PPG Omni paint line????? Any good??? - Third Generation F-Body Message Boards

87transam5.7tpi · 03-04-2003, 10:13 PM

I am getting ready to order some paint for my car and my local auto body store is saying that this is the best bet for price/quality for a paint. anybody using this? or any suggestions??

thanks

Josh

IHI · 03-05-2003, 09:32 PM

here's mine ppg omni torch red, just a stripe toy, so i did'nt want the best of the best, but it'll hold up like any other if maintained. Still a work in progress.

camaro6spd · 03-06-2003, 09:27 AM

ICI is owed by PPG and that the PPG OMNI Line is the same as the ICI ValuPro line. I am going with the ICI ValuPRO line for the repaint of my camaro, i have already ordered all the paint(Epoxy Primer, Urethan High Build, Plastic Primer, Base color, Clear Coat), all i need it is to order the flex agent for the bumpers.

IHI · 03-06-2003, 01:33 PM

DO NOT put the flex agent in the paint!!! I asked the guy that painted mine about this before it came to shoot it and he said that stuff is very bad!! He's been painting longer than I've been around alomost 30yrs, and he deals with paint reps almost daily at his "real" job so I'd say his word has some realistic backing behind it. The paint supply stores always try to push this ****, but most of them only know what they're told, or learned about in a night class at a tech school, my painter told me that for 1, the flex additive tends to give a bad orange peel effect to the part being painted and at worst, multiple fisheye. Another thing, the flex aditive is only in the finished product for 30 days maximun and it "dries out of the finish", they recommend installing the plastic bumpers and what not as soon as possible, so when the clear reaches maximum hardness (usually 28-30 days) it will retain it's shap. Also, after the flex agent has dried up and removed the flexible quality that it was originally intended for, the part painted with it tends to yellow after some exposure to the sun. The shop he heads up is one of the biggest in the area and he was saying they have'nt used flex agent for years because of the problems it caused. I'm not a bodyman, but this guy has been doing this his whole life, so I would think he knows what he's talking about, mine does'nt have any in it anywhere, just base/clear over everything, and thus far no problems. So take my 2 cents for what it's worth, I'd just hate to see a guy spend a ton of money on paint and all the labor involved for a final product that looks a...less than perfect?!

chrisrip · 03-06-2003, 02:57 PM

Most people use PPG, because it is cheaper. PPG is real bad to dye back later and give you a hazey look. Dupont costs more, but it is hands down, the best money can buy. You might save some money now, but you may regret it later....

eric17422001 · 03-06-2003, 04:06 PM

When it comes to paint and body materials there are so many choices to make. Paint has come a long way. The first car I had painted I used Martin-Senyor enamel, just a strieght enamel thinned with Mineral spirts. I think the shine would last about two months with that stuff.

The last painting I did (I ain't no professional) was to shoot my S10 in the backyard in one weekend, I used single stage acrylic urethane, looked ok, a few gnats landed in it, but the boo-boo was using lacquer primer-surfacer under the paint, instead of uerethane primer-sealer under the topcoat. It chips extremely easy as the bond isn't good.

I will use a base-clear on anything I paint anymore as I don't have a booth, and with the two part system you buff it out and I have seen some AMAZING results done in a crappy garage with minimal ventilation.

I think you truly get what you pay for when it comes to material, don't scrimp, and it's all in the prep work.

Eric

FSTFBDY · 03-06-2003, 04:37 PM

I just got a quote for doing my car.

Im going with All house of Kolor Paint.

A Silver Base toped with Cobalt blue.

Total for all Supplies is right around $800-900bucks.

Not really much more then the then the PPG or Dupont I priced out to do the Same Blue as on The grandSport vette. (ademeral Blue)

side by side the HOK is hands down so much nicer.

http://www.cecoatings.com/images/misc/cobaltblue2.jpg
http://www.cecoatings.com/images/misc/cobaltblue.jpg

Im doing the UK5 over BC 02
Cobalt blue over orion Silver.

Under Diff. light as seen with or with out a flash Its like a diff. color.

