K well this is what is goin on, I picked up a LQ4 from a 99 cehvy truck. mileage was bout 70,xxx pick it up for 600$? good idk sounded like it though. K now i plan on swaping this motor into my 90 firebird formula, with a t56 from a ls1 based firebird/camaro. Now i have read somewhere that the LQ4, can handle up to 700hp with out any mods to the bottum end ( true?/False? ). Now i have a come up with a list for this engine, Heads, cam, intake, ext. First let me ask this, On the lq4 the year i got 99 i have to swap the crank (LS1) right? to make the t56 bolt up to the flywheel? correct if not let me no what i have to do. Now for the parts list, Heads-( Patriot LS6 series head combo )- chamber volume is 59cc, intake 235cc, exhaust 83cc. ( to much? that will raise my compression? but how much, dangerous?) cam specs-226/226 585 lift both in/ex 112 lobe seperation. ( if this combo wont work i was thinking maybe ported out ls6 heads? suggestions. Intake-Edelbrock PRO-Flo XT with the fuel rails, Throttle-body-fast 92mm Injectors-(i was thinking maybe 32-36lb) Headers-Hawks conversion long tubes Now i no that the t56 stock prolly wont be able to handle this power amount i am thinking bout 400+ maybe 500. Or will it? rebuilt will it? I have been thinking bout this, tryin to come up with ideas/combos for awhile and i need some help with it so maybe you gents can help. If not the ls6 heads what heads would be good to port and put bigger and new valves in? or is this patiot combo the way i should go? idk, The car has the 350tpi and i am sick in tired of putting money into it and gettin nothing back. So LSX has to be the way to go. I see these things putting done insane numbers with just topend upgrades, so let me no what you guys think of the partslist. I want the car to be a street friendly, not just drag, I want to be able to drive on the streets where I find the fun. So, and suggestions would very well appreciated.

MAn, that is allot of questions! LOL

Not a bad deal, but if it is a 99 with iron heads, you are screwed as the crank is too long to work with the T56, you need one that cam with aluminum heads, sorry about the ban news there.

The bottom end will usually live to 6800-7000 RPM from what all my friends turn on stock lower ends. HP wise? Depends, on motor with natural aspiration you would have to turn it to the moon to get 700 HP and it would fly apart. On boost? Hell yea, you arent turning that much RPM, so with a compressor or nitrous it will handle it with the proper tune.

The cam you mention is too small in my book for those big heads and cubes, a torqer V2(231/234 i think) would do great but bigger is better in my book.

The T56 will handle whatever you throw at it if you treat it normal, as in hit the gas, let out, shift, release the clutch and then mash it again, buddy of mine makes over 500 RWHP with a 427 LS1 and his T56 is still stock and alive but he doesnt beat on it like i do, so it is just on borrowed time till you have it upgraded with stronger parts.

HTH

ok,..... so the 99 is no good? Well ill get rid of it,... so i need a lq4 from what? and what year and up? so i can call a couple yards to see what kinda prices i am looking at. Well thanks for being cool bout it, I am not a noob to 350sbc of the tuned port injection or anything, I am 19, and i think what that says is i DO NOT have much experience with ls based engines. So,..... yea well let me no asap man and ill see whati can do. I gotta wait for this snow to clear so i can go pick up my car. I bought a 90 formula, and i currently own an drive a 89 formula 350, BUT the floors are rusting out, LOTS of metal is rusting so i found a good solid body that i am gonna swap all my stuff into then LSX swap so tryin to get my motor built, but there is a hurdle. Oh, well.............................

Well for the crank issue, couldnt I just swap the crank for a ls1 crank? or not? cause wouldnt the ls1 crank fit right in there and fix the length problem? idk

f-bomb

Yea, you can replace the crank with one from an LS1 and then you'd be able to use a T56. That's exactly what I did.

well that is great! sweet i dont no when ill get around to that, i had to get another job just to fund this build HA! so I will update when I get the funds but THANK YOU! bluezee AWESOME CAR! i watched the build amazing man hopefully you can give me some insight when i need answers, well thanks ill update as soon aas possible first update will prolly be me gettin the other car the 90 formula shell to start swapping and painting so thanks

The stroke is the same 92mm on LS1 and 6.0's, so yes swap the crank. Be aware of the 24x to 58x reluctor rings which at not compatible. Lucky for you the 24x version is significantly more common (97-04)

The LQ4 is a lower compression engine to begin with, LS6 heads wont bump it up too much but you will see a boost

