DIY PROMDo It Yourself PROM chip burning help. No PROM begging. No PROMs for sale. No commercial exchange. Not a referral service.
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First of all I would like to thank JP86SS for his great help, and this project would not be possible without his help.
anyway this hack I did (with John's help) is to enable linear wide band dataloging for MAF 165 6E.
simply plug your Vout from your wideband to D8 pin in your ecm, and use the Ads file for your datastream on tunerpro.
there is only one problem which is "Engine Run time" will not display correctly but who cares.
i hope you guys enjoy it and happy tuning
Ivan
Edit: The file is now also available at Moates website in the file section under Custom Modified Binaries
Re: APYPWB MAF 6E Linear wideband dataloging is here
I cannot beleive no one else has replied to this post. This is good stuff!! FYI, the compressed file from the first post did not work, had an error message, corrupt file or something. So i went to the Moates site and got it. It opened up fine from there.
This is something I was working on my own last summer, to get my LM1 WB linear output in the datastream using TP RT. Of course I got some ideas from reading the above thread. But once winter hits my IROC gets parked and my tuning takes a break.
I thought I had it working, but I questioned the accuracy of what I saw in the WB field.
So it looks like after you get the new APYPWB hack, you need to get all your current bin values into the new bin, so it will be specific to your engine? I took a look at the new bin. What engine application is that for originally? I am using a spin-off of the ARAP bin, as most of $6E tuners use. Hope it is ok to post Q's here, cuz I got more.
__________________ Best ET 14.413 @95.57 w/2.77 stock rear(10/01/2000)
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Re: APYPWB MAF 6E Linear wideband dataloging is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by 400Z28Racer
simply plug your Vout from your wideband to D8 pin in your ecm, and use the Ads file for your datastream on tunerpro.
Hey guys quick question...
I'm just getting started with my autoprom and the learning curve is steep!!!
I bought a Wideband O2 Sensor with Guage last summer knowing that I had to get into the chip tuning thing...
Where is this D8 pin in the ECM that your talking about? Is it relatively easy to do?
I wanted to monitor my A/F ratio while I was datalogging..... this would make all that possible right????
I hope that someone can help me out "I'm a newbie"
__________________ 5.7Liter (357"+.040) 50,000kms/30,000mi, AirFlow Research Eliminator 180 Heads, Holley Stealth Ram, LPE 211/219 Cam, Comp Cams Pro Magnum 1.6 Roller Rockers, CAI, MAF screens removed, TPIS Airfoil, ADS Superchip, 24Lbs Accel Injectors, Kirban AFPR, MSD 6A Ignition Box and Blaster Coil, Moroso Ultra 40 wires, E3 DiamondFire plugs, A/C-Smog pump Delete with 1LE pulleys and Heaterbox, March 3 Piece Underdrive Pulleys, 160' Thermostat, Throttle Body Coolant Bypass, Hedman Elite Ceramic Coated Longtube Hedders pn68468, Custom Y-pipe with Flowmaster 3" Catback+80 Muffler, Trans-go Shift Kit. Corvette Servo
[
Where is this D8 pin in the ECM that your talking about? Is it relatively easy to do?
I wanted to monitor my A/F ratio while I was datalogging..... this would make all that possible right????
[quote]
I tell you what I know. D8 is just an unused pin on the 32 pin connector to the ECM. I think what I did was goto my local GM store, and bought some of the correct contacts for that connector. Then I just crimped a wire to it, which was the analog out of my LM1 WB. I can tell you that this works.
Re: APYPWB MAF 6E Linear wideband dataloging is here
Man-O-Man.......
Guess I'll have to take a look at the ECM once the ice melts off my garage floor.... seeing is believing... and I'll have to see it for myself cause I can't picture it...
This does look very interesting though!!!!!!
I'd love to datalogue "everything" so that I can tune more efficiently...
Is anybody else doing this? (besides the 2 or three...)
Re: APYPWB MAF 6E Linear wideband dataloging is here
I tested the accuracy of the hack vs LC1 Software, and it seemed to be dead on. As far as APYPWB, it is a stock bin (APYP) for 89 Ybody 350 TPI 6 speed manual maf system, and you need to transfer your current ARAP values to APYPWB.
