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Old 04-28-2012, 01:38 PM   #1
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Lq4 has a date with the dyno

Im all excited and hoping to make decent power on monday when I go for a dyno tune.So far the car feels sluggish on the bottom end and gas mileage is poor in the city.Ive never had a car dyno tuned before so this will be weird watching someone else pound on my car even though its on rollers lol.

Anyone care to take guesses on my numbers after a tune.Id be happy getting anything over 340rwhp and tq.Mods in sig.
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Lq4, Tsp 228R cam kit, .030 milled 243 heads, Potz p/p throttle body, ls6 intake, 4 cai, ls2 85mm maf, granatelli solid core plug wires, stock t56, 1 5/8 longtube swap headers and 3 inch y pipe,Qtp 3 inch cutout, Magnaflow 3" lt1 catback exhaust, Eibach sportline lowering springs, TDS Wonderbar, stock 3.23 gear

400whp/400tq

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Old 04-29-2012, 11:21 AM   #2
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Re: Lq4 has a date with the dyno

380/360.... 10 bolt will be your friend on the dyno
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Old 04-29-2012, 05:54 PM   #3
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Re: Lq4 has a date with the dyno

Thats higher than I was expecting for the mods I have.Ill be sure to post tomorrow after the run.Im hoping for some decent numbers but Im really after making it more efficient and getting the best performance out of it overall..not just peak.
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400whp/400tq

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Old 04-30-2012, 01:04 PM   #4
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Re: Lq4 has a date with the dyno

So I return with some small issues restricting my car from making more power but my tuner had alot of advice.Car made 310rwhp and 330rwtq. Baseline pull was 290rwhp and 310rwtq.

So we spotted issues that I need to address.My beautiful looking msd wires are miss firing like mad (especially 1/6 cylinders)and Im in need of fresh NGK plugs aswell.My o2 sensors need to be replaced as they are reading too slow and in accurate.My driver side o2 being the worst and not reading anything untill the motor is above operating temperature.

A/F was bang on 13.0 across the board and tq was consistent 300+ from 2500-5500rpm.Pulls were made upto 6600rpm.Tuner said this setup is in desperate need of headers and either mill the heads or change to 243 heads and the rwhp will drastically wake up.I was expecting around 320rwhp and Im sure I can get that just fixing my o2 and spark problems alone.For now Im just super happy with the driveability and having torque down low again.Video will be up shortly and Ill repost my results when I go back for a tune after I iron things out.
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Lq4, Tsp 228R cam kit, .030 milled 243 heads, Potz p/p throttle body, ls6 intake, 4 cai, ls2 85mm maf, granatelli solid core plug wires, stock t56, 1 5/8 longtube swap headers and 3 inch y pipe,Qtp 3 inch cutout, Magnaflow 3" lt1 catback exhaust, Eibach sportline lowering springs, TDS Wonderbar, stock 3.23 gear

400whp/400tq

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Old 04-30-2012, 01:31 PM   #5
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Re: Lq4 has a date with the dyno

Heres one of the pulls,missed the final pull..cam messed up.

http://youtu.be/BFGDXRagekQ
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400whp/400tq

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Old 04-30-2012, 01:35 PM   #6
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Re: Lq4 has a date with the dyno

What kind of dyno?
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Old 04-30-2012, 01:36 PM   #7
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Re: Lq4 has a date with the dyno

Dynojet,numbers are low but given the issues I know theres alot more in it once I work them out.
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Old 04-30-2012, 01:44 PM   #8
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Re: Lq4 has a date with the dyno

headers alone will make a huge difference, you need to let that 6.0L breathe!

243's would be good down the road too, but then that puts you into 91+ for octane rating......

glad to hear you have found a couple of issues that are easily repaired.
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Old 04-30-2012, 01:58 PM   #9
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Re: Lq4 has a date with the dyno

I would run 91+ anyways. Mine getd frustrated if i run anything but premium.

