UnstableAviator

Well, its time for me to throw my name on the pile of TGO LS1 swappers...I just picked up my 2002 LS1 takeout engine/trans today.

The engine has 52,000 miles, 3572 (LS6) intake, and was originally in an automatic car. I have a T56 as part of the deal, so I'll need to do a little extra research on wiring. Otherwise, I feel as if I got a great deal and am pleased with the purchase. Yes, I'm in Colorado, and yes, my car is in Ohio. I work for the airlines so I bounce around quite a bit. My cousin who is currently working out here is going to drive to Ohio anyway, so his pickup is gonna make for the cheapest cross-country engine shipment in modern history.

Here's the engine upon arrival in my garage.


Here's the engine harness fresh from the engine.


Here's the car and the shop in which I'll be doing the swap. Its good to have a retired hot-rodder uncle who like to wrench. Always a rust free V6 body, already equipped with an LT1 style T56 (sold), Ford 9", Spohn TQ arm, 4.11's, SFC's, Eibach Pro-kit, GR2's, etc. Its a good car, just needs some LS1 power.


I'm planning in doing the engine harness using Pocket's posts as a guide. I'm looking forward to digging in tomorrow.

cprmn14

iTrader: (3)

Good luck man!
Thats a clean looking camaro

RockJay81

iTrader: (1)

Nice! Make sure you get a manual harness the one you have in the pic is for auto. Not sure if that would work with the t56. Talk to pocket about wiring issues he is a genius.

ghettocruiser

iTrader: (4)

The auto harness will work fine. My donor car was an auto that was switched to T56. When I got it, I deleted all of the auto related wires, and reworked things slightly for the T56. Its a piece of cake.

Having a T56 PCM would be nice, but you can get the Auto PCM tuned to work with the T56.

Unless you get a line on a nice T56 harness and PCM...then go for it!

J.

UnstableAviator

That's good to hear. I figured it wouldn't be a major hurdle.

Since the kitchen is obviously the best place to do tedious work, being right next to the coffee pot and all, I dug into the wiring harness this morning. It took me about 2 hours to de-pin and strip the tape/loom.


The standard "pile of spaghetti" pic.

Iroc'nthe87

iTrader: (5)

mmm mmm copper soup! my favorite!

LB9Iroc87

Subscribed! I'll be keeping an eye on this one bcuz i just bought a LQ4 and planning to put in a T56 behind it.

UnstableAviator

I labeled the connectors when it was still attached to the engine, so that obviously going to make things easier for the next step; labeling the pins for the PCM. I've got the harness disassembled, which went smoothly following Pocket's guide. It's taken me about 4 hours to get to this point, which considering the amount of pesky electrical tape I had to remove I figure that isn't too bad. I would take a more detailed picture but there's really nothing there that can't be found in the sticky. The injector/coil IGN common was left intact, and upon disassembly, I have no idea why anyone would think of cutting it anyway.

Pocket

iTrader: (24)

T56 change is simple as long as you have the proper connectors. They can be salvaged from the 3rd gen harness

Thats hilarious

No point to cut the INJ/coil commons because you'll be resoldering them right back. Oddly enough, truck harness do not have these. All INJ and coils are individual to the fuseblock

UnstableAviator

Just mocked up the harness, got it taped into the basic shape. Not bad for my first attempt at a wiring harness and a single day's work. I guess all those weeks studying and mentally preparing a plan pay off.

I'm mentally exhausted though, so I called it quits for the day. Tomorrow I'll re-attatch the harness to the engine, check everything again with a fresh brain, and add in the HO2's, IGN commons, and ground commons.

rickyzZ28

iTrader: (4)

Looks like some nice progress in a fairly short amount of time. Also where in Ohio is the car?

UnstableAviator

Pike County. The land of very little traffic, hills, nice roads for hot rods, and unfortunately no jobs. And I'm doing the first LS1 swap I know of in the local scene.

ghettocruiser

iTrader: (4)

BINGO!! This is really the hardest part of doing this swap. Just reading and getting yourself together mentally. The work is pretty darn easy.

You did a really nice job with the harness! I forgot to mention you'd need some plugs for the T56, but as Pocket mentioned, you can nab them from a thirdgen, or a 4th gen. You can order pigtails from GM if you are having trouble finding something. I did that for my alternator because I kept breaking that tiny exciter wire.