Thats a mild cam for a 6.0 with a really bumpy idle. I wouldnt hesitate to put that in my 5.3 and drive it every day. 6.0's can have quite a bit more duration. Look over the GEN III internal forum of LS1tech, or any of the performance truck sites for opinions and tech

The edelbrock intake wont clear any stock 3rd gen hood. Its 2 inches taller than the stock 6.0 intake which requires a cowl to fit. Go with a LS6 or any aftermarket car style intake

A performance build of the T56 may help, but generally the parts upgraded are damaged from abuse, not power ie power shifting and slamming gears

So far you've got a pricey build sheet. I wish I could have pulled that off when I was 19

Add to the list the Fbody swap parts, like oil pan, front accessories, mounts etc

Then tack on fuel system changes, pump, lines etc

Then jump into the wiring aspect (free to $1200)

T56 cost is unreal (generally more than the engine and related)

And add the cost of mods

$Total =

i've learned that whatever i plan on doing to my car i add 50% to what i THINK it will cost lol. for instance i bought some nitrous things...thought the whole thing would cost around 1k...now i'm planning on 1.5k lol

Im finding the finishing touches cost more than the whole project

If someone told me Id spend more on belts/fluids/fittings/couplers than the whole engine id tell them they're crazy

$250 later, I know better

I also scoffed at the $230some GTO K&N intake systems. My 4" mandrel steel intake is nearly half that and Ive got the cheapest filter that comes in 4". Id be close to the K&N price with a decent lifetime filter and real automotive fittings over the rubber sewage couplers I got from Lowe's

I find that overpricing the small things on paper helps in the end, after doing several projects over the year, i got wise and made bigger numbers on the cost side and it kinda brakes even.

yep i ill have to agree with ya there, i do the same thing ill add or round off parts prices just to make sure that if i run into anything then i KNOW that i will have a an 50 to 100 dollars laying round. but for "Be aware of the 24x to 58x reluctor rings which at not compatible. Lucky for you the 24x version is significantly more common (97-04)" what does this mean?

when i come up with a parts list price ill let ya no thank ya guys

Keep the crank and use an LT1 T56.

Wouldnt that take his starter out of alignment?

well doesnt the lt1 6speed have a buldge where the slave goes, that would interfer with my long tubes, i want to go with the ls1t56, seems as though it would be stronger idk (I havent looked to much up on the lt1t56 so). I think i might just sell the lq4, and go with ls1 block and build up from there. Prolly get one for a good price then replace heads and everything i was going to do. idk,....... thinking

I got a picture of the 90 but i cant figure out how to put it up? any help!!??

K I found a ls1 5.7 long block, Heads assembled, block (crank, pistons, rods). Waking up in the morning and gettin the ls1 so my friend is buying lq4 off me for his truck HA! so got that takin care of. woot woot!

k well i got the ls1 yesterday, got it al torn down, yes i got pics. Question for ya which heads are the better ones, the ones on the motor are the 806? the crank is bad to, number 5 cylinder the bearings in it were worn to nothing. Ill prolly have to replace the crank i dont think the shop will be able to fix it but i will see. but yea let me no bout the heads.

there is some teasers for ya guys,.. lol that is the 90 firebird i gotta go pick up. so untill then ill post some more pics of the motor all torn down to nothing so untill ttyl

Looks like a LQ9 from what i can tell, has flat top pistons.

isnt lq9 a 6.2? 6.0? the back side of the block it says 5.7, it is an ls1 outta a 99 z28. so,.............

Alum block and perimeter valve covers suggests 97-98 LS1 5.7. Its from a Fbody so its a 98 long block. Just like the one I sold two weeks ago

yea well i paid 350 for it so i figured it was a good buy which imo it still is the tpi motor couldnt compare so ill post pics in a lil bit

LOL, thought you said it was a LQ4, didnt even notice it was aluminum...

You can sell it for double that much

well i had a lq4, i bought it then i found this ls1 for 350 so i bought it and sold the lq4 to my friend

Ok well i got some stuff done today. Got the piston cleaned up ( gonna replace a couple are bad youll see ) heads torn down and all that jazz so here we go enjoy!

if you look closer to bottum of the pic that nick, yea that is from a valve my frnd the apprently normal slap of the piston.


another nick woot!






now this one i found wierd, there is a date stamped on this head and it is stamped 11/08/97 wierd right? normal?






















well that is it for now.

They started building '98 model year parts in '97. Not unexpected if it is a '98 model year engine. Next year production usually starts late summer.

