1quickTPI

hello all, i have an '89 iroc and was wondering what one could do to keep the opperating temps right around 160-170ish.. right now its around 220ish and this motor LOVES cool temps more than any other motor ive had.

right now i have a highflow 160* thermostat with stock radiator, fans, an A/C condensor that need replaced since 1/3rd of the cooling fins on the front are flattened out and wont comb out, and a cheap Oreilly's trans cooler routed in series with the factory trans cooler in the radiator. im assuming somebody went into the computer and changed my fan on temps because the fans stay on for the most part.. still might need a 176/160 fan switch.

how much benefit would i see if i got the TPIS aluminum radiator?
will LS1 fans work or would it be WAY too much hasle? (im not affraid to fabricate).
is there anything else i can do to cool this beast down?

ive done the throttle body bypass

throw your opinions, dogs, arms and legs out there.. i dont care help a brother out!

J91

Get the fan switch, check your air dam underneath. Mine was pointing backwards itt should at least be at a 90 degree angle w/ the car. I shimmed mine w/ some plastic wedges giving it a forward angle, I got the idea on this site. It really helped.
I have to question the 160 therm. It is probably open all the time, our radiators are small, and having coolant flow constantly through does not give it much time to cool. My car ran cooler w/ a 180....

Twin_Turbo

iTrader: (25)

160-170 is way too cold, run above 180 at least.

DJP87Z28

I had about the same condition with my radiator beside a small leak..replaced radiator now high temp with A/C now 20deg cooler. Just go with a stock radiator.

1quickTPI

first and foremost, i dont have emissions in my area. i dont care about emissions and i dont care about the ozone.. so in all reality, i dont need you telling me what temperature my car needs to run at..

i dont have EGR, AIR, or anything smog on my car.. i know what temperature my car runs optimum at and it likes the 160-170 area..

if its over 180* it runs like total dog sh**

AND higher temperatures actually cause the engine to wear more.. just a heads up. i build race engines. but thanks though.

Badass355ciz28

iTrader: (17)

what about a 3 row aluminum radiator with a nicely made fan shroud with dual cooling fans? and a high flow water pump

Twin_Turbo

iTrader: (25)

You big mouthed &%^*%^* ...my recommendation has nothing to do with emissions and everything with oil degradation

This board is full of disrespectful punks... 19 y/o time to STFU and listen.

Badass355ciz28

iTrader: (17)

on thig with the hotter temps it will decrease engine oil viscosity and the y pipe under the oil pan doesnt help it either

J91

Wow, if you know so much, then why are you asking questions???

1quickTPI

thanks for the good information.

where would one find a 3 core radiator for these cars? all ive found are 2 core?

1quickTPI

woah you need to chill the F**kin hostility dude.. i was just stating that there are no emissions which is what 90% of the population bring up when it comes to engine opperating temp.. chill the f**k out and quit being a bipolar psycho.. i did not mean for that post to sound hostile..

as for oil degradation, it dont matter because i change my oil every 2k miles sometimes, 1500 miles..

dont let my age fool you, i am not as dumb as my age may show. grow up and quit being hostile.

and as for me not knowing much about cars, i posted this thread asking for ways to cool a TPI camaro down.. last time i checked carbed cars are alot easier to run cooler than these cars.. maybe the 150 "overheating" threads werent a good enough indication that these cars are hard to cool down?

on a side note, i dont have the airdam, was unnaware these cars even came with one..

and i appreciate everyone's especially badass355's positive post's that actually helped me instead of critiquing my wants and needs.

y84pauloflondon

This is THE BEST PIECE OF ADVICE your gonna GET.....
All the anwsers to you questions can be found in other threads....Take some time and do a SEARCH!!!!
3 Core rad.....Theres a thread on that!
Overheating issues/Running hot......Theres a thread on that!
Fan Temp Switch.....Theres a thread on that too!
Electric fan info.......Theres Even a thread on that one!
And So On And So Forth........

y84pauloflondon

OK I do agree with you that SOME threads can be pointless(lack of GOOD info....) Even SOME good threads can have some useless crap hiding in them! YOU need to go through it to find the good stuff(work on that skill).

"on a side note, i dont have the airdam, was unnaware these cars even came with one..." So it seems that you need to do some Home Work, and learn about your car.

