JokeR 1987

So I just baught a 350sbc to put in my 87 camaro (came stock with a 2.8 v6 with a t5) I want to keep it a manual. I understand I will need a new bellhousing and different spline gear or.something if iwant to mate the t5 to the 350. I also hear that a t56 doesn't exactly bolt right up either. I would like a pain free straight bolt up 5/6 speed trans for under 1200. Not sure if such a thing exists. Would a TKO600 bolt right up? What manual trans did the v8 camaros come with? What trans will Be the easiest to install in my 350 swapped 87 camaro?

soarestransam

Best transmission to use with the 350 would be a world class t5 outta a 1988-92 trans am/ camaro but u have to be careful an not beat on it since the torque will tear the t5 to pieces.

JokeR 1987

The 350 has 10:1 compmpression with a 750 carb. Soon it will be getting an upgraded intake heads and cam. So I think I will stick wih my current t5 which will just need the new bellhousing and spline because I will grenade all t5's. Or I will get somethinlike the t56. Does the t56 require a different crossmember on an 87 camaro? And how hard is it to put an different spline.in the t5?

Anti-Venom

You'll want to just buy a WC unit if you bolt up a T5. There's more difference there than just the spline count that makes them stronger and your V6 non-WC unit will never be up to the task. Even a WC won't last with any wheel hop or power shifts, They are barely rated enough for the 305's torque output.

You can beef up a WC unit with new gearsets from G-Force and there's another company on the tip of my tongue that I can't think of off hand, starts with an A. The gearsets though run about around $1300 and after spending $200-$500+ on a WC core your still a large step behind a T56 in power handling and reliability. Those who run built T5's seem to have hit and miss success with them and the opinions are more subjective and hear say than they are concrete. The advantage is though that the T5 uses the same stock speedo sender, same flywheel, and shares the same crossmember and hydraulics. So install is factory.
With reduced helix or spur cut gears they will take a built NA 350, many circumstances withstanding.

Reading the T-5 sticky at the top of the page will help enlighten you considerably.

A TKO, your looking at around the same cost as a built up T5. It will be a stronger transmission at its core though by design, Uses a T5 bell and hydraulics, Requires a different crossmember, but IMO they are rougher shifting and the shifter needs to be shimmed over a tad to center in the console. Most folks run the Mustang unit with an adapter to clock and move the trans back a bit to get everything lined up. I really haven't heard many people claim to be overly happy with this swap.

T56 will require a speedo box from Dakata Digital to convert the higher pulse signal from the T56 sender $85, a new crossmember which are everywhere used for cheap or new for well under $100. You'll also need an LT1 pull style clutch, slave, flywheel, and torque arm mount, Don't forget pigtails for the wiring. Have to cut your stock shifter hole back 2" in the floor for the shift housing but the shiter comes out of the console perfect and the lower boot still seals the hole.

I strongly considered building a T5 myself but ended up buying a T65. Just can't argue with a trans that handles 450lbft stock and can be built to take more, shifts like butter, and has a double OD for mileage. Shop wisely and it will cost less than either the TKO or T5 lbft per $, There's a reason why the swap is so popular.

Just remember, HP costs and there's no free lunch, only broken parts. Do it right once and save yourself the headaches.

JokeR 1987

I appreciate it transam and venom good info. Ugh looks.like I'm gonna have to work harder than I thought but that's OK I'm a fabricator so I can cut some holes. In fact I'm putting a full nhra roll cage in it it next month.gutting the interior, and doing an aluminium dash and console.
It looks.like I'm doing the t56. So what crossmember should I use? Is it welded in? Should I bolt up the motor and trans first then drop it in? It doesn't look like there is enough room to do that since the radiator support doesn't come out.
What flywheel? What bellhousing? Can I use my stock starter? Thanks guys this project would be an even crazier without this site.

soarestransam

Has to to be a t56 bellhousing an a 1pc rear main seal or 2pc rear main seal flywheel made for the t56 cant use the stock t5 flywheel since it is to small for the clutch that the t56 needs

91phoenix

iTrader: (5)

You need the LT1 T56. the correct T56 flywheel as said above. The LT1 bellhousing. The crossmember is a bolt in item using the factory bolt holes. The torque arm mount can be reused from a T5 onto the T56. The starter I believe needs to be from a V8 T5 or LT1 car.
I feel the T56 swap thread sticky is a good read for the first 3 pages and more if you have a mechanical speedo. It covers the flywheel and digital speedo converter wiring and much more.

