LTX and LSXPutting LT1's, LS1's, and their variants into Third Gens is becoming more popular. This board is for those who are doing and have done the swaps so they can discuss all of their technical aspects, including repairs, swap info, and performance upgrades.
Welcome to ThirdGen.org!
Welcome to ThirdGen.org.
You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community, at no cost, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is free, fast and simple, join the ThirdGen.org community today!
Hey everyone, Im looking at building a 383 LS1 and I wanted to know if anyone here has built one and what HP# they are putting out and what parts they used to make it.
Im looking to make atleast 350+rwhp with my setup but want to build a strong engine that is very reliable.
Stage 1 6.3ltr Holden/LS1 Price per Unit (piece): $3 000.00
Including our nodular iron full counterweight 4.00" stroke crankshaft, 4340 forged steel "I" beam conrods with fully floating bronze bushed small ends, hypereutectic cast alloy 10.5:1 pistons in .010" oversize, moly rings, rod and main bearings, new GM crank angle sensor wheel fitted and indexed, the whole assembly is internally balanced
Thanks. Steve
This ad is not displayed to registered members. Register your free account today and become a member on ThirdGen!
Well I dunno.... 350 rwhp is an awful lot to ask for out of such a small mill.
Dude... Are you kidding? I put down 400 rwhp with a lil 346 with a tiny 224 cam! An engine that size with L92 heads will crank out well over 500 rwhp with a decent cam. Reliable? Heck I buzz my stock bottom end motor to 6900 all the time
You are on a road to far exceed your expectations my friend. Enjoy
stock ls1's lay down anywhere from 290-320rwhp.. you can get 350 with just a cam, on an otherwise bone stock 5.7 ls1.. add an intake and full exhaust and your lookin at around 400rwhp..
__________________
1984 Trans Am
385sbc(RIP)/t-5/4.30-9"
1.69-7.44-11.65 @ 116
next up-->383 with mild upgrades
Sweet, thanks for that now that has made me want it evan more.
Hehe I hear that! I'm already putting parts together for my next 6.0L build with L92 heads and monster cam! LS1's are like crack! one hit and your HOOKED for life MUAH!!!
I don't know mutch about the LS series engines but i want/need to learn as mutch as i can.
Also what work will I need a machine shop to do and can you go through all the main steps to build a 383 LS1, I don't want to be a pain but I wanto know what im getting myself into (I don't care how hard it will be, im ready for it).
Well I'm not one for stroking out engines. I find it costs more than its worth. For instance if you take a stock 6.0L which if memory serves is 364ci or thereabouts and dump the money it would cost to stroke it to 383 into go fast parts for the stock cubes instead and you will make more power.
There is no truer statement than nothing beats cubic inches however so if you want to stroke for more cubes like 454 or so then I understand it. If thats what you want start out with the LSX block their $2500.00
The question I think you need to ask yourself is not what cubes you want but how much power do you want? There are so many ways to go its not funny. Do you want naturally aspirated? If so put the coin into cubic inches. If you want as much horsepower as you can get then go for a stock cube engine and bolt up a power adder ( supercharger or turbos ). Heck even a 5.3 who cares just boost the snot out of it.
To give you an idea my tuner just built a forged piston,callies rod and crank stock cube 346 LS1 and added an F1R procharger and put down 885 rwhp through an automatic tranny that he didnt even lock up!!! Stock PCM as well no fancy schmancy stand alone management. A combination like this can be built for under $10 grand if your careful at planning. Farm out the rotating assembly to an engine shop and do the rest of the wrenching yourself and match up parts nicely is the key but it can be done.
Spend time reading over at LS1tech.com theres more info there than anyone can handle. Power is easy with these engines you just have to decide how much you want and what your willing to spend and what method you prefer. Intended usage of the car etc. If you want to drive it then stay mild on cam and stay N/A and you can still have a 500rwhp car thats civilized. Strictly a toy? Then go for big boost and hang on
That being said if you want my advice on the bang for the buck answer???
Grab a stock 6.0L truck engine ( about $1500 or less ). Put a new LS6 oil pump, LS2 timing chain, Katech rod bolts ( approx $450.00 )
Then slap on a pair of L92 heads ( new from GM they are cheap as snot ) add stainless valves, patriot gold springs, ( $1000.00 or less complete if you shop smart )
A decent size cam ( 230 or so duration $400.00 )
The Aussie intake and Wilson 90mm throttle body ( $800 pr maybe more dunno for sure on the TB but the intake is cheap )
Combine that with a set of longtubes and a 4" catback and you can put down around 530 rwhp for under five or six grand again if you do all the work yourself. This is engine only though not including trans or wiring. A couple grand will get you into a decent auto or stick. Plus you will need to source f body accessories and oil pan and either pony up $1200 for a Speartech harness or wire up your own which still costs a couple hundred bucks by the time you pay for all the gack you need.
