82TA90FORMULA

iTrader: (2)

Hi I have a 1982 Trans Am, here is the issue. At first the headlights went up, the drivers side motor was spinning, while the passenger side had a broken relay that is attached to the headlight motor. The passenger side went down. I decided, I had so many issues, I would get two rebuilt headlight motors. I installed them, I turned the headlight switch on and they both went up, worked great, then I put them down and they went down. I decided a second test, so I turned the headlight switch on and they went up and then when I went to turn the switch off, the headlight motors didn't go down, the fuse inside the car blew. I put a new fuse, 20 amp and the headlight motors went down. The headlight fuse blew again, I put a new 20 amp fuse and trieed turning on the headlights and nothing happened, the headlights came on but, no response from the motors. So I read somewhere it could be the isolation relay, so I picked up one and the headlights went up and down, but the fuse blew again. Now here is the interesting part,each time I go to put a 20 amp fuse it wants to immediately blow the fuse. I went and bought electrical tubing to make sure the wiring by the motors as well as the isolation relay didn't touch metal. Help me out, could it be something in the wiring, could it be a bad headlight switch causing the problems. Give me your ideas. Thanks.

82TA90FORMULA

iTrader: (2)

Help Please!!!

82TA90FORMULA

iTrader: (2)

I guess this is a stumper

Trans AM Scott

Hey,

I am a 1984 Trans AM owner and I am going through the same pain you are. I am past the fuses blowing, now I am draining batteries.

I have an electrician buddy taking a look at it this afternoon. I'll bring up your problem as well. I was considering trying a motor from a later model that may bolt up and not kill my system. I am not sure if later model motors will bolt up. I don't mind changing the electrical to accomodate the newer motors but I am not sure they will mount. I am really unsure what to do. It is a great looking feature to have but a royal pain in the rear to fix. I have bought multiple re-built motors, replaced fuses too many times to mention and now I fried two batteries in one week. I am sure there is a way to fix it but it is getting expensive and time consuming.

82TA90FORMULA

iTrader: (2)

Thanks, let me know what he said.

86LS1Firebird

im sorta having the same problem on my 86 LS1 swap Firebird, but what im going through is way worse and more hell i guess you could say, now as for your problem, i went through the same thing in both of my previous 86 Firebird's, i replaced the headlight switch new (not used), new dimmer switch (i belive the run to the same fuse, make sure to replace both), used a 10amp fuse, and the BOTH headlight units used, different years have different bushings!!!! i believe 82-84 was the same, 86-90 was the same, and 91-92 are the same i know that much, ok back on subject...
IF you replace them with the battery connected they should automatically rise without touching the switch, which usually messes up the the little bushings they have in the motors which usually ends up frying the junk motors GM made back then...
NOW TRY THIS don't replace the headlight switch or the dimmer switch until after you have tried this...this should give you the answer, this is how i tested mine and found out it was the passenger headlight motor, try disconnecting both little connectors to your headlights(you'll need to remove your air dam under the front nose to get to them usually, or a parking light removed), have a good fuse tested before, flip the switch, and turning them off again, check your fuse, try one more time, if the fuse is not blown, then you should have a defective motor and/or a wire is either kinked somewhere maybe touching steel?
Basically if your headlight switch is bad it should blow the fuse when you turn the headlights on and off with the headlight motors disconnected this is of course once you have checked the fuse... the wiring is really old and brittle gotta remember plus GM didn't cover alot of the wires or cover them that well.... love to hear how it goes, hopefully it works

p.s. you can get both switches at like autozone for like $6-$12 each
p.s. 91-92 headlight units bolt up, but you will need a 91 or 92 front nose becuase of the parking light location, i've done that front end swap before
Charlie

82TA90FORMULA

iTrader: (2)

Thanks, I'll give that a try when the weather cooperates. I'll let you know. I'm hoping it's the switch.

82TA90FORMULA

iTrader: (2)

Hi, here's the update. I disconnected the power plug to my headlights the small single plug. I put the 20 amp fuse in the fuse box and it didn't blow as it previously did. So I turned the headlight switch in the on postiton and the headlights went up. Then I went to turn them off by moving the switch in the down postion and they didn't go down. The fuse was still good it didn't blow. So what could it be. I'm thinking a wire is touching metal. It has to be that single power plug, causing the fuse to blow, I think the wire on that plug is orange. Give me any idea's you have. Thanks!

