Engine SwapEverything about swapping an engine into your Third Gen.....be it V6, V8, LTX/LSX, crate engine, etc. Pictures, questions, answers, and work logs.
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is there any differences between the 8.1 L vortec\duramax and any other gen 3 engine? if so, anybody put one in an f-body? the main differences im wondering about are the heads.
thanks!
__________________ -if you can't dodge it, run and quiver-
1989 rs camaro 350 sbc(temporarily) and 350 tranny/125 shot nitrous
we have an 8.1 in our 05 suburban, for it being a 7k pound monster, that truck really moves out when there's a trailer behind it the torque pulls the trailer/car like a dream. It's LS-based controlled like the others, but I haven't looked into a thirdgen swap since they want 8 grand for one from chevy.
actually 5200 from scoggin dickey
btw, its rated at 440#s of torque and 330 hp for your suburban......torque for days
and i did find a company who makes heads\cams\intake manifold, and even mahle forged pistons for them.... sounds like just the engine for me....
__________________ -if you can't dodge it, run and quiver-
1989 rs camaro 350 sbc(temporarily) and 350 tranny/125 shot nitrous
Its basically just a stroked 454ci big block (496ci, 4.25" stroke) with roller cam provisions similar to what an L98 block has, and *I think* a 1pc rear seal as well.
Originally posted by Z28***** Its a big block, just about everything to it isnt related to an sbc or LSx either which way, it shares a little borrowed technology.
it also has the individual coils on the valve covers like a LS1 with no distributor like the LS1 and on and on. I'd say it's a big block LS-based controlled motor then. If you're going to argue that LS-based computer system motors are only small blocks then alright, but it shares many of the same features and improvements.
__________________ 2011 chicago world of wheels placed in super street class
Best Engine '11 Thirdgenfest
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MFBA March 2008 Featured Calendar Vehicle
Originally posted by xpndbl3 it also has the individual coils on the valve covers like a LS1 with no distributor like the LS1 and on and on. I'd say it's a big block LS-based motor then. If you're going to argue that LS-based motors are only small blocks then alright, but it shares many of the same features and improvements.
The ford V8 in the lincoln LS has coils on the valve covers, and no distributor, is the LS1 now ford V8 based ?
It's not LSx based, like Z28 said, it shares some technology from them. Firing order is the same, and coil packs. Everything else is different just like a 427 is different from a 350.
Quote:
The 2001 truck line includes a new 8.1 liter 496 cubic inch "8100" big block. The bore will remain at 4.250", but the stroke will be increased to 4.370". The firing order is also new 1-8-7-2-6-5-4-3 and features individual ignition coils mounted near the spark plugs, similar to the LS1 Gen. III smallblocks.
How much "potential" does it have? Would it be a good start for a big inch performance build? Obviously, weight would be an issue, but no more a concern than any other big block build.
http://www.raylarengine.com/ check this out. looks like there is parts available from at least one source. im really kinda thinkin bout tryin to put one in my car. i already have a tubular k member in the works, just gotta figure out some sort of mounts for the engine. btw, the weight is 750# and with the raylar heads it drops 100#, or so they claim, nonetheless, the heads run 2800$, but they say they will make them to your own specs. im thinkin big chambers, low compression, and some sorta forced induction. maybe two cummins 5.9 holset hx35's
p.s. its speed density, and computer programming is already out there for them
M.S.D. sells a module for the LSx motors that will work with the 8.1l engine. But why bother with the 8.1l when you could build a way better carb big block and make way more power with other big blocks. The crank sensor on the 8.1l makes the crank specific to that motor only.
Its a Gen VI bbc with 4.250 cast bores instead of the the 4.5 the gen VI is capable of. Thats it, nothing else. All the modern technology on top of it doesnt change the fact thats its just a GEN VI big block.
__________________ The world's best cam combined with a poor set of heads will produce an engine that's a dog. But bolt on a set of great heads even with a poor cam, and that engine will still make great power
Its a Gen VI bbc with 4.250 cast bores instead of the the 4.5 the gen VI is capable of. Thats it, nothing else. All the modern technology on top of it doesnt change the fact thats its just a GEN VI big block.
