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ok, is there anyway to install one of these without cutting the body lines and re flaring them? I found a fitting for the master cylinder to adapt it to 3/16 inverted flare, but i still need something to convert the hardline. I assume the thread is 12mm 1.0 iso? I would need a coupling for that size, but i cant fine one anywhere.
anybody?
__________________ "i thought the plan was fool proof?"
"fool proof, yes. idiot proof, no."
pretty much what im doing, but im eliminating the propvalve. I have a 10mm bubble tee fitting for the fronts, and i have the rear plumbing figured out, but i just need a female 12mm bubble fitting for the hardline, converting to either 1/8 npt or inverted flare. I can have a friend fabricate one, but i would rather avoid all that extra work.
I forgot to add that I gutted the factory valve. I take it you dont need/want the idiot light? I would go to your local auto parts store they might have the fitting your looking for. The Edelman brass come in myriad of fittings.
Theres a hex at the bottom of the valve I just removed it and the assembly with it. Then I installed a hex set screw in its place to plug it.
I might recommend doing the mod to troubleshoot the rear brakes, but you do need to reduce the rear pressure with a valve, so the rear tires NEVER lock before the fronts.
trumps2000:
Thats one of the cleanest mods like this I've seen.
<86TA>: I want to know where you got a bubble T for
the front lines. None of the parts houses (O'Reilly's,
NAPA, Standard, & Auto-Zone) could help w/ that.
That's a huge obstacle to overcome.
So what remains is getting from the m-cyl into the prop valve
inlet, and then the (single) rear line into the p-v outlet.
The p-v will have NPT threads, and I'm willing to bet that an
NPT-to-bubble flare is hen's-teeth-scarce, if it exists at all.
That leaves getting those 2 lines flared for inverted flare.
If your friend can do that, you should be good to go.
Sidebar: After upgrading to rear discs, I also wanted to totally
eliminate the prop valve. Long story short, to get acceptable
flares (i.e. straight & centered) took way to many hours, and
three progressively expensive flaring tools. The KN unit (at
1.5$BenFranklin) finally got the job done.
trumps2000:
Thats one of the cleanest mods like this I've seen.
<86TA>: I want to know where you got a bubble T for
the front lines. None of the parts houses (O'Reilly's,
NAPA, Standard, & Auto-Zone) could help w/ that.
That's a huge obstacle to overcome.
So what remains is getting from the m-cyl into the prop valve
inlet, and then the (single) rear line into the p-v outlet.
The p-v will have NPT threads, and I'm willing to bet that an
NPT-to-bubble flare is hen's-teeth-scarce, if it exists at all.
That leaves getting those 2 lines flared for inverted flare.
If your friend can do that, you should be good to go.
Sidebar: After upgrading to rear discs, I also wanted to totally
eliminate the prop valve. Long story short, to get acceptable
flares (i.e. straight & centered) took way to many hours, and
three progressively expensive flaring tools. The KN unit (at
1.5$BenFranklin) finally got the job done.
Good luck, and post some result pics.
i found every part needed to remove the stock provalve completely except the fitting for the hardline that goes to the rear brakes, you would need a 12mmx1.0 bubble flare female x something adapter. All i can find is a 12mm bubble by 4an adapter, which is made for STI oil feeds. I just dont want to have to use that, and buy a AN flaring tool as well.
I have a baer adjustable prop valve, it came with adapters to convert to 1/4 hardline, inverted flare, so you have to make a short piece like in the above pics coming from the master with a bubble flare on one side and a inverted flare on the other. The i just need that damn 12mm female bubble fitting....
as for the "t" fitting, i found it on ebay, i think its for a porshe or something, its just a little brass "t" and it happens to be 10mm bubble flare. Havent ever seen another one.
I plumbed in the adjustable prop just like the pics in the earlier post, but i want to re-do it all once i figure out the last hardline fitting.
it will work, but like i said, you need to get a AN flaring tool, so you will end up with 3 different flares in the brake system. And to be honest, i may just do that.
you know what, i said F-it and ordered 4an tube nuts, a 37degree flaring tool and the 12mm adapters. I just going to do this and be done with it. I will have pics when im done.
Last edited by //<86TA>\\; 09-11-2009 at 04:13 PM.
trumps2000:
Thats one of the cleanest mods like this I've seen.
Thanks, I thought so. I think having all those fittings and cutting up factory parts would be an eye sore with no ability to put it back together.
Quote:
Originally Posted by //<86TA>\\
i found every part needed to remove the stock provalve completely except the fitting for the hardline that goes to the rear brakes, you would need a 12mmx1.0 bubble flare female x something adapter. All i can find is a 12mm bubble by 4an adapter, which is made for STI oil feeds. I just dont want to have to use that, and buy a AN flaring tool as well.
