I finally got the engine back in and the rest of the car put back together yesterday afternoon. When I went to start the car, I found that my starter had gone bad. I dropped the starter a few days ago while I was pulling the motor out, so I guess I messed it up. I got the new starter today, and will get it in in the next few days. Still Trying - Mike......

SWEEEETTTTT! - I can't wait to hear the results Mike. -

chevyboy07 91 - another Florida boy huh? I'm in Fort Myers.

Mini Ram 383

Hopefully it will run close to this since we have 98% of the same parts.

Good stuff with the motor being in and back together mike.

iv'e been following this post for a LOoooong time now. chimed in here and there.

I too have a vortec headed motor, mines a 355. stock valves, vavle job, and bowl work. 10.7 compression. perofrmer rpm intake and an Xe274 cam.

finally the weather broke here in jersey long enough to get it down to the track.

i've got a total of twelve runs on the car so far, it's a bear coming out of the hole with the track very cold but it's manageable.

Best so far is a 12.54 @ 109.96. Best mph overall.. 111.28

unforunatly mother nature's preventing any better than 1.911 60er's. but that too shall pass.

Hey Pony Killer, those are great times, and a great mph as well. When you knock another .1 - .2 off of your 60 foot times, you should be in the low 12s - that's awesome!!

Well, my car is back together and running. Drove it around today for the first time, and it seems to be fine. I have dropped back to my Crews6 chip, so I can work my way up gradually through 6, 7, & 8 to see how they all work. I'll hook up the Tech1 this week while I'm driving it, to see how everything is doing. If all goes well (work, weather, etc.), I'll dyno the car this Friday afternoon and have some numbers. I haven't had a chance to really get on the car yet, so I don't really know if it "feels" any stronger or not, but I'm sure that I'll get my chance this week.

Later - Mike.......

Hey Mike glad to see you are running again . I cant wait to pull my engine and use that new cam(new to me)LOL.

Thanks again on the cam and I hope your new one works out for you keep us posted.

hey mike, do you know what the lift is on that cam with 1.5 rockers? also with 1.6?

Hey CEDOE, Thanks again.

slp_firehawk, the XR269 HR is .495/.503 with 1.5s, I imagine that it is .525/.533 with 1.6s (CC does not specifically list 1.6s, but they generally add about .030 to 1,5s).

There have been several questions about gas mileage in this post, and I said that I would post some milage numbers with the new cam. Well, you won't believe my gas mileage numbers from the last two days. I drove the car to Atlanta and back (about 350 miles or so). For the entire trip the car averaged 19.4 mpg!! That includes 2.5 hours each way on the highway at 75 mph, and also all the Atlanta in-town stop and go driving that I did. Pretty amazing to me. The car is getting better mileage now that with the old (and smaller) LPE 74211 cam. Hopefully I will dyno one day next week, or maybe next weekend at the latest.

Later - Mike...........

Wow I can't beleive this thread is still alive. I think this is one of the all time best threads I have read. I think I started reading and posted a few things last fall.
I have a 350 with LPE L98 D port heads, LPE 219/525, SuperRam, forged TRW 10.1, 24lb SVO injectors, 255 fuel pump, 52mmTB, TES headers, Ed Write chip, 2400 stall B&M converter, 373 gears, LCA, PHB, frame ties, DR's ect. The best I have run is 12.96 at 110MPH. The engine dynoed 304RWHP 336RWT. This was on a Mustang Dyno. I know there is more there but can't seem to find it. I just picked up some coated headman headers and am going to piece together a true dual with x pipe out the rear. It will be like Willies set up if you have seen it. Mike and I have talked before last fall. I am going to step it up in the next few weeks and am looking for help on which way to go. I have a N20 kit I just picked up. It is a dry kit 75 HP shot because of the SR. I don't think that is going to get me were I want to be. I want to go as fast as poss with what I have to work with. I have little over $3000.00 to play with. I though about a ATI P600sc and spraying the intercooler. I have alway gone with NA engines before so torn between a stroker motor and the blower. I really like the thought of a 406 tho. Would my LPE parts work good on a 406 short block with say 11.1 compression? My engine combo only has about 1500 miles on it now. This is my toy and have had it since new. Only driven a few hundred miles a year.
Mike or Mike or anyone else have any input? You guys know your stuff so please help with which way to go. Thanks guys.

Chris you should ask for a supercharger for your birthday!

