I have designed an airlid based off of 1bad91z design...mine is slightly different...thanks 1bad91 for the inspiration....but here is the progress so far...not done yet...but getting there. The white pieces are PFDE plastic that I attached to the factory ABS plastic and schedule 80 oval intake pipe...I'll update with more details later, but here is pics, IMG_1147.JPG IMG_1146.jpg IMG_1149.JPG

some more
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Interesting work. What kind of hood will you be using? It looks like you've made the air lid slightly taller on the sides, so thats why I'm wondering.

I extended all the sides of the air lid roughly 1/2" higher all the way around, moved the factory locking tabs down to the bottom section of lid (so that they would reach), and then attached a 3"i.d pipe that I splayed longways down the middle adding 1 3/8" of material to make it an oval shape to match the 58mm bbk throttle body about 3" by 5 1/4" oval, (larger diameter than stock, stock rubber tube won't even go on my bbk), and the cut and molded it into the air lid. The rubber piece is some kinda oval seal for sewer systems but when on the car almost looks factory. Yes I know I built it with sewer system parts, lol!! I'll take some more pics when I get done sanding and painting it and show it on the car. It DOES clear factory hood, it touches it, but just ever so slightly, but we checked and rechecked it and it seems to work great. I used a two part epoxy to hold the whole thing together, and then fiberglass re-enforced bondo to mold the edges smooth (see more in later pics). Where I couldn't even get my fingers in that airlid before, I now can get my hand almost in there...should flow great. I'll get more pics on here as soon as I get more done on it....I've got to mold some more stuff smoother and make it look good now....it looks pretty rough on pics, but that was just to get it stuck together in right position, it'll look a lot better when I get it done....

oh where the white is on the air lid and the pipe is where I added material to it....forgot to mention that

man that is sweet will you be turning these out for people?

Lookin good! Do you have any pics of it installed?

I don't think I will sell any....don't know for sure yet....I just don't have a lot of time to make these.....I will have to decide that...but I know that 1bad91z makes and sells some for a great price!!

I haven't taken any installed pics yet....but those are coming soon....sanding and painting it....gonna put it on the car and get some pics on here real soon. Sometime with a day or two I think....just doing finishing touches.

I was following 1bad91Z's design a while back and was thinking about doing this and have since acquired a few of the stock Y-shaped upper intake pieces. I was originally thinking of just cutting the sides out of one and cutting the other in half. Then I was going to plastic weld the sides into the other one to raise it up like you have done. Unfortunately, I don't have access to a plastic welder and I never really got around to doing it.

Otherwise, instead of using epoxy or plastic welding the sides in, what if a mold of the top portion could be made and then just epoxy it to the flat base like you have in picture #4. I was thinking the top portion could be made out of fiberglass or if you want something a little more exotic looking (and expensive) carbon fiber could be used. Do you think a wooden mold would work if it was really greased up? I only ask about wood because it is so cheap, I have so much just laying around and because I have a good amount of experience working with it. I was also thinking that since the wood would be durable, I could use it repeatedly and make several of these before needing a new mold if I would ever need a new mold.

How thick are the white portions you added? I don't have one in front of me to look at, but they look a little excessive for what the stock one was made out of.

Another thing that can be seen in your pictures is the little tube braces that extended from the bottom portion to the top. Are you going to be extending those as well, or do you think it will be strong enough without them? Will you also be cutting out the cross brace that pushes down on the air filter, or will you leave them as is?

If you don't mind me asking, how much do you think this whole project is costing you, and about how many hours do you think you have (or will have) into it when it is completed?