Randy82WS7

fyi the 82 are one year only
they are three wire motors

83 and up are two wire


check all connection plugs and for hot at the motors when you turn on the headlamp switch

test the relays too

tape up wires touching metal dont let them do that!

you have alot of testing to do yet

good luick

82TA90FORMULA

iTrader: (2)

Yes!!, I tracked down the problem. It's my passenger side newly rebuilt headlight motor, which is causing my interior 20amp fuse to blow. There has to be some sort of short in the wiring. I installed my previous passenger side headlight motor and the headlights now work perfectly. So I'm going to have to exchange the defective motor for a good one. I still want to thank everyone for your ideas.

stormy69

i have a similar issue on my 86. just realized the motors are dif than 87 up. they spin but dont raise, lights also are coming on so my issue is why wont they raise? are 87 up motors adaptable?
HELP! i cant drive the car....

86LS1Firebird

yes, i installed a set of 87 headlights in my 86 Firebird, and my currect LS1 86 Bird has a set of 84 headlights, they'll all interchange except 91 & 92 they are different sizes and bolt patterns, the 87 headlights you have will work, if they arent raising and just turning on then your motors are more than likely defective, try disconnecting them and plugging them back in and then try turnign them on if nothing happens, then they're bad... you could always start to barely spin the motor by hand, and they should spin up... but if not just just dissconnect them and spin them up manually and leave them up until you can get a new set
Charlie

82TA90FORMULA

iTrader: (2)

Most times when the headlight motors don't go up you need to have them rebuilt or replaced with new, the gear sometimes gets stripped or the bushing inside th motors end up crumbling after age.

stormy69

when i turn on the lights, i can see the motors spin? but they only do so for a short time and then they stop (thermal breaker tripping in the motor?) the 87 up motors are different and are 2 wire vs 3 wire in my 86. TDS has a repair kit but i took one apart yesterday and they look ok inside. regreased, went to reinstall and decided to try one headlight and it went up?? wtf?

KCGTA

82TA90 hit the nail on the head. When your headlight motor spins but does not raise, it is because there are gel bushings inside your motor that have crumbled apart. This causes the 3 plastic sprockets to not properly contact the worm gear in the motor and hence not raise the door. If you can grab your headlight door and pull it up relatively easily, this for sure is the cause. There are kits sold for less than $10 and take less than 30 minutes to install with new bushings. Lonsal, a moderator on this site sells them, else you can do a websearch. Very easy to do. You just need a boxend wrench to get the motor out and the motor cover comes off with three small bolts, just be careful when removing them, they can break easily. Once you get the motor case opened, you will see what happened and be able to put it back together with the new bushings. Good luck.

KCGTA

[quote=KCGTA;3633208]82TA90 hit the nail on the head. When your headlight motor spins but does not raise, it is because there are gel bushings inside your motor that have crumbled apart. This causes the 3 plastic sprockets to not properly contact the worm gear in the motor and hence not raise the door. If you can grab your headlight door and pull it up relatively easily, this for sure is the cause. There are kits sold for less than $10 and take less than 30 minutes to install with new bushings. Lonsal, a moderator on this site sells them, else you can do a websearch. Very easy to do. You just need a boxend wrench to get the motor out and the motor cover comes off with three small bolts, just be careful when removing them, they can break easily. Once you get the motor case opened, you will see what happened and be able to put it back together with the new bushings. I see though you took a motor apart already. It is possible that the plastic gears themselves have been worn down as well, and the bottom line is if there isn't proper contact, the lights will not raise. If the motor spins, the motor is good. You may want to replace the plastic gears and the bushings as well. I'd bet you'll solve the problem. Good luck.

stormy69

actually, thats incorrect. the bushing kits are for the 2 wire 87 up motors. i cant speak for 82 motors but 83-86 have double gears internally and are riveted together. i drilled mine apart and cleaned/relubed them. i still have issues, there doesnt seem to be a lot of info on the 3 wire motors here, at least not that i have found yet..... its really giving me a nerve trying to find the culprit keeping them from raising like they should.

