RBob

iTrader: (1)

The Lockers hardware has been redesigned and combined with a ROMLess C3 TBI Little Board. This means that it fits inside of the ECM, IOW: embedded within the ECM. All surface mount (except EPROM and NETRES/CALPAK) means a compact board with a drop in form factor. The Embedded Lockers board uses high speed CMOS devices for low power consumption and high noise immunity. A solid robust design for years of reliability.

Included with the Embedded Lockers system is Jon Prevost's data logging and display software (the HUD). As a joint effort between Jon and myself the best of two combine forces.

The Ultimate TBI code (a licensed copy is included with each Embedded Lockers board) has much improved functionality. High resolution VE, AE, PE, knock, and spark tables, along with many other enlarged tables (too many to list). This provides better control and a smoother running engine over the stock TBI code. Code support for VATs, soft RPM and MPH limits, Valet mode, VAFPR compensation, improved IAC idle control routines, sync AE fuel control, improved spark control, again, the list goes on.

Small stuff too, such as linear IAT and CTS values for all functions. Blending of the IAT and CTS for improved fueling with cold air induction. Support for Y-Body digital dashes (ALDL stream). Nitrous wet flow system control, N-Alpha control, electric fan control, smart A/C compressor control, a hardware output that goes active when in PE mode (can be used for opening air cleaner flaps or increasing the alternator voltage, or even illuminating an LED).

Combined with Jon's Windows based data logging and display software this is the ultimate TBI system. There is a Setup Wizard to guide users through the first bin. This Wizard prompts with questions that allow an initial bin to be set up. No need to go through each and every calibration parameter for that first bin. The display software is a combination of a digital dash and graphing package. It is the same as Jon has posted images of on TGO.

What is Lockers? It is a state of the art data logging system. The Lockers board transmits the ECM's 256 bytes of RAM 17 times a second through a serial link (57.6KB). From there the logging software uses that data to display every vital ECM parameter there is: PW, SA, knock retard, delta TPS AE, delta MAP AE, accumulated miles, accumulated PW (for MPG calcs), MPH, RPM, TPS%, MAP KPa, CTS, IAT, blended IAT/CTS, BLM, INT, everything the ECM uses is available.

On top of that the Embedded Lockers board has 8 10-bit ADC channels (0-5 volts) that are transmitted in real time with the ECM data. This allows the logging of a WB unit, EGT units, accelerometers, fuel pressure transducers. Basically, any 0-5 volt device can be data logged along with the rest of the ECM RAM variables.

Lockers can be used with today's emulator products. Base EPROM size is 128kb, a 256kb EPROM is plug in compatible.

So where is it now? The new design has been prototyped and tested. Jon's software has been in use for ages. The Embedded Lockers board is in the final stages of PCB layout. Once that is completed it's off to the board house. We still need to clean up some odds and ends, but this is no vaporware, it's the real deal. No pricing as of yet, but it will be reasonable.

For anyone using or considering a TBI setup, this is the way to go.

RBob.

robertfrank

iTrader: (27)

YOU ARE MY ***!where do i sign up?is this going to be used with prominator ,autoprom or both?

vernw

iTrader: (2)

So, when ya gonna start on the 730/$8D version? LOL

RBob

iTrader: (1)

It can be used with any of those devices. The EPROM socket is in an open area that can easily be accessed. There will be ECU and XDF definition files available immediately. A TDF file will follow.

RBob.

RBob

iTrader: (1)

If the demand is there we will do it. With the 8192 baud ALDL stream I'm not sure how many would go with it.

RBob.

Dominic Sorresso

RBob,

You son of a gun. You and Jon went and did it. Congrats. I can tell you the enhanced resolution for VE is a *** send when you have a modded Xfire. So I could use my Moates "Ostrich" with this?

JP86SS

iTrader: (1)

Makes me want to go TBI
or
Go buy a car with TBI just so I can play with the new toys.

I'm hoping we can get the 730 expansion that's in progress to this level someday.

justlearning

is there an approx. cost in mind yet just so i know if its out of reach and if i should just try and get the tunning stuff and jump in...but it sounds like the king of all prom mods for the 7747, and 8746 ecm

BMmonteSS

Hot damn !!!! I knew there was a reason you were keeping hush hush about the speedreader. I'll take one even if I have to sell a liver. Go ahead double whatever your asking price was going to be, I'll pay it!!!! This is just intime for my new motor build over the winter.

robertfrank

iTrader: (27)

will this also work with the 8036? it`s what i`ve got.

dimented24x7

iTrader: (2)

EDIT: I take it you mean 8063? Yes, itll work with that ecm, the hardware is the same.

dimented24x7

iTrader: (2)

...