Good work,
Mike

I don't know much about making a mold, but if that worked it would be awesome and a lot easier to make a bunch more, and fiberglass or carbon fiber would work great, plus you could custom mold it to make it even better, but I don't know much about making or pouring molds......as far as air lid goes, the white pieces attach to upper air lid are 1/2" taller.....I used 1/4 inch thick to give it some more structar support and it matches up to factory lid nicely.....Since I raised it, those little 'poles' don't reach so I'll cut them off, and don't really need them since the material I added is real sturdy, probably better than stock, don't know, but seems very strong (I didn't wanna use a thinner material and have to worry about it breaking), but it looks good and whenever I get some more pics on here, you can see that it did mate up nice. The cross-bar across filters I am leaving in. I think I spend like $11 bucks at home depot getting pipe and rubber piece, and under $20 getting a sheet of 1/4 thick platic. Paint and primer, was like 8 bucks, and epoxy and re-enforced bondo I had laying around, but that's not that expensive either......Not too much overall actually pretty cheap build (I did use toilet/sewer part remember, lol), I was thinking build time was between 10-15 hours, but now I'm thinking with more sanding to smooth everything out and painting and what not, like 15-20 hours, but this was my first one, so less time of course if I ever built some more.
Thanks for the replys guys, hope this give you all some ideas to bounce around.....I'll keep ya posted with what's happening with this, and get the pics on as soon as I'm done...

Where did you find the plastic you used to extend it? I also like the neck you built. The stock rubber bellows on my car collapses when you go WOT.

The plastic pieces on there that are white, I bought at a place called interstate plastic company, locally.....there are 4 or 5 places here in small boise, idaho that sell plastic....someone in your town will....try looking up plastic in the phone book.....you can buy all kinds, I was going to purchase ABS, which is what the factory lid is made out of, but they didn't have any scrap pieces, so I got this stuff called PFDE or something like that....anyways...the tube/pipe is just pvc 80 pipe, you can get that at a place like home depot. I wanted a hard tube just for that reason so that it wouldn't suck it in.....

Thank you for the reply and information. I live close to both Daytona Beach & Orlando. I will look around this week in my spare time to see if I can come up with a supplier. I've been wanting to mod my spare air box and do something about the factory rubber bellow. I doubt it will net HUGE increases on my nearly stock car, but it shouldn't be much for the materials... mainly my time/efforts.

Yeah the materials are actually pretty cheap.....but it takes quite a bit of time do mod one of these.....But I think it's worth it....the stock air lid, I read somewhere, flows only 499cfm...which is not even enough for a stock motor, you should feel the difference. Just take your time with this, don't rush it, otherwise it'll turn out bad....check out 1bad91z thread called high flow air lid as well for some ideas. Let me know if you have anymore questions, I'll get some pics on today I think.

update on lid....don't have pics on here yet, but I have sanded and molded all the plastic together, and used a black "plastic" color paint, you can NOT tell that the new pieces are epoxy in .....it looks 100% from factory like it was molded that way. The plastic color paint matches an unpainted clean airlid exactly...I can't wait to get pics on here for you guys. Oh....I did run into a little snag....where the straps and rubber piece attach to the Throttle body, is hitting the hood right on where one of those plastic retainers hold the hood insulation on....underneath that little platic retainer the metal hangs down a bit, so I took out that plastic retainer, and cut that little section of metal out of hood. It is not a structer (sp) support so it doesn't affect anything. Besides that everything fits perfect. I also should mention that I have a Holley stealth ram and a 58mm BBK TB.....a factory height intake should not need any modding what so ever, since they don't sit near as high. But even so, the mod to cut hood a bit took 5min and was easy. I'm almost totally done with air lid setup and promise to get pics on here soon. I even suprised myself how the lid turned out, especially the way it looks molded and 100% factory.....

I saw you posted an update and I got my hopes up... I was expecting pictures.

What kind of paint did you use? Brand and/or color code please...

I decided I'm going to try and make a wooden mold. I have a friend that might be able to get me access to a CNC machine so I may be able to get an exact replica of the stock part down to the thousandth of an inch. However, I'm still trying to decide if I want to do plastic or fiberglass.

Back to your project... Did you raise it 0.5" all the way around, or did it vary from like 0.40" to 0.55"?

