DIY PROMDo It Yourself PROM chip burning help. No PROM begging. No PROMs for sale. No commercial exchange. Not a referral service.
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Does the prominator need a memcal? I am about to buy a 730 ecm and it does not have a memcal. From what I understand from the posts the prominator I wont even need the memcal. Is this true. Thanks
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Originally posted by AustinT Does the prominator need a memcal? I am about to buy a 730 ecm and it does not have a memcal. From what I understand from the posts the prominator I wont even need the memcal. Is this true. Thanks
I am sure there is more to it than what I will write but the way I understand it is that you will need a MEMCAL, for the other "end" of it, the KS filter, the PROMinator just replaces the PROM, where the engine tune (program) is.
__________________ "James": 1985 GMC S-15 Jimmy, 3.2L turbocharged, intercooled hybrid 13.873 @ 99.08 Under the knife
"Bu": 1998 Chevy Malibu, mostly stock for now.
That's exactly right. It ONLY replaces the PROM, where the engine cal data is stored. Anything else that was there before a prominator is installed MUST be there after.
By the way, field testing is going very well. There is one unit "out there" that has been going and going and going. I'm not sure how many bin downloads he's done so far, but I know he's having way too much fun LOL. I will be sending two more units out for testing next week. In the meantime I am working on building up parts stock so that hopefully the wait won't have to be too long. Initially I will probably be able to build about 10 at a time, so filling orders "might" be a little slow to start.
Oh yeah that was the main reason why I clicked on this thread for a time line update. LOL I can't wait to get my hands on one, my biggest problem right now is finding a program that I can use for my engine .bins, since the 60*V6 (FWD .bins) don't seem to have a whole lot of support at this point, and I'm still trying to learn about what makes an .ecu file an .ecu file. But I think this is leading to a different topic....
__________________ "James": 1985 GMC S-15 Jimmy, 3.2L turbocharged, intercooled hybrid 13.873 @ 99.08 Under the knife
"Bu": 1998 Chevy Malibu, mostly stock for now.
Hi bill becker here
newby never burned
I read this at bills site---
NOTE: PROMinator is NOT approved for use on emissions-controlled vehicles, therefore it is ONLY legal for off-road use!
does the program make it not legal
or does the prominator?
I intend to tune my gta one way or the other but can someone set me straight please.
I have 89 gta street car 350 tes headers dual cats
edelbrock exhaust,mds ign,fuel pres reg,hypertech stage2.
buying wonderbar and sfc's from tds
soon. saving money for engine mods
which include edelbrock centerbolt 60cc heads ,crane roller cam,edelbrock
tpi manifold.
I do runs at the track to see performance feedback . I love my car
Had it since 1991 and all(i think)of my upgrades have a 50 state legal tag.
I am keeping all emmissions controls.
the possability of having more than one program available is cool
highway or race.
I live in nj and dont know auto modification laws I have been to the track and there must be much worse
offenders than what i am attempting.
does anyone have experience with
my type of situation?were you able to pass emmission testing?is there a method to ensure good emmission controls?after heads and cam installed
and chip tuning are my emmissions
going to be much worse ,a little or not at all > nj now has dyno emmission testing?
please help and thank you in advance.
count on me buying a prominator
I can wait longer than the other guys
but i am still itching.
merry xmas
wjbecker,
My '89 Formula 350 passed emmisions. Here's what's been done to the car.
AFR 190 Heads
Accell 219 Cam
Edel. Headers
High flow cat.
Exhuast air pump removed
T56 Manual transmission
Stock intake manifold components (will be changed soon)
Somewhat custom chip (as custom as you can get without dyno or road tuning the car)
In Chicago, we have the cassis dyno emmisions testing, and my car was able to pass. You will need to have cat converters. I doubt the car will pass without them. Also the engine should be in good running condition (no dead cylinders, no missing, no burnt valves, etc...)
The car should have no problems passing.
As far as the disclaimer, it's not a matter of whether it passes emissions tests or not...it's simply a violation of FEDERAL (not just state!) regulations to modify emissions-controlled equipment, unless the device being installed has a CARB certificate. At least that's my understanding...but I really haven't researched the laws to any great extent.
Ok I think that this Is One Killer Project, and applaud Craig Moates, Mr. Bill, and Mr. Mangus on Good Sports man ship (for lack of a better word)This is how good products and Services become a reality.
Even though I am new to Prom Burning and will be getting the PROMinator when ready and learn how to tune correctly I know that if any problems Just to post a question on the best ThirdGen Forum Ever(thirdgen.org) and that eventually I will get the answers I Seek. Now I have spent the last 3 weeks just reading posts in the DIY-Prom board the more I read The more I get comfused (since i have yet to burn a chip and have no hands on experience yet.)
Like I have a 1985 Camaro With the 870ECM Every time i post a question about how to burn chips for the 870 (eprom type 2732) I get the Switch to the 165ECM or go speed density debate, I wish some of the others on these boards would share the same (sportsman ship like Moates, Mr. Bill, and Mr. Mangus and just help you with what I want and share some know how not what they want!! I don't want a 11.5 second car I just want to be able to tune with a 870 for slightly better driveabilty and bolt on upgrades untill i have a better grasp on this. So for this post is to give you guys a STANDING OVATION!!! You Rock
Now Please Tell Me If This Will Work on The 870' Ecm I see one post on the 870 In this Post eariler but didn't quiet understand it.