TIP of the DAY: That AIRDAM is a BIG, BIG part of your cooling system, NO JOKE. That AIRDAM can be the difference between staying Cool OR Overheating......

oil pan 4

iTrader: (1)

There are even threads on those evil electric coolant pumps.
These cars are not hard at all to cool down if you know what you are doing.

Stephen

iTrader: (12)

Before you do anything, put an airdam on. Unless it is REALLY cold where you are right now.....It WILL overheat when Summer hits, without an airdam.

If you want it to run better, get it to run in the 180 range. At 160, it is still in closed loop programming & not running/performng like it could.

You might THINK it is running good. It might FEEL like it is running good, but that is because of it's basic, closed loop programming it uses to start with. You want it to run good for REAL? Get it into the 180 range & open loop operation.

J91

You have to have an airdam, get one! As for a larger readiator, Jegs, Summit, etc. If your car runs bad over 180, there's a problem w/it. The TPI set up was designed to run around 185-190 degrees. You shouldn't need a larger radiator w/ a stock engine....

101btp

iTrader: (1)

Well ya he doesn’t need to tell you what temp your engine needs to run at but if you go so far it turns into the what ever I want to do arrogance

Twin_Turbo

iTrader: (25)

Higher temps cause the engine to wear more and he builds race engines, 19 years old and not a damn clue. At higher temps engines wear LESS. Almost all the wear happens in the first couple of minutes when the engine is cold.

Badass355ciz28

iTrader: (17)

thus is true too.... all the engine oil is in the pan.....needs to be pumped thru the engine............

Deimos140

Thats why we have mutli viscousity oil. Anyways cooiling I don't have an air damn they are important. U can use a large rail aluminum radiator or a copper one if you don't have alot of hp. CSR electric water pump is my pump of choice and electric fans rock I ran mine to direct switch.

1quickTPI

thanks for the info guys, im gonna get an airdam soon.. as for cooling, i dont necessarily want it at 160* running temp but i understand that with a 160* thermostat your always gonna have over 160* temps.. i had a 160 in my truck and it ran about 175-180.. i want the engine to RUN at 180* i dont just want the fans and thermostat to open at 180.. but my understanding is the airdam only helps if your moving.. i want my engine to stay cool idling as well so i need to get an aluminum radiator.. what aftermarket fans would you guys suggest for these cars in place of the stock fans?? i may have some LS1 fans but im not sure how much of a hasle it would be to install them.. im thinking about also buying the JET 176 fan switch.

and twin_turbo, ever heard of thermo-breakdown?? there are multi viscosity oils for startup.. higher temps are proven to kill engine longevity.. but i will not argue nor will i waste my time with you any further past this.

thanks again guys

Stephen

iTrader: (12)

You might think about flushing (to start with) your pump & the cooling passenges in the block itself.

Here in Texas, my stock airdam, stock water pump, stock radiator, stock thermostat, stock chip, stock airdam, stock fans, all on my 22 yr old 1987 350/700R4 GTA....Will hold my car at 200-210, parked at idle, on a 103 degree Summer day.

If you go throwing "fix-it" parts at a system that already has a problem, all you doing is applying a band aide, not trylu fixing the problem.

Twin_Turbo

iTrader: (25)

Yes I have heard about thermal breakdown and this does not happen anywhere near the temperatures you're talking about.

There is no such thing as a multi viscosity, that's complete rubbish. multiGRADE!!! oils have a viscocity range that moves from one type to another, like 10W40 behaves like a 10 weight (thin) oil in cold temperatures and as temperature climbs due to Viscosity Index Improvers (spiraled up polymers that stretch out when temperatures rise, as such having little or no effect on viscosity when colder and when stretched out they improve the thickness, in other words the oil resists thinning out) where it starts to behave like a 40 oil. This does not mean the oil has 2 viscosities a fluid can at a certain temp only have a certain viscosity.

Now these VII are not the holy grail, in large quantities (oils with a big wt spread) they can cause problems like the polymers baking onto rings and they don't lubricate.

Optimal engine temps are in the 180-210 range. Below 170f ring wear could be as bad as .0001"/1000miles now since you are an experienced race engine builder, you know how much wear you can tolerate there. Assume it's only .00005 or so per 1000 miles at the temps you're running....

Then again, as an experienced race car engine builder, you probably know why serious race cars have a dry sump tank with heaters and/or a heater blanket and a heat exchanger setup on the radiator not only to cool down the unit after the race but also to heat it up before..