3.8TransAM

I dont have TBI for one :-)

But I use Rauchers lockers on my TTA with the 148 and I will say, if you dont have a lokcers board already, put this on your list of things to own if u have one.

Nice work guys.

Looking forward to seeing it in Oct Rbob :-)

later
Jeremy

DM91RS

AWWSUME............

There are some nice features listed! Sounds like alot of things that you can do with a C4 and more.

How does the serial link hookup?

Very impressive!! Great work guys!!

DM

Grumpy

I hope you meant kidney. With no liver, you won't be around long.

RBob

iTrader: (1)

It is a 2-wire RS-232 output with a MAX232 on board. Just plug it into the laptop serial port or USB to serial adaptor. The Embedded Lockers board transmits data whenever it is powered up. This makes it real easy to log the data.

RBob.

justlearning

do u even have a price range in mind if its close i may hold off on some stuff before i dive into the tuning and get this when its released all i need is a base price....and will this also burn chips or is it just a dataloggin program i dont understand all the features u listed

DM91RS

Kool..........can this be run through Craig's ALDU1 box?

Already have that and an Ostrich hooked up.

Oh.....and where do I order this thing?

Thanks......DM

Dewey316

This is great news. Sign me up when you get them going.

Fast355

iTrader: (2)

If its available for the 7747 or the 299 let me know.

Grumpy

A) Small stuff,
Ya, all those ugly little detail things, that make it all worth while.

B) Talk about an understatement. I've been using the *old* Lockers for years, and when all's been said, and done, when I want to get the data I want, out comes *Lockers*. 20-30 mis of datalogging (at 17 frames a sec), and then being able to sit down and look for all the lil issues is just invaluable, well, at least to me.

FWIW, I have one for the ecm bench, and one that rides along in the car, and now, I'm buying 2 of the new ones.

BMmonteSS

One word......dialysis

89 Iroc Z

Got any pics?

RBob

iTrader: (1)

Can't give a price yet, it's one of those odds and ends we are working out.

Doesn't burn chips, will still need a burner or emulator to use with it. What the Embedded Lockers provides is three fold: a high speed data acquisition system, a logging/display software for the PC/laptop, and the actual code that runs in the ECM.

The data acquisition system sends the ECM information along with some ADC channels to the PC/Laptop logging/display software. This software can log this data to disk and/or display the information on a graphical display.

As for the actual code, the Ultimate TBI code, this is what runs the engine. It has been enhanced and re-written to provide the functionality required for low, medium, and high performance engines. As an example there are two VE tables, a low RPM table and a high RPM table.

The low RPM table goes from 400 to 2000 RPM with a row every 100 RPM. The MAP increments are 20 to 65 KPa every 5 KPa, then 70 to 100 KPA every 10 KPa.

With this level of resolution the engine runs better. Smoother and more responsive. The high RPM table has RPM resolution of every 200 RPM from 2000 to 3600 RPM, then every 400 RPM from there to 6375 RPM.

Many of the other tables have been increased in size. These items provide the tuner the flexability required to have a greater running vehicle.

Edit in additional answers:

No pics yet. As soon as the layout is complete I'll post a scan of the silkscreen. This will show the size and shape of the PCB. Basically, it is twice as deep and the same width as the current little board. With the rear half narrower to clear the ECM heat sink.

It just may work with the ALDU1 box. There is another serial output that is +5 volts. I had dropped that on for future uses. If the ALDU1 box will operate at 57.6 kb then it should work.

As for which ECMs this will work with. At this time I know of 5 that share the same hardware:

1228746
1227747
1228063
1228747
1228062

There may be others. The Embedded Lockers system turns off the on board ROMs. In this manner it runs just the U-TBI code, so all of the above ECMs become the same.


RBob.

justlearning

oh so ur saying it will allow for better loggin than our orriginal 160 baud that only shows a few points etc...that sounds good and so does the code, so this code will be a .xdf then to use w/ tunner pro also or will there be many formats but all in all sounds like a great tool

Fast355

iTrader: (2)

Should work with the 299 then? It is almost identical to the 8062 and similar to the 7747.

dimented24x7

iTrader: (2)

The hardware has to be exactly identical to the above ecms. If the hardware/hardware addresses/proc. are different it wont work.