Mike

Yeah, I didn't get to working on it yesterday, my buddy blew up his turbo, and so we all rushed to get the spare in (ran 6.80 at 218mph!!!)....but I'll get those pics on here soon....

I raised the whole thing a total of .5 inch.....it did vary a little due to shape of airlid....but overall the whole thing went up .5. Excited to see you mold and hope that works out good!!

waiting to see pics!!!

here are some updated pics for ya.....the green stuff on the sides is the fiberglass bondo, which I am using to make the whole box look like one smooth piece with no transitions. The top portion has been painted....notice the white strip on the tube is gone....the paint matches the stock plastic color perfectly....the lid itself has not been painted to show how close the color matches (intake tube painted, air lid top not..if that makes sense)....I'm going to sand and smooth the edges out and post the final pics.....enjoy guys.....
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this is cool nice work. I wonder how much this thing would flow, it would be interesting to see on a flowbench. I've been looking into building something for my current motor. the stock setup is way too restrictive.
Nice work

I don't know the exact numbers on the flow, but it will be a ton better than the stock junk that's on our cars.......Sorry guys, no more pics for a while.....came home friday and girl friend of 3 + years decided to move out....took a lot with her.....including home computer and camera.....so I'll have to get pics on another way....I will let ya know when I do.....I have the air lid done now and it looks awesome!!! I'll get the pics on here somehow......

Sorry to hear that. Been there and done that!

You probably heard the same thing my ex you say to me.... "You care more about that car than me! and blah blah blah....!"

Sorry to hear about that, a similar situation happened to me about two years ago. She said she needed more time to herself.

I still have not found a source for plastic, well... one that will sell to the public. I will keep looking, pretty soon I am going to go looking on my shelves to see if I have any factory plastic parts I don't need/want anymore. I'll cut what I need out of those.

hey guys....sorry for delay....i'm back. I had to go chase down my girl...couldn't let her just walk out of my life....crazy how that is (and how she is LOL)....but anyway, things seem back to normal (actually better than before I think)...but she is in process of moving back in....and as soon as I find the camera I'll post the pics of the final product on the car...I drove it around the other day and wow, that thing works great....I got many compliments on it....some people didn't even know it was modded..they thought it was supposed to look like it did...anyways I'll get some pics on here ASAP....might be a bit till I unpack, and of course it'll be in the last dang box...but I'll get the pics on here.
86iroc.....sometime someone who sells to public is hard to find...but I know someone does...you might be able to order something via internet too.

Thanks for the update. Glad things in your personal life are getting back to normal.
Looking foreward to installed pics.
Kory

You two guys are beginning to motivate me. I had modified my airlid because I needed something to match my 3.5" MegaMAF. So I only modified the outlet tube to 3.5".

The mold idea is fairly straight forward. You split the factory airlid down the middle along the sides. Add to the sides whatever height increase you want. Sand, smooth out and prep the two prototype halfs. I guess that you can make a fiberglass mold on the inside or the outside surface. A fiberglass mold (top half and bottom half) could be made and these "tall" airlids could be mass produced as far as a home business is concerned. Having a lot of hands on experience in a pattern & mold shop as a teenager and while in college helps quite abit. Its a matter of having the right tools, experience, and some creativity. You guys certainly are creative. Nice work!

are you plan to make some of those for sale?

For ABS plastic (and a lot of what we use is ABS) you can do your own "plastic welding" in your garage with basic tools.

You'll need a solvent that'll evaporate completely, paint thinner works perfectly. Make sure you get the strong stuff. Nothing pre-diluted or enviromentaly friendly.

Then using your favorite method you need to generate a supply of ABS plastic shavings.

A drill bit works well but use the largest you can, the type used to make holes for door knobs will make quick work of this task.

A good source of material for this that most of you have laying around the house is ABS plumbing pipe.

Fill a container (NOT PLASTIC! lol) with the shavings and mix in solvent until you have a mass of liquid plastic.

You'll want to add just enough solvent to make the plastic easy to work with but if you add too much and it's difficult to work with, time or more shavings will thicken it up.