It's a fact that 80-90% of the wear happens at startup with cold engine oil, it's also a fact that too cold oil can not boil out condensate (water) and combined with the acidic products of combustion this causes all kinds of troubles.

If your oil starts to come apart at 180F you should really buy a new temperature gauge.....

oil pan 4

iTrader: (1)

I have read hard backed books printed back in the late 50's and 60's showing how cylinder bores ware faster with cooler and no thermostat setups.
The old timers pretty much always know what they are talking about.

8t2 z-chev

if you want it to run at 180*most of the time just get a
180 thermo,big aftermarket radiator,good water pump
such as eldebrock,and some powerful fan(s) If you have
factory dual fans,4th gen fans(93-02 are all the same)
will not make any difference as they are the same blade
and motors as 3rd gen.Could salvage a large electric fan
from a junkyard and adapt(3.8l taurus,late-model chevy
impala etc.) hook up fan to turn on at 185* so it will
turn off at highway speeds to reduce load on the alt.
An engine oil cooler will help too.

1quickTPI

thats exactly the answer ive been looking for.. something to KEEP me at 180*. a CONSTANT temperature throughout most driving scenario's.

thanks!

Twin_Turbo

iTrader: (25)

in your first post you wanted to run 160-170, I said run 80 at least ...and low an behold...what do you want now? LOL A thermostat should control the minimum hot running temperature, that is if the rest of your cooling system is properly sized or oversized. If it's running hotter than your thermostat dictate it means your cooling system is lacking.

1quickTPI

congratulations and thank you for trying to help but your attitude could have been MUCH more possitive in your last few posts and i would not have had a problem with you.. but since it was a negative attitude i dont care what you have to say at this point..

i always ran my engines at 180*.. sorry if i stated otherwise in my first post.. but i do agree.. if the cooling system isnt up to parr then yes, the temps will be higher than the thermostat and fan switch rating.. im gonna keep the 160 stat in it and just buy an aluminum radiator, good fans and a fan switch just so i can keep it right around 180 or so.. i may even put a higher stat in it..

thanks all, i know what i gotta do now..

next up is a TPI 406! woot woot!!

y84pauloflondon

You(1quickTPI) next Replied With:

"i dont care about emissions and i dont care about the ozone.. so in all reality, i dont need you telling me what temperature my car needs to run at.. (I would say that this is NOT a positive additude)

i dont have EGR, AIR, or anything smog on my car.. i know what temperature my car runs optimum at and it likes the 160-170 area.. (you wrote this twice, how are we to know that you ment 180*)

if its over 180* it runs like total dog sh**

AND higher temperatures actually cause the engine to wear more.. just a heads up. i build race engines. but thanks though." (others were also rubbed the wrong way by this statement!)

Twin_Turbo was Not the first one to cast a stone!

This Thread could have gone MUCH better....its BS that it didn't....and its a damn shame that its 60% CR*P!

Those who have givin info, should be thanked, including Twin_Turbo! TT and I are NOT Friends/Buddys, but I would have felt the same way as HE DID by recieving replies like yours!

This Thread is Done!

1quickTPI

i do beleive i thanked him as well as everyone else.. but thanks for chiming in.

transam85dudeman

HEY WAIT A MINUTE. Im a bipolar psycho! I SWEAR. its not fun. . I just wanted to say, if youre running a 160 tstat. then a chip upgrade (Thermomaster by Hypertech) will prevent open loop. For example the chip in most stock cars are programmed for 230 operating temps. if the coolant is too cold hence 160* you maybe running in open loop mood not getting the real live responses from other sensors on the car. One thing that always could use lower temperature is the Tranny. I want to get TWO tranny coolers with fan. that helps with radiator temps too. ps. i really am bipolar. www.free-tv-video-online.info

1quickTPI

hmmm.. maybe it runs like crap in closed loop then.. it might be staying in close loop and thats where my performance is coming from since its running pig rich..

i got new iac, good tps, good ecm temp switch, good Maf, good everything except for the 02, im unsure about.. but my brother has a new 3 wire heated 02 and his does the same thing.. runs like complete crap when its hot.. i would really like to figure this out.

ps i run a tranny cooler right behind the air duct on my car.. no fan but im looking for one.
thanks

101btp

iTrader: (1)

closed loop always helps your performance, it adds on another sensor, road conditions will affect your car or the driver, more than a sensor, if it's good, it add's more ability to monitor and control the engine further down the line than stock mounts

1quickTPI

then is there a way i can wire up a toggle to flip it into open loop when i race? lol its amazing how much power i loose with it being in closed loop.. i cant stant it.. itll barely get out of its own way but when its in open loop it hangs with 12 second cars.. wtf?