All you need is a line with one or two prebent bubble flares on it then flare the other with inverted flare. The inverted flare to NPT fittings are easy to find.
Last edited by trumps2000; 09-12-2009 at 09:40 PM.
All you need is a line with one or two prebent bubble flares on it then flare the other with inverted flare. The inverted flare to NPT fittings are easy to find.
um no, im talking about completely removing the factory prop valve, without cutting up the factory body lines, mine are stainless and i dont even want to try and flare them, and im not buying a 200$ flaring tool that i will use once.
problem, apparently the nut on the rear brake line coming off the prop valve is NOT 12mm 1.0 bubble flare, its larger with corse thread. Great, thats a 50 dollar fitting thats now useless to me. Guess i have to go with plan "B", and have a friend machine one from the old prop valve.
all the fittings on the brake system are 10mm bubble or 12mm bubble, except for the small line that goes from the master to the prop for the front brakes, and this fitting on the 6mm line going to the rear brakes.
I liked the idea of the valve before the prop block, but didn't like the adj. valve not having any support. So this is what I came up with. I had an extra stock prop and an extra 4th gen master so was able to fab it all up off the car.
I'm running a 4th gen master on my car, and this is a second 4th gen master I got for my fiancee's 89 IROC I bought for her.
I wasn't too worried about supporting the valve, its light and the tubes are pretty stiff. That said if there were an easier way to mount it I would have. I left the warning switch in the prop valve, but I'm not sure how well it works. It comes on when I hit the brakes pretty good.
I just wanted some support for the valve, and it was easy to do with the valve I got. It's an SSBC valve, but pretty much anyone has the same one avaialble.
I'm going to try it with the stock light switch left intact. I really don't have to hit my brakes hard to stop my car. I have a set of 13" Wilwood brakes I built for the front and LS1 rear disks so not much pedal effort is required. But with such large brakes in front they lock way before the backs to, so this is why I'm trying the gutted valve and adj. prop valve. I have a good disk/disk stock prop valve on now, and the one in the pics is my old drisk/drum valve. Figured I'd take the disk/disk one off in case this doesn't work like I want, and it it does work I'll sell the disk/disk valve. They seem to be hard to come by now days.
I saw that valve and called wilwood tech support on it and they told me it wasn't designed for a street driven vehicle. I'm not sure what his reasoning was behind what he said, but he suggested doing exactly what I did to retain the factory prop valve.
I would be interested in seeing the pics of your installed valve.
__________________ I do the T56 cable drive speedometer modification. PM me for more info.
i used all the factory lines for the whole thing. went to Autozone and went through all their brake lines until i found what i needed. I also rented the flaring tool from them and did it all myself.
I liked the idea of the valve before the prop block, but didn't like the adj. valve not having any support. So this is what I came up with. I had an extra stock prop and an extra 4th gen master so was able to fab it all up off the car.
I'm running a 4th gen master on my car, and this is a second 4th gen master I got for my fiancee's 89 IROC I bought for her.
Bringing this thread back from the dead...
I'm trying to do the same thing depicted in these pictures, the only thing that is holding me up is that I cannot find a 12mm 1.5 male fitting to any kind of female adapter.
That is what I measured the fitting going into the top of the combo valve anyway. I see that you have some kind of adapter in there. Did you get that adapter at a parts store somewhere or did you have to order it?
Just wondering if it is something I can find locally.
I'm starting to drive myself nuts looking for fittings to do this. Any chance you can list what you used?
I just saw your post, I'm heading out to meet my new girlfriend now (shes hot....sorry she comes first) but when I get back I'll see what I can do to find a part number for you.
I found the fitting at a local parts store in their fitting cabinet.
__________________ I do the T56 cable drive speedometer modification. PM me for more info.
I just saw your post, I'm heading out to meet my new girlfriend now (shes hot....sorry she comes first) but when I get back I'll see what I can do to find a part number for you.
I found the fitting at a local parts store in their fitting cabinet.
Don't worry about it, hope you had a good night
I figured it out. I had to buy a 6mm line with bubble flares on each end. I then cut the line in half and put the inv. flare fittings on each end for a 1/4 inch line. The fittings themselves were the size up from 3/8ths, i cant remember the exact size. I then had to buy new 1/8th npt to female inv flare adapters for the prop valve.
The reason I got away with using a 1/4 inch line fitting is that 6 mm is very close to 1/4. The flare worked out perfectly on these lines and off I went.
I also tapped the hole in the plug on the combo valve with a 8-32 tap and installed a screw with thread sealant. Worked perfectly.
This is really probably the easiest way to do this mod after looking at all of the alternatives. BTW the fittings on the line from the MC to the prop valve on a 91 are 12mm 1.0 on the mc and 12mm 1.5 into the prop valve. You can buy both fittings but I ended up just reusing the 1.5 fitting on one end of my lines