By the way, if there is enough interest in EGT dataloging , I will implement it another hack for this bin
Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeT 88IROC350
I cannot beleive no one else has replied to this post. This is good stuff!! FYI, the compressed file from the first post did not work, had an error message, corrupt file or something. So i went to the Moates site and got it. It opened up fine from there.
This is something I was working on my own last summer, to get my LM1 WB linear output in the datastream using TP RT. Of course I got some ideas from reading the above thread. But once winter hits my IROC gets parked and my tuning takes a break.
I thought I had it working, but I questioned the accuracy of what I saw in the WB field.
So it looks like after you get the new APYPWB hack, you need to get all your current bin values into the new bin, so it will be specific to your engine? I took a look at the new bin. What engine application is that for originally? I am using a spin-off of the ARAP bin, as most of $6E tuners use. Hope it is ok to post Q's here, cuz I got more.
Last edited by 400Z28Racer; 04-14-2009 at 11:08 PM.
Reason: APYP correction
Re: APYPWB MAF 6E Linear wideband dataloging is here
I tested it on 2 cars + mine and it works flawlessly
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTA Sammy
Man-O-Man.......
Guess I'll have to take a look at the ECM once the ice melts off my garage floor.... seeing is believing... and I'll have to see it for myself cause I can't picture it...
This does look very interesting though!!!!!!
I'd love to datalogue "everything" so that I can tune more efficiently...
Is anybody else doing this? (besides the 2 or three...)
Re: APYPWB MAF 6E Linear wideband dataloging is here
Does this mean I can just buy a replacement Bosch WB02 sensor, connect the sensor V-out wire to the ECU, and not have to spend the additional $100 or so for a gauge and whatnot?
Re: APYPWB MAF 6E Linear wideband dataloging is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by 400Z28Racer
...By the way, if there is enough interest in EGT dataloging , I will implement it another hack for this bin
Uh Oh, The source code bug has bit another
It is nice when you want to see something and then you can just add it.
Check for any pull up/downs on the input you want to use to confirm the signal won't get skewed by it. Might need to do surgery to scratch off the trace on the board to disable the power to it. Not dificult just need to find it. Check the schematics on Ludi's site if your not sure which input is open for use.
the Bruce,
You will need a sensor and a controller.
The controller provides power to the WB and conditions the output to be 0-5 volts. That's all you need.
The external gauge or displays are optional when you can log it into the ECM.
Re: APYPWB MAF 6E Linear wideband dataloging is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by JP86SS
Uh Oh, The source code bug has bit another
It is nice when you want to see something and then you can just add it.
Check for any pull up/downs on the input you want to use to confirm the signal won't get skewed by it. Might need to do surgery to scratch off the trace on the board to disable the power to it. Not dificult just need to find it. Check the schematics on Ludi's site if your not sure which input is open for use.
LOL, Cool thanks for the tip. I am thinking about implementing WB as feedback to ECM instead of O2 NB. I think that I have to change all memory addressrs of NB to the WB adresses.
maybe I'll do it one of those days, I just want to stay away from cars for now
Re: APYPWB MAF 6E Linear wideband dataloging is here
Alright after reading that last post again, I think my bubble just burst.
I thought by doing this hack that the ECM would now use the WB as it's new primary O2 sensor and you could pitch the NB O2 Sensor... and with that being said you could now datalogue the info from the ECM through your ALDL.
As it is, if I understand everything correctly...... the car would still run off your NB, and You would run another O2 Sensor Bung in the other collector with your WB O2 in it and run it into the D8 pin so that it could be datalogued for tuning sake..... through the ALDL....
Do I have it right????
I have LC-1 wideband sensor (that hasn't been installed yet) but I hadn't planned on having 2 sensors running for some reason..... Guess I'll have too right?
Please help me straighten it out!!!