Fast355

iTrader: (2)

Makes sense. Doesn't really matter anyway. Got to thinking about it you get rid of any prior advantage the 299 has anyway.

ben73

Wow! This is fantastic news!

BMmonteSS

Ben, your not allowed to have one, you have to give the rest of us time to catch up

DM91RS

Fast355

iTrader: (2)

I'd get it just if it would fix my A/C on idle when I shift it into park. It runs fine a 650. Drop it into gear it idles at 650. Turn the A/C on it idles at 650. Drop it into gear with the A/C on, drive it a little, then put it in park, Idle is up to 1,200 and stays. Turn the A/C off and it goes to 650, turn it back on 650. Aggitating to say the least.

dimented24x7

iTrader: (2)

Aside from the nice engine, his PCM is lightyears ahead of the stock tbi ecms. Those have many of the features of RBobs ultimate tbi code, and much more. One thing they did in the code that I thought was neat, was temperature dependant AE filtering terms for the MAP and TPS. At cold temps, the filtering gets slower to allow the AE to stretch out a bit. Dont know if the UTBI has that yet or not, but Im keen to try it out.

The UTBI code should provide a huge boost compared the stock garbage thats currently in these ecms. Thats a big issue in itself.

JPrevost

Actually RBob's code has more performance oriented features than even the newer pcm's. The only thing the newer pcm's really have is the trans controls. I'd say the ultimate TBI code is the best for fuel and spark hands down. Make something more complicated and you'll spend more time getting it to work when it doesn't... this is the perfect blend. He's added features like fan control and nitrous control, PE mode output to let you know when you're wasting gas , sync AE, and believe it or not, better spark energy! I won't induldge any more "secrets" because it's not necessary only to say that it's a much better setup for the DIYer than the later pcm. No re-pinning required, just cut and maybe add a few wires.
Do the later pcm's give you a feature like dial-a-timing? The Ultimate TBI code does. Just hook up a trim pot, set it up the bounds in the code and you've got yourself a spark retard box. Heck, this thing has built in nitrous controls that retard the timing a set amount programmed by the user when active!!! The features included far surpase those of the later unless you don't need them. Even then this code is easier to program because it's completely documented NOW, not down the road. Don't take this the wrong way because I know the later code like 0D has some ways of doing things that could be implemented into the ultimate tbi code down the road. I don't know what as of yet but you just came up with a good one. The only problem with the AE thing is that you pretty much want AE to come in as quick as possible, not stretched out. This is why strong fuel pumps and large injectors are so useful. Grumpy's been preaching this for a while with port injection but it's even more important with TBI. You don't want to stretch out AE, you want it to follow the air so get it in and in FAST. Big injectors can do this and don't have to carry over to the next pulse . It's the only reason why I was running 28psi. Not because I needed that much fuel but because the AE was much better.

Fast355

iTrader: (2)

You have us HOOK, LINE, and SINKER!!! Just keep us updated.

Now heres the question. What all do you have to do to the ECM. Mine is currently equiped with the flash chip adapter and flash chip.

justlearning

uggghhhh....just wish i had a general price even it it does change so i know how to budget my checks.....so does this upgrade the output to a quicker baud then too? so that u can actually get decent readings out of our 8746 ecms? im almost sold just need that price and a time it will be availible!! and about what will the system requirements be to run this on a laptop?

Grumpy

Here's a snippet from the latest tune on my car.
Note: 0 initial AE, then it ramps in, and then it *ENDS*!.
Like I've said, use just enough AE to get to PE.

Note: I probably can now even 0 out the "5" entries, but I have left them as just a cushion for that ocassional tank of bad gas.

*--------------------------------------
*MAP AE FACTOR
* VS
*DELTA MAP ABOVE MINIMUM
*--------------------------------------
F90 FCB 4 ; USE 5 VALUE TABLE
FCB 0 ; 0
FCB 20 ; 64
FCB 20 ; 128
FCB 15 ; 192
FCB 0 ; 256

;===================
; TPS AE BPW term vs. delta tps
; AEPW = Value * 15.26 usec
;===================
AEDTPS:
FCB 16 ; line cnt
;-------------------------------
;mSec ; % delata TPS
;-------------------------------
FCB 0 ; 0
FCB 10 ; 3.12
FCB 20 ; 6.25
FCB 25 ; 8.37
FCB 20 ; 12.50
FCB 20 ; 15.62
FCB 10 ; 18.74
FCB 10 ; 21.86
FCB 5 ; 25
FCB 5 ; 28.12
FCB 5 ; 31.25
FCB 5 ; 33.37
FCB 5 ; 37.5
FCB 5 ; 40.62
FCB 5 ; 43.74
FCB 5 ; 46.86
FCB 5 ; 50

BMmonteSS

Will the install require soldering? or will it just plug into the "mother board"? I'm just interested incase I ever have a ECM fry while on a road trip I would like to be able to swap the new board to whatever ecm I get from the parts store. If not it's no big deal I'll either just cary a spare or have a back up chip ready to slap into a stock ecm.