A good friend of mine has a shortblock almost identical to mine, and heads that are identical, and is running the Superram on the scoggin dickey vortec base. running a cam that's i believe a 218/224 comp XE grind. flat tappet joint., i'm curious to see how he's gonna run. I think it'll run very well, i kinda always figured the superrams to be the efi version of a dual plane manifold.

I'll keep ya's posted on how his runs with that vortec combo when he gets it in.

on the other hand, mine's still running very well. havent' done much in the way of tuning, just a bit of driving to feel it out., got a new best last night at atco

12.28 @ 111.37. on a 1.76 60er.

she's creeping up on the 11s. when it warms up enough to tune it down the track at night i'll probalby start making some gains.

Good times pony killer.
Breadfan yes what ever I do is going to be my birthday present. I have a habit of that. I got the IROC for Christmas and the WS6 for Christmas. My wife hates to see the hoildays come around as she doesn't know what I will buy next.
I am wanting to get into the low 11. high 10's and still be streetable. I think I will proably go with the supercharger. Right now I am on my 3rd engine. It doesn't have but maybe 1500 miles on it so I might as well use it alittle. I am only thinking of going with 9psi. I will pick up a 406 short block and start getting the other parts together. That way by the time the 350 gives it up I will have the 406 together. Now I just have to find who has the best deals on superchargers.

To Mike Crews - hey! how does the car feel? Any numbers? I should have numbers in a couple weeks!

To Chris Ja - The ATI is a good choice. For any motor thats 10:1, you dont want to go over 6 lbs. of boost at the TB. The 9 lb kit puts out ~6.2 lbs. to the TB by the time the air passes through the intercooler and all the piping. I'm getting the 9 lb. self-contained kit soon for my car. Make sure you opt for the larger intercooler and the satin finish DOES disapate heat better than the polished piping (FYI). Before you pick a blower cam, you really need to figure out what your heads flow and if you are going to run an automatic, get a cam with a 114 LSA with a 110 ICA. With a manual, like me, a 112 LSA with a 108 ICA will be fine. I'm going to do the moser 12 bolt swap and do some suspension work before I buy the blower. Get your suspension, rear-end, and squeeze as much as you can out of your current combo before you get the blower. Thats what I would do.

Mike (1bad91Z)

Hey Mike,

The cars feels good, and I've run it full throttle up to about 120 or so a few times. I've got the tranny shifting at 5500, and the car is strong all the way to the shift. So, it does FEEL stronger. However, I've learned not to trust the "old seat of the pants dyno." I'm not going to count my chickens until I hatch them at the dyno (and at the track). I should get to the dyno late this week or early next week, if it ever stops raining.

Oh yea, when I pulled my engine, I found out that my 1.6 intake push rods were indeed rubbing. So, no more 1.6s for me unless I elongate the push rod slot. Anybody want to buy a good used set of Comp Cams 1.6 self aligning roller tip rockers (with about 10,000 miles on them)? Just e-mail me if interested.

Later - Mike.......

Hey Mike, gotta question for you. I'm smelling gas coming from the charcoal canister (gas vapor purge canister). Have you ever had this problem? The wierd thing is that the BLM's are arround 118 which is a little rich, but not bad. Fuel pressure is set to 41 lbs. at idle. Any suggestions?

Mike (1bad91Z)

Check the charcoal canister purge valve. When the valve goes bad it causes the canister to fill with fuel. just my .02

Hey guys, this continues to be a great thread. I had asked earlier if anyone knew whether or not I could expect to get the XR269HR-12 to pass California emissions with some custom tuning. I guess I got my answer... Dennis from CompCams sent me an email letting me know that I can meet Ca emissions with that cam!! I'm stoked and can't wait to get this engine together. Thanks to both Mikes for sharing your setups.

Hey Mike,

I agree with Chris, it sounds like the purge valve is going bad. This has never happened tp me, but I have a friend that had to repalce his when it failed. 41# of fuel pressure sure does sound low to me. Have you been backing it down to try and get the BLMs up? I'm running 50# right now. My BLMs are in the 128 - 132 range with the new cam, which is right where I wanted them. It sounds like you still have to much fuel in your chip. 118 BLMs will cost you a little hp (and gas mileage). My experience on the dyno had taught me that running just a bit lean (128 - 132) produces the most hp (at least on my Camaro and my ZR1). My BLMs are still very high at idle (150), but it has been that way ever since I built the motor. They drop to 128 - 130 as soon as I get to cell 2. I thought that I had a vacuum leak, but I could never find it.

