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I'm trying to put in a line lock because the rolling burnouts are not getting the tires hot enough as I want. I'm running the stock proportioning block but it doesn't block off the front from the rear brakes? When I had the front brake line loose from the block, I barely tapped the brakes and it shot a bubble out the hole where the line goes. Maybe my block is messed up? I would like the keep the factory fittings on the brake lines cause there isn't enough room left to reflare it. anyone running the factory proportioning block with a line lock? I can post pics if needed.
I already have the solinoid plumbed in between the master cylinder and the proportioning block. It doesnt lock the front brakes because the block doesnt seperate the rear from the front. Just wondering if my block is messed up.
Exactly. I did both the Camaro and the '57 that way. You have to plug off one of the combo valve outlets, have the other one go to the line lock inlet, then an outlet to each front wheel. No problems with either car with it set up that way.
I already have the solinoid plumbed in between the master cylinder and the proportioning block. It doesnt lock the front brakes because the block doesnt seperate the rear from the front. Just wondering if my block is messed up.
I have a 3rd gen pp valve and master cyclinder on my Grand Am and have it plummed like you and it works great. Does your front brakes work? I allso plummed my sons 96 bird like that, using a 3rd gen pp valve. I did have a hard time getting all of the air out off the 96 bird.
After looking at mine, its been gutted out with a plug on the front of it. I have one from another camaro I'm going to put on it tomorrow and see if that helps. The front and rear brakes work good as of now.
I'm trying to put in a line lock because the rolling burnouts are not getting the tires hot enough as I want. I'm running the stock proportioning block but it doesn't block off the front from the rear brakes? When I had the front brake line loose from the block, I barely tapped the brakes and it shot a bubble out the hole where the line goes. Maybe my block is messed up? I would like the keep the factory fittings on the brake lines cause there isn't enough room left to reflare it. anyone running the factory proportioning block with a line lock? I can post pics if needed.
I originally installed mine this way. NEVER held no matter how many times I pumped the pedal. Only way I have seen it work (myself) like this is to block off the line to the rear brakes. You still hold the pedal during burnouts, the LL just keeps pressure from reaching the rear lines. Works great on auto cars (have 3 friends run theirs that way) but mine being stick I redid the routing like...
Quote:
Originally Posted by five7kid
You have to plug off one of the combo valve outlets, have the other one go to the line lock inlet, then an outlet to each front wheel.
Well I put on a new proprtioning block off an another junk yard camaro and it works like a champ now. Took mine apart and it didnt have any of the springs or anything inside it. I'll try it out at the track tomorrow night and see how it does.
Seriously consider getting rid of the PV all together. Normally guys gut it, like yours was to get alot better braking/stopping power. When i changed all my brake system stuff over i eleiminated it all together and the difference in stopping power was day and night.
One more thing to think about also, esspecially since your drag racing and have the typical tire configuration, you WANT more brake in the rear due to having in most cases at least 2x-3x's the rubber contact on the pavement as you do with the tiny front tires most of us run....there simply is'nt enough friction to the pavement with skinny front tires to do any real braking without locking up/sliding which is dangerious as we know. Just think, all diggers have only rear brakes and they stop/slow down just fine, so you losing a touch of front bias for a more equaled brake effect will be worth while for ya. I'm actually going to be adding a second set of calipers to the rear of my set up since i plan to up the mph a bit and want to be assured i have ample braking ability without a bunch of fuss.
Seriously consider getting rid of the PV all together. Normally guys gut it, like yours was to get alot better braking/stopping power. When i changed all my brake system stuff over i eleiminated it all together and the difference in stopping power was day and night.
One more thing to think about also, esspecially since your drag racing and have the typical tire configuration, you WANT more brake in the rear due to having in most cases at least 2x-3x's the rubber contact on the pavement as you do with the tiny front tires most of us run....there simply is'nt enough friction to the pavement with skinny front tires to do any real braking without locking up/sliding which is dangerious as we know. Just think, all diggers have only rear brakes and they stop/slow down just fine, so you losing a touch of front bias for a more equaled brake effect will be worth while for ya. I'm actually going to be adding a second set of calipers to the rear of my set up since i plan to up the mph a bit and want to be assured i have ample braking ability without a bunch of fuss.
I'll get a good adjustable proportioning block if I ever decide to go faster. I only run the 1/8th mile 7.00 index pro tree racing. I'll hit 101mph sometimes so it's pretty easy to get stopped even on the short shut down tracks @ 3200lbs. It has a pretty decent bias now, with the front being just a little stronger than the rear.
I'll get a good adjustable proportioning block if I ever decide to go faster. I only run the 1/8th mile 7.00 index pro tree racing. I'll hit 101mph sometimes so it's pretty easy to get stopped even on the short shut down tracks @ 3200lbs. It has a pretty decent bias now, with the front being just a little stronger than the rear.
Dont even waste your money on one, i bought one just in case, plumbed it in, and the dang thing is cranked wide open....huge waste of money.
For a street/strip car, an adjustable prop valve can be useful, but it can get you into trouble too. I use mine to dial the rear brakes