86transamws6 · 03-06-2003, 08:37 PM

ok, omni is the B line of PPG, just like dupont's nasson(cheaper). in my shop we use all dupont cause our teacher likes the warrentee or something. but i prefer PPG. i painted both my cars with OMNI cause its dirt cheap. to tell u the truth for the price it looks really good. its held up for 2 years so far. the only problem is OMNI clear is a little tougher to spray and will orange peel easier, and gives u nasty head rush if u dont wear a spray mask, so unless its a showcar, u have the money to spend, or the person whos gonna spray the car doesnt know what theyre doing, i would go again with omni

VortecZ · 03-06-2003, 10:41 PM

Just remember that you usually get what you pay for. I've used Omni and Deltron (both are PPG). Omni really is dirt cheap compared to Deltron but the Deltron holds up better. PPG has a warrenty on Deltron but does not have a warrenty on Omni. That tells me that they don't trust the Omni as much also.

Ray87Z · 03-07-2003, 02:19 AM

What's the deal with the flex agent, use it or not? I'm thinking of painting my car myself soon hopefully and I've just started looking into this stuff.

collin0825 · 03-09-2003, 08:44 PM

Ive been paint with PPG for 9yrs. The Omni line is their lower grade,I would recomend their Deltron or Global line. Global being the better. Just remember with paint you get what you paid for. And a for the flex additive it DOES NOT cause fisheye, oil and silicon do. But yes it does tend to cause more orange peel which can be buffed out. Also NO it does not evaperate out. Just smash a bumper with it and one without. You'll wish you had it..I speak from experience on that one.

camaro6spd · 03-10-2003, 08:38 AM

the above post is right, both of my camaros did not have flex in them and well, they cracked after a while, all the little bit of flexing over time, and then when my back bumper got hit all the paint cracked and spidered....it was bad, the bumper was fine but the paint cracked and fell off and ****....i am using flex in my paint and i am using ICI ValuPro paint, y? b/c it is a 15 year old daily drivin car, that is driven by a 18 yr old. And i am planning on making is shine nicer by just color sanding it so i am not worried about orange peal at all.

collin0825 · 03-10-2003, 10:12 PM

camar6speed, from my understanding ICI is a fairly good brand of paint. Are you painting the car yourself? Because orange peel is not caused by any certain type of paint. Its usually caused by the painters technique of spraying and at times the weather. Although a good painter should be able to compensate for the weather.

TheLG4Whore · 03-11-2003, 02:13 PM

well then what do you guys have to say about centari?

camaro6spd · 04-29-2003, 10:25 AM

isn't centari a single stange dupont paint. If so we have used in it my polytech and think it comes out like *** compared to basecoat/clearcoat systems. But it works. Yeah ICI is a nice brand of paint, my old body shop where i worked used it and it was nice stuff. But PPG just bought them out and from what i can tell and have been told the PPG OMNI line and ICI ValuPro line are the same damned things... I chose ICI ValuPro just from working around ICI stuff. Today is Tuesday and b/c of only being able to work on it for an hour and a half each day the car is moving slow. But on Thurdays most if not all the car will be sprayed with the Epoxy primer and the Door jambs will be sprayed with 2 coats color and 1 coat clear. Then the car will have the door mounted up and the car will be scuffed and get High Build Primer. It is starting to move along....i will see if i can get some pictures and i will repost how it sprays later this week....some will just have to reminde me. send me a PM or AIM me if i am on (IROC5spd).

IHI · 04-29-2003, 11:30 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by TheLG4Whore
well then what do you guys have to say about centari?

I've personally used Centari on my old work truck-if that tells you anything. It was alright, found out later a trick with the 1 step paint is to start mixing a little more hardner than is called for in the second coat, then a little more hardner than that in the 3rd coat to achieve a super gloss. My truck turned out alright, but my buddy shot his truck with it doing the hardner trick, and while not even close to a base/clear paint job, that thing was smooth as glass and glossy beyond belief. Not really a "deep" looking paint, but for a daily driver that is cost concious, not a bad deal.

Irhal · 04-29-2003, 07:57 PM

centari is the acrylic enamel series of Dupont... it is high class enamel but still no match for basecoat/clearcoat... as for the flex agent, like most ppl in this post I say go for it unless you want spider webs in your bumper paint after a few months... and clearcoat do not take a month to hardens, bc/cc is a very fast process. Without getting technical, that paint uses stuff (very nossif so if you paint, please use a mask) and it hardens in a matter of hours which is why you can wash and wax the car only a couple of days after it has been painted opposite to the old enamel where as you had to wait around 6 or 7 months

Jim85IROC · 04-29-2003, 08:22 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by collin0825
Ive been paint with PPG for 9yrs. The Omni line is their lower grade,I would recomend their Deltron or Global line. Global being the better. Just remember with paint you get what you paid for. And a for the flex additive it DOES NOT cause fisheye, oil and silicon do. But yes it does tend to cause more orange peel which can be buffed out. Also NO it does not evaperate out. Just smash a bumper with it and one without. You'll wish you had it..I speak from experience on that one.