I hate to bug you about all the features, but is there a way to wire up a switch input for a dual stage rev limiter? How big of a stretch would it be to make one of these TBI ecm's run a multi-port setup? I know the injector firing schemese are completely different, is it as simple to swap between modes as the '749?

ben73

LOL! I doubt I would swap back to a 7747, but i'd just like to play with one of these because it looks so damn cool!
The logging software looks nice too!
What port on the laptop does it use for logging?? USB/serial/parallel???
This is AWESOME! It is soooo good to see these things being developed for 'lowly' TBI.. I'm glad someone else thinks its worth the effort also.

dimented24x7

iTrader: (2)

The AE stratagy uses variable, coolant based filter coefficients for the slow filtered map and tps term. This allowes the time that AE is in effect to be lenghtened or shortened, based on the temp. The AE still comes in as fast, but the duration and decay is tunable.

Obviously I dont think GM intended to run nitrous on their cargo trucks , but it does have alot of nice features. Some other features are derivative spark control. Not only does it have this for idle to allow dampening of the idle speed, but it also has a derivative SA control routine for use with a manual trans. This, in theory, helps smooth the engine operation and reduce bucking. Theres also teh usual full sized VE and SA tables, etc. The real leg up that it has, IMO, is nice hardware such as lots of A/D and several timer inputs. Its fully interrupt driven so there are timer input and output compares. The TICs generate interrupts based on some periodic input, such as, say, a MAF . This can then be used for high res. pulse accumulation. The timer outputs can be used to generate periodic, timed interrupt driven output, or just a timed interrupt. One use I can think of for that, if the output is enabled, is a computer driven speedo.

Theres definatly alot of nice stuff in there that could be incorperated into UTBI. I hope your ecms came hungry

dimented24x7

iTrader: (2)

Yeah, I really dig the datalogging package. Its really slick.

dimented24x7

iTrader: (2)

here comes the feature creep...

The inejctor drivers are pretty much static in the ecms. Tehy fire autonomously based on DRPs. Id say its possible for a PCM to do both, but I really dont have the tools to experiment and see to what extent the injector drivers are under its control.

elkabong

I'll take one for the 7747.. Where is the list to put my name in?

Fast355

iTrader: (2)

Was that a jab at me?

Dominic Sorresso

Heck, the AutoTune function alone is worth the price of admission.
At $3/gal, it should save a ton in driving around and re-calc'ing the VE tables.
RBob,

I presume all the PID controls are available as part of the UTBI code?

BMmonteSS

To awnser some of my own questions and add to what the u-tbi code can do here are some quotes I doug up from Rbob's previous comments on the software.

Comments on N2O control
I'm sure there's more, but this is what I found on a quick search. Hope that saves you some typing!

I didn't find much more about Jon's HUD system other than his one thread. I guess I'm just getting antsy and can't get enough info.

7Point4

Sounds like just what I need. 1228747.

DM91RS

Not to be a DA but what does HUD stand for? I've missed that somewhere.

DM

justlearning

did u see the pic of all the guages and stuff on the screen...thats the hud

K Rbob time to put this thing out u see how many want it so ud better stock pile about 100 of em so all can get one!! lol hope it comes soon.

dimented24x7

iTrader: (2)

I was thinking more along the lines of a 454 cargo truck with 'U-Haul' on the side of it.

As far as the autotune, is that a function of the HUD software? Thats where I saw it mentioned.

I was thinking of something in the actual computer itself that uses a WB-O2 with PID control. Could then have BLMs assigned to short spans of airflow or VE cells. For that matter one could make the AFRs in the ecm ratios of soich and have the ecm determine a global stoich afr from the WB data. Probably observing the direction/magnitude of the INT and the magnitude of the derivative term would tell the software when its time to update the global AFR. This would open the door for using E85. Could go right up to the pump and put whatever in and the computer would then emperically determine what the stoich AFR is for the fuel in use.

BTW, if its not too much trouble, RBob, can we have that, too?