Engine SwapEverything about swapping an engine into your Third Gen.....be it V6, V8, LTX/LSX, crate engine, etc. Pictures, questions, answers, and work logs.
Welcome to ThirdGen.org!
Welcome to ThirdGen.org.
You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community, at no cost, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is free, fast and simple, join the ThirdGen.org community today!
You mean THAT hood? It's not my car. It belongs to Blue502 who is a member of the Cascade Crew here at thirdgen. He has a web site at www.irocnroll.com . The hood was made by a guy in Portland, OR. It's one of two. I'm not sure if you could ever lay your hands on another.
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Camaroman: Qwktrip did you end up with Hookers?
Have any trouble putting them in?</font>
Yes I did use the Hookers for a lack of anything better. It's a two or three man job to get them in. One person has to operate the engine lift and set the motor in place while another handles the driver side header. If you have another person he can handle the passenger side header. If not, then you need to leave the bellhousing off the motor (WHOOPS!) in order to slip the passenger side in from the bottom side. Also, the motor needs to be lifted a bit to get the #1 passenger side header tube in place.
I'm still pretty annoyed at how they're visible from the side of car and I still don't know what I'm going to do for exhuast... but if I don't just push forward I'll never get the car running. Here's some pics.
[This message has been edited by QwkTrip (edited June 11, 2001).]
yea thats too bad about seeing the collecters....it'll annoy me too...
What if the car had ground fx? would it make any difference?
dont have a real good judgement of how far down they are
Also...could you leave the headers in the car and drop the motor in..then put the headers on?
[This message has been edited by Camaroman (edited June 11, 2001).]
I don't have any idea on the ground effects either.
I did leave the driver side header in place and dropped the motor in beside it. I did the job by myself. Clearance is so stinking tight I didn't even want to try snaking the motor between both headers. My motor tends to go in a little crooked to the passenger side. It doesn't drop down on the mounts without significant prodding and pushing.
Awesome car. I don't know about the gfx idea to hide the collectors. I mean, it is a formie and that says to me, no gfx, lol. Maybe sidepipes would look cool but then again I don't know. Hope it's not too difficult or expensive for you to figure out.
The Camoro ground effets cover it up some (see the pics on my page) but not all the way. I have 3 chamber flowmasters mounted under the front foot/seat area. Currently there is 2 1/2 in pipes about 2 feet long after each muffler (the pipes are bent to follow the floor boards (ie the modified floor boards). I plan on changing it, but just not sure how yet I am thinking of running a single 3 - 3 1/2 inch exhaust out the back in the stock location (after routing the driver side over to the passenger side somehow.
Miles
------------------
88 427 Camaro
12.18 @ 113mph 1.75 60ft
Currently installing 3.73's into my 9 bolt (YES,it is a 9 bolt & YES they are 3.73's, not 3.70. 4.11's to follow soon ) www.koolmeister.com
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Camaroman: Oh one more question...what are you doing for a radiator?</font>
I'm using a 3-core brass radiator made by Modine(?) that is a direct fit. It's just something that the local radiator shop ordered up for me.... although it was the only shop in town that knew about it. It's an upgrade from any stock radiator but nothing major. I'll have to dig through some piles of paper to get the part number. Actually, I'll just call up the radiator shop tomorrow (tuesday) and post it for you. I had an aluminum 4-core before that which was *supposed* to fit. What a joke! I traded it off for work on the car. What a waste of $350!
[This message has been edited by QwkTrip (edited June 11, 2001).]
ok I just asked the tranny guys about a flywheel for this....and I assume you have a stick car "gotta leave the bellhousing off to get the passenger side header in"
Are you using a 168 or 153 tooth flywheel???
Do you have an aftermarket bellhousing so you can use the specific flywheel?
Any info would be cool...
The 454 big block is an externally balanced engine and requires it's own specific flywheel. The only option you have is to use a 168 tooth externally balanced 454
Chevy flywheel. Even if you did find a 153 tooth flywheel you wouldn't want it anyway because the 10.4 inch clutch is too small for the power of a big block. It is highly recommended that you get one that is billet steel SFI approved.
The stock T5 bellhousing won't fit over a 168 tooth flywheel and it's not safe enough anyway. Lakewood makes a bellhousing for our cars that doubles as a scattershield. This will protect both you and your engine block in the event the flywheel shatters. It comes with the hydraulic clutch mount needed for our cars. All Lakewood Chevy bellhousings are made for the 168 tooth flywheel. It also fits in the tranny tunnel with no problems. The Lakewood unit is made such that the factory T5 tranny mounts right up to it, so treat it just like the factory bellhousing when ordering an aftermarket tranny (i.e., you'll need a tranny adaptor). You can reuse the factory clutch fork but you'll need an adjustable clutch pivot ball to set the geometry properly.