Anti-Venom

Just want to add to avoid the Spohn crossmember unless running stock exhaust routing. It's a brick wall if your running long tubes to get the exhaust around. If you look at it you'll instantly know why. Dang thing is made out of box steel and also hangs pretty low. Complete overkill IMO.

Learned that lesson with my first LS1 swap.

Edwardgp

There is a lot in the way under these cars when trying to build an exhaust.

JokeR 1987

So which crossmember do I want?

91phoenix

iTrader: (5)

I would suggest looking at the Hawk's T56 crossmember.

JokeR 1987

wassup guys im back. i just got a 1990 camaro donor car for my project and it has a (L03)305ci with a 5spd. i just got it and havent gotten to tearing it apart yet and i have some questions

first- when i get in the car (car is off no key) the shifter just moves throught the gears freely and VERY EASILY without even touching the clutch (clutch not down). is this normal for the t5? most the newer manual transmissions ive had take a little more and feel like they are actually going into a gear.

second, how hard is it to switch input shafts from my 14 splined v6 to the 26 splined v8 one? (just in case the donor trans is blown or i blow it in the future.) do i need special tools for any pressfit bearings? whats the level of difficulty on this? ive done the research but need a little more details on the specifics.

(btw im still doin the t56 swap in the future just wanna get the car on the road and break some stuff first lol)

JokeR 1987

??

danielsan

You dont need to use the clutch to row the gears unless its running. At least that's how my T5 has always been and it hasn't given me issues yet.

You won't break it unless you drive like an *******, power shift or dump the clutch routinely. The amount of torque an average 350 puts down can grenade your T5, just be easy on launching and watch your shifting.

My car has had a rebuilt T5 behind my 350 for about 40k. However, I rarely shift higher then 3500-4k rpm max. For a daily driver/street car its a good combo if your gentle. Just don't shift like its fast and the furious.

InfernalVortex

iTrader: (4)

Mostly very good info, but there is no difference between a T5 and T56 torque arm mount if we're talking about the clamshell mount. Mine is off of a T5 car. So he can use that one. The 700r4 mount is different, though.

Another issue is the TKO500's are very strong transmissions, but they have some really awkward gear ratios. Really short first gears in them. Plus all the retrofitting that needs to be done... makes you really think about whether or not thats worth it.

If I were the OP Id buy WC T5... they're $300 or so. Just see if it will last. If you blow it up within a year, go for a T56.

sofakingdom

iTrader: (1)

"Easiest" is probably a T-5... it only weighs about 75 lbs.

Which is probably a good thing, as you will be replacing it OFTEN most likely regardless of whether it's the 1st design or the 2nd design (the one that got the TQM / PIT team /6-sigma "buzzword" that some brilliant but totally inexperienced straight-out-of-college whiz kid decided was a good idea to slap on it), if you go with "easy".

Wrong question to ask. Bad way to start out.

jmd

iTrader: (4)

There is no correct-length, 26 splined input shaft with a matching maindrive gear to work in a V6 T5. Just sell the V6 T5 and .

Your plan to get it going, then go T56 is solid.

Download and read the Tremec T5 rebuild manual from their site. A T5 was my first rebuild ever and the owner of it after that put 10,000 miles on it before selling the car with no issues. I think a bearing splitter and a press were needed; you can get by with a puller but a press is nice.

InfernalVortex

iTrader: (4)

So you used a press to pull the gears off the shaft instead of a puller?

Im thinking Im going to end up rebuilding my T56 one of these days soon, still not exactly sure what all I need. But maybe I should just invest in a press...

KingsHustleLA

What's the Max a world class T5 can handle? And what's the Max a LT1 T56 can handle?

InfernalVortex

iTrader: (4)

This is off the top of my head but should be close... wct5 is around 300 ft lbs, T56 is 450 ft lbs (Except for the 93 T56's). There's a drastic improvement there. The T56 is about twice as heavy, but weight low and centered in the car isnt the worst place to put it. It may even lower and centralize the center of gravity, but it's still an extra 50-75 lbs.