Headers will definitely add a lot. I bet youre closer to 360-375 after your issues are sorted out.
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Old 04-30-2012, 02:00 PM   #10
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Re: Lq4 has a date with the dyno

Yeah I agree.I always run 94 octane in it as it sits.This dyno is a heart breaker aswell.Stock ls1's make only 250rwhp so Im not sweating my results and my issues are very minor.Im already pricing those nice Hussler longtube headers,I think I need to run a full 4inch intake piping and 4inch cone filter instead of my 3inch stepped up to the ls2 maf.

My tq curve is very nice and flat which was my goal aswell...I like torquey motors over peak hp.
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400whp/400tq

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Old 04-30-2012, 02:11 PM   #11
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Re: Lq4 has a date with the dyno

torque is definitely more fun on the street, its more enjoyable for me to blow somebody's doors off from a slow roll while "cruising"(haha, about my only option, due in part to my low traction mod...lsx). my car is a dedicated "fun car" so it never sees lower octane. i love my husler mid-tubes, for the money(purchased through brp), there isn't a better score out there.
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Old 04-30-2012, 02:21 PM   #12
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Re: Lq4 has a date with the dyno

I wasnt aware how bad msd stuff has a bad rep on lsx motors I know my stock manifolds are big choke..aswell as my dual 2.5 catted y pipe to 3inch catback magnaflow.Im just scared of big longtube headers with my car lowered 2 inches already :S I dont scrape much and take speed bumps at decent speeds still lol
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Lq4, Tsp 228R cam kit, .030 milled 243 heads, Potz p/p throttle body, ls6 intake, 4 cai, ls2 85mm maf, granatelli solid core plug wires, stock t56, 1 5/8 longtube swap headers and 3 inch y pipe,Qtp 3 inch cutout, Magnaflow 3" lt1 catback exhaust, Eibach sportline lowering springs, TDS Wonderbar, stock 3.23 gear

400whp/400tq

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Old 04-30-2012, 07:16 PM   #13
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Re: Lq4 has a date with the dyno

Mine is lowered and the only thig that scrapes is a small section of my y pipe...
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Old 04-30-2012, 07:21 PM   #14
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Re: Lq4 has a date with the dyno

I think this is the point where the sick n twisted part kicks in.After that dyno session I want to hit that target rwhp..and that requires more mods.I wanted a fun lil street car and this is one..but this isnt going to end is it fellas? Lol
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400whp/400tq

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Old 04-30-2012, 08:12 PM   #15
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Re: Lq4 has a date with the dyno

Our only differances are headers and a tad bigger cam I think and higher compression with the 243 Heads. My dynojet numbers are below. I gained close to 45 RWHP with a cutout after the Y . We got that by accident as I couldnt get past that 380ish and my timeing was only at 22-23 Total before we had knock. The I pipe fell off and we made another pull for giggles and was rewarded with MUCH more power and zero knock. I have an appointment in a few weeks at my buddys shop to add more timing to around 27 total and increase my HP. I find my numbers are very high for a somewhat stock GM motor. My Cam is a TrickFlow 228/232 585/585 112 Mild but Hauls. I've since ditched my resonator and Edelbrock catback for a QTP cutout and GMMG exhaust.
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Old 04-30-2012, 08:25 PM   #16
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Re: Lq4 has a date with the dyno

My timing is around 29* total.We had no knock.I gained 1hp going from 27* to 29*.Your numbers do seem quite high but even still its impressive none the less.I just love the sound of my magnaflow muffler so I think 1 7/8 long tubes and 3 inch y pipe should net me 20hp to be safe.Fixing my plugs and wires 5-10hp at best,milling or head swap maybe another 15hp and I should be over the 350rwhp easy.If that doesnt work...I got a 10lbs baby bottle I might have to put in use lol.
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Old 04-30-2012, 08:56 PM   #17
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Re: Lq4 has a date with the dyno

I love my Magnaflow bullet muffler, sounds so sick haha. And ya you have the bug now, it is all down hill from here!

