Derrick86

Hello i am having a little problem. Every time I go to start my 86 camaro (305 tpi) it is kinda hard to star. It takes maybe two or three tries before it finally starts. Well when I finally get it started I go to give it gas and the acceleration is really slow. If i push the gas it doesn't start to rev up till maybe 1 or two seconds after i have pushed it down. It finally revs up and then it will die out. I do it again and it does the same thing. I have just put on a new egr vacuum solenoid. The o2 sensor wire was cut when I got it, i spliced in a wire to connect it together. Does anybody have any ideas what might be going on and why it is performing the way it is?

rusty vango

is your CEL on? if so , what codes are shown? have you done a complete tune up? did you buy a MAF from auto zone? give us more details.

Derrick86

What is a CEL? And my scanner won't stay connected to my aldl connector. It's like the aldl is worn out and it won't keep the signal so I can't read any codes. And no I didn't buy a MAF sensor it is the original one from the factory. The only thing I have changed emissions wise is the egr vacuum solenoid and the o2 sensor.

Derrick86

Tune up wise it has brand new spark plugs and wires, new oil and filter, gas and I put sea foam in the fuel tank. New distributor cap and rotor. All the wires going to each sensor work I did the testing stage on them already with a voltmeter.

rusty vango

check engine light,, it will be on when the engine is running, if there are any codes stored.

Derrick86

Oh yeah it has a service engine light on. I disconnected the orange wire by the battery the one that gives power to the ecm and powers it. So it cleared any stored codes and it still threw a light shortly after I started it again.

rusty vango

the stored codes will point you in the right direction ,as far as what needs done.what codes do you have?

Derrick86

I can't scan it. The connection between the scanner and aldl won't keep a signal. Like the wires in the aldl are loose

rusty vango

then read them with a paper clip. you connect the upper right hand "A" and "B" terminals. they are on the top row of the ALDL. the last two terminals. there have been many many write ups on how its done. do a search on here and let us know the codes. it is said that the 7165 ECM is not the easiest one to connect a scan tool to. so that MAY be your issue there.

Derrick86

I did the paper clip trick today. I put the key on "ON" and the engine light stayed solid. Once I put the paper clip in the aldl connector and connected "a" and "b" the engine light would flash 3 times then go out for 3 seconds then flash 3 times again and it repeated this. What do you think?

Derrick86

It would flash pause flash flash long pause. Then flash small pause flash flash then long pause again. It would repeat this. I got a scanner and hooked it up and put the car in on mode and the engine light came on but on the scanner it said that there were no codes present.

rusty vango

at this point I would suspect a fuel delivery issue is the source of your bogginess
. have you checked your fuel pressure? how about the ignition timing? is it set at 6 degrees?

Derrick86

I think the timing is set at 0 but I'm not sure I'll check that tomorrow. And I'll check the fuel pressure as well. That should be around 45 pounds of pressure right?

Derrick86

So I could check the timing because the car won't start at all. I pulled the spark plugs and they were covered in gas. I also scanned it and I got a MAF sensor code.

rusty vango

timing should be set at 6 BTDC. change the plugs, and try it with the MAF sensor un plugged. if it starts and runs but not very well, youre onto something. now, the MAF relays can and do give headaches. especially if they are not the right ones. resist the temptation to waste money and time on a re, man MAF sensor. the only way is to buy a new one . and stay very far away from anything "cardone".

rusty vango

I see we have the same cars, if you need them , I have the GM part numbers for the relays and MAF. ill help you if I can.hit me up.

Derrick86

I can't check the timing because the car won't start. It just cranks and cranks but doesn't actually start. Ill go to town here in a few and get some new plugs. What plugs should I get? And I don't know if this has anything to do with the problem but the temperature sensor for the egr valve is broke.

Derrick86

And I have open headers on it right now, I haven't got it to the shop to get the exhaust on it yet. So I don't know if it is messing with the o2 sensor as well.

rusty vango

everyones EGR sensor is broke. and if its a TPI 305. AC R43-TS plugs. and have you checked the ICM? it would cause a no start. check the coil too. check for spark. unless someones played "mix-n- match" with it, you should have the coil in cap type distributor.

Derrick86

That's what plugs I got. The distributor cap and rotor are brand new. And what is ICM?

rusty vango

ignition control module. its found under the distributor cap. when they go bad, you get irregular or no spark. it can be tested at your local auto parts store. BUT have the test done 5 or 6 times in a row, as they fail most likely under heat.

Derrick86

If i had to get a new one, what one should i get? I have read other threads on here saying people got new ones and they don't work either. So brand or which one should I get if I do have to replace the ICM?

rusty vango

I have been having good luck with BWD select parts. I get them at oreilleys. I have one of their ICMs and im happy. try and stay far away from auto zone and advance

Derrick86

So I pulled number 1 spark plug out and hooked it to the plug wire and set it on the top of the wheel well and tried to start to engine. No spark so moved the plug to a different ground still nothing. I set it some where else and it had a very very small spark but it took 4 times for that one small spark and that was the only tiny spark I got the 10 times I tried.

rusty vango

have the ICM and coil tested .you are likely to find your trouble there.