The pics are awesome! I wish I would have gone with a BBC for my Camaro. Just imagine the torque. I would have gone with aluminum heads for the big block. Oh well... Great car.
------------------
Big 454 72 Chevy Nova
383 86 Camaro Z28
10.5:1compression Dart Pro 1 Aluminum heads 215cc,234dur.488lift exh&int,Victor Jr. intake, 770 Holley Avenger vac.sec 400 crank,flat top pistons,tranny shift kit,2500 stall converter. 3.42 ,Hooker Headers,2.5inchpipes with 40 s. Flowmasters,MSD coil,MSD module.
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Big454blockchevy: The pics are awesome! I wish I would have gone with a BBC for my Camaro. Just imagine the torque. I would have gone with aluminum heads for the big block. Oh well... Great car.
</font>
Thanks. Given comparable designs, an iron head will make more power then an aluminum head because the iron doesn't allow the such high rate of heat transfer from the combustion chamber. The aluminum heads start paying off when you bump compression higher then what an iron head can tolerate on 92 octane. I'm running 9.1 compression and the blower is putting out 8-psi. Iron head is the right choice.
damn you make me want to go get a painjob now. that bird kicks *** . you have any more 3/4 shots I might be able to put on my website? like without that yellow thing in the way? as for the exaust; GET SIDEPIPES!!!
------------------
-Tas
'89 Formula WS-6
305, TBI, auto, 14x3 chrome flat based open element with K&N, Milodon 160* thermo, functional Formula hood, cross-flow Flowmaster, '99z28 rear pipes and tips....
Soon to be installed:
Hooker 1-5/8" 50 state legal headers, Dynomax 3" I pipe (PN 44063 and 43248), Catco 3" cat, and injector spacer.
Big454blockchevy... oh. Just slap me over the head when I get defensive.
Tas... you don't like the rotortiller? Thanks for the compliment. I don't have any more shots since I stuck the engine in but that's just a matter of borrowing a camera and doing it. I can probably take care of it this weekend. What is the website you want to stick it on?
Tas, don't bother. I'll get better pictures with a MUCH better camera. You ain't seen it shine yet!
Blown 87 camaro... The headers are Hooker SuperComps. They are supposed to be a direct fit but didn't quite make it. I had to beat a little curve in the firewall for one of the tubes on the passenger side, take a slight bit of metal off the driver side control arm (I do mean just a slight bit and it does not reduce structural integrity. Looke under your car and on the back side of the control arm behind the rear bushing you will notice a small hole in the stamping. This got trimmed out completely.), and trim a metal flange under the car. This was really basic stuff. I know ZERO about body work and I was able to do it.
Actually, I was scared of doing the firewall but had no choice. Turned out to be an absolute peice of cake! Turns out the area you need to beat back is just an over hang and there is a a strong peice of metal behind it with a curve that is perfect for slipping the header tube through. Just beat the metal all the way back and it will end up perfect. Don't even need to hit the front side so you won't leave any visible marks.
If you want the complete list of what needs to be done for the big block swap, go to my page. I did it about 3 years ago. It includes all the modifying for the Hooker super comps. There is some pictures there too.
Miles
------------------
88 427 Camaro
12.18 @ 113mph 1.75 60ft
Currently installing 3.73's into my 9 bolt (YES,it is a 9 bolt & YES they are 3.73's, not 3.70. 4.11's to follow soon ) www.koolmeister.com
QwkTrp - PLEASE tell me you have the part numbers for the fittings that go from your rubber fuel lines to the braided lines, and then to the TBI... Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please... I'm trying to get my crap all hooked up and it is driving me friggin crazy trying to find fittings! Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please...
Just go to your local hydraulic supply shop. They can make them up for you.
Miles
------------------
88 427 Camaro
12.18 @ 113mph 1.75 60ft
Currently installing 3.73's into my 9 bolt (YES,it is a 9 bolt & YES they are 3.73's, not 3.70. 4.11's to follow soon ) www.koolmeister.com
------------------
1985 Trans Am - rough and ready -- 3" cat and primary exhaust, lowered 2", custom rust body work mild fender denting. Daily driver.