Randy82WS7

82= 3 wire

83-up= 2 wire

82 is one year unique

the pic above is of my 82 ones

riveted together just like any others

i drilled them all out after taking this pic, so i could inspect parts


my housings are broken,cracked

the internal parts are really nice condition

i am going to find a pair of any year housings and put all my parts into them

once i locate a pair of good housings

no one seems to have any that are in good shape but not working, or any bare housings unbroken

youre the first person i have ever seen that has said that 87-up are different

really odd


hmm

everyone says something different

but i know 82 are one year unique and that 83-up are two wire

so..

everyone saying something different will be never-ending, however
bad bushings is the most common problem with these, replace them with new bushings if available or whatever you can find to replace them with, many ppl have replaced them with custom materials, one memeber replaced his with something very interesting and that you would never think of to use, but i have forgotten what
its in a thread on this site somewhere



good luck

stormy69

i beg to differ. i will say that the differences between your and mine arent that much. you have the relay attached to the motor, they are on the fenderwell for the 86 for sure, as that is what i have. the other noticable diff is the 4 wires you have are not on one connector, on my 86 it is 3 wires on a single flat connector. and in 87 they changed the design to a 2 wire and a change to the way the motor raises the headlights, one gear vs two in the earlier motors.

Agent13

iTrader: (6)

Correct.

1982-1986 = Three Wire. This system used relays and the motors were noisy.

1987-1992 = Two Wire. This system used the Headlight Control Module and the motors were much quieter.

stormy69

Randy,
i also missed your last comment. the 82-86 motors do not have the bushings you are referring to.

Merlin86TA

I have been having the same problem with my headlights for a while now. My car is an 86 Trans Am, and I have been trying to figure out the problem also. I have changed the motors out so many times I am a pro at it now.

stormy69

i havent had a chance to put mine in, but i just happened to notice when i barely push the switch it will consistently raise the pass side headlight. may also be the reason the drivers does not work properly. just sharing my experience. will post again when i manage to find time to replace the switch, it was around $20 new at a parts store.

Firebirdstu

The majority of the time its the "controller" relay that goes bad, if one goes up and the other does not or such like, non functional controller relay no lights up or down

Stu

stormy69

the only headlight "controller" on the 82-86 is the headlight switch and your finger. 87 went to a printed circuit card controller and did not have the relays in the earlier system.

Firebirdstu

Just for infos sake, there are 3 relays in the 82 systems and those that have had 82 systems put in them, 2 on the motors and 1 by the firewall part numbers 10022620 controller relay, part number 10031018 x 2 door motor relay after 82 say 83-86 you are correct
door 1
door 2

controller

Stu

stormy69

83-86 have the same 3 relays, just not any mounted to the motors. they were relocated to the core support just behind the headlight doors.
----------
and to clarify that a bit, they are on the engine side of the core support.

JoeBJr

I just purchased a 86 Firebird SE. A problem I am having is that when I turn on the headlights the drivers side light will go up and then about 5 seconds later the passenger side will go up. Same thing when I turn them off, drivers side goes down first then 5 seconds later the passenger side will go down. I could live with that however, the passenger side light seems to be draining my battery dead if I leave the relay for that light motor hooked up. I was told it is a new motor on the passenger side light. I have also replaced the passenger side light motor relay with a new one and I get the same effect where the one light goes up and down just after the other. I don't see any obvious shorts anywhere that might be causing my battery to drain when I leave the passenger side light motor hooked up. But if I leave the passenger side relay hooked up she will drain the battery to the point like there is no battery in the car. If I leave that relay un hooked she is fine. Anyone else experience this that might be able to give me some info on this? Thanks.. Joe B.

sflthndrckn

i havent had this problem myself but have done a lot of research in trying to fix mine. this seems to me that voltage isnt being properly distributed to the motor that is taking longer to operate. this would also explain the draining of the battery as the battery will be constantly trying to supply it with power until it operates. as far as what to replace id say to check to make sure that all your connections are in good shape. may need a new motor though.

stormy69

i would replace the headlight switch in the car. then swap relays and see if the problem moves, if it does you found the bad relay.

90GTA350

i have a 1990 trans am GTA, i have 2 headlight motors that are failing, and am looking for a place to get cheap(ish) parts to replace... god so many problems with it, all minor... it has a trans fluid leak, oil leak and u can smell gas while driving on 1/2 tank or less with windows down... spoiler needs stripping and repainting, need the clips for spoiler to hold to car, and other things...