For the parts you intend to bond make sure the surfaces are clean and slightly roughened. You dont want to try to bond pieces with the glossy factory finish intact.

Wet the surfaces to be mated with the solvent. Use a screwdriver to test the consistancy of the plastic, it should be soft or nearly liquid at the surface but not all the way through.

Use a tounge depressor or similar tool (body men will have this type of stuff around allready along with plastic mixing cups that wont melt because of paint thinner) to apply a generous amount of the "weld" to both pieces and attach.

Find a way to secure the pieces for as long as it takes the weld to set.


After a few hours the two pieces will be one


For the plastic you'll be needing for this project check out Home Depot or similar stores. Square ABS pipe, plastic gutters and fences are usualy ABS and will provide more flat stock than you'll likely ever use for a few bucks.


This is also great for restoring interior trim pieces and cracked OE body kit parts that you cant get new and for molding custom pieces.

Thanks Is six, that's an exelent idea, I have some industrial paint thinner at home I will try this, I really want to let more air pass through this damn air lid since I have the "ram air kit". I have been thinking alot to do it for a while and more since 1bad91z and 91interceptorz started to work on them. I just cant aford one that 1bad91z makes.

I don't want to hijack too bad here, but how much are people willing to pay for a high flowing air lid that looks stock? I just want to figure out if it would even be worth the trouble to make a mold and do a short production. The way I'm think of now is going to cost around $40 for the materials for each piece but unless you wipped out a ruler, you would think it was the stock part. It will probably even have cleaner seams then the stock part (no excess epoxy that oozed out a little at the factory).

Mike

Nicely done, I am anxious to see the end result. Was their another thread done by 1bad91z that I am unaware of ? I have never seen this design before.

Racing Geek are you a member of brew city muscle?
I noticed you are from Milwaukee. I live in new berlin.
Kory

Well, there's also some engineering involved in making the lids' plenum as large as possible while also retaining the use of the factory fastening snaps to fasten to a factory lower air filter housing AND clearing the stock hood at the same time, hence all the hours that I put into the ones I make. I hand fit each one to my car.

Good luck if you decide to make a mold.

Do you have any pics and how much do you charge for one.
Kory

If you are interested in one, please PM me about that. I'm not trying to high-jack this thread. 91interceptorZ has made his own different design.

I'm glad to see the interest growing, the guy that will start a production of the high flow lids could make alot of $$$ cause I'm sure alot of camaro owners would want one!

No offense at all is meant to anyone, but it has been my and many others experiences on this board that once a product comes out or a concept is presented, you first have all kinds of interest from many people. Then when it comes time for the product to come out, most of those people either back out of purchasing, complain about the price, or even worse start to bash the manufacturer. Look what happened to BBK here on the boards. You have a company that was or is still trying to bring a new TPI intake to market and look at all the crap they got. It's almost not worth it!

I've been on the boards for many years and I've seen it time and time again.

make that $.04. Everybody and the brother is interested till it comes time to pony up some money.

Great looking product. Just a thought though; will the single flex coupler handle enough deflect for regular motor mounts? If the engine has more flex than the coupler can handle it will create a bind, thus twisting the box around and/or over-stressing epoxy holding the tube to the lid.

Actually, this is not my thread, it is 91interceptorZ's thread. My design is different in a few ways and my air-lid thread post is under the TPI board.

I can only speak for myself in saying that my lids are rock solid. You'll crack the main plastic body before you crack any of the epoxy joints. The stuff I use is used by GM to glue the chevy truck door hinges to the fire wall. Those hinges aren't held on by bolts, their glued on with epoxy.

I have 2 lids running arround on cars with stock rubber motor mounts without any issues. The silicone rubber connecting sleeve is more than adequate for any flex the motor can give it (short of having a completely busted motor mount).

1bad91Z: what is your lid outlet ID and OD?

