Firebird and Camaro PROMinator - Page 4 - DIY PROM - Third Generation F-Body Message Boards

AM91Camaro_RS · 11-06-2003, 11:25 PM

keep up the good work! if these are going to be for sale anytime soon, i'll probably wait and get one of these. i need a new burner but i won't be able to sell that stuff once this comes out! HURRY!!

MrBill · 11-07-2003, 01:13 AM

Well I've still got some cleaning up to do...but you will all be glad to know (as am I!)...that the prototype is working!

Bulldog92 · 11-07-2003, 12:37 PM

Thought I'd offer some more words of encouragement / nagging / annoyance...I can't wait to get my hands on one of these Prominators. I've been using the burner I have at work to handle my reprogramming duties for now so that I can save some bucks for once these babies are released. We're all behind ya Mr Bill...

va454ss · 11-10-2003, 11:28 AM

So, what's needed as far as the laptop is concerned?

What do I need as far as floppy drive, serial port, etc?

Any specific rec's on brands, etc?

I'm considering new vs used.

Thanks

Bill

MrBill · 11-10-2003, 12:23 PM

The only requirement is that it has a parallel port.

You don't need to spend the bucks on something new just for this, an older laptop will work fine. I just needs to be able to run Windows. The one I've been testing with is a Winbook 400MHz. I've also got a newer Compaq 1GHz with WinXP that I will test with also.

I'm also finding out that the quality of parallel port signals varies quite a bit from one PC to the next...that sux.

va454ss · 11-10-2003, 12:29 PM

[quote]Originally posted by MrBill

I'm also finding out that the quality of parallel port signals varies quite a bit from one PC to the next...that sux.
[/QUOTE

Care to elaborate?

eighty8T/A · 11-10-2003, 05:06 PM

just thought I'd ask. any progress? and will this work 4 the 165 ECM? The PROMinator is the best thing since 3rd gens were introduced!

Shawn

jon_volk · 11-10-2003, 06:04 PM

yeah, you wouldnt happen to know an BALLPARK idea of when it might be available...given everything goes as well as it has so far.

Craig Moates · 11-10-2003, 07:20 PM

Give him some room... This stuff's a PITA big time...

Craig Moates · 11-11-2003, 05:48 AM

Bill,

What kind of issues are you running into with the parallel port? I know I was able to tackle it from another angle a while back with that little Flash programmer I described earlier.

I didn't want to make it too complex with the staged 4-bit exertion going back to the PC, so I just set it up for being compatible with bidirectional ports. Used series termination (10k I think) coming from the parallel port going to the flash chip. That way, if you exerted the data or address info from the parallel port, it was available and ready to work with regardless of what was going on at the device programmer, and just in case the CPLD was called to active outputs at the same time, or the Flash chip was configured by the CPLD for CE+OE, the parallel port databus and Flash data lines (to which they were directly linked through the series resistors) wouldn't come into contention. The logic and Flash were strong enough to push the device end of the business around to whatever state, regardless of the parallel port data line states. Of course, you'd have to float the parallel port lines from software to pick up the exerted data in a readback. But the series termination helped out in more ways than one this way. I guess this is standard stuff though, I've seen it in many different public domain layouts for various devices.

Anyways, just thinking out loud. Don't know for sure about when the transition was made from unidirectional to bidirectional, but I think it was pre-286/386 for sure. Using some sort of series termination like this might help keep the bus clear of contention as well as simplifying your logic. You're probably way past this though, based on the earlier pics and discussions.

See ya...
-Craig

Quote:

Originally posted by MrBill
The only requirement is that it has a parallel port.

You don't need to spend the bucks on something new just for this, an older laptop will work fine. I just needs to be able to run Windows. The one I've been testing with is a Winbook 400MHz. I've also got a newer Compaq 1GHz with WinXP that I will test with also.

I'm also finding out that the quality of parallel port signals varies quite a bit from one PC to the next...that sux.

jamesbob02 · 11-11-2003, 01:05 PM

I'm getting so excited about this! Can't wait til its ready.

MrBill · 11-12-2003, 02:23 AM

Craig, you have mail.

MrBill · 11-12-2003, 02:35 AM

Oh, and yeah we've made some good progress lately. It's working pretty reliably from my laptop. So far I've used it with a 7747 and a 8746, both are happy with it. I'm still concerned about the inconsistency of the quality of parallel port signals. A working theory right now is that desktops just have crappy built parallel ports, whereas laptops are much cleaner. If this is the case then it shouldn't be a problem. I hope to get some more testing done regarding this issue tomorrow.

As for availability...all I can say is I'm putting every spare minute I can scrape up into it. I'm working full-time again so the night shift is about the only time I get to work on it, and some weekends. I really do wish I could give you guys a definate date right now, but I just can't accurately do that. I will tell you that it absolutely will not start shipping until I know for sure that it's a reliable design. Been down that road TOO many times! It is getting close though, I think we're over the major humps now.

bigals87z28 · 11-12-2003, 03:15 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by MrBill
Oh, and yeah we've made some good progress lately. It's working pretty reliably from my laptop. So far I've used it with a 7747 and a 8746, both are happy with it. I'm still concerned about the inconsistency of the quality of parallel port signals. A working theory right now is that desktops just have crappy built parallel ports, whereas laptops are much cleaner. If this is the case then it shouldn't be a problem. I hope to get some more testing done regarding this issue tomorrow.

As for availability...all I can say is I'm putting every spare minute I can scrape up into it. I'm working full-time again so the night shift is about the only time I get to work on it, and some weekends. I really do wish I could give you guys a definate date right now, but I just can't accurately do that. I will tell you that it absolutely will not start shipping until I know for sure that it's a reliable design. Been down that road TOO many times! It is getting close though, I think we're over the major humps now.