I've never encountered problems with flex agent in the paint other than the orange peel, but I also find it completely unnecessary if you use urethane paints.

I've got a 3 stage urethane paint job on the GTA (read: thick paint) and I saved a piece of masking paper. A year and a half later, I can bend that masking paper and the paint won't crack until I have a bend radius of 1/8". Trust me... if anything on your car bends that far, your paint is the least of your concerns. The urethane paint stays flexible.

On lesser quality paints it may be necessary, I don't know. My father doesn't use the cheap paints.

camaro6spd · 04-30-2003, 10:24 AM

...yeah...you need more then just a mask when using basecoat/clearcoat, they have isocyanaes(spelling way off), in the clear and that **** is real bad for your lungs and you need a fresh air supply mask, not just a filtered one b/c isocyanates can't be filtered out. Flex is cheap and i am gonna wetsand and buff the whole car afterwards so peel is not a problem here. Cheap insurance.

ninja · 04-30-2003, 12:32 PM

Has anyone thought of using BASF paint, comes under the name of RM, or glasurit in europe ??

twiztidz28 · 04-30-2003, 02:12 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by TPl383
I just got a quote for doing my car.

Im going with All house of Kolor Paint.

A Silver Base toped with Cobalt blue.

Total for all Supplies is right around $800-900bucks.

Not really much more then the then the PPG or Dupont I priced out to do the Same Blue as on The grandSport vette. (ademeral Blue)

side by side the HOK is hands down so much nicer.

http://www.cecoatings.com/images/misc/cobaltblue2.jpg
http://www.cecoatings.com/images/misc/cobaltblue.jpg

Im doing the UK5 over BC 02
Cobalt blue over orion Silver.

Under Diff. light as seen with or with out a flash Its like a diff. color.

I have to agree with you on this house of kolors that is what i have on my car and you have the same colors on the chart. i have a mix of uk-6 and uk-7 over bc-02 and i love it. it always looks different. I was going to go with the same color you have but as you can see i didnt.

camaro6spd · 04-30-2003, 02:18 PM

yeah that is the paint that we have in my polytech class. BASF RM is is good paint, but it is mad expensive, that his the whole reason i am not using it, it would have cost the same amount as house of kolor. So I went with the ICI ValuPro( PPG OMNI) basecoat clear coat system for my 15 year old daily driven IROC convertible. It will be much better then a single stange paint.

HanSoloWS6 · 04-30-2003, 07:09 PM

I have used both Deltron and Omni the times I painted my car. And I am by no means a painter, I just find it cheaper to do my own work.

First time around was with the Deltron. Great stuff except where I had to paint it. No one had a decent garage or booth open, so it was shot in a garage that had a few bugs fly in lol. Everything went well until it was time to clear. Got to the last coat and a moth decided to use my hood as a landing strip, lol. And since it was humid, there was a spot on my bumper that began to bubble after about a week.

Second time was Omni in hugger orange. Not bad stuff for $100 for all my materials. Had a better place to shoot it and it came out great with minmal wetsand and buff. Almost as good as a pro job. Except when it had not totally cured yet and my ex sat on the hood, lol. Then after I 'bout beat her down, she ran he nails across the hood. Was not good times. Then before I could repair the damage, I totalled the poor car.

Firebird 383 · 04-30-2003, 09:03 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by eric17422001
...the boo-boo was using lacquer primer-surfacer under the paint, instead of uerethane primer-sealer under the topcoat. It chips extremely easy as the bond isn't good...

Ya know, I was wondering about that. The guy at the paint shop sold me "Painter's Pride" lacquer primer-surfacer to go under my DuPont base/clear enamel. I have only done one 1/4 panel and the hatch in primer so far. I'm doing the bodywork one panel at a time and then priming. After I finish bodywork, should I spray urethane primer-sealer over the whole thing before I spray the color? And is that the same as "epoxy primer"?