If you're still looking for a crank, send me a PM. I've got a perfect one out of my LQ9. I've also got the 317 heads, which are the same as LS6 heads with a bigger combustion chamber for a lot less money.

I am so jealous of you even getting a bare LS1 aluminum block for $350. That could never happen in this state. But that was nothing next to seeing you working barefoot. I long ago learned to wear steel toed non-slip work boots. Other than that, it seems you're doing well. I'll be watching this thread.

HAHA!! that is so funny, you wanna no something even better. My wife is cool with me bringing my stuff inside down in the basement so i CAN work barefoot haha! well more pics of my feet soon to come. Cause spring/summer is just round the corner and Ill be sleeping in the garage

Hey and about that crank you have forsale Jim85iroc pm me prices on the crank and heads. thanks

(90 firebird gets a lap dance (ls1/t56, body work, and interior))http://www.thirdgen.org/techboard/showthread.php?t=561458&goto=newpost

So i cleaned the garge out today so here are some pics, the car wil be here saturday so i had to clean it out. here are some pics, I am writing out a parts list so wheni get it done i will post it up.

So i started messing around with my stock heads. Porting um and stuff i only got like 2 intake ports done um here are a couple pics. I am unsure at this point if i am going with aftermarket heads i will find out though.

K so i came up with a parts list, Pretty much just the esentials so here we go let me no any of your ideas, Thanks

Heads: Patriot 225cc 59cc
Intake: Fast intake 102mm $900
Cam: Tpis ZL-11 Dur: 281 267 Gross lift: .559 .557 Lobe sep: 112 $425
Rods: 6.100 light weight rods $335
Pistons: Mahle flat top $590
Injectors: 30lb $240
Throttle Body: 92mm $405
Fuel Rails: Fast fuel rail kit $200
Rockers: Scropian $400
Ignition Coils: MSD coils $600
Headers: HAWKS stainless works $800
Trans: T56 $1200
Clutch: Excedy Stage 3 $500
Cross member:HAWKS $110
Motor mounts: Spohn $100

My LQ4 had flat top pistons. (knew it was an LQ4 because of the iron heads and loner snout crank, since it was a '99/'00)

well doesnt the lq4 have a cast iron block? mine is a ls1 aluminum block and heads from a 98 z28 so i dont know what to tell you. Well i am leaving shortly to go to my parents house they are gettin back from there trip and then tomorow i go to get the car woot woot! i cant wait. but ill get pics as soon as i can.

Today has been a fairliy long one so far, my dad and i got the 90 formula today. So i got it out in the garage on the jackstands ready for tear down but that will wait till tomorow so here are some pics and i got a question for ya guys. The cars harness is for a 305 tbi, now i was wondering how am i supposed to remove the harness? just pull everything out or leave psecific wires? let me no thanks





So i think this color is sick, but if you notice in the background there sits the 89 woot

k so questions questions. I got started on removing the harness today, got a carfax report on the car as well. formula 305 tbi auto, now i got all the wire loom of and cut the gromet from the passenger side. Now, the wires i need i am kinda confused, i dont understand wiring to much so. What i gather is that i need to get rid of all the connectors that control the 305 tbi. Then the driver side that connector with the body front end harness. I no i need to keep the brake connector, oil pressure, temp, starter wires, and what else? help? what all do i need to leave connected, what wires do i need to leave revealed to connect to the new harness thanks any help at all will be appreciated i have read all the write ups and i am still a lil confussed so maybe a lil one on one would help lol so any help thanks

Wiring is covered in the sticky

The C100 takes a 1/4" socket to remove. The pass side needs the ECM and C207 unplugged and the pigtail shoved into the fenderwell. It will pull through above then. You dont have to cut anything

You should have two small harnesses left in the engine bay, one under the column for the cruise harness, another near the HVAC box for the blower fan control and AC request

k,........ i have the one still in the car, the one i guess that controls the ac box. um other then that there is no wiring in the enigne bay after i took out the harness. Now pocket i am not tryin to be rude, i just do not understand this part of the swap. i no cause it is the biggest part of it, i guess u could say i am a noob to the wiring part of it i just have a hard time understanding exactly what all i am tryin to keep ya no i read your write ups and if i understood it then yea i would be set but i am 19 and i dont understand wiring to easy. um,.......... so just tryin to jump into it and get going but i am gettin kinda lost i thought i understood it.