Derrick86

Okay I will get it checked out tomorrow. On a side note I want to put in a mechanical temp gauge, where is the sensor I need to remove in order to put in my other gauge?

rusty vango

on the left cyl. head ,between cyls.1 &3

Derrick86

Okay so good news I got the car to start. Now the only problem is that I have a code 33 (MAF sensor). The car also revs up high and drops down and then revs up and drops down by its self and it repeats this.

Derrick86

Could the MAF sensor cause this?

rusty vango

yes the MAF can cause the idle to go all crazy. if you have the code for a bad MAF ,it will be 33 or 34. should you need to buy one. resist the temptation to go cheap.buy a "rich -porter" NEW one and you will be happy

Derrick86

I started the car with the MAF sensor on it and it ran bad so I shut off the car and unplugged it and started it back up and it ran better with out it on there.

rusty vango

a sure indication, that you have a problem with the MAF itself, OR the power and/or the burn off relay and/or the wiring to and from said parts. you can drive it with the MAF unplugged, but it wont be fun. I have the GM part numbers for the relays and the MAF .

Derrick86

There is other thing. I pulled my oil dip stick and it smelt like gas. So I changed the oil and filter. And started it back up yesterday and pulled the dip stick again, and it is starting to smell like gas again.

rusty vango

when the MAF and/or relays goes bad it will run rich by default.

Derrick86

When I put a scanner on it, the MAF burn off relay is always off. Is it suppose to be?

rusty vango

the burn off relay only is powered up for a few seconds after you shut the engine off. and what scanner do you have?

Derrick86

A snap on one

rusty vango

I need to get one of those, would you mind posting the model and serial numbers?

Derrick86

Yes I'll get the numbers tomorrow when I go back to the shop. Got another problem we are back to square one, it won't start again but this time there is no cranking. So I looked up a starting wiring diagram. I checked the crank fuse to. It was good. So next I went under the car and checked all the wires going to the starter and moved them around a little and then it cranked. Went to do it again and nothing. Moved the wires around again but still nothing. The only thing I hear is like a small ticking noise. I used a test light and had someone inside the car trying to start it and put the test light on the ignition wire at the starter and the test light lit up every time they would try to start it. So I charged the battery over night went out to do it again and the same thing the small ticking noise. I got a starter push button switch hooked the one end to the positive on the battery and the other to the ignition spot on the solenoid on the stater. Went to start it and nothing still. Sooo I took the starter off the car and look it into the shop where we have a starter tester. It worked fine there. We even hooked it up a 12 volt battery and used a starter push button switch and it still worked. Brought it home today and put it back on the car, and guess what nothing. If you have any idea please enlighten me on it cause I am lost.

mlbinseattle

The car is almost 30 years old. Has the ignition cable ever been replaced? Over the years, corrosion can occur inside the cable, especially if the insulation has gotten hard and brittle. Minute cracks begin to form and moisture makes it way into the cable. Additionally, I bet the connectors have lost some connection at the cable ends. Try taking a set of jumper cables and connecting one lead from the battery positive terminal to the starter terminal ... essentially bypassing the old lead. If it cranks, you found your problem. Also ensure your ground lead is good with clean connections, too.

rusty vango

an excellent idea, him being in Indiana dosent help. on the corrosion part either

mlbinseattle

Many, many moons, ago, I was an electronics tech in the Navy. I worked on all the comm gear and satellite systems. When you see what salt water does to RF transmission lines after many years, you become a believer.

Derrick86

I took a pair of jumper cables and tried it. I put the red on the battery spot on the solenoid and the black on the case of the starter motor. Then I hooked up the black to the negative on the battery and the red on the positive and still nothing just a clicking noise.

mlbinseattle

If it does this with a set a jumper cables, then your battery apparently isn't taking a charge or it's not getting charged enough. Have you tried a known good battery?

Derrick86

Scanner is a snap on scanner. MT2500STKA. And yes I have tried a good battery and it worked. My voltmeter reads about 12 to 13 volts from the alternator.

mlbinseattle

So, a known good battery works. I take this to mean that it turns the starter/cranks the engine. But, the battery you charged doesn't work, i.e. turn the starter. Is this correct?

rusty vango

thanks man, did you fet it fixed?

Derrick86

I took the starter off the car and hooked it up to a different battery with a push start button and it worked. Put it back on the car with the battery in the car that I charged and it's just a little clicking noise. What do you think new battery? And no not yet.

rusty vango

I would trace the wiring ,just to rule it out.you can have your battery tested for capacity too. I just looked that snap on tool up on the website and nothing comes up.

Derrick86

Trace what wire? I jumped the starter directly off the battery with jumper cables. And I went to Google and typed in snap on scanner Mt2500