Save that copper soup! I found myself cutting out pieces of wire from the leftovers and from the donor cars body harness throughout my swap. Just nice to be able to use different color wires instead of all red or black or green. Whenever I used a wire to hook something up that it wasnt intended, I made a note of it in the wiring diagram of my swap paperwork. So 5 years from then I would know what the wire was haha.

I like the way your swap is going and Im looking forward to seeing you progress!

J.

UnstableAviator

I've got the "engine" part of the harness mostly finished. I soldered and shrinkwrapped all the grounds, and connected them all together. I also added an extra ground ring since I know my car is already using one to the body just behind the right cylinder head. The harness looks great on the engine, unfortunately I didn't get a pic of the last mockup this morning. After looming it should be real nice.



Now...on to this mess. Any "insider" tips before I start? It'll be a few days, I leave tonight for a trip and won't be home until next week.

Pocket

iTrader: (24)

Do one PCM connector at a time, preferably in each pair of 20 pins. I like to start with the red connector on the left, tabs face out. Remember which direction the connectors are facing before finalizing anything. Try to keep the splices away from areas the harness will be bent

White'89

iTrader: (8)

I completely forgot to check that my connectors were in the correct orientation when I lengthened and soldered everything together. Not a mistake I will ever make again....

UnstableAviator

Thanks for the good advice, I've pretty much got the harness finished now and ready to connect to my 3rd Gen. I'd guess I've got nearly 20 hours total in this wiring job, but it was worth it to reach a good understanding of the engine wiring and build some new skills. If I had to do it again it would be a lot easier, and certainly I would do a few things different.

I havn't taped the loom, and before I install in the car I want to check each pin with a multi-tester and verify my work. I feel confident everything is going to check out just fine.



The ugly end at the PCU. Thanks White'89, I could very easily have made the same mistake you did if I hadn't checked the thread.

LB9Iroc87

Awesome job on re-pinning that plug! Now the big question... does it all work correctly?

86White_T/A305

Awesome job on the harness.This just goes to show how clean I think your swap will be.20hrs on just the harness...I spent a total of maybe 5hrs on mine but I do automotive wiring for a living.The wiring for the t56 inside the car is alot easier than you think..easier than making the harness lol.

What are the plans for the car for setup.Stock ls1/156..cam/heads/intake/exhaust etc? I havent decided still what i want to do with mine as its nears winter and needs to be rebuilt.I miss having a heftly lobed cammed motor but I also want to have a sleeper deadly N/A ls1 at times.Too many options in building these gen 3+ engines.

Keep us posted

UnstableAviator

Plans for now to keep cost "reasonable" (yeah, right) is just using the LS1 in stock form with the additions of bolt-ons. I've already got the LS6 intake (stock 2002), Hawk's 1-3/4 headers, GTO CAI, and Monster Stage II clutch w/18lb flyhweel. Future plans definately include heads/cam. I'd love to have 400+ RWHP and nice driveability. The LS1 should meet that goal easily.

I've made some progress this week, and as usual, things snowballed a bit. K-member is notched for oil pan clearance, and the rearend is getting LCA relocation brackets welded on. While I'm at it I'm going to convert to rear disc and LS1 front brakes. I also picked up a 2.5 turn lock-to-lock steering box to replace the manual S10 I've had on the car for years. The stock V6 wiring harness is prepped and ready, I ended up stripping it down to basically wiper controls, IGN power, and starter. I'll be using Autometer guages.



I ordered a 255lph Walbro, and I got the kit with the sock and harness for $15 extra. Its a GSS307, not sure if I should run this pump or sell it and get a GSS340 like I know I should have. The 307 is good for 60psi...so I'm not sure. I might pull the tank again and change it just for my own piece of mind.

STREETDEMON

i just bought my kit from racetronix and went with the gss340. pocket did my harness, i wasn't as brave as you, and with 3 kids at home, its hard to find a good block of time to sit down and do something like that!

great build so far. are those TT2 wheels 17"?

UnstableAviator

When I originally had a T56 intalled behind my 383, I used a Wier Hot Rod products bellhousing, which required a Tilton 1" Master Cylinder for the clutch. I wish I could take credit for this bracket, but it was fabbed up by my dad 6 years ago and has worked great since.

Now that I'm going to a Monster clutch with an LS1 style hydraulic throwout bearing, I'm switching to a Tilton 7/8 master. Purchased from Ebay for less than $50, came with everything. So the combination on the Tilton 7/8 and this clutch line from Speedway should make for a nice shifting setup.