Vexter, good luck with you engine build. I can now say that the XR269 seems to be a sweet cam, and should work well for you.

Later - Mike.....

Hey Mike!

Yea, I think I'm going to replace the purge valve. However, my car is a little weird. My car felt so much faster when I dropped the fuel pressure down from 45 lbs. to 41. I'm running a 24# injector constant and the SVO's are rated at 24#'s @ 39.5 lbs fuel pressure. Could the purge canister still be doing it's job and the reason why I smell fuel from it could be because I'm still to rich in the PROM? Or, is it the purge valve failing and even though I'm a little rich in the PROM, the purge canister should get rid of the extra vapor no matter what? What feeds the canister? The big long plastic line that plugs into the throttle body is what feeds the throttle body with excess fuel, right?

Also, what inj. constant are you running in your PROM? And what do you have your target Air/fuel ratio set to?

I think I'm stuck in cell 4. Will diacom plus show what cell I'm in? And if not, what program do I need? The car does run pretty damn good, ~12.6's I figure from the cars that I've raced. But, I want to get it closer and everything ironed out before I take it to the dyno. With gears, suspension, slicks and all the bugs squashed, I think I could pull some 11.90's. (which was the goal all along).

Anyways let me know!

Thanks,
Mike (1bad91Z)

hey mike (1badz),

was wondering what kind of modifications you had to make to install the hooker long tube headers, my motor is pulled and will be easy (hopefully) to install, but wondering if you needed to make changes to the floor pans or crossmember. i'm also putting together a vortec headed 383, just about the same as mike crews, just need to find a job. sucks getting laid off. anyways thanks for your help.

jason

I too would be very intrested to know how the hooker LT install went- and can you get some pics? how are the plugs to get to? and how about the rest of the exhuast?

this is the setup i would like to do, but i want to hear something from someone who has already done it first.

Steve

Hooker LT install notes

See if this helps.

Well, I went to the dyno today with mixed results. The long and short of news is that the car "improved." My new PEAK numbers are 303 rwhp @ 5100 rpm and 336 rwtq @ 4700 rpm (as compared to 293 and 415). The bad news is that the place that dynos my car totally recalibrated the dynojet they use, and switched to a new upgraded program that has modifications directed specifically at higher hp and tq cars with an automatic trans like mine. He says that the tq numbers from his old program are flawed. I lost 80 rwtq, but only on paper due to the conversion process. The hp numbers were not affected by the new program (but the shape of the curve was). So. I can't really even compare my new numbers to my old numbers - yet. The dyno guy is converting my old numbers with this new program, and I will have the specific numeric increases in a few days (but I already have a new converted graph of one of my old runs).

So, with my new PEAK numbers at 303 rwhp and 336 rwtq (as compared to 293 and 415). Here's what I was able to determine about the cam swap based soley on the graphs that I have. I picked up 11.5 rwhp and 3 rwtq at peak. However, under the hp/tq curves is a great story. The old and new curves lay pretty on top of each other until about 4600 rpm, then they split and steadily move apart. At 4600 the new cam starts showing it's stuff. By the time the car gets to 5500 where I shift, the tq is about +25, and the hp is about +23. The car is pulling hard all the way to 5500, even though it peaks at 5100. The guy at the dyno (who runs with me at the track), said it might just be enough to knock off that extra 0.4 I need to shed to get into the 11s. I'll have better numbers for comparison later in the week. I need to put some shims in my rear end, then it's off to the track to test this thing (maybe in a week or two). Right now I have more questions than answers, but I'm working on resolving them.

Later - Mike....

can you scan your dyno graphs? What side effects if any have you found in the cars drive abilty ? Do you think for the litte increase in power it was worth going with the larger cam?

And on a side note . I went to the drag stip last night with a friend that ownes a 99 ws6 . He installed a hooker long tubes ypipe and aerochamber muffler . Also a ls6 intake , on stock heads , and bottom end . He ran a 12.6 @ 114.22mpg , with a 2.10 60ft , on stock 3.42:1 gears and pep boys tires . Damn thats not fair. Hes looking at low 12s if gets a new rearend , with nittos. Car pulls so good .