Twin_Turbo

iTrader: (25)

Get a 640OHm resistor, wire it parallel into the CTS harness and use your switch to switch between the CTS and the resistor. Easy peasy...but don't take my word for it.

cIaRmOaCrZo

sorry, dont hate me lol but you have your words meanings backwards. closed loop and opened loop should be switched around in your post.

Stephen

iTrader: (12)

Really? I thought Open meant it was reading the sensors & adjusting the programming, while was was exactly that. Closed to all the sensors & running strictly off the pre-defined tables.

You sure? Couldn't even make sense the other way.

cIaRmOaCrZo

im positive. closed loop is when all sensors are giving the ecm feedback while it makes constant adjustments to them. open loop is when its running off the pre-defined tables.

y84pauloflondon

cIaRmOaCrZo is correct....Had a laptop hooked up to my car a couple of weeks ago.

Its Open when you first start up the car (Cold), and stays open until the fan kick on (Stock is at 180ish*--Warm). At 180* its now a "closed loop".

Now, I've got a 160* therm, and a Hypertech cooling fan switch (On at 177* Off at 166*). When the fan turns on at 177* it closes the loop. My car is now running around 170's in a CLOSED LOOP...

Twin_Turbo

iTrader: (25)

closed loop is when fuel delivery is adjusted of the O2 sensor signal, open loop runs off prom tables.

Its very easy to see if the engine goes into closed loop, jumper the ALDL and watch the CEL. If it blinks fast, it's probing for a proper O2 sensor signal, open loop. If slow, you are seeing O2 crosscounts (lean->rich and rich->lean swings)

The term open loop comes from the operating loop of adjusting a rich mixture till a lean mixture is observed by means of the O2 sensor signal, enrichment mode is entered until a rich mixture is detected, then it leans out the mixture until a lean mixture is detected...its a vicious circle....a closed loop.

Closed loop is not active when the fans kick on. That has nothing to do with it. For the system to go into closed loop you need at least 3 parameters a hot enough coolant temp a certain time has passed and a proper O2 sensor signal, in other words the sensor has heated up and is working. When the O2 sensor zirconium element is heated up it becomes permeable for O2 molecules (but not free flowing, there is a sort of resistance so to speak). Simply put, as with all in nature there is a strive for equilibrium. The outside air with high O2 content compared to the exhaust gas tries to dilute the exhaust gas so that the concentrations are in equilibrium (much like the driving force behind osmosis), of course there is no way enough O2 can permeate through the element to actually do this but another thing happens. As the conc. differences between the outside air and exhaust gasses change, so does the driving force for the O2 to permeate and restore equilibrium. This is called a chemical potential and the sensor actually creates a small voltage ranging from close to 0 to about .9 V for a simple narrow band sensor.

Here's an old speed density (CFI) related tid bit I wrote years ago for the crossfire forum

The ECM is devided into three major sections:




The ROM (READ ONLY MEMORY.)
The PROM (PROGRAMMABLE READ ONLY MEMORY) also known simply "the chip".

There's also a CALPAK, wich is the calibration for the type of engine. Some ECM's have been used in both V8 and V6 engines, the '7747 is such an ECM. These have different calpaks (can be swapped out).


The RAM (RANDOM ACCESS MEMORY).





The ROM contains the basic set of instructions for the ECM to follow. The programming in this chip cannot be
erased or changed. The ROM is NON Volatile.



The PROM works along with the ROM to fine-tune the functions of fuel and timing control. The PROM can be
replaced by a "power" chip (also a prom) or an EPROM (or even EEPROM) from which the data can be erased and
changed. The PROM is NON Volatile.





The RAM has three primary functions:





To act as scratchpad (temporary memory) in case of a mathematical calculation.
To store BLM (Block Learn Multiplier) information when the engine is off or the ECM is in open loop.
To store fault (trouble) codes. These codes are stored for 50 starts or whenever the power (orange wire on
juction block for '82 vette) is disconnected. Unlike the ROM and PROM the RAM is volatile.