Good luck
***edit*** oh man i just noticed your down under. Well I dont know what engine combos came stock down there but the 6.0L engines here come in 2500 series pick up trucks so find the biggest equivalent engine around your area and apply same combination of parts I listed above and your set. What is the biggest stock LS engine size offering down there?
put a 224/228 cam, with 918 springs and hardened pushrods
thru a stock 99 z28 muffler, with stock manifolds, and a 9" sucking up power...
365 at the rear wheels... and it sounds like stock. idles like stock.. has that daily driver reliability... and gets 19mpg city, 30mph hwy.
a 383 should get identical MPG, be just as reliable, but make more power.
----------
Quote:
Originally Posted by cam-
Well I'm not one for stroking out engines. I find it costs more than its worth. For instance if you take a stock 6.0L which if memory serves is 364ci or thereabouts and dump the money it would cost to stroke it to 383 into go fast parts for the stock cubes instead and you will make more power.
BUT!!!
if you're getting a forged shortblock built.. theres only a $120 price diff between them using a stock GM crank (good for 1200 hp) or an Eagle crank (also good for 1200ponies)
so for only $120, you gain the cubic inches.
notice, this only applies to when you're having a place like TSP or thunder build you a shortblock... but if you need something built that doesnt have cast pistons and stock rods, its worth the extra 120.
Last edited by MrDude_1; 07-20-2007 at 10:25 AM.
Reason: Automerged Doublepost
True but I was suggesting using stock components they are plenty strong so long as you dont spray or boost them. Some guys do but I dont... Heck i dont need to haha!! My first ( and only ) trip to the dynp put 373 rwhp down at 5200 RPM on a TR 224 112 with stage 2 hand port 941's ( stock LS1 heads ) The curve went completely flat at 5200 all the way up to 6300 so we stopped until I could remedy the valve control issues. Ditched the used 918's that came on my heads for new Patriot golds and dropped in SVO30 injectors. Retuned and made a HUGE difference up top she pulls strong through 6500. No dyno yet so guessing around 400 rwhp or so.
Anyways point is my 99 stock bottom end motor sees 6900 all the time and all I did was change the rod bolts. Engine has over 80k miles. Not bad for an engine that cost me $1700.00
***edit*** by stock bottom end components I mean no rebuild or machining costs at all. Just buy a used engine and go! If she blows who cares for $1500 you can get 6.0L truck engines all over the place. I saw one locally advertised the other day for $750.00!!
Last edited by cam-; 07-20-2007 at 10:55 AM.
Reason: clarity
my buddy is putting together a 383 ls1 and its gonna be nasty. I'm thinking upper 400's whp. i've seen alot of 383's make 475whp or so and i think his will be close if not more with that big cam
I think it is a waste. My best friends '02 firehawk put down 500rwp at a dyno contest.
All he has is
.580 lift cam ($400)
FAST intake ($500)
FAST throttle body ($400)
DART Aluminum heads ($1500)
Long tubes ($700)
Maganaflow. ($700)
Also a tune ($400) (Uses laptop and software
Wide band O2 and sensor ($250)
well over here in Aus there are only 2 LS engines that are soled LS1 (5.7) and LS2 (6.0L) they don't have the others, LS1 are easer to comeby and a wrecked LS1 car is about 1/2 the price of a LS2 one.
Pluss if i make it look like its still a 350 (5.7) I don't have to have the car checked by the goverment to see if it is road legal. how are they to know it is a stroker? if i go to LS2 (6.0L) I will have to have the car checked and with my luck it wont pass the emissions and roadworthy test.
Pluss if i make it look like its still a 350 (5.7) I don't have to have the car checked by the goverment to see if it is road legal. how are they to know it is a stroker?
Ahhh yes i have heard about these laws in Aus before. Right hand drive is mandatory too for road legal correct?
Not to worry though one other cool thing about the LS series engines is they are externally identical so regardless they look the same for any John Q laws poking there nose around. The only way to tell if its a 5.7 or a 6.0, 6.2 or whatever is to look at the rear of the bell housing or behind the water pump so they still wont be able to tell unless they tear it apart.
Drag is though as of yet there is no L92 style low buck head available for the smaller 5.7 bore. There are still great options out there for good prices. . I like the patriot LS6 stage 2's I have viewed all the heads on the market and they look good and perform very well for the money.
Are you looking for a stock sounding build as well? Or can you get away with big lumpy cams? Is this a toy or are you driving it daily?
well over here in Aus there are only 2 LS engines that are soled LS1 (5.7) and LS2 (6.0L) they don't have the others, LS1 are easer to comeby and a wrecked LS1 car is about 1/2 the price of a LS2 one.
Pluss if i make it look like its still a 350 (5.7) I don't have to have the car checked by the goverment to see if it is road legal. how are they to know it is a stroker? if i go to LS2 (6.0L) I will have to have the car checked and with my luck it wont pass the emissions and roadworthy test.
wouldnt they know the physical appearance difference of a gen1 sbc and a gen3?
wow id be extreamly happy with that
If I was to go carb, what would be my best option (intake, carb and cam) for a mild 383 LS1?