When I took this photo the bracket was upside down. Doh.


Here's a shot of the approximate angle it will install. Note it bolts into the factory firewall bolt holes.


Another pic for reference


And the final install. The AN-4 fitting is covered with tape, but it looks like I won't even need to buy the $22 AN-4 90 degree swivel to connect everything. Tick master cylinder performance..for about $100.

HP52TA

iTrader: (4)

Nice job on the wiring, things are coming together nicely.

Speedway also make a remote bleeder kit for the T56 slave cylinder you may want to consider. Makes it real easy to keep fresh fluid in the clutch hydraulics.

scooter

iTrader: (11)

Nice work showing us that bracket, I think that should be easy to replicate. Just need a turnbuckle and a small rod eye or something for the other side of the master.


I wouldnt say the Tick piece is a rip-off, but it is more expensive, plus they make the firewall bracket out of billet aluminum and they modify a rod end for the pedal so it fits without having to fab anything.

If I ever need another master for another car I am definitely going to do all that myself.
Thanks

UnstableAviator

My old (bought in 1998) Moser 9" was prepped and installed today. New "Right Stuff" brand disc brakes, and the previous 4.11/Posi was just reused. The disc brake kit was about $300 and I feel it was well worth the price. One caliper bracket did require some grinding/filing to clear the sliding action of the caliper, but otherwise it bolted right up.

Just for kicks we threw it on a bathroom scale, weighed in at a hefty 249 pounds. If you're looking to save weight, I can't recommend a 9". I now see why the aluminum center section is so popular.


All new brake lines are run from the new Wilwood proportioning valve, it sure was nice to use 4 adapters (master cyl/front rubber lines) and get away from the metric stuff. I found it interesting the prop valve bolted in directly with no mods to the stock bracket. Big thanks to my uncle for bending the front lines...they turned out great...much better than I could do without wasting 30' of line in errors.


I also have LS1 front brakes, dropped off the old rotors at a machine shop today for modification. Bigbrakeupgrade is supplying the brackets. Easy mod for what I'm sure will be major braking improvements. Hope to get the LS1 in the car by Tuesday at the latest. Maybe running by next weekend.

UnstableAviator

My LS1 for the swap only had 52,000 miles on it, so it really wasn't a greasy, corroded engine like several others I've seen. It still needed some cleaning, and after experimenting with several methods like carb cleaner, wire wheels, brushes, etc, I discovered 3M Scotchbrite pads worked better than anything. After scraping off the thick grime with a screwdriver and using a couple cans of carb cleaner, I waited for everything to dry and started scrubbing with the scotchbrite. I never expected it to turn out this nice. Its not "show quality" but for the average joe hot-rodder I think its pretty dang good.



My uncle bolting up the Monster Stage 2 clutch. I used the lightweight, 18lb flywheel. More fun on the street I figure.



Afterwards we attached the T56 and got it on the engine hoist. The plan was to install from the top. I did notch the crossmember, so I was hoping that was gonna be enough to make it work.


The notch. I welded in a nice heavy piece of 1/8" steel.

UnstableAviator

We had to remove the hood, which I'd recommend anyway since it just makes everything easier working in the engine bay. The engine install was straightforward and fairly easy, but without the leveler and frame notch I'm not sure it would even be possible. The motor mounts and stock LS1 engine mounts lined up with very little hassle, which was a welcome surprise.



I wish I would have taken some pics of the header install, but these were much, much easier to install than the previous Hooker 2210's I'd been running for several years and a bunch of engine installations. The driver side required removal of the steering shaft, and spark plugs, and went right in from the top. Same for the passenger side, no fuss from the top with the coils removed. Starter access is ridiculously easy, also a welcome change from the 2210's.

UnstableAviator

Like just about every other swapper with a crossmember mounted torque arm, I can't believe nobody has stepped up to the plate and made a good double hump unit. I copied someone else' idea and combined a Hawk's crossmember and my old Spohn unit into one.

Chopping the old $100+ dollar crossmember...thankfully owning it for 5 years lessens the pain of cutting a nice part.


After a quick test fit, it was time to weld. This thing is so easy to make any caveman with a chop saw and a welder could do it. Just slightly enlarge the Spohn center hole for the larger LS1 trans mount, bolt it all up, and you'll see it come together quickly. Its worth mentioning the Hawk's piece didn't bolt right in, I had to slightly enlarge one of the frame bolt holes to get it right. No big deal...and partially expected since bolt in parts never are.