I know that newbies can be a pain but everyone was a newbie Once!!
This is a question to some of the more experienced programmers for this thread. I have a C3 ECM and I am hoping to get the prominator. WOuld it be advantageous to upgrade my ECM to a P4 to make programming easier or is it just going to be a larger hastle??? Thoughts please....
Yes, it should work fine on an 870 ECM based on what I know.
Get all you can out of your C3, then use that experience to decide what to do next. You can do lots from where you're at. Big thing with the newer PCMs is the higher data rate for datalogging.
I am keeping a watch on the prominator site for the pro version to be released. Hopefully in a month or so. My car is in storage and badly needs a new program for it. Extensive upgrades have made the stock 350 chip useless.....
Originally posted by Craig Moates Yes, it should work fine on an 870 ECM based on what I know.
Get all you can out of your C3, then use that experience to decide what to do next. You can do lots from where you're at. Big thing with the newer PCMs is the higher data rate for datalogging.
Thanks Craig i am glad that I finally found some body that understands that You need to learn to walk before you can learn to Run. don't get me wrong Most Everybody in the forums are very cool people that have a very Good knowledge of DIY Programming. I am almost afraid to post any questions for when I do most answers are to switch to the (165ECM) or (SD) If ya throw to much at a newbie to quick it will most likely confuse them and scare them away from Learning it. am not a Newbie to engines Just ECM and Prom Tunning. Now that I finally have a camaro again, I want To be able to drive more than 20 Miles with out pulling over and getting gas, so It is time since this Car already has a 1985 TPI that I learn How to Tune Proms and such. So I want to learn the basics first, then with that knowledge learned there I will be more confident to take on a more challanging Step. The PROMinator Will make this eaiser You all ROCK
well now that I am done rambaling I just Want to thank YOU Craig and EveryOne for their knowledge and Help.
anyone With any 870' Knowledge please PM me info lol
been a while... how bout an update? I need to get my hands in on this, Just got a new cam in my car and its running ok, but since the swap... bout 40 miles to half a tank, dont see how that is possible, i aint tellin the ecm to throw more gas in there, but that tank is drainin a heck of a lot faster than it used to. Tuneing is a must and I'm in a situation where I have to repurchase my PP2 software, but this made me hold off on that, I would much rather have this, and fund fellow 3GO'ers than xtronics again.
__________________ 350 motor from 5-19-02 to 12-04 and 7-2-05 to ???
92 Camaro RS, ram air hood, t-tops
As of July 2nd, junked the 305 and put in...
92 subarban motor rebuilt.... weiand intake, accel cap and rotor, blaster coil, holley annihilator module, 2" TBI, open element with K&N, 65# 350 cop car injecors (9C1) custom burn prom, 1.6 rockers, Comp Cam [.317"/.317"(lobe lift)] x 220*/224* @ .050 111* LSA", hedman headers and y pipe, BORLA cat back, no cat, tranny cooler, rebuilt 3/4 race trans, 2400 stall, no emissions BS
R.I.P.
Copper Bronze Metalic '89 RS
First and last run... 7/30/03
14.727 @ 91.88mph R/T .994
Well any ways I can't wait to hear how it works, Please give the most informative feed Back. Also I was wondering if Bill has spoken with anyone regarding making TunerCAT RT Work with This.
__________________ ---------------------
speed•(spëd)•n
The rate or a measure of the rate of motion or distance travelled per unit time
I think I am as pumped as you are about this prominaor. I also have the 165 ecm so I am eager to hear the results and your feedback. Please keep us all in the loop.
Originally posted by MTPFI-MAF Ok Craig I have a question. is the Prom on the PROMinator permanent or is it removable using one of your adapters.
There is no "PROM" on the Prominator board. It uses a flash ROM, eliminating the PROM...which is where the name came from: "PROM elimINATOR". Clever ain't it. LOL
The Prominator board itself will attach directly to Craig's adapter where the EPROM would normally sit for the P4 ECM ('49, '165, '30...etc), for C3 ECM apps ('7747, '8746...etc) it will attach directly to the ECM main board, again where the EPROM would normally sit. There are no removeable parts on the prominator board itself, aside from the parallel port ribbon cable.
And for an update...still working out a minor bug, in the process of updating two test units, should have results in a week or so. The only real issue left is that we've ran across an IBM Thinkpad that it doesn't like.
Finished the initial logic for the Pro version tonight, so far things are compiling just fine. Still a little software work to do for the Pro version, should be ready to test it by this weekend.
Updates should start coming more frequently now.
Thanks for the testing help Craig! That was cool hearing the tires light up in the driveway over the phone! LOL
I've been testing a prototype in a C3 ECM ('8746) in my 83 Cross-fire Camaro. It doesn't require the socket to fit in the C3s, so the fit is better than the pics in Craig's review.