My numbers are in my sig. On a dynojet -stock cube 6.0, 239/242. 64x/.64x 111, LS6 intake, dtock TB....that was with the "small" Hawks headers with the 1 5/8 primaries...havent dynod.it wih the bigger headers yet.
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Old 05-01-2012, 09:15 AM   #18
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Re: Lq4 has a date with the dyno

http://youtu.be/FZ4JQ3LueHI

Another video of the same dyno run in car.
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Old 05-01-2012, 11:32 AM   #19
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Re: Lq4 has a date with the dyno

I have the 1 3/4 headers with the only the 2.5 collectors. I couldnt imagine 3in with an auto trans. I had to trim alot of the shift bracket to fit a pipe in there.
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Old 05-02-2012, 07:29 AM   #20
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Re: Lq4 has a date with the dyno

Quote:
Originally Posted by 86White_T/A305 View Post
Yeah I agree.I always run 94 octane in it as it sits.This dyno is a heart breaker aswell.Stock ls1's make only 250rwhp so Im not sweating my results and my issues are very minor.Im already pricing those nice Hussler longtube headers,I think I need to run a full 4inch intake piping and 4inch cone filter instead of my 3inch stepped up to the ls2 maf.

My tq curve is very nice and flat which was my goal aswell...I like torquey motors over peak hp.
This isnt true. LS1's are extremely underrated from the factory. The "crappy" 97-98 LS1's "only" made what, 305hp? But they put that down at the wheels.

Auto cars dyno lower numbers then 6-speed cars do. My buddies 100% factory stock, 2000 Trans Am 6-speed put down 311rwhp and 330rwtq before ANY mods.

Hell, my LT1 in my car now put down 347rwhp and 341rwtq with only Long tube headers and a 218/224 off the shelf SBC roller cam.

If you're using at least stock 6.0L manifolds, they're not to bad and although your plugs and wires need to be replaced I think something else is up, otherwise your car really does need some help to breathe my friend.

Sounds and looks wicked though! Where in Ontario are you?
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Old 05-02-2012, 08:08 AM   #21
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Re: Lq4 has a date with the dyno

Im in Scarborough.And from what Ive seen repeatedly on that specific dyno stock ls1 cars were making 250-260rwhp.Lq4's supposedly make around 320hp at the fly if I remember correctly.So I wasnt expecting huge numbers and my mods arent big..just cam and springs and the ls6 intake.

I know for sure now I need new plugs,wires,o2 sensors are pretty much shot,might need a few new coils and Ive started to hear my muffler baffle rattle and quite possible both cats are plugged up from my previous ls1 when it had massive blowby spewing raw oil out the back.

Im leaning more on the exhaust being my major power culprit..the other issues will help some but we will know for sure once I get that checklist taken care of.Im going to fix the plugs wires and o2's next week and go for a driveability tune again and make sure Im getting o2 swings ..make sure the random miss fires are gone.If it doesnt have a drastic improvement from that then I know for sure the exhaust has to go.

Car was dynoed at Champion motors,Rob heavily stressed my car isnt exhaling and the o2 being decent one side and really messed up on the other isnt helping.Otherwise everything else checks out 100%
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400whp/400tq

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Old 05-02-2012, 08:11 AM   #22
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Re: Lq4 has a date with the dyno

Oh forgot to say Im using stock 00 ls1 manifolds..not the 6.0 going to a 2.5inch dual catted y pipe and then opens to my old 3inch magnaflow catback.My magnaflow has been on there almost 7yrs.It might be time to replace it aswell..who knows lol.
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400whp/400tq

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Old 05-02-2012, 08:53 AM   #23
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Re: Lq4 has a date with the dyno

I dont think the O2's have anything to do with it at all. I tuned my car without 02's and then turned them on when I was finished.
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Old 05-02-2012, 09:52 AM   #24
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Re: Lq4 has a date with the dyno

Quote:
Originally Posted by 86White_T/A305 View Post
Oh forgot to say Im using stock 00 ls1 manifolds..not the 6.0 going to a 2.5inch dual catted y pipe and then opens to my old 3inch magnaflow catback.My magnaflow has been on there almost 7yrs.It might be time to replace it aswell..who knows lol.
Your magnaflow isn't holding you back. I have less motor then you do and I made more HP & TQ thru my 4th gen maganflow catback with dual 2.5" to 3" custom Y pipe then you did with the cammed 6.0L.