The ECM controls the injection system, it fuctions in either one of 3 different modes:


[*]Shutdown Mode..
When the ignition is off for 2 or more seconds. Only the RAM (trouble codes) and the BLM remain powered.[*]Startup Mode.
When engine is cranked. Timing is locked at initial startup and air/fuel ratio is enriched. This mode is on for
about two seconds after starting to ensure the engine will continue to run.[*]Running mode


divided into:

[*]CLOSED LOOP.
The red arrow doesn't indicate a signal, it's an event. Due to the more/less pulsing of the injectors a
rich/lean condition will be observed and the ECM will compensate for this.

In closed loop mode the ECM has 2 differend modes;

[*]Enleanment Mode
When the throttle is closed.[*]Enrichment Mode.

[*]At wide open throttle.[*]High engine load.[*]High engine RPM.[*]Overheating engine. (the cold fuel is a great contributor to engine cooling)




The ECM is normally in enleanment mode, it constantly lowers fuel addition. When the oxygen sensor detects a
lean condition enrichment mode is entered untill the oxygen sensor doesn't sense a lean condition anymore.
Than enleanment is entered again. This (theoretic) gaurantees an "ideal" air/fuel ratio.


[*]OPEN LOOP.

[*]Fuel cutoff Mode.
When the throttle is closed and the MAP sensor notices a negative load (deceleration) untill about 1500 RPM..[*]Clear flood Mode.
When throttle is depressed more than 80% while cranking. Injectors are turned off or air/fuel ratio is lowered
to 20:1.[*]Limp Home Mode.
When there is major trouble with any of the critical sensors/actuators.



The ECM monitors different sensors and controls the injectors and actuators to respond to changes/demands.





The different sensors and actuators are:


[*]The Oxygen sensor is the only sensor on the car that creates it's own voltage and has therefore only one wire
coming from it. It's actually a chemical voltage generator, based on the potential difference between the
oxygen rich condition in outside air and the lean condition in exhaust gas.. When it's at it's operating
temperature of about 600ºFahrenheit it will produce a Voltage ranging from 100 to 900 mV. At operating
temperatures the sensor will respond to changes in the oxygen content in the exhaust gasses. It creates a
potential difference between the "clean" oxygen rich outside air and the oxygen poor exhaust gas. The voltage
potential is developed due to chemical imbalance between the two oxygen concentrations. When the voltage is
low (oxygen levels in exhaust high) the ECM will assume the engine is running lean and thus enter the enrichment
mode. Lean conditions usually produce voltages lower than 450mV, rich will be over 450mV. As you can see there
is a very critical value for "ideal" air-fuel ratio. This is done to ensure that the engine never runs very
lean/rich. This way a nearly ideal air fuel ratio is always obtained, the engine never gets the chance to
run off this point by far without the ECM noticing it.





Due to the nature of the oxygen sensor it has a hard time distinguishing between a perfect and a rich running
engine, when all oxygen is burnt the mixture can be ideal or rich. The oxygen sensor doesn't recognise surplus
(unburnt) fuel in the exhaust. Therefore the ECM will always assume the engine is running rich unless it
notices a lean condition.


[*]The Tach Signal
The Tach signal is used to synchronise and sometimes (WOT) sequence the injectors. At very high engine RPM the
ECM always enters enrichment mode.

The TPS is actually a three wire potentiometer. It's got a 5V reference sent to it
by the ECM. The TPS is grounded through the ECM. The 5V is lowered to a different voltage through the
potentiometer (read variable resistor) When at no throttle the resistance is lowest and the voltage is also
lowest (normally set to 0.525V ±0.025) When at full throttle the resistance between the 5V and the ground is
highest (theoretical infinity) and the potential difference (voltage) will be 5V.


[*]The Idle Air Control valve or IAC (stepper motor)


The IAC is a motorised plunger that regulates the idle speed of the
engine by regulating the incoming airflow. The IAC has 256 positions. At normal idle it's somwhere around
position 20. When full throttle is applied the IAC valve completely opens.




The EST retards timing when the knock sensor (a sort of microphone) notices
detonation. Normal spark timing is controlled by the EST, commanded by the ECM.