__________________ 5.7Liter (357"+.040) 50,000kms/30,000mi, AirFlow Research Eliminator 180 Heads, Holley Stealth Ram, LPE 211/219 Cam, Comp Cams Pro Magnum 1.6 Roller Rockers, CAI, MAF screens removed, TPIS Airfoil, ADS Superchip, 24Lbs Accel Injectors, Kirban AFPR, MSD 6A Ignition Box and Blaster Coil, Moroso Ultra 40 wires, E3 DiamondFire plugs, A/C-Smog pump Delete with 1LE pulleys and Heaterbox, March 3 Piece Underdrive Pulleys, 160' Thermostat, Throttle Body Coolant Bypass, Hedman Elite Ceramic Coated Longtube Hedders pn68468, Custom Y-pipe with Flowmaster 3" Catback+80 Muffler, Trans-go Shift Kit. Corvette Servo
Re: APYPWB MAF 6E Linear wideband dataloging is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTA Sammy
As it is, if I understand everything correctly...... the car would still run off your NB, and You would run another O2 Sensor Bung in the other collector with your WB O2 in it and run it into the D8 pin so that it could be datalogued for tuning sake..... through the ALDL....
Do I have it right????
yes you are correct; however, LC1 has 2 analog output: one can be used to simulate NB O2 sensor, and the other for Wideband. so you do not have to weld another bung.
Re: APYPWB MAF 6E Linear wideband dataloging is here
I'll have to look for the 2nd analog output..... don't see it.... Maybe it's different than the LM-1???
I sure would love to use only 1 O2 sensor.....
Just came back from the Innovate Website and I do have a Analog 1 and 2...
so I can simulate the NB for the ECM and Watch the WB contoller on my Triple Pod. Yippee
Now we'll see if i can get my head around this patch
__________________ 5.7Liter (357"+.040) 50,000kms/30,000mi, AirFlow Research Eliminator 180 Heads, Holley Stealth Ram, LPE 211/219 Cam, Comp Cams Pro Magnum 1.6 Roller Rockers, CAI, MAF screens removed, TPIS Airfoil, ADS Superchip, 24Lbs Accel Injectors, Kirban AFPR, MSD 6A Ignition Box and Blaster Coil, Moroso Ultra 40 wires, E3 DiamondFire plugs, A/C-Smog pump Delete with 1LE pulleys and Heaterbox, March 3 Piece Underdrive Pulleys, 160' Thermostat, Throttle Body Coolant Bypass, Hedman Elite Ceramic Coated Longtube Hedders pn68468, Custom Y-pipe with Flowmaster 3" Catback+80 Muffler, Trans-go Shift Kit. Corvette Servo
Re: APYPWB MAF 6E Linear wideband dataloging is here
I am just starting to tune the 86 maf tpi with AutoProm and TunerPro RT. I don't have a wideband but this makes sense tho... Basically the WBo2 is just so that you can see if what you are changing equals an AFR of 14.7 at every RPM? If not using a WBo2 (i didnt get one.. yet) then what is the difference between NBo2 and WBo2? Why wouldn't a NBo2 read the same thing? I downloaded the ARAP 6E bin by the way is this the right one for my 86 auto maf TPI?
thnx in advance!
__________________ "An engine is like an orchestra. It's made up of wind, brass, percussion, and a whole range of other complimentary sections, all working to make that beautiful music that we call 'performance'..."
Re: APYPWB MAF 6E Linear wideband dataloging is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by hellz_wings
I am just starting to tune the 86 maf tpi with AutoProm and TunerPro RT. I don't have a wideband but this makes sense tho... Basically the WBo2 is just so that you can see if what you are changing equals an AFR of 14.7 at every RPM? If not using a WBo2 (i didnt get one.. yet) then what is the difference between NBo2 and WBo2? Why wouldn't a NBo2 read the same thing? I downloaded the ARAP 6E bin by the way is this the right one for my 86 auto maf TPI?
thnx in advance!
The WB O2 will do much more than that. Read up on some posts, you will get it. It is more for tuning WOT, PE, AE, and lean cruise. 14.7 is just the magic number for perfectly burning gasoline. You really dont need a WB if that is what you want to tune to. Think of the NB O2 as just a switching device, from rich to lean. That is really all it does. Don't worry about that 14.7 number. Instead, make changes to get your BLM and INTs close to 128.