Yes, 243 heads will make more power then the 317's you have now stock for stock, but then you will HAVE to run higher octane fuel, for what, maybe 10-15hp?

I've heard from more then a few people that Champions dyno isn't calibrated correctly and that it consistently puts out lower then average HP numbers.

I say this because im sorry, but 250-260rwhp from ANY LS1, is terrible. Even STOCK, automatic LS1's should put AT LEAST 280rwhp down. 250-260 is LT1 territory through an auto.


Like the last person said, O2's shouldnt affect anything but will help with mileage and a bit of drive-ability, but not WOT pulls. Get a wideband on there if you really wanna know how close/safe your tune is.

Your stock manifolds are definitely holding you back, get some headers on there ASAP. All the other small things you can take care of fairly easily (plugs, wires, o2's, etc).

I'd love to see this car sometime
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Old 05-02-2012, 10:39 AM   #25
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Re: Lq4 has a date with the dyno

The a/f was perfect on the wideband so Im not worried about the new tune.Its running perfectly on the graph.Im not able to post it as I only have the printed copy.I think the headers are the biggest drawback..nothing I wasnt already expecting so Im not disappointed.I always run ultra 94 as it is so later on in fall I will mill the heads down instead of doing a head swap.Theres lots more left in this setup...I can taste it lol.

Anytime you want to check it out I am down! Not many lsx thirdgens around here to cruise with or pick on unsuspecting drivers.
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400whp/400tq

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Old 05-02-2012, 10:45 AM   #26
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Re: Lq4 has a date with the dyno

Plus on a side note..I know that dyno reads low so if I hit over 330rwhp I know its north of 360 so i want to reuse that same dyno after I get things fixed up so that i see improvements.
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Old 05-03-2012, 03:07 PM   #27
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Re: Lq4 has a date with the dyno

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Originally Posted by Z28 MeTaL HeAd View Post
I've heard from more then a few people that Champions dyno isn't calibrated correctly and that it consistently puts out lower then average HP numbers.
none of that matters if you do your pulls on the same dyno everytime. then you are able to judge your improvements accurately.

he's not building a dyno queen, just a fun street car, so actual numbers are less important, than hard gains made by modifications.
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Old 05-03-2012, 11:32 PM   #28
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Re: Lq4 has a date with the dyno

I was a dyno rat with my race cars (see side bar). Many runs.
Watching those videos, can't help but think just plugs and wires should do something. The car just does not seem to run clean up top.
On the other hand, LOOK at that torque. It's not a curve, it is a plateau. Nice numbers from as soon as the dyno starts recording.
I'm not up on head casting numbers, but seems to me truck heads and the 228 cam might be at cross purposes. Isn't the reason for running higher CRs so you can make HP? Even with long tubes, top end efficiency will be down with the lower cr- it will breathe better, but still not have that pop.
Now I can't wait to see what I will get with the same exhaust, less cam, and a C5 engine- albeit the early one. But it will still be a while, sorry.
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Old 05-04-2012, 11:21 AM   #29
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Re: Lq4 has a date with the dyno

I love the torque..starts strong and ends strong ..most pleasing on the streets i assure you.the low compression and having the cam isnt building hp...so this year im going to keep my mods simple and redo the exhaust..and mill the heads..bring the compression upto 10.4 or so and i should see marginal gains.Im not worried about getting this combo over 350rwhp from just that alone.
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Old 05-15-2012, 03:09 PM   #30
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Re: Lq4 has a date with the dyno

So for an update on my situation Im slowly fixing things and seeing how the motor responds to change.First I switched to tr6 plugs as my tuner and noticed a much better idle,mileage and increase in power.Next was changing my msd plug wires to oem and had a positive response to that aswell and my random miss fire went away.