Hey, just take your time and it will all pay off as im sure everyone on this part of the board has been waiting for something like this. Just keep working at it and Im sure you will figure it out man. I got my laptop all set up and ready to go.

jamesbob02 · 11-19-2003, 03:05 AM

Any news or progress?

wjbecker · 11-19-2003, 06:31 PM

Hi im bill becker
I have a 89 gta 5.7 w/tes headers,adjustable fuel reg,hypertech stage 2,march underdrive pulleys,msd,
ignition.-----next year cam head work
new chip!---- street car.
best time 1/4 mi 14.844 at 40 deg f oa
I have been doing research on whether
or not i can tune by myself.I made my scanner work for the first time last week
(winaldl).
my ecm is a 1227165 $6e

I was going to start out using the eeproms and the pocket programmer
but I stumbled on to this -prominator!

I am reading alot of posts and i am trying
to study a hack but the more i learn the more confused i get.

anyway i want to buy one like the rest of you guys.

MrBill · 11-21-2003, 05:19 PM

Ok guys just an update...

I'm still fighting inconsistencies (sp?) in signal quality between computers (laptops included). Just by coincidence my laptop that I've been using mostly has really good signal quality, but every other one I've tried has pretty lousy signal quality. Sometimes they work, sometimes they don't...not good enough. The problem seems to be with crosstalk between signals internal to the parallel port hardware itself (which can be nothing more than poor design of the PC's hardware). I'm working on adding a circuit that will make the prominator hardware all but immune to crosstalk effects on the incoming signals. Don't worry, this is not going to require a board redesign...I designed in the ability to add this circuit. All I need to do is solder the part down on the board and add a little CPLD logic, no big deal.

Stay tuned....

Bill

88305tbi · 11-22-2003, 10:20 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by MrBill
The problem seems to be with crosstalk between signals internal to the parallel port hardware itself (which can be nothing more than poor design of the PC's hardware).

would it be feasible to set these cards up with a USB port that those of us with newer laptops (and XP) could use? i know nothing about hardware or circuit design and ask only cuz it popped into my head, but i'd rather pay you guys and extra $10 or $30 or whatever than go to radio crack for an adapter that might or might not work... just a thought...

MrBill · 11-23-2003, 01:05 AM

We considered a USB interface...but it would have taken SO long to implement that we tossed the idea for now and just stuck with parallel.

fun Pain · 11-26-2003, 09:16 PM

Have you fellas thought of how you are going to produce them. I mean are you going to hand build everyone, or did you have something else in mind. Just wondering.

I am a stundent at OSU for ele. engineering, and i have been pondering the same idea,(prominator) with a few small differences....
but my knowledge and know/how... doesn't compare to moates and bill.....(yet) but if I see a problem i can solve, I will help, if i can.

jeepguy553 · 11-30-2003, 12:18 AM

WOW! I wish I had read this a week ago! This kind of stuff is what makes tuning a bit easier for newbies like myself!
Count me in once you get it all up and running. If it will work with an 8746 and the cheapest laptop I can find in a pawn shop, I'll bite for sure.

MrBill · 12-06-2003, 11:12 PM

I thought it was about time for an update here.

I sent out three units for testing this week. One is working fine the other two are having some minor issues. Those two should be on the way back to me within the next couple of days to troubleshoot. I've also got two more going together here to do some of my own testing. I don't think the issues are serious, I'm pretty sure I know what's going on and can fix it pretty easily.

As far as production, it just depends on demand. For just one or two here and there I will most likely build myself. Now if someone comes along and wants a large number, well then I would probably send them out to an assembly shop.

Ken has one that's having some problems and was in the process of sending it back to me...but I just got a message from him just a few minutes ago that his dad had another heart attack and that he was on his way to the hospital. Let's all keep Ken and his dad in our thoughts and wish for the best.

Thanks,

Bill

Swapmaster · 12-06-2003, 11:47 PM

Hey Mr Bill, is it time to start taking pre-orders yet? I bet you are going to sell more than one or two here and there. If you have a dollar amount set I will send you a check now and wait for a working model to show up at my door whenever you get them ready to ship and I really don't care how long it takes.

jeepguy553 · 12-07-2003, 07:58 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Swapmaster
Hey Mr Bill, is it time to start taking pre-orders yet? I bet you are going to sell more than one or two here and there. If you have a dollar amount set I will send you a check now and wait for a working model to show up at my door whenever you get them ready to ship and I really don't care how long it takes.

Me too. I can have a check or money order in the mail at the end of the month. Just let me know how much and where to send it.

jamesbob02 · 12-07-2003, 09:15 PM

KAOSRacing · 12-08-2003, 08:36 AM

Put me down for one, I'll buy one as soon as my budget allows.

bigals87z28 · 12-08-2003, 12:10 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by MrBill
I thought it was about time for an update here.

I sent out three units for testing this week. One is working fine the other two are having some minor issues. Those two should be on the way back to me within the next couple of days to troubleshoot. I've also got two more going together here to do some of my own testing. I don't think the issues are serious, I'm pretty sure I know what's going on and can fix it pretty easily.

As far as production, it just depends on demand. For just one or two here and there I will most likely build myself. Now if someone comes along and wants a large number, well then I would probably send them out to an assembly shop.

Ken has one that's having some problems and was in the process of sending it back to me...but I just got a message from him just a few minutes ago that his dad had another heart attack and that he was on his way to the hospital. Let's all keep Ken and his dad in our thoughts and wish for the best.

Thanks,

Bill

I hope that Ken's dad is doing ok.

87_TA · 12-08-2003, 05:42 PM

ops , wrong thread.