82gtafirebird

hi sry i dnt have an answer to your problem but i was wondering if you ever have a problem with your high beams i have an 82 gta firebird and my highbeams work once in while

axestrum

1982/83 Motors are 3 wire motors,3 relays,1 each on motors and headlight switch,2 wires running to the relay on motor,one is a constant hot,the other from the switch,the single wire is for the motor down circuit,easy check,disconnect relays on motor,run 12 volts direct to motors if work motors OK, problem is in the wiring or relays,check wiring ahead of relays,one should be hot all the time the other should read 12 volts when switch is activated to on position,if not check wires for short or bad switch,each motor has a separate circuit for the constant hot,so if one light raises and the other doesnt or lags may be short in the hot circuit.most likely not the switch itself.hope this helps with this pesky problem

Guest

i had the same problem... mine went up but would not come down... i tested the lid motors with a jumper wire... they tested fine, fully operational... the two relays on each side of the engine comparment are for going up and the isolation relay brings them down. 85 has a three wire system. the blue wire should have power until the motor reaches its fully closed position which then cause the relay to warm up and disconect power... i have no power at the blue wire at any time... but now i notice my parking lights are not coming on and neither are my fog lights... so now i'm pretty sure it is my light switch...

axestrum

Hi,this certainly is a pesky problem,i would check the power at the headlight switch before shooting the parts cannon at it,my problem was a short in the headlight motor wiring harness,may have a short/broken wire,
in the motor down circuit,check a wiring diagram to see how the parking/fog lights tie into the wiring harness,sounds more like a short or bad ground,although cant ruleout the switch.
LMK how you make out and what you find.

goodluck ken

lonsal

iTrader: (2)

Not correct. 1982-86 were 3 wire motors. 1987-92 were 2-wire motors.

Lon

smokejeremy42

hi I basically have this same problem....i have a 86 t/a carbed 355 and my headlights go up normal but then only the driver side will go down I've checked 2 of the 3 relays "the two on the inner fenders I checked them both they worked fine on drivers side the one next to radiator I'm not shure about" ok on to the one next to the radiator I was reading in a forum on here that when the light switch is off in the car the 2 blue wires on that relay would have some amount of voltage not shure what amount he had said....anyways I get voltage their when the switch is on not off........one more thing how do I check the motor from its plug thanks hope you can help me out

FLoldcarlover1

Where can I get AC Delco Isolation Relay 10022620? I can find headlight relays but not Isolation relay, it is a different animal! Sam Clay, "Frustrated in Spring Hill, FL" [727]422-1101

FLoldcarlover1

Is there a subtitute for AC Delco 10022620 Isolation relay that is 6 pin for 1983 Firebirds?

OutriderDriver

What info I think we would all like to also know is whether or not replacing the relays will help with battery drainage from the headlight motors. Ive had drainage for years on this car and never made the connection until today that every time I connect the battery, the motors click twice and 4 days later the car is dead. I just now disconnected them and will test the car in a week. I can of course put the motors onto a separate switch but would like to keep them hooked as they are stock but replace parts as needed and not as a fix. thank you to whoever knows..

Yup, the bastards were the cause. nice to know I can use my security system again. still does anyone know of a fix other than possibly new motors?

Widowmaker121

Hey I' am currently having the same problem with my 1983 trans am. I replaced the driver side no problem but now am having issues with the passenger side. At first it was finding one that would match and bolt to the passenger side. Websites say the driver side is universal but that's not true. found that the hard way. So now I have a 1984 Fiero headlight motor that fits to the passenger side, same connectors and all. The problem with my driver side was it was constently cranking so i disconnected it replaced it. My passenger side will not go down it goes up with the new motor but not down which was the opposite problem with my old headlight motor it would go down but not up. So here is somethings I read on the internet that might help.... the Connectors might not be receiving power because they are corroded you might have a bad relay switch or the actual push switch might not work. If you are Blowing fuses the second you replace one something might be drawing power from the harness. In my car my interior lights, dash lights and radio stopped working because a nickel fell into the cig lighter hole and was drawing power non stop and caused the fuse to blow over and over til i figured it out. It might just be something as stupid as that, Its hard to say when trouble shooting. So it could be the motor itself, the connectors, the wiring harness the relay or the switch. also with different relays the 84 motor works differently i have 3 different relays one new and two old. certain relays go up some go down and one cranks non stop not sure what to do. Hope this helps.