I cut and added a brace to help things out. I think it'll be plenty strong for the stock LS1, I looked over my frame good and it seems crack-free and the Hawk's piece has a bigger "saddle" over the frame rails than the Spohn unit.

88blackiroc

iTrader: (1)

Looking very good and clean!!! Nice to know the headers went in without much trouble, can't wait til I get some now!

cprmn14

iTrader: (3)

Very nice job on the crossmember, makes me feel alittle better about attempting to fab my own. Love that torque arm too btw.

Looking good!

UnstableAviator

I picked up my turned down hubs for the LS1 front brakes, the machine shop did a real nice job. I picked up some longer wheel studs from Autozone since the stockers didn't really look up to the task. I'll get more pics of the brake work next time I'm in Ohio.


For the wiring, rather than connect to the 26 year old wiring in the car we decided to build our own fuse/relay panel. My uncle (years of experience in this sort of thing) fabbed it up and did a real nice job. One toggle switch in the car turns on the master relay which powers up the rest of the circuits. Easy to get to, easy to troubleshoot, and plus it looks cool. We just need to make a nice cover for it now to keep it dry, for those rainy Power Tour days.

UnstableAviator

I'm reusing my Griffin radiator, so I decided to get the hoses other people recommended here in the sticky. I ended up using a 3.4 Camaro upper hose, which required some trimming, probably due to the Griffin's further tilt towards the back.

The lower hose is a Dayco 71321, which after trimming both ends it fit perfect. Seriously, I don't know that a better hose could be designed for my particular vehicle.


For the steam line, a local shop welded a piece of aluminum fuel line to the radiator, so it was just bent to fit and a small piece of 5/16 rubber line was used to connect to the engine. After looking at the pictures, I'm not happy with it so I'll probably cut the line closer and use a piece of braided hose for a cleaner look.

I order the B87629 hose for the heater loop, but Autozone didn't get it in time for me to pick it up. Too bad, its the last thing I need to seal up the cooling system and fill with coolant. The hose it a small 180 degree bend with 5/8 on one side and 3/4 on the other.

UnstableAviator

It was time to get out the laptop and OBDCOM software and see how things checked out. Other than having some puzzling issues with the ALDL grounds the software connected and everything on the engine seemed to work. It was the first real test of the wiring since checking continuity on a bench just doesn't give the same satisfaction as watching real-time TPS, IAT, etc data.


I put together the 04 GTO cold air intake and sure enough, it did seem to fit well and looks good. There's some contact with the upper radiator hose, and I need a small piece of intake pipe to put the filter further into the corner. Overall, not a bad fit!

UnstableAviator

Its running, and running well. Still no coolant, so only running for very short periods of time. Great oil pressure, engine runs very smooth. It definately sounds like a stock motor through open headers, definately not what I'm used to coming from Gen 1 SBC hot rods.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EpAyEH0A8cI

I felt the same sense of accomplishment getting this engine running as I did when I finished a half marathon. Thats why we do it I guess, its definately not for breaking parts at the track or being frustrated at an inexplicable problem.

We'll see how she runs on the highway later on, I've still got a lots of work to do. Double check all the driveline bolts, get the front LS1 brake swap complete, and make certain all lines and hoses are secure, fix a power steering leak, hookup tach, etc etc.

6 months ago I didn't think I could do this swap, but thanks to this forum, the search function, and the sticky it actually turned out to be a challenging but very rewarding swap.

dprest68

iTrader: (1)

Awesome man! Sounds good. Are you trying to make me jealous!?!

HP52TA

iTrader: (4)

Congrats man! Sounds great.

Nice job on your x-member too. Going to keep that idea in mind for a future upgrade.

UnstableAviator

Thanks for the compliments everyone. I managed to get a week and a half off work, so we did most of the swap in ten days work. I have a feeling a year from now it'll be coming outta the car again for a head/cam upgrade...

1SICK90RS

looking forward to updates. nice job on the crossmemberl

UnstableAviator

Finished up the LS1 front brakes, the project took just about the entire day including modifying the spindles and bleeding all the brake lines.

The spindles were easy enough to modify, but I had a chop saw (as seen in posts above) and a new drill bit and tap for the 12mm bolts. BigBrakeUpgrade.com brackets, and after I went through the trouble of buying bolts at Lowes I found they were included with the kit.