I checked the o2's and they are both in need of replacements and my cats are both clogged from my ls1 the had blown cylinders and oiled my entire exhaust.So from here my next upgrade is longtube and y pipe..maybe a 3" cutout or highflow cat after the Y.Once this is done I want to re-dyno and make sure the tune is still accurate for what the motor wants and see how much it puts down.Then last will be head work either milling the 317's or switch to 243's and port n polish and call it a day for a 400hp cruiser.
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Old 05-15-2012, 07:41 PM   #31
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Re: Lq4 has a date with the dyno

Another thing about what I could see of the dyno chart; the HP and Torque aren't doing a dive above 5000. That would make me think the cam is working, and the exhaust manifolds aren't blocking things up. On the other hand, things are not taking off and singing, so the manifolds aren't a big plus, either.
Love to see what updates so far have done. Oh well, dyno time doesn't grow on trees.
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Old 05-15-2012, 09:47 PM   #32
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Re: Lq4 has a date with the dyno

No sadly dyno time doesnt grow on trees but my friend works at the shop and is the dyno operator so I get a good deal on it.Heres another strike against me I found out tonight.I started getting a rattle sound in the exhaust..wasnt sure if it was from my muffler or something.Lift the car up and there is a line across the underbelly parallel to my rear end My poor 7.5 is on its merry way out lol,I gotta take it easy on the rear.Other than that I got no other problems suggesting to be down on power unless my rear brakes are slightly dragging lol,car shows to be running great on a wide band.Time will tell..just going to take more money to figure it out lol,I will find the answer whether its exhaust or low compression or mis calibrated dyno .....someother factor not yet revealed.It drives better than what the dyno says.
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Old 06-16-2012, 02:09 PM   #33
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Re: Lq4 has a date with the dyno

*Update* So sadly Ive been laid off work which is going to put things on hold for now but I did some upgrades and went to a dyno day at another shop for some fun.

So to recap I have changed to tr6 spark plugs,I replaced both o2 sensors,and just changed to solid core Granatelli spark plug wires.The spark plugs wires over my msd's missfiring soo much on the topend even with my clogged cats still on the car I went from 310hp/330 to a whopping 352hp/368tq at the wheels on stock manifolds. Now I think a slight retune is in order since its running a bit rich.Its now the animal I expected it to be.
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Old 06-16-2012, 07:23 PM   #34
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Re: Lq4 has a date with the dyno

DRAG about work.
Great, the gain from just cleaning things up in the ignition- 42HP & 38 ft pounds!
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Old 06-16-2012, 09:18 PM   #35
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Re: Lq4 has a date with the dyno

The second I started the car with the new wires and didnt hear arching and gained throttle response i knew she was a happy motor now.

I almost bought the new Hawks headers to make up that kind of hp gain,its a good thing I held off last week.It will be awhile Before I can confidently keep modding further into the car.Those numbers will keep me happy for now with the stock manifolds on there
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Old 06-17-2012, 07:39 AM   #36
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Re: Lq4 has a date with the dyno

Even more impressive when considering those numbers were generated through 3.23 gears.

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Old 06-17-2012, 10:38 AM   #37
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Re: Lq4 has a date with the dyno

Maybe I missed it, but were the MSD wires new or used?
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Old 06-17-2012, 11:07 AM   #38
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Re: Lq4 has a date with the dyno

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Even more impressive when considering those numbers were generated through 3.23 gears.

M
Actually, the modest gearing helps. Swap in some 4.56:1 gears, NO other changes, the dyno results would suffer enough to measure.
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Old 06-17-2012, 12:41 PM   #39
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Re: Lq4 has a date with the dyno

My msd wires were re-used from my previous ls1 motor.The wires were 1yr old and only been taking off the motor twice.
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Old 06-18-2012, 08:35 AM   #40
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Re: Lq4 has a date with the dyno

glad to see you got things ironed out, bummer about the job though. a tune and some headers, when you've got the cash, should net you a nice gain.
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