Irhal · 05-01-2003, 08:12 AM

toss that laquer primer in the garbage and just use the primer-sealer... that's all you need.. if you begins to put 2 or 3 primers on your body you gonna have problems later... it is not good to over build the material on a surface... and base/clear is not enamel

camaro6spd · 05-01-2003, 09:59 AM

Here is what you should be doing, if you are at bare metal, i would say use Epoxy primer(not the same as sealer), it is a great anti-rust primer. Then topcoat that with 2 or 3 coats of Urethane High-build Primer, wet sand that down for a nice smooth surface, and then top coat that with you base and then your clear. But if you are painting over old paint, then i would recommend doing what we do at my polytech, use 1 coat of etch primer, eats into the substraight for a good bond(is has acid in it, don't let that fool you, it is good ****), then Urethane high build, base, clear.....should work out fine and i would remove that other primer you put on there. Here I will get you the web pages for each of the things i told you about in the ICI ValuPro system, the one i am using....

Etch - http://www.autobodysupply.net/iciaut.../vp3301100.htm

Epoxy - http://www.autobodysupply.net/iciaut.../vp3301200.htm

Urethane High Build - http://www.autobodysupply.net/iciaut.../vp3301500.htm

camaro6spd · 05-02-2003, 10:02 AM

I sprayed the epoxy on the majority of the car yesterday....it sprays nice, i like it alot. I sprayed with a HVLP graviety fed 1.4 or 1.5 tip gun. The parts that got sprayed were....
1) Both Fenders
2) Hood
3) Trunk Lid
4) Ground Effects(side)
5) 1/4 panel G F/X
6) Door Jambs (on door)
7) Spoiler and side parts of the spoiler

I think that is it, today i am putting the High build over that and with the epoxy primer you have 3 days to topcoat before you need to scuff it.

The High Build has the Isocyinates in it so i am gonna use a half-mask fresh air system. We will see how it sprays.

Once all that is out of the booth, the door jambs will be trimmed with color and clear and then re hung on the car, the underside of the trunk lid with have epoxy sprayed on it then color and clear and remounted. Then the car will go in the booth and the outsides of the doors, the 1/4 panels, the tonneau cover, and the a-pillers will get epoxy and high build. The car is moving along...very slowly but is moving at least.

camaro6spd · 05-05-2003, 10:09 AM

i put the High Build Filler Primer on Friday...OMG that stuff was THICK, we used the biggest tip gun we have at polytech, which is unknown and it was still a little funky....i reduced as presscribed but it was thick....That was kinda of a good thing, it says lay on 2-4 coats of it and i went for 3. It filled in some things that i did not notice, but they are gone now and i dunno, for the price of the primer and the results being just a primer that i am gonna wetsand anyway i would say it was pretty good, not like the epoxy, that layed on real nice, now i have to to get the rest of the car in the booth and finsh it off too.

Jim85IROC · 05-05-2003, 12:29 PM

lacquer primer has its place. Epoxy primer is a pain in the ***, because once you mix it, there is no shelf life. That means every time you want to prime a spot, you've got to mix a batch, prime it, wait forever for it to dry, and throw away all the left over primer. With lacquer primer you can leave it in the gun and just spray it when you need it. As long as you seal the whole car before you paint, the lacquer primer won't cause any problems.

Firebird 383 · 05-05-2003, 01:39 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Jim85IROC
...lacquer primer has its place... As long as you seal the whole car before you paint, the lacquer primer won't cause any problems.

Thanks Jim, that's what I thought.

camaro6spd · 05-05-2003, 07:20 PM

that is true but if you can estimate how much it will take to get a coat on the car it is not a big deal and it is a nice strong primer. I sprayed my car with it and had some left in the gun, nothing worth crying over tho. I mean it takes 1 coat of epoxy and for my car that equates to somewhere between 2 and 3 qts. so i ordered 2 qt kits and that give me a sprayable 3 qts. Epoxy bonds nice, is a sealer in it self, and is waterproof, so if you plan on driving around with just primer(not that i did this), epoxy is the way to go...AND you have up to 3 days to topcoat it without have to scuff it...BIG advantage when you have limited time and can on;y get 1 primer on at a time, like i had to spray epoxy one day and High Build another.