No shims were required, everything bolted up real nice and looked great. I didn't drill the top hole deep enough, so I had to cut 2 threads off one of my Lowes bolts for it to tighten down.


Here's the beautiful rotors from the donor car. They were rusty, so I hit em with a DA sander til' they looked good enough. Big improvment over the stockers, no doubt.

BTW, new calipers from NAPA. I used my stock rubber lines and the 4th Gen banjo bolt.

UnstableAviator

Here's the finished product engine bay. Well, if a car can ever be finished that is...



I need to order a new coolant resevoir from Hawks, my 1984 vintage tank looks like old newspaper.

I took it for the first drive today, I gotta say I'm impressed. A stock engine with a few bolt-ons has no business running as hard as this one does. No traction in 1st and 2nd, and pulls real nice in 3rd and 4th. I've seen a lot of built small blocks that won't run how this one does stock internal with a couple of bolt ons. Its absolutely nothing like a stock LS1 f-body, thats for sure. Gears, headers, lightweight flywheel/clutch, intake, and thats it. I'm more than satisfied with the horsepower for now.

89rs454

Looks great man! I hear you on the power increase over the run of the mill sbc even my stock lt1 puts bolt on 1st gen sbc to shame.

UnstableAviator

Got the exhaust put on today, turned out real nice. 3" from the collector to the y-pipe, with a 4" outlet, reduced to single 3", cutout, and then the rest of the Flowmaster "cat-back" system. Sounds great, no rattles or weird y-pipe induced rasp, just a clean sound. I totally ripped off Ghettocruisers setup, so much so I showed my exhaust guy pics from this board posted in his "2nd attempt" thread.

The Flowmaster y-pipe was bought on Ebay, its a dual 3" in and 4" outlet.




I'll get some more pics of my cutout after I get it wired and operating. Right now its just bolted on closed and keeping things nice and quiet. Obviously the cutout isn't installed in this pic. Or at least I hope that's obvious.



After driving it about 50 miles today, no ground clearance issues yet. Its easily the best setup I've had on the car, I'm 100% pleased.

dprest68

iTrader: (1)

Looks nice! Is it just me or is your rear sway bar sticking down really far in that last pic?

UnstableAviator

I thought the same thing about the rear sway. Its an oddball setup, Ford 9" with 3.25" axle tubes, 24mm sway bar, Spohn mounting kit. With weight on the car, the ends are mostly parallel with the ground and everything looks a lot more normal. In the pic the rear is at full droop.

HP52TA

iTrader: (4)

I am suprised you didn't get those rotors turned before installing them with the new pads and calipers. Pretty minimal cost to get new brake performance.

Awesome job on that Y-pipe. Looks to have excellent clearance. I may copy that too Thanks for posting the pics.

Jaysz28

iTrader: (30)

great job on that y-pipe and x-member.........

looks like a clean solid swap to me

ghettocruiser

iTrader: (4)

Glad to see my y-pipe/exhaust set up has inspired some other folks I really loved my set up. Ground clearance was awesome and it seemed to flow like mad. Best part was, you could really put any catback you wanted on it...with just some slight mods to the catback itself vs. messing with the y-pipe.

Your swap is looking great! I like how methodical youve been and how cleanly its all turning out for you. You're going to love that car when you get it out on the road!!!

J.

UnstableAviator

HP52TA - I took the rotors to get them turned, the shop wouldn't do it. Said something about the softer material of perfomance rotors...it didn't make much sense to me. Doesn't matter, they work great and are nice and shiny now after some driving.

Ghettocruiser - Not inspired, but 100% ripped off! The car is on the road, and its a blast to drive. Nobody told me a free-breathing stock LS1 and 4.11's would have the amazing throttle response and torque. Its the most fun motor to drive I've ever had in the car, and everyone else who has driven it loves it too. I'm a GEN III man for good now, I don't think I'll miss the old SBC stuff at all...

HP52TA

iTrader: (4)

I have never heard that before either. Only time they wouldn't turn them for me was when they were already too thin. Glad to hear they are working well for you.

Tried my SBC Y-pipe today and she is not even close to fitting, so there will be one more ripped off. LOL. Thanks Ghetto!

Your road reports are getting me all excited to get mine finished.

Pocket

iTrader: (24)

Most places only turn blank rotors because the holes and slots are murder on the cutting bit