History / OriginalityGot a question about 1982-1992 Camaro or Firebird history? Have a question about original parts, options, RPO codes, when something was available, or how to document your car? Those questions, answers, and much more!
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Hey guys, I posted up a video on Youtube of my 91 T/A 'vert about a month ago and just today I received this comment on it:
"Big Help about the (1 out of 555) what GM doesnt tell you is that there where really only 400 made the other 150 of them had extream computer problem so they where trashed. So thats a big head up for you . and i own a 1992 Pontiac Firebird 'vert and they only made 250 of them because it was the last year of the f-body firebird. and between 90-92 there where only 823 Pontiac Firebird Convertibles Made, very rare cars. very hard to find so keep hole of it. -Thanks"
Is that true? If so... anyone wanna trade their Turbo Trans Am?
. . . and i own a 1992 Pontiac Firebird . . . because it was the last year of the f-body firebird.
Wrong. That F-body platform was used by GM (Pontiac) from 1967 all the way too 2002. They made F-body Firebirds during the 4th generation ('93-'02).
And yes, there were a documented 555 '91 T/A verts built. Were only 400 actually released and the rest trashed? Never heard that one before, but even if I had, unless there's some kind of official documentation on this, it means nothing with regards too the increased rarity of it. I'd be very happy to discover it is documented.
Quote:
1992 Pontiac Firebird 'vert and they only made 250 of them because it was the last year of the f-body firebird. and between 90-92 there where only 823 Pontiac Firebird Convertibles Made, very rare cars.
Both statements in the above are also incorrect. Firebird convertible production in 1992 alone was 1,265! More than both of his numbers even put together.
that, and I wouldn't believe a word from anyone who can't spell. Seriously. R u guna bleev me when I say tht Pontica onlee mad wun firevurd? seriously.
that, and I wouldn't believe a word from anyone who can't spell. Seriously. R u guna bleev me when I say tht Pontica onlee mad wun firevurd? seriously.
Hahaha good point. And I never really believed the guy. I know a bit about the thirdgens, and this is something I've never heard.
Well I responded to his comment:
"Thanks for the complement, but I think your numbers are a little off. I never heard of any documentation saying that 150 T/A 'verts were trashed and well over 1,000 firebird convertibles were made in '92. They're still obviously pretty rare, but not THAT rare.
Thanks for the comment. "
And he wrote this back:
"No, believe me my uncle works for GM and he is the assistant to the GM head. it was a secret document and GM didnt want to let out that they had made a mistake with their computer systems and also a big problem with 91-92 was a bad clear coat in the paint that would peel only 6 months after the car came off of the line."
I don't totally doubt the thing about the clear-coat.
Do we have a conspiracy on our hands here?
Well I responded to his comment:
"Thanks for the complement, but I think your numbers are a little off. I never heard of any documentation saying that 150 T/A 'verts were trashed and well over 1,000 firebird convertibles were made in '92. They're still obviously pretty rare, but not THAT rare.
Thanks for the comment. "
And he wrote this back:
"No, believe me my uncle works for GM and he is the assistant to the GM head. it was a secret document and GM didnt want to let out that they had made a mistake with their computer systems and also a big problem with 91-92 was a bad clear coat in the paint that would peel only 6 months after the car came off of the line."
I don't totally doubt the thing about the clear-coat.
Do we have a conspiracy on our hands here?
The peeling paint used to be an issue when they switched from oil based paint to water based paint to meet production plant emissions standards. That switch was done in 87 though, so it shouldn't be an issue for later years. It was covered under warranty if the paint delaminated from the body.
Yours just looks like typical peeling clearcoat like found in cars that have been left unprotected in the sun.
The argument with the convertible wiring issue would be interesting indeed. The problem I have with it is there is 1) nothing I have ever heard of. 2) If it was a problem, why not include hard tops too? There is nothing unique about the vert wiring except for the tonneau release which is actually the same as the trunk release on a coupe... Right now it is not holding a bunch of water.
John
__________________ 87 FORMULA - 5.1 LB9/A4 T-tops 3.73 Modified (Yellow/Black)
87 FORMULA - 5.0 LB9/M5 T-tops 3.45 (Yellow/Gray)
89 FORMULA 350 - CONVERTIBLE 3.27 All original (Red/Gray) www.3rdgenformula.com
The argument with the convertible wiring issue would be interesting indeed. The problem I have with it is there is 1) nothing I have ever heard of. 2) If it was a problem, why not include hard tops too? There is nothing unique about the vert wiring except for the tonneau release which is actually the same as the trunk release on a coupe... Right now it is not holding a bunch of water.
John
I know! And wouldn't it be just silly for GM to trash 150 cars? Virtually anything electrical is repairable in a car.
It was covered under warranty if the paint delaminated from the body.
I bought my '87 sport coupe in 1992. By 1994 there were spots of missing paint as large as a fist. Of course all the usual spots were affected - the rear deck, the roof, and especially the hood. I took the car to a body shop to see what my options were. The shop gave me a GM contact to call, and told me the paint was covered under warranty.
I still remember the conversation with the GM rep, his name was Mr Mudd. We argued for over an hour, but long-story-short the verdict was that if the car had over 75K miles, it would not be covered.