The ability to drive, log, pull over, make changes, and be driving again in 30 seconds is amazing - I've never used emulation, so I can't comment on the comparison, but I love this thing.
I was a total PROM newbie before my Prominator - I never burned a prom using a conventional burner - I simply loaded the bin in TunerPro, made my changes, and off I went - like Craig mentioned - the Prominator software is a no-brainer.
The DB9 ALDL connector in his article connects to his HAM board. HAM stands for Harness Adapter Module. It's an adapter I made to convert a 7747 or 8746 ECM to mate with the Crossfire wiring harness. See http://misterbill.homeip.net/aboutham.asp , maybe that'll help make more sense. The picture on chevyhacker's article that shows the DB9 is with the HAM installed in an 8746. The HAM board has the RS232 translation circuit (1 transistor, 2 resistors) required for WINALDL built onto the board, so all that's needed is to "hang" a DB9 out the end of the ECM to connect directly to the PC serial port.
Now what do i do If the laptop dosen't have a parallel port. I was going to go buy a new LapTop but 90 percent of the good ones don't have a parallel port just 4 usb ports. the only Paralle port to usb adapter i see only convert Usb to Paralle Centronics conector(printer)
In the process of testing Pro version right now. I'm also fine-tuning the board for a production run. We should be able to start taking orders very soon...a week or so.
Yes, the Standard version (non-tune-on-the-fly) will be $175, and the Pro version (tune-on-the-fly) will be $275. If you need it installed, you'll ship your ECM to Bill and he'll install it for $25.
We're hoping to have both of them in actual production within a few weeks (possibly less?)
There's no "waiting list" - but if you'd like to start one, you're welcome to e-mail me.
Does that $25 installation go for any ECM? I have an '8746 and was under the impression I'd need an adapter as well. Will you do the full install for this as well?
Is a site I can go look at this. I have a '91Z28 with a custom built SDPC engine. 350 w/FastBurn heads. At a mile hi in Denver it has245lbft/345hp at the rear wheels. Want to do a little tuning of my own. $500 dyno time at a time gets spendy.
Is a site I can go look at this. I have a '91Z28 with a custom built SDPC engine. 350 w/FastBurn heads. At a mile hi in Denver it has245lbft/345hp at the rear wheels. Want to do a little tuning of my own. $500 dyno time at a time gets spendy.
Okay guys, the time has come; we've got the production boards in and parts. We'll be shipping soon (within a week or two!) So we've decided to go ahead and take "pre-orders" (where you pay up front, and you will be the first batch of people to receive your Prominator) and we're also putting people on a "list" (where you will pay for it when it's ready to be shipped to you, but you will be AFTER the people who have already paid for theirs, obviously.) There won't be any physical difference between the two batches - they are all the same.
Go to the order page to order one, whether you are pre-ordering or want to be on the waiting list.
The production run has the 8-position image switcher capability built in. You can either buy our small panel-mount switcher (no display) or Craig's box-mount (with display) switcher to use. They are both compatible. You must specify whether you want this option or not! There is no charge for this option; only the switch! You can order it without the switch and it will function as a single-BIN Prominator until you get your switch.
When you order, you need to specify:
Vehicle/Year ECM (part number; i.e. 1227165, 1228746, 1227730, etc.) Chip size (27128, 2732, 27256, etc.) Whether or not you want the BIN switcher option (our switch is $15, or you can buy Craig's with a display for $25 through www.moates.net as well.) Standard ($175) or Pro ($275) version
We can't be held responsible if you get the chip size wrong, so be VERY SURE you have the correct chip size! If you're unsure, ask here on Thirdgen; someone knows! That's why we ask for your Vehicle and Year - so we can double check with you to make sure you have the correct ECM and chip! (As many members here know there are all kinds of upgrades!) Also, if you are unsure whether the Prominator will work with your laptop or not, PLEASE CONTACT US! We have tried to test it on laptops as slow as 133Mhz up to 1+ghz. YOU MUST HAVE A PARALLEL PORT for this to work! The current Prominator does not have USB functionality! (It might in the future, however.)
Also for those of you who have asked - the Prominator does NOTHING about datalogging or ALDL. That's entirely up to you. This device simply replaces the "memcal" chip and allows you to program it right on the ECM without removing it or erasing it. With the Standard version you will have to PULL OVER to program (good for single-users,) but the Pro version allows you to tune-on-the-fly (meant for professionals who have someone else to drive for them while they tune.) DO NOT TRY TO TUNE AND DRIVE BY YOURSELF WITH THE PRO VERSION!!!!
Currently we accept PayPal and checks/money orders. E-mail Bill for details.
Also, we are constantly improving the software for the PC - making it faster AND better. We wll also be working with Mark and Tunercat to get it implemented into their software for easier tuning. The software is ALWAYS free! Updates will be available through the website. Software improvement suggestions are also appreciated so if you see a better way to do things, feel free to e-mail either of us!
BIN Switcher allows you to load multiple calibrations. Say one for "valet" mode, one for the track, one for economy, one for letting the kids drive.. etc. Up to 8 images can be loaded on a single Prominator.
lol 