[*]The EGR or Exhaust Gas Recirculation

EGR is a method to decrease emissions by venting exhaust gas into the intake
(about 7% of the intake volume is rendered "useless" due to this). It also decreases detonation due to the
uncombustable (inert) exhaust gas. The EGR position is ECM controlled via the EGR position control solenoid.
This is a solenoid that regulates vacuum to the EGR valve thus opening/closing it.


[*]The AIR system or Air Injection Reactor

The A.I.R system consists of an AIR pump or just SMOG pump, that pumps fresh air into the headers/catalytic converter.
When the engine is in closed loop air flows into the headers (and cylinder head exhaust ports) to speed up O2
sensor warmup. When the engine is running in closed loop air is pumped into the catalytic converter to speed up
the chemical reactions taking place there. Also during deceleration the air is vented to the atmosphere to reduce
detonation in the exhaust. The route the air travels is regulated by a control solenoid (that is ECM controlled)


[*]The TCC or Torque Converter Clutch (lockup converter)

The TCC is engaged when the car is travelling at about 30mph at
relatively light load and in a high gear and when a relatively steady signal is observed from the TPS (steady
throttle) This is done to maximize fuel efficiency.


[*]AC compressor clutch


When the Air Conditioning compressor clutch is on the ECM increases the RPM at idle to account for the increased
load.


[*]The Auxiliary cooling fan

The Cooling Fan is engaged when the ECM detects a high signal from the coolant temperature switch. On the Cross-
Fire system the auxiliary fan is NOT ECM controlled


[*]CTS or Coolant Temperature sender


The Coolant Temperature sensor on the manifold sends a signal to the ECM. The one on the drivers side cylinder
head goes to the temperature gauge, the passenger side one controls the auxiliary fan.


[*]The MAP sensor or Manifold Absolute Pressure sensor

The MAP monitors the manifold pressure and is an indicator for engine
load. Also the ECM calculates the quantity of incoming air from the signal of this sensor.

1quickTPI

thanks man ill try that.

whatever84

Wow! I thought these forums were here for tech help along with entertainment. Why so hostile? I'm not trying to start a riot but da*m. I am 41 yrs old and I've learned a few things on here myself without even asking and I've built a few cars.

Mark.

J91

This thread has been all over the place, it's too bad that it has to get so ugly in order to get some good info!

formula1LE

iTrader: (3)

s

formula1LE

iTrader: (3)

Yes, this thread got away in a hurry. Good breakdown of sensor descriptions though! With regards to ideal operating temps, 180 was the norm in the 70's but with ever increasing demands on clear emissions, in order to burn more of the unburnt hydrocarbons in the exhaust, it was necessary to run at a higher temperature. It should also be noted that race engines and daily driven engines are worlds apart in terms of VE imo. I am 34 and I've built everything from stockers to legitimate 9 second "street" cars-heh heh so I know a little bit about tuning for power vs. tuning for economy. For one thing, I run very tight end gaps and maintain very tight bearing tolerances because I run everything on Mobil 1 oil or Amsoil. With an iron block I go a little more loose but with all aluminum, he tighter the better. Synthetic oil will aid in keeping your motor cooler because of 1 very important aspect-rate of evaporation. The is the temprature at which oil will begin to break down, forming sludge and it gives you that brownish haze inside your valve covers you've always wondered about. 99% of all conventional oil regardless of viscosity, begins breaking down at 240 degrees. Mobil 1 for example starts breaking down at 450. I have literally drove four engines (one 305, two 350's and a 4.3 SFI V6) in my life that was pegged at 260 degrees and each one I had to drive at least 15 minutes to get it home and none of them showed any signs of damage after they had cooled and I fixed the problem that caused the overheating. Synthetic oil gives your motor an extra lease on life should something go awry. The uniform molecules allow for tighter clearances, synthetics have higher film strength which means you can run tighter clearances and beat them harder and the engine stays together longer. Anybody who doesn't believe in synthetics is just mis or non-informed about the differences..plain and simple. So try that and see how much cooler your motor runs and how much smoother it runs as well.
Back to operating temperatures-the reason TPI's are designed to run @ 190-200 is to raise the combustion chamber temps to lower NOx emissions...this serves to reduce the harmful emssins but it also aids in improving VE through a more complete burn. This is why you get much better mileage with EFI over as carb. That's why detroit moved away from carbs and to FI-they needed to introduce a mist into the intake vs. a partially atomized droplets of fuel. Smaller droplets are easier to heat and heat makes power as well as improving VE so it's a win-win. The ONLY thing that needs to be cool as far as the combustion chamber is concerned is the incoming air. This is all just the tip of the iceberg-I've moved way past this stuff and am currently retro-fitting a TPI system to run on hydrogen assist with a water fuel cell and brute force electrolysis. With what I know about computer tuning and the TPI stuff, I should be able to dial my engine to run as lean as 30:1 while leaning my fuel out by 75%. If you understand how the actual properties of hydrogen work, you'd see how this is possible. Anyway, that's my project but imo I would not try to run any TPI other than 190-200 degrees, it's just too efficient not to...if you want to experiment with building power, trying going to a cylinder head that has more velocity and an intake that allows for more breathing like the StealthRam. Then upgrade to a larger throttle body, etc. Lastly, ditch that cooling fan for a more robust unit like form a Taurus or Mark VIII. I build Mark VIII kits because they are the best as far as I'm concerned. Cut through the eye candy of the fancy radiators with cheap fans like Flex a lite or Spal and realize that any aluminum radiator is going to aid in heat disipation....what you want is a fan with the biggest freakin copper windings you can find. Why? Because that along with blade design are the two most important things to look at when deciding on a fan. A large single fan is always more efficient at cooling that two smaller fans because of the total surface area it utilizes-the law of thermodynamics tells you that. And, the small pancake style fans simply CAN'T pull a large amount of air when needed because you need a lot of windings to spin a motor faster. The OEM Ford fans are the best...sorry GM guys but they are. Want proof? Look inside two blower motors for a 1990 Suburban...on with rear AC and one without. The motor for use with rear AC has more windings....it needs them in order to spin the motor faster to get the air to the back of the truck! And yes this will increase the average amp draw to the fan but hey, you can't have your cake and eat it too! lol Hope some of this stuff helps ya. Just some thoughts as I'm typing late at night! See ya.