I need to keep the power through the wires and the guage wires, and stuff but then i am being told wrong so i dont no and the write ups i no i have read them all and then i thinki got it but then i feel insecure bout it so idk

k so i got some stuff done, not to much though my wife broke her finger trying to walk the dogs lol so been taking care of her and spending time with her. But i got some done, got the k-member removed and started cleaning the engine bay. Will take some pics for ya guys tryin to get it cleaned up so i can paint the engine bay and start buying the suspension parts and brakes and all that jazz. Put the front end back together then tear the rear apart, get a new rear/ build the one it came with. new suspension in back sway bars ext, then fourth gen fuel tank, new braided steell fuel lines, new brake line to the master. All that stuff. Once i get her dependent on her own feet then ill paint. Black? idk i am unsure so good thing i got time, black, that dark red color ( on car currently ), white, or blue. so yea any comments would be great but i think for the harness i am gonna go easy and just buy one. Maybe over time mess around with one but i just want a clean install and reliable so i dont trust my knowledge in that department lol but yea here is an question for ya the rods i pulled outta the ls1, they are in good shape but i will be replacing them. But can i use the ls1 rods to put into a sbc? thanks

The goal is to retain the power distribution and gauge functions of the 3rd gen harness and relocate them for the simplest attachement to the swap harness

A stock LSx harness is reworked to remove unneeded/unnecessary functions and pieces for a clean install taking the best routing paths to make the install simple and easy. Generally, the necessary splices are routed to one location to centralize hookups. I route them to two places for the easiest hookups of the C100(engine side bulkhead) and C207(fuses connector near the old ECM)

The marraige of these two halves makes the engine run with the new control system in the 3rd gen and retains all dash functions. Itd be like the engine was always there

Engine bays look best with 4 color choices
Body color
Flat black
Gloss black
Dark gray

Any other color looks terrible

Nothing is compatable between LSx and SBC

Thank you pocket, i have read on this forum and heard alot of good things bout you, and i appreciate that. That made it alot easier to understand, so let me get this right i am gonna take the lsx harness and rework it. Removing like egr, and ac and stuff. Then the 3rd gen harness i gonna retain the gauge wires, and the other odds and ends and mate them to the lsx engine its self? i take it

Correct. Its a very long process, but thats the game plan

so i found a ford 9inch for FREE going to pick it up tommorow. So what all has to be done to make this thing work in my car? i no i have to cut of the shock, spring, lca mounts , other then that what else?

is there axles that have the same bolt pattern for the firebird rims 4.75x5? or 5x4.75>?

So, i got the 9inch, and i am planning on rebuild this thins with a new aluminum center section, 4:11 gears, axles new carrier, brackets, and new disc brakes, I have been looking and looking for the best brake setup for discs on this rear and i havnt foud the best yet, i think i will make my own but yea ill update tommorow it is supposed to be nice out so we will see

ok,... i am now talking to myself,... i got picsw of the engine baym the 9inch all cleaned and primered, and the kmember cleaned and paint. The first step to my build is to build the suspension ( front and rear, rearend, ect) so ill be ordering some stuff like shocks struts, strut mounts, sway bars, ( the ws6 ones that are one the car i will sell so if interested pm me with an offer) rear lca's and panhard bar. so woot


Ok, so this engine bay is the result of pure frustration, i am a perfectionist, so i painted it looked GOOD! but i thought hey if i spray it again then it will really look good! so i did, ten minutes later all the paint started cracking so as soon as i saw this i was pissed! to the point where i grab the angle grinder and went crazy so enjo plz comment motivation is a must and is very well appreciated thanks by the way my name is Evan

Just imagine you're on TV. You can't see us, be we're watching you.

tubular kmember ftw!

k,.... so after TONS of frustration, i finally got the engine bay painted this morning, and guess what IT DID NOT FLACK!!! WOOT!! So i got the k-member in and the control arms snugged. I am going to order the lsx swap spohn motor mounts, now what else do i need? The motor mounts that bolt to the ls1 from a firebird/camaro 98-02? an answer to this question would be nice. but here are some pics of the progress. ENJOY!

ok, so i got a question bout this ford 9 inch i got. I called Currie today and talked to one a my guys bout it, and he said that they will have to retube it to make it the samewidth as a stock thirdgen. Now ill be sending it off once i got 700$ to get the brackets welded on, and retube it. Now, for my question, Do they make a yoke that will accept a stock thirdgen drive shaft? if not do i gotta get a custom driveshaft? any info would be well appreciated thanks!!