I knew someone else who did successfully have their car repainted around the same time; their car was an '86. It seemed like the blues were the worse.
"Hey, Uncle of the grammatically challenged, 150 of the cars sent to ASC for conversion all happen to have the same extream computer issue! Don't worry though, we will replace the computers and still sell the otherwise perfect vehicles for profit."
Fictitious Uncle: "NO!!!!! Draft a secret document and crush those cars, but count them in the production total... it's the only logical thing to do! Nobody will know until 18 years from now when my nephew tells the world in a comment on a crazy futuristic web site called You Tube... mmmmmuuuuhahahahha!!!"
"Hey, Uncle of the grammatically challenged, 150 of the cars sent to ASC for conversion all happen to have the same extream computer issue! Don't worry though, we will replace the computers and still sell the otherwise perfect vehicles for profit."
Fictitious Uncle: "NO!!!!! Draft a secret document and crush those cars, but count them in the production total... it's the only logical thing to do! Nobody will know until 18 years from now when my nephew tells the world in a comment on a crazy futuristic web site called You Tube... mmmmmuuuuhahahahha!!!"
I bought my '87 sport coupe in 1992. By 1994 there were spots of missing paint as large as a fist. Of course all the usual spots were affected - the rear deck, the roof, and especially the hood. I took the car to a body shop to see what my options were. The shop gave me a GM contact to call, and told me the paint was covered under warranty.
I still remember the conversation with the GM rep, his name was Mr Mudd. We argued for over an hour, but long-story-short the verdict was that if the car had over 75K miles, it would not be covered.
I knew someone else who did successfully have their car repainted around the same time; their car was an '86. It seemed like the blues were the worse.
The problem with the paint in the 80's and 90's was GM, Ford and Chrysler all started using a new sealer, the nice thing about the sealer is it really reduced rust, the down side was it was expensive so in order to reduce costs they forwent the primer. The problem with Blues, Whites, Silvers, purples, etc is the fact that so little pigment was needed and so coverage was easily obtained, add to that the sealer was very UV sensitive. In the end the UV rays would go through the blues, silvers, whites etc and would attack the sealer and the paint would eventually flake off.. whereas yellows reds oranges etc tended to hold up slightly better, they just tend to fade, although it does happen to those colors as well on occasion.
I bought my '87 sport coupe in 1992. By 1994 there were spots of missing paint as large as a fist. Of course all the usual spots were affected - the rear deck, the roof, and especially the hood. I took the car to a body shop to see what my options were. The shop gave me a GM contact to call, and told me the paint was covered under warranty.
I still remember the conversation with the GM rep, his name was Mr Mudd. We argued for over an hour, but long-story-short the verdict was that if the car had over 75K miles, it would not be covered.
I knew someone else who did successfully have their car repainted around the same time; their car was an '86. It seemed like the blues were the worse.
If that was the verdict then how did you manage to argue for that long?
If that was the verdict then how did you manage to argue for that long?
Start off nice, gradually get angrier to the point where I am yelling at him. I had nothing to lose and everything to gain. At least at first, I thought GM was gonna cover it. I got the "I feel your pain" speech, and the guy talked ALOT. Things went downhill quickly. Every time he tried to end the call, I started the "SO YOU'RE TELLING ME THAT I HAVE TO LIVE WITH YOUR DEFECTS" speil. I remember assuring the guy that I would never again buy a GM product for the rest of my life. He probably hears the same thing a dozen times per day. I just thought he would get sick of me and agree to cover the repaint.
Start off nice, gradually get angrier to the point where I am yelling at him. I had nothing to lose and everything to gain. At least at first, I thought GM was gonna cover it. I got the "I feel your pain" speech, and the guy talked ALOT. Things went downhill quickly. Every time he tried to end the call, I started the "SO YOU'RE TELLING ME THAT I HAVE TO LIVE WITH YOUR DEFECTS" speil. I remember assuring the guy that I would never again buy a GM product for the rest of my life. He probably hears the same thing a dozen times per day. I just thought he would get sick of me and agree to cover the repaint.
Oh wow... I'm surprised that he didn't give in. They usually do after a spiel like that!
"Hey, Uncle of the grammatically challenged, 150 of the cars sent to ASC for conversion all happen to have the same extream computer issue! Don't worry though, we will replace the computers and still sell the otherwise perfect vehicles for profit."
Fictitious Uncle: "NO!!!!! Draft a secret document and crush those cars, but count them in the production total... it's the only logical thing to do! Nobody will know until 18 years from now when my nephew tells the world in a comment on a crazy futuristic web site called You Tube... mmmmmuuuuhahahahha!!!"
LOL. Classic.
__________________ Tom
1992 Z28 1LE, 305 TPI 5-speed
Radio delete, Red/Red leather
9,XXX original miles
Update:
HAHAHA look at the private message that user sent me:
"the crazy non-scenc comment about GM that was my cousin who thinks he knows everything. truely very sorry. the only thing i know about my car is that its rare but not nearly that rare."
__________________ Bright Platinum Metallic with painted hoodbird, 17x9 Year One Snowflake Wheels, smoothed inner fenders, shaved door locks and antenna. Black leather interior.
Current Drivetrain: LT1 and T56 with SLP 1 3/4" primary headers and catback, Borg Warner 9-bolt.
