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Erratic idle

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Old 05-11-2011, 06:38 AM
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Car: 1989 Camaro RS
Engine: 2.8l V6
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Erratic idle

My car starts up fine when it's cool but when hot it takes around 5 seconds of cranking to start it up. After it starts some blackish smoke comes from the exhaust and a pretty strong smell of gas.

Didn't pass the emission test bacause the idle is erratic, around 500-1500rpm.
Carbon monoxide levels rise when the car sounds like it's gonna stall and then the idle goes up to around 1500rpm.
I have no problems with idle when the engine is cold.

Vacuum leak? Leaky injector? I have no idea...
Old 05-11-2011, 11:58 AM
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Car: 1988 camaro
Engine: cammed 3.1
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Re: Erratic idle

Is the check engine light coming on? A few months ago I was fixing a cadillac hearse and it was doing the same thing you describe and it was a combination of a bad Throttle positioning sensor, Idle air control valve and a bad 02 sensor but that was a 305 tbi engine. Blackish smoke means its running very rich. Try disconnecting the Mass Air Flow sensor and start it to see if it runs any better. I wasn't getting any codes when my MAF wasn't any good and was running way too rich and had high idle.
Old 05-13-2011, 03:06 AM
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Re: Erratic idle

I disconnected the MAF and started the car but no difference, the idle is still messed up.

When I pulled the codes i got: 24: VSS, 32: EGR failure, 34: MAP (Volts LO/Vac HI) and 45: Oxygen sensor (rich).

I checked the codes AFTER the MAF disconnection "test". Don't know if that caused most of these codes or not.

Last edited by CamaroDude90; 05-13-2011 at 03:09 AM.
Old 05-13-2011, 01:54 PM
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Re: Erratic idle

New symptom: The cooling fan won't turn on and the car overheats. The fan works when I check for troublecodes.
I also noticed that the fan relay connector is a little burnt and melted, just the connector with the big red wire.

Could all my troubles be caused by a faulty coolant sensor?
Old 05-13-2011, 04:25 PM
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Re: Erratic idle

If your talking about the sensor at the back of the engine on the passenger side head, then no that would not cause any problems, or shouldnt. I actually dont even have mines plugged in and the fan still turns on. Its more of a backup sensor. I also had an erratic idle problem and it was the MAF sensor. When you disconnected the MAF was the idle constant or was it still erratic? Unplugging the MAF forces the computer into limp mode and makes it run rich and rpms ted to be high but should be constant.
Old 05-13-2011, 05:15 PM
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Re: Erratic idle

Hmm well the code 34 was probably from disconnecting it. You could check the coolant temperature sensor with a digital multi meter and a cup of warm water. I have the chart on how to check them if you PM me. Might not be a bad idea to replace the o2 sensor if it's the original one.
Old 05-14-2011, 05:23 PM
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Re: Erratic idle

Disregard codes 24 and 34 for now. You should concentrate on code 32 and 45. My guess is that your problem is in 2 parts. First, you have a fueling or ignition problem, either a leaky injector (check all 7), or weak spark. Second, you need to find out if the EGR valve is stuck, either through the solenoid sticking or the valve sticking. Either of the EGR problems will cause hard starting and rough idle.

Did the HC number change with the CO level? I'm assuming you had the car smogged or a sniffer test done at the tailpipe. Check the fuel pressure to check for an injector or fuel pump problem, and then pull a spark plug and look for a bright white spark.
Old 05-15-2011, 01:30 PM
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Re: Erratic idle

Yet another symptom: Now I keep getting a code 15 everytime I start the car. The fan turns on with the SES light. Maybe my car has cancer or something... Spreading all over the car...

I also broke the small vacuum line going from the throttle body to the canister when I tried to remove the CTS... There is a 1cm long tube left in the rubber connector in the throttle body. Any idea how to fix that little tube?

Last edited by CamaroDude90; 05-15-2011 at 02:44 PM.
Old 05-15-2011, 02:49 PM
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Re: Erratic idle

IIRC, code 15 is the CTS reading low, as in -130*F. Which could explain any number of problems you're having except the codes 24 and 32.

To fix the vacuum line, get a small screw and thread it into the broken piece of line and pull the screw out with the line, and then put the remaining part of the line into the vacuum block if there is enough. Otherwise, you will need to cut some of the line to put into the block and patch it together with a piece of hose.
Old 05-16-2011, 01:14 PM
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Re: Erratic idle

I pulled out the CTS and tested it with a multi meter. Probably completely dead because the meter says nothing. No current flow or resistance.
Old 05-17-2011, 10:52 AM
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Re: Erratic idle

This just ruined my whole week... After I had installed the new CTS I noticed a crack. I did not use so much force tightening the CTS to cause that. I knew that this car had some problems when I bought it but had no idea it was this bad.



Idle did not change but code 15 went away. Now I have a code 45. Have to get a new oxygen sensor?

Is there anything I can do instead of buying a new engine to fix the crack?
Old 05-17-2011, 11:48 AM
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Re: Erratic idle

Yes, you did put the CTS in too far, for one. There should be a couple of threads outside the manifold, and it looks like yours is down against the manifold completely. With that said, try to find someone on here who is parting a V6 that will sell you a new manifold. I just got rid of mine last week.

And again, get a fuel pressure gauge and check your fuel pressure. A leaking injector can and will put too much fuel into its corresponding cylinder and cause a rich condition. Same for the spark coming out of the coil. Weak spark won't burn the fuel completely and will also set a code 45. Also, remove the MAF sensor from the air box and look at the orange film inside. Check the film to be sure it's completely flat. If not, it may be overreporting the amount of air coming into the engine and can set off a code 45 without setting a code 33.
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