transam85dudeman

Neoprene gaskets are needed to convert to synthetic. thats my opinion. cork is old school. Mobile 1 rocks. Castrol is better in my opinion though. i dont synthetics in my ride, only cars made after 2001. Dont get me wrong, I use syntec Castrol 0w-30 in foreign car, Castrol GTX 10w-30 in the T/A. i liked your post. you are the man.

ThePain

deleted

formula1LE

iTrader: (3)

Any engine regardless of year stands to benefit from synthetics....Castrol Syntec is classified as a Group III Hydrocracked Carbon oil. This means it is a highly refined mineral based oil-in other words, not a true synthetic. About 10 years ago, Mobil sued them over the use of the term "synthetic" but the jury was hung because the jury really couldn't wrap their heads around what a syntheic oil should be comprised of. Since synthetic oil molecules are much smaller and uniform in shape, any exisiting tiny leak will become a bit more noticeable but it is completely false that synthetics "create" a leak.

1quickTPI

formula1le, that is absolutely the best and truest of information.. i applaud you as i too, know all about oils.. (a friend of mine works with it)..

yes syntec castrol is not a full synthetic.. which is why i run mobil 1.. i did notice that when i run mobil 1, my engine smokes more on startup because my vavle seals/guides are worn a little bit.. it smokes more than with the castrol GTX i used to run.. but it deffinately stays cleaner longer..

as far as my engine, i have some AFR 195 in the works early next spring with a miniram and a decent, yet streetable cam with a 3k or so vigilante stall..

im also thinking about doing the T-56 swap just for the fun aspect even though you cant beat the consistency of an auto car.. i love automatics, but with this being a streetcar, and me wanting to make it basically a vette killer, the t-56 would be so fun..

thanks for the info formula.. much apprecaited!

transam85dudeman

I ran with mobile one before, gain hp right off the bat. BMW said the same about Castrol, youre very knowledgable dude way to go, know a lot of good facts. In the Bmws Mobile creates a noise in the upper rpms in the valve train (Common with bmw.). Castrol doesnt so much, thats my reason for Castrol. I still got a few liters of Mobile one sitting on the shelf, dont get me wrong , that oil is sweet. i did have that problem with leaks with sythetic, mainly because of seals that are already gone, GTX plugged it up for me. To help the main dude on that posted this thread. Electric water pump, three row radiator, thermomaster hyper chip, 160* t-stat- jet fans fan switch, dual fans, external tranny cooler with fan, tb bypass, heat core bypass. external oil cooler