KingsHustleLA

Alright cool thanks for the info. I have an auto 700r4 and want to go stick but I think that T56 would be the better one to go with for me. I'm just trying to figure out if a 3rd gen clutch pedal will work fine or not. I hear some people say yes then some say jt doesnt work properly and you got to modify and use the 4th gen clutch.

garcia45

well, guess i gotta get me a t56 aswell.

danielsan

Just to add to this.. a lot of people forget that the torque rating is based off first gear. As you go down further (2nd, 3rd, etc) the torque rating decreases. So, with that said.. 300 lbs in first gear is great, but most likely your 350 is putting another torque to destroy it in it's strongest gear.... soo yeah, the outlook isn't promising.

Johngypsy

I know I am very late with these questions talking about the world class transmission,

Few things,

What year was the first world class made in? Have a 88 Gta 305 Tpi 5-spd is This a world class?

Also have a 1990 305-tpi Camaro Iroc z car that I just put in a 89 Trans am Gta 355 motor and new clutch,
Is this a world class? Or is this the standard t-5 type one,
A friend has a 91 Camaro Rs 305 throttle body with a 5-spd, W/C?

As I've was going my new clutch in my 90 Iroc z, the mechanic said I DO NOT HAVE a world class and only the basic T-5 tranny, so I am soo stumped on this one, I know a lot when someone has a issue I try to help out all I can, but me? I feel like I am a new born baby, and forgot my A.B.C's

So in any matter guys, I so need some in put on what this world class was all about and years offered in, and was they changed as a option package in 88-92 years? Or did they all come W/C bourg Warner?
Thanks so much guys
John
Houston tx,

sofakingdom

iTrader: (1)

B-W started supplying GM the 2nd design T-5 in 87 if memory serves, but maybe it was 88. Later than some other car mfrs for some reason. I don't too much care about the year; back when I had no choice BUT to keep buying T-5 cores, I just looked at the parts when I was inspecting them. All that about "year" is about like looking up gear "codes" as far as I'm concerned... a waste of time and source of potential error. Why risk making a mistake with all that, when you can simply LOOK AT THE PARTS and they'll tell you everything the other stuff ever will, and MORE besides.

The 2nd design (I REFUSE to use that stupid buzzword) wasn't an "option". When GM switched to the updated design, they switched to the updated design.

It's VERY easy to tell whether a transmission is 1st design or 2nd design, even when in the car.



Top is 1st design.

Look at the front countergear bearing; it's down low on the pass side of the trans, and part of it extends below the bell housing. 1st design is shiny and flat, and has a sort of rolled-over looking edge, kinda like an upside-down freeze plug. 2nd design is dull and has a very sharp edge, and the center is sorta depressed, leaving what looks like a raised band around the outer edge.

Externally, as far as "fit" and all that, they interchange directly. Of course, no transmission out of any other car will interchange with those in ours, no matter which design.

Johngypsy

Yea your fight, the first year of the world was 88 I was told, but yea I am haveing the 88 Gta most likly parted out, costumer was asking about spline? So I will post back when I find this all out, I also go some info today also, not sure if it's accurate or not? In 1989 bourg Warner lost there contract with the Camaro/firebird in that year and General Motors had a cut back issues, so 89 was there final year with the company, and in 90 they went with a General Motors different type rear end to, from the Borg Warner 9 bolt to a 10 bolt, which I think it wasent good, a lot of guys seem to disagree with that. As I live the 9 bolt and the W/C transmissions, but thaks for the info I'll check thoes numbers on it,
John

sofakingdom

iTrader: (1)

The transmissions and rears are 2 completely separate issues.

GM had used the 10-bolt all along in these cars; they just bought the 9-bolts for a few years for a few cars. The bulk of them always did get the 10-bolt.

The T-5 continued in these cars until their end, and further on, were used in the 6-cyl 4th gens for some years afterwards.

luvofjah

iTrader: (2)

Astro Performance is the other company that makes superior upgraded gears to G Force... I'm getting one end of month...

There are many people running in the 10's and I've found very few complaints about it (the GForce parts, lot's of complaints)...

Any who... There are many members here also that have T5's behind big power, some break, some live... If you've got a a lot of power and street tires, It will last a while... but abuse it, and replace it... and for the price of replacing it, you could buy 10 T5's to one TKO 600 or Astro T5...

My T5 is a world class has a few issues and 150k miles and is the last thing on the drive train that needs attention... The Astro A5 is a bit of change, but it should be the last trans I buy... Lighter than the TKO and shifts nicer... (Pro 5.0 Shifter helps )

Rafael