Also would my 700R4 (if i cant get a good 4L60E in my price range) bolt up/work with the LS1?
mine makes over 400 at the rear wheels even on a bad day, and she sips fuel at 19mpg city and low 30mpg hwy....
if you have to pass emissions and roadtests, id carefully look at what the holden guys around there are doing before attempting the swap.. it would suck to do all that work, only to be heldup by legal issues.
you could always swap in a stock LS1 (~305 to 315 at the rear wheels) then when it passes as a dead stock swap, slap a small cam (224/228 range) in it for 360ish hp... then throw some headers on for 400ish... thats assuming you dont have to constantly re-test the legality of your car.
Bolt on cars with stock 346's can do that. My 1999 LS1 T/A did 323rwhp without headers or LS6 intake. Same car is at 418rwhp with heads & a 224 X-ER cam. The car is mild mannered and can be daily driver, and is even pretty well mannered crawling at like 3 mph uphill in parking decks which is the harshest streetablity test I've found.
Some of the radical LS1 heads and cam builds have have broken 500rwhp. Many have made 430 to 450rwhp with bigger cams etc. Heads have improved and people run bigger cams now since my T/A got heads and cam.
382/383 LS1 stroker, I've considered it for my build up, have the stroker crank and set of TEA Stage 2.5 LS6 heads in hand along with an LS1. However, the LS6 intake isn't really up to flowing air for an engine that big. You will need the FAST intake and a 90mm TB along with some good headers to really get the benefit out of the 382/383 stroker. To really get a hot 382/383 the FAST will need to be ported. With all the supporting mods a solid ~475 to 485 rwhp with a 382/383 is do able. I think you'll really want a set of custom headers 1-7/8 primary with 3 inch collectors etc the 382/383 to get to that level.
With an LS6 intake the stroker will probably be in the 440rwhp to 450rwhp range. You'll more torque a good 40-50 over the 346 but the peak hp won't be all that much greater.
I'm probably going to get the 346 rebuilt with mostly stock interals and use the TEA 2.5 LS6 heads and a nice ~230/230 sized X-ER lobed cam for my LS1 RS.
well i didn't know what to expect, im still learning about these engine.
I want a basic 383 nothing wild in HP but I want good torque numbers.
Im going to install a dead stock LS1 coz I have to have the car checked now no matter what so my primary goal is making them think my car can handle the power (should be easy enough) but after it has passed I will remove the engine and stroke it because they only check it once.
Take these guy's advice, don't even bother opening up the bottom end untill it need rebuilt, even then it's not really cost effective to rebuild when low mileage long blocks go for 1500$.
You can make enough power to twist your car in half with just bolt on's and a cam. They'll cost much much less than stroking the motor.
Plus the whole idea of them finding the engine size out sounds a bit far fetched. As long as you have a "350" block, are they really going to make you tear the engine down to prove the stroke and bore are stock?
They aint that cheap over here, you are looking at at least $3,000 for a LS1 or $7,200 new with ECU and EFI.
The LS1 or LS2 this don't matter anymore because it will still have to go for an inspection so what I was saying earler was that im going to run with a LS1 5.7L (stock) for now then later on when it needs a rebuild I will stroke it to 383ci.
If you do buy a used long block, consider the following...
I bought an LS1 drive line pulled from a wrecked WS6 T/A. The car had been running etc. I expected the engine to be good to go but because we check stuff before we install it, had the motor tested for leak down.
Two cylinders had leak down issues. During tear down, discovered the car had a fitting in the oil pan. It was probably for forced induction. More neat stuff discovered #7 cylinder hand a replacement piston in it. Bearings, looked good as did everything else. In short, the engine needed to be re-ringed and freshed up before being used. The motor would have ran but been down on power.
Do a leak down if you can before buying the motor.
Dose anyone know if a LS1 will bolt to a 700R4? because mine only has 112,000Mile on it with a almost new stage 2 shiftkit.
It works but not what I recommend. I large part of the success in auto LS1's is the computer controlled aspect. You can literally create a perfect transmission tune and have the combo working in complete harmony.
Slap it in drive and hang on. Just dont buzz those autos too high
Im def going with LS1 383 but im not going EFI, My question is dose anyone know the best Carb, Intake, Cam and Ignition system setup that I could go with?
This is going to be a weekend car so im not real fussy about MPG I just want a beast for cruising.
Hmmm Off the top of my head I'd go a 240 ish cam around 650 lift, LT's, 3+" true duals, L92 heads with the best springs your money can buy, 11 to 1 ish compression, I think Edelbrock has the only plug and play ign system out there but there may be others, As for intake I'm not sure what carb ( if any ) intake is available for those heads so if not AFR 225's and the victor Jr will suffice albeit a tad pricier. 950 Demon carb should do fine
And to top it off a 150 dry shot of fun fun gas.
That should net you close to 600 at the wheels N/A and 700 on spray and if you get everything dialed in juuuuuust right?.... Can you say deep 10's on motor and possibly 9's with fog??