Yes, the ARAP $6E bin is a good bin to use for any 350 TPI MAF engine, with auto tranny. Just make sure you have the '165 ECM, and the $6E tdf files. I am sure the 86 cars used the $32B TDF.
Re: APYPWB MAF 6E Linear wideband dataloging is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeT 88IROC350
The WB O2 will do much more than that. Read up on some posts, you will get it. It is more for tuning WOT, PE, AE, and lean cruise. 14.7 is just the magic number for perfectly burning gasoline. You really dont need a WB if that is what you want to tune to. Think of the NB O2 as just a switching device, from rich to lean. That is really all it does. Don't worry about that 14.7 number. Instead, make changes to get your BLM and INTs close to 128.
Yes, the ARAP $6E bin is a good bin to use for any 350 TPI MAF engine, with auto tranny. Just make sure you have the '165 ECM, and the $6E tdf files. I am sure the 86 cars used the $32B TDF.
Ah yes the BLM and the INT. I've read about those two, and tuning them to 128 in open loop first and then doing in again in closed loop. That's another story tho... So the ARAP $6E bin is good for 350 TPI MAF's? I have a 305 TPI MAF with a chip that has some settings already how I want... I want to start tuning from the setting on my current chip, so would I still need the BIN files and/or the tdf files? If so, which one is it for mine, $6E or is it $32B. I have done: !Cold start injector, !AIR !EGR !AC..
The chip I have now is from TPI PArts.net and it has custom settings to accomodate the things that were removed so my car runs decent now. But it's a stock tune so that is why I would like to start from the settings on this chip so I don't have to fiddle with these things since they are already done. I think they used the code from 89 MAF for this chip.. Not sure..
Good stuff, glad to see the MAF still kicking. I've got mine in a box somewhere...
Careful, your dating yourself as an old timer
I have a 95 MAF I never figured out what to do with too!
Hybrid code to run either MAF or SD would be cool...
That should go into the other thread.
Re: APYPWB MAF 6E Linear wideband dataloging is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by hellz_wings
Ah yes the BLM and the INT. I've read about those two, and tuning them to 128 in open loop first and then doing in again in closed loop. That's another story tho... So the ARAP $6E bin is good for 350 TPI MAF's? I have a 305 TPI MAF with a chip that has some settings already how I want... I want to start tuning from the setting on my current chip, so would I still need the BIN files and/or the tdf files? If so, which one is it for mine, $6E or is it $32B. I have done: !Cold start injector, !AIR !EGR !AC..
The chip I have now is from TPI PArts.net and it has custom settings to accomodate the things that were removed so my car runs decent now. But it's a stock tune so that is why I would like to start from the settings on this chip so I don't have to fiddle with these things since they are already done. I think they used the code from 89 MAF for this chip.. Not sure..
Well some people tune in open loop, but not me. Closed tune for 128 is great for part throttle settings. The ARAP bin might be too agressive for a 305, but if you are modified.....You can always change the settings to whatever you want. There are many bins out there for our cars. So if you have a '86 TPI, that did use the 1227165 ECM. That is the good news. But the cal file used for your year was $32. Sort of a one of a kind. So if you want to read that custom chip, you might need the $32 TDF. The good news is that you can upgrade to the latest TDF used for MAF cars, which is the $6E. And then you can get a hold of the ARAP bin.
Enjoy!
Re: APYPWB MAF 6E Linear wideband dataloging is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeT 88IROC350
Well some people tune in open loop, but not me. Closed tune for 128 is great for part throttle settings. The ARAP bin might be too agressive for a 305, but if you are modified.....You can always change the settings to whatever you want. There are many bins out there for our cars. So if you have a '86 TPI, that did use the 1227165 ECM. That is the good news. But the cal file used for your year was $32. Sort of a one of a kind. So if you want to read that custom chip, you might need the $32 TDF. The good news is that you can upgrade to the latest TDF used for MAF cars, which is the $6E. And then you can get a hold of the ARAP bin.