Sorry, but I don't have a scanner. However the new curves look totally different than my old ones. The drivability of the car is actually a little better now with the new cam. It idles a little smoother (and a little louder), and it gets better gas mileage. As far as seeing if it was worth it - I won't be able to say until I get to the track. I can't really quanitify my gains yet, so to say that I only picked up a little might be inaccurate, because I'm comparing old numbers to my new numbers (like apples and oranges). Plus, total area under the curves is what really matters, not peak numbers - and I did gain a lot of area under the curves. The dyno guy said the change was significant, and he thought that my 1/4 mile ets and mph would improve (he races with me). I'll have some better numbers for comaprison this week, and I'll get to the track in a few weeks. If the car pulls down into the very low 12s or high 11s and my mph is up around 110 - 112, then yes it will be worth it. Also my chips are running just a bit lean (14:1), so I might have Dean at S&P tweak those a bit.

Later - Mike......

www

www

Sorry, but I don't have a scanner. However the new curves look totally different than my old ones. The drivability of the car is actually a little better now with the new cam. It idles a little smoother (and a little louder), and it gets better gas mileage. As far as seeing if it was worth it - I won't be able to say until I get to the track. I can't really quanitify my gains yet, so to say that I only picked up a little might be inaccurate, because I'm comparing old numbers to my new numbers (like apples and oranges). Plus, total area under the curves is what really matters, not peak numbers - and I did gain a lot of area under the curves. The dyno guy said the change was significant, and he thought that my 1/4 mile ets and mph would improve (he races with me). I'll have some better numbers for comaprison this week, and I'll get to the track in a few weeks. If the car pulls down into the very low 12s or high 11s and my mph is up around 110 - 112, then yes it will be worth it. Also my chips are running just a bit lean (14:1), so I might have Dean at S&P tweak those a bit.

Later - Mike......

picture

lol looks like you're having a little trouble with that picture mike. some things are a pain in the *** on here, i just spent the last half hour writing and rewriting a post on a different board cause everytime i tried to post it it said i wasn't logged in, then i had to type it all over again...just venting a little i guess lol i'll be ok

jason

Hey Jason - Yea, I was trying to post some pictures that my wife took at the dyno run, but as you can see, things didn't work out too well for me (LOL). I even went back in and tryed to delete those posts, but I "was not allowed to." Oh well, I'll figure it out sooner or later. Can anybody give me some coaching on how to post pictures??

Thanks - Mike........

just a picture of my car i think, never tried to post a picture before

oops, well its really actually black, that was me just messing around with photoshop when i first got it.

mike, are the pictures saved onto your computer? if so just create a reply like you normally would, and you have to enter something for the reply. then at the bottom it says "attach file" click browse, or open whatever it says, then find where the picture is saved and click open. the only catch is the picture has to be smaller than 102kb, most pictures taken with a digital cam usually come out bigger than that. try it though if it doesn't work then i'll help you try and make the file smaller.

jason

ok anyways, back to your car mike....i'm sorta confused is the torque of 336 right, or is it up around 400 like it used to be. i would expect the 383 with tpi to have alot higher torque. but then if it really is 336 with hp of 303 then how are you pulling such great times?? lol

anyways found an engine shop that will do everything to my shortblock for 900, machine work, grinding clearances, and assembly..etc. so that's a pretty good deal. have to get this started its starting to get nice out lol.

jason

Hey Jason,

Yea, I'm confused to. If he puts the dyno data into the old program, I peak at 422 ft/lbs at 3600 rpm. When he uses the new program, I peak at 336 ft/lbs at 4300 rpm. I don't get it. Plus that shapes of the two curves (the old & new) are obviously totally different. So, I might try a different dyno shop here in town, or I might not sweat it and just go to the track. Anyway, I also found out that my fuel pressue was off by 2 - 4 pounds. That's why both my chips were running lean at the dyno. I never checked the fuel presure after I reinstalled the engine (ooops). So, I'm sure that there is a little power there once I get it worked out. I'm sure that I'll probably be back at the dyno in a few weeks once I'm through tweaking the new combo, and getting my rear end shimmed.

Later - Mike.....

i wouldn't worry about a number on a piece of paper. A dyno, imo , is just a place to tune your car . The track is what you should be more concerned about . Why waste your money to just see what power you are making , when its already tuned?

Breadfan - I couldn't agree with you more, you don't race on a dyno, and all the numbers in the world don't really tell you how you're going to do at the track. Really the only reason that I do use the dyno occasionally is the "quantify" chaages that Ihave made to let me know what kind of changes I might expect at the track. But now that my baselne numbers have changed (because he changed dyno programs), it's hard for me to really quantify anything. Oh well..... I'm looking forward to getting my fuel pressure up, gettting my rear shimmed, and getting back to the track to really quantify my changes.