496 = 4.250" x 4.37" (2001 Vortec 8100, 8.1 liter)
And some quick notes on the 8.1
Quote:
The 2001 truck line includes a new 8.1 liter 496 cubic inch "8100" big block. The bore will remain at 4.250", but the stroke will be increased to 4.370". The firing order is also new 1-8-7-2-6-5-4-3 and features individual ignition coils mounted near the spark plugs, similar to the LS1 Gen. III smallblocks. CR is 9.1-1 and it uses Sequential Fuel Injection (SFI). All 8.1 liter BBC production motors come with an internally balanced crank, four bolt main caps and redesigned heads with equal length port runners. The 2001 model 8.1 liter BBC uses a roller hydraulic cam and makes 340HP @ 4200 rpm and 455 ft./lbs. @ 3200 rpm. You'll be able to get either an Allison 1000 5-speed auto trannie or a new ZF S6-650 six speed manual gearbox with this new big block. Both trannies are built for a maximum of 520 ft./lbs. of torque.
Straight from the Mortec website
and the head casting number
12558162...01-up...oval..CLOSED..Gen.VII,"Vortec 8100", 8.1L, 496, truck
Bore and stroke
496 = 4.250" x 4.37" (2001 Vortec 8100, 8.1 liter)
And some quick notes on the 8.1
It uses a standard Gen VI 454 block. Its the heads and everything else on top that make it differnt. Its considered a Vortec Big Block by GM. No such thing as a Gen VII block.
Gen VII is just a term thrown around on the internet. You'll find in on mortecs sight only. Not from GM though.
I have never seen a 454 with a crank sensor hole in the back of the block like the 8.1 has and the crank has to be different for the sensor to have something to read. Mike
I actually have one of these sitting in my garage and have done alot of research on it. I am probably going to put mine in a short wheelbase chevy truck lowered 4/6, better brakes and a six speed. But until then. it has the same firing order as a ls1. i plan on using the carburated ls1 msd box to fire ignition and a megasquirt to handle the injection part. gen 7 big block. tall deck. symetrical port heads. torque to yield bolts and everything is in metric on these motors. 4.250 bore 4.370 stroke. the rod if i remember correctly is 6.700. the exhuast ports are tiny. there are very few parts aftermarkter wise. heads cams etc. raynor or something like that has heads and a few other trinkets for it. the cam is different cuz of the firing order. internal balanced unlike a 454. the oil pan is mondo i havent seen one that would fit a car. The water outlets are completely different then standard big block. i got some pics of standard oval ports and the 8.1 heads next to each other for comparison. the heads wont interchange either trust me i wanted to put the big oval ports on it. I got lots of pics etc and other info if u need it. xx_ed_xx@hotmail.com
oh and 06 is the final year of them. so a whopping 5 years they were made 01-06. they finally fix the head problems on the big blocks and now there going to stop making them cuz of gas prices....
the 3.9 in the thunderbird and the 4.2 have design similarities.
Ah yes that be true.
I love constructive discussions like this one, no name calling, just friendly discussions, makes me glad i came back to this board. I used to be here years ago, and haven't since my 91Z met it's demise, and now that i'm back in the market, i'm glad to see that this is one of the few well-behaved forums.
Oh, and BTW, one of those Raylar engines would look sweet as hell in a thirdgen, hangin out of the hood. I would like to also see a Duramax in an F-body, gobs and gobs of torque, with decent HP possibilities, there are companies making crazy power with the duramax's. Duramax/allison combo, with a big *** dana 60 stuffed under a 91 camaro would be beautiful.
It uses a standard Gen VI 454 block. Its the heads and everything else on top that make it differnt. Its considered a Vortec Big Block by GM. No such thing as a Gen VII block.
Gen VII is just a term thrown around on the internet. You'll find in on mortecs sight only. Not from GM though.
that's ignorant. check out a copy of the chevrolet power catalog from pre-01 and you'll see a mark VI BBC. the head bolt patterns are different on the new blocks.
I love constructive discussions like this one, no name calling, just friendly discussions, makes me glad i came back to this board. I used to be here years ago, and haven't since my 91Z met it's demise, and now that i'm back in the market, i'm glad to see that this is one of the few well-behaved forums.
Oh, and BTW, one of those Raylar engines would look sweet as hell in a thirdgen, hangin out of the hood. I would like to also see a Duramax in an F-body, gobs and gobs of torque, with decent HP possibilities, there are companies making crazy power with the duramax's. Duramax/allison combo, with a big *** dana 60 stuffed under a 91 camaro would be beautiful.
I do believe sir, that it would do WICKED burnouts before the turbo even spooled!!
If you're going to argue that LS-based computer system motors are only small blocks then alright, but it shares many of the same features and improvements. 