Enjoy!
I'll try both and see what happens! I have't even started yet! Good news is the car is out and I'm starting tomorrow!! So happy!
What is a "BIN" ? I know it's a file you download and load into TunerPro RT but how does it affect the settings? Does it have its own settings? If this "ARAP" file is a "BIN" then what are the $6E and $32 files for? Also how would I 'upgrade' to the $6E and what are the benefits to this?
Also, I have a modified engine completely... Internals forged, cam, heads, intake ported, everything, so I would be willing to run a bit more aggressively... But could this blow the engine if it's too aggressive? If so i'd rather start with something like stock settings and tune it from there..
Thanks in advance!!
__________________ "An engine is like an orchestra. It's made up of wind, brass, percussion, and a whole range of other complimentary sections, all working to make that beautiful music that we call 'performance'..."
Re: APYPWB MAF 6E Linear wideband dataloging is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by hellz_wings
What is a "BIN" ? I know it's a file you download and load into TunerPro RT but how does it affect the settings?
The BIN or "Binary" file is the software code with parameters compiled so the computer can run it.
Quote:
If this "ARAP" file is a "BIN" then what are the $6E and $32 files for?
The $32 & $6E are different programs (Mask ID's) that can be run on the same hardware (165 ECM)
There are different BCC or programs such as ARAP, etc that are different factory versions of either a $32 or $6E mask.
ADS= Datalogging definition
ECU or XDF= BIN Editing definition.
Definitions are different for each "Mask ID" because locations of items are different.
These files indicate the placement within the Binary program that the item is at.
Without the "Roadmaps" to indicate where the item is you wouldn't know what to change.
They also convert the values like 0-255 counts into engineering units you can understand such as Deg C, RPM, Kpa, etc.
Quote:
Also how would I 'upgrade' to the $6E and what are the benefits to this?
It gets rid of the cold start injector for one, Other things I'm not sure of.
Quote:
But could this blow the engine if it's too aggressive? If so i'd rather start with something like stock settings and tune it from there..
There's always that chance but starting from stock and working it slowly and watching results, you can do it safely.
HTH
Re: APYPWB MAF 6E Linear wideband dataloging is here
This is great! Now I can hook my fuel pump diag pin back up . Resolution will be 1000X better than the way I have mine set up now, and I can use the wb's whole output. Thanks!
Re: APYPWB MAF 6E Linear wideband dataloging is here
Not sure if there's a bug, but I got a maf high error and the INT won't enrich. Maybe related to the fact that I have maf input on C11 instead of B12? Ran fine before doing this.
Re: APYPWB MAF 6E Linear wideband dataloging is here
Because I'm using an analog t-bird maf. It's a V6 car (digital maf originally)- I needed an analog maf without burnoff so I didn't have to wire in all the extra crap to run a tpi maf. Can't read the signal on B12 or D8, only on C11. If I recall a pullup resistor was interfering on those pins...
__________________ 1985 Camaro LB8 smoothed & balanced to perfection. Abscence of excess is excellence.
________________________________________________________
Increasingly I find the difference between a 'fact' and an oppinion is the number of people who believe it.
Re: APYPWB MAF 6E Linear wideband dataloging is here
So this basically datalogs rpm vs wideband airfuel so you dont have to buy a rpm converter for the LC-1 stuff to read air fuel vs rpm? That is pretty nice addition.
I ended up tuning in open loop and just watching my wideband gauge and rpm and made changes that way no problems. Just harder to do because you have to keep watching the road, gauge and rpm all at the same time.
Figures this hack comes out right when i decide to go to SD for my boosted project... lol
Re: APYPWB MAF 6E Linear wideband dataloging is here
All's good, teqilaboy found where the maf read locations were moved to. Thanks.
__________________ 1985 Camaro LB8 smoothed & balanced to perfection. Abscence of excess is excellence.
________________________________________________________
Increasingly I find the difference between a 'fact' and an oppinion is the number of people who believe it.