1976 Corvette Stingray - not so rough, but always ready. 427 BBC .030 over (433 ci) 12.5:1 compression about 600-700 HP/World Class T5 tranny, and no, I can't gun it for fear of breaking my tranny - upgrading to a muncie/gear vendors O/D as soon as I get some more $$$
scauffiel... Why, yes I do! part number 310-74730 Fitting Kit $ 33.99. Go to JEGS and do a key word search on 'fuel rail' and then follow the link to Accel TPI fuel rail fittings. http://www.jegs.com/cgi-bin/ncommerc...t?prrfnbr=6288
RyanSS... that is a B&M 177 low profile big block roots blower. B&M was bought out by Holley 2 years ago. Holley is soon going to discontinue the B&M line and go solely with the Weiand brand. The injection system is a modified Holley 4Di. I have an Aeromotive fuel pump, external adjustable regulator, Commander 950 controller, and increased fuel pressure.
The part number I gave above will adapt your factory fuel lines to a -6AN fitting. The steel braided hose you see is just a standard 3/8 diameter piece from Summit Racing that you cut to length yourself. A large set of shears or snippers will do it. The fittings on the ends of the hose are just -6AN hose end fittings. The guys at Summit will know what you need. I also used a 90 degree swivel bend to fit to the TBI inlets. The last piece is a -6AN to 3/8 pipe thread fitting that screws into the throttle body. Now I don't know what fitting you'll need for your throttle body but if you take it to a parts store they should get you set up... then order some nicer stuff from Summit. The parts store will pretty much hand you ugly brass fittings.
The problem I ran into now is that I need to lay out 1/2 inch lines so everything I have there is useless. It would have worked well with my ZZ4 but it won't service the big block.
[This message has been edited by QwkTrip (edited June 22, 2001).]
Which hard lines? You just leave the flex rubber hose in the engine bay between the factory steel lines and the factory fuel rail lines. It's high pressure hose and is designed for it. The Accel kit screws right into them.
Well, I was looking to ditch those rubber lines and replace it with two 5 foot lengths of the stainless braided stuff. So, basically from the hard lines clear to the TBI unit would be one single piece of braided line.
Of course, if I could run it so that I could put a FP gauge in there that would be nice. So that would mean it would go: Hard line -> Fitting -> Socketless hose -> Fitting -> Gauge -> Fitting -> Socketless hose -> Fitting -> TBI - at least on the supply line. Of course, I could also combine it so that as soon as it goes from hard line to fitting it would go directly into the gauge; thereby eliminating one length of hose. I dunno, we'll see.
Did that kit only come with those two pieces? $34 for two adapters!? Man, I hope not!
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by scauffiel: Did that kit only come with those two pieces? $34 for two adapters!? Man, I hope not!</font>
Yep.
The factory fuel lines actually use power steering fittings. We have an Aeroquip shop in town so I trucked on down there and thought I would just go pick up power steering fittings. Ya right. They didn't have a CLUE what I was talking about and I searched through every catalog they had. This was not just a little car place. This was a real Aeroquip dealer with aisle up aisle of fittings and EVERYTHING sitting there. So I gave up right then and ordered the Accel kit. Like someone said earlier... you could have a hydraulic shop make the hose for you.
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by QwkTrip: scauffiel,
I guess I didn't answer your entire question.
The part number I gave above will adapt your factory fuel lines to a -6AN fitting. The steel braided hose you see is just a standard 3/8 diameter piece from Summit Racing that you cut to length yourself. A large set of shears or snippers will do it. The fittings on the ends of the hose are just -6AN hose end fittings. The guys at Summit will know what you need. I also used a 90 degree swivel bend to fit to the TBI inlets. The last piece is a -6AN to 3/8 pipe thread fitting that screws into the throttle body. Now I don't know what fitting you'll need for your throttle body but if you take it to a parts store they should get you set up... then order some nicer stuff from Summit. The parts store will pretty much hand you ugly brass fittings.
The problem I ran into now is that I need to lay out 1/2 inch lines so everything I have there is useless. It would have worked well with my ZZ4 but it won't service the big block.
[This message has been edited by QwkTrip (edited June 22, 2001).]</font>
So the accell kit will connect to the rubber hose www.cse.buffalo.edu/~ermer/pictures/fuel3.JPG and then a standard 6-AN fitting will connect to the other end of the Accell fitting?
------------------
87 IROC-Z 305 TPI gears, exhaust, converter
14.70 at 94.1 mph
Solid Roller Minirammed 377 waiting to be installed
)
They didn't have a CLUE what I was talking about and I searched through every catalog they had. This was not just a little car place. This was a real Aeroquip dealer with aisle up aisle of fittings and EVERYTHING sitting there. So I gave up right then and ordered the Accel kit. Like someone said earlier... you could have a hydraulic shop make the hose for you. 