Hey guys, sorry for delay again, I didn't forget about you.....Found camera last night so I'll get pics on here ASAP. I have had the car out now for a couple weeks with new air lid and WOW that thing get a lot of attention. But the best news is I ran the car at the track with the air lid off and with it on, same temperature, same style of running, and did it a few times each way....to my suprise it actuall went .2 seconds faster each round with the air lid on (must be how it funnels air in)...but this thing seems to run good....I am going to have it flow tested if I can to. I was thinking about making these to sell, but it actually took me 15-20 to make just this one and I don't know how many I could make.....If someone is interested I could hand make some....I seen someone talking about a mold which is cool, and of course Bad91z sells his design, which mine is designed after. But if there was at least say 3 or 5 orders I would take a weekend off to make some.....updated pics coming soon!

Sorry, kinda mixed you up. I quoted you for the re-sale thing, the comment about the flex was towards 91interceptorZ. - That panel adhesive you're speaking of is some tough stuff though. It's rated as strong as a weld, even on metal panels. After using it for a mini-tub job, I don't argue.

about the flex...I've had it on the car for a couple weeks now, and have had no problem with cracking...at least non so far. I have stock rubber motor mounts and a high horse motor, and with all the abuse I put on it, the rubber piece I used seems to have enough flex in it. I guess it is a possiblity and if you were worried about it you could cut the tube a little shorter and run a larger rubber section, or design it like 1bad91z did and use a flexable material all the way down. I have drove a week or so with the hood off to watch how everything is doing in engine bay, and even when I'm on that loud pedal, the motor doesn't seem to move, at least I can't see it moving (I know it does), but I don't think the intake is in danger of being damaged.

and yes pics are coming I promise, going to try and get them on here this weekend...I know I keep saying it, but they are coming!! sorry for delay in pics.

Holy crap I have to build one of these. I think my air lid is choking off my LT1..

I have some material suggestions:

McMaster Carr http://www.mcmaster.com/# for side of air lid filler plastic material
Devcon Plastic Welder™ Black http://www.devcon.com/products/produ...3&familyid=310 for epoxy. This stuff is wild! Works great to repair cracked dashes in 3rd gens too!

how has the lid been on your car

I know Doc has his ability to modify the PROM to deal with all this extra air since he was the initial inventer on our board for the 'Mega-Maf', but what are the rest of you doing to compensate for the RAM air induction you're esentually getting from the much more free flowing air lid. Aren't you getting code's thrown?? Nitro-Nicky

well, I don't run a MAF, mine is a MAP system...but the car will adjust for the increased amount of airflow. It's just like if you go from a hot day at high altitude, and then go to a cold day at low altitude, way more air cold and low...and the car reads that and can add fuel to compensate, increasing power. That mod will for sure not need any computer mods what so ever.

on my car I noticed a for sure difference in power. Also to test we put it on a stock 5.7 thirdgen and took it to the track. the car an 14.9 with stock system and 14.5 with new system, and that's on a stock motor.

I will get some more pics with the box installed on the car, it's very very clean looking, most don't even know it's been altered, you would have to know what youre looking at to notice it, but once they do, it's gives a in shock effect.

Wow!!!! A 14.9 down to a 14.5? Let's see, if we use the basic rule of thumb of it takes an added 10 horsepower to cut each tenth of a mile off the ET (And I do drag race), you cut 4/10ths off; that means you free'd up approx 40 choked off horsepower!! That sounds about right.

Your MAP example makes sense too. I've kept shying away from all the computer stuff as there's been so much else to learn about and/or modify, but I just found a problem with my original ECM and it's time to dig in and stop being such a electronic wuss

Unfortunately for me, my Iroc kept breaking down as more and more major parts failed. I could never make it to the track but did get some computer simulation runs done with the G-Tech plug in stand alones. They're very close to track timer accuracy.

Thanks for pitching in with the info tidbits! It'll give hope for those of us who's been stuck with having to make brand new cars all over again! Nitro

were are the photos....... almost 2 years.......... i need to feed my moster! lmao