: (1)

one way to do it, if you have room, is to use a jack on the breaker bar

RBob

iTrader: (1)

Note that in '92 those bolts are torque to yield, one time use. So need to purchase 4 new bolts, washers, & nuts. Torque spec:

125 ft/lb
Followed by 120* turn
Final torque must exceed 148 ft/lb.

RBob.

TTOP350

iTrader: (8)

Wow, really? (off to look in my service manual) Been reusing them for years..

TheExaminer

Can you generate that much torque with no air tools? I don't even have a torque wrench right now.

TTOP350

iTrader: (8)

All the ones I have done only have a washer under the bolt head.

I have pulled 800 lbft with hand tools b4.

TheExaminer

Yeah, I'm not sure why you'd need to change them either, but I'm not expert in suspension. Actually the service manual says "discard" on the bolts. I guess that's where he's getting it. Considering how little I drive this car, and I never race it, I may re-use. I'm not sure. We will see.

TheExaminer

Could be it was there and I missed it.

TTOP350

iTrader: (8)

Normally the discard thing on stuff that old is because its a mechanical lock nut and would/could loose that locking feature if reused.
Need to find out for sure whats up tho.

TheExaminer

Replacement bolt sets are $25 on eBay, just checked. But I'm still trying to figure out if I can do this job w/o air tools. Can't afford to buy a set right now, but having someone else do this would be wasted money I could use towards a set. Annoying.

stealtht/a

iTrader: (1)

I have air tools but some of those I had to do with a breaker bar. They are tight.
A big bar can force more torque than any 1/2" impact.
I have a 5 foot pipe over a 1/2 breaker handle.

gt4373

As RBob Stated The Torque May Vary Between Model Years,My 1984 Required A Torque Of 195 Ft. Lbs. As Per The GM Shop Manual,Check Your Model Year Shop Manual To Be Sure.

TheExaminer

Bob's right, the 92 manual says 148. I'll get it, once I make up my mind and get ticked off enough, not much will stop me. I'll put jackstands under both lca's get a long pipe, some penetrating oil and maybe a small torch. When I put the new ones on I'm just going to get them as tight as I physically can with a breaker bar. I'm not Stallone, but I'm pushing 180, surely I can put 150 lbs on a bolt.

Barlow8869

iTrader: (1)

if you put a jack on the end of the bar, and jack it up, you can use the weight of the car to get the bolts loose, with one hand ... no brute force needed

TheExaminer

Yeah, I'll try that too if I can get everything maneuvered around.

TheExaminer

Ok, got the new struts in without too much trouble. Penetrating oil and a pipe on my breaker bar was enough to get the old ones out. But I still have a small problem. The old struts had a 10mm hex at the top that it was easy to get a wrench on so I could turn the top nuts but the new ones just have a slot type top for the stud. An open end 10mm will fit around the slot, but that little wrench isn't strong enough to hold, even with a pipe on it. Vice grips weren't holding either, it just started to mangle the stud, which is the last thing I want to do. So is there a special tool that will grip the stud? Obviously they won't work right if the top nut isn't all the way tight. I need to snug about 1/16" or so.

novaderrik

they do make sockets for that, at least for smaller shocks.. i don't see why there wouldn't be a larger one for struts.

TheExaminer

Where? Would Autozone have that? I'll check eBay too. Part of my problem doing online searches is that I'm not sure what to call it to do the search!

TheExaminer

I THINK I found one on Autozone, which would be great because I could use it and return it for a refund! LOL I'll have to get a closer look at it to check the size.

Armada95

I did my struts today, just take a half inch air impact on the top nut with a wrench in the back holding it, and on the bolt on the bottom bolt, with a wrench on the nut, it will buzz it right off, and the bolts are torqued to 203 ft lbs (atleast on my 91 camaro, could be diff on other years)

I would recommend undoing the top first and letting the whole thing hang so you dont get hurt while taking thr bottoms off


Good luck


Edit: didnt see you got it off haha.

TheExaminer

I don't have an air impact wrench, and don't even know anyone who has one. All I need is something to hold the top stud so I can tighten the top nuts.

Armada95

I used a socket/ratchet to hold the center nut and the open end of wrench to tighten it, its only tightened to 18 ftlbs so you can guaged it by hand, I had to go at a angle, easy to do just have to make sure you have a bite on the nut.

someone972

iTrader: (2)

So did you figure out if you actually have to replace the bolts/washers/nuts? I'm replacing my struts in the near future, and the manual for 91 also says to discard. Could you post a link to the replacement set you found?

TheExaminer

Its a double D oval stud, and even my open end wrench won't hold, the stud turns inside the wrench and the nut is not screwed down on the stud enough to be in proper position yet. My old struts had a 10mm hex at the top, but not these. Doesn't matter anyway, I found a universal strut set at Napa that looks like it's going to work. If it's 18 lbs, it may not need to be tightened much more anyway.

TheExaminer

I never did find out if you HAVE to replace them, but since the shop manual said to I thought I might as well play it safe and do it. I found a set on eBay, this is what I bought.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Front-Strut-to-Spindle-Mounting-Hardware-Bolts-Nuts-Kit-1982-1992-GM-F-Body-/271537558658?fits=Year%3A1992%7CModel%3AFirebird&hash=item3f38e65482&vxp=mtr

someone972

iTrader: (2)

Thanks. I went ahead and ordered some too. Even if they don't really need replaced, it will at least be peace of mind knowing that if I bugger one of the bolts up getting it out that I have a nice shiny new set ready to go in.

TheExaminer

That universal strut stud set I bought at Napa works, but even the socket in the set started to deform when I tried tightening the top nut. Screw it, if it's THAT tight, I don't need to tighten it any more. I'm taking it back, I don't need it, and plus I think it may be cheap because of how quickly it started deforming.

someone972

iTrader: (2)

Are you talking about the quality of the sockets being cheap, or the studs? Hopefully I won't have as much trouble with the bolts as you did since I have an electric impact, don't know if my 1/2 inch torque wrench goes up as high as it is asking for though.

Armada95

My strut had a 6 point "nut" for the top, thats why I was able to use a socket

TheExaminer

I was talking about the sockets, they started to deform, and the stud started spinning even inside the socket. My stud is that double D oval thingy. Why they didn't just put hex studs on there is more than I know. That'd be too easy I guess. But the studs started to strip slightly too. Could be they're designed to do that when a certain torque spec is reached. IDK. I bought AC Delco gas charged struts and shocks from Rock Auto. $153 shipped, so that was a pretty good deal actually. They'd have been twice that much at Autozone. But honestly, I'm not having that much trouble. They went in pretty easy once I got the pipe on my breaker bar and etc. Just the top nut was being a little ornery. But really, if they're that tight I'm probably good, surely there's 20 lbs or so on it already.

TheExaminer

Yip, my old ones had that, made things much easier. These new AC Delcos have the double D oval. I think I've got em on there good enough now though, should be ok. LOL