Later - Mike......

Mike,

I know it's been said already but great post and way to keep everyone in the loop on your progress.

I just dynoed my 92 TA (383ci, 190 AFRs, nearly 11:1 compression, Superram, etc). My #s were 301 hp and 366tq corrected. I didn't do any tuning because I was running a 14.9 A/F ratio, so I was playing with the FP and crimped the return line to see if that did anything but I couldn't get the motor to richen up. I have to upgrade the stock intank pump (I already have 30lb injectors and inline Bosch pump).

What was your A/F ratio when you dynoed the car? Can you give us the specifics of your fuel system? Do you think your fuel system would hold up to a 150hp plate system?

During my first few sets of dyno runs with the LPE 74211, my AFR was 13.2 (pretty much perfect). On these last two dyno runs with the XR269, my AFR was 13.9 - 14.0, a little lean. I'm going to bump up my fuel pressure a pound or two to see if I can fix that, and maybe also pick up a few hp along the way. My fuel system is totally stock (except for a TPIS FPR). As far as the plate system, I've made a concious decision not to spray the car (just my preference). Plus, I am clueless about nitrous, so I'd probably blow up my car.

Later - Mike......

hey mike,

sorta off-topic but i remember you said that you paid somebody to put the engine together and stroke it etc....was wondering how much that cost, i got a quote of 900 for everything. i think that's pretty good but, wanted to make sure. thanks

jason

Hey Jason,

$900 sounds like a pretty good deal to me. I paid about $1200 for all the work that I had done.

Later - Mike.......

slp_firehawk

What exactly are you getting for 900$? Sounds almost reasonable.

I paid this.

42.75__Ovenbake and shotabrate block.
138.75_Zero deck block, with BHJ fixture to square decks.
148.75_Bore and hone with torque plates.
38.75__Install cam bearings.
100.00_Clearance block for stroker.

469__Total

I skipped the main align hone since I measured within spec, do not pay for this service if you dont need it. Also, I would recomend that you have your block decked and honed like I did, that is the proper way to have it done, you can sidestep the fixtures and save a few bucks but it just aint worth it. I installed an Eagle 383 kit myself so I saved on those install costs, I ended up needing to grind 4 rods to clear the cam, also had to grind down the top rings because KB Hyper pistons require special gapping. I also have about 100$ into my gaskets.

Post what you are getting and Ill let you know.

Mark

well first they gave me a price quote of 550 that included the freeze plugs, cam bearings, boring, acid dip, resizing the deck, and blueprinting. then they told me for 900 they would do all of that, plus install the stroker kit and grind out all the clearances for the 6 inch rods and bigger crank etc. they told me i'm not going to have to have in balanced in the end, is that true?

umm is anybody else see ing HITHERE everywhere. or am HITHERE haveing HITHERE flashback

Someone hacked the Forum!!!!

lil update on mine.

i've had it down the track a bunch of times in the last few weeks.

i usually save the allout runs for the last two or three of the night, kinda tuning it and feeling it out.

best so far is a 12.18 @ 111.57 mph best 60er is a 1.66

iv'e got a 12.204 and pair of 12.28's otu of it as well as 8 or so 12.3's

the problem i'm having now is the motor cutting out when it launches really hard. which happens about two runs aweek when the track is really sticky.. hopefully it'll be like that again tonight and i'll cure it.. it's either the fuel sloshing out of the bowl vent, or need longer pump shot.. as far as i can tell.
but having the motor cut out 5ft out of the hole, and still pulling of low 12.3's @ high 110's aint too shabyy.
still through the exhaust.

Mike, glad you like that cam. I told you it would be better than that LPE. I never have gotten any numbers on my car, for many reasons. But it'll whip any car in town foolish enough to try their luck against me.

Hey Warbird,

Good to hear from you, I've been wondering where you've been. Yea, I really like the XR269. It drives and runs better (smoother) than the LPE cam. Once I get my fuel pressure adjusted, the car should be ready for the track.

Great to hear Mike. - I really think that you're gonna see those high 11's at the track. - Good luck w/ it!

later, justin...

Mike,

Good luck at the track, after you get it sorted out then I 'll have to get Dean to burn me the same chip you end up with. I haven't had time to do anything with my car so I stayed off the board so I wouldn't go crazy. Now, I have some time so I'm getting back to it. I'll be real curious to see what you run at the track. Your numbers look real close to what I predicted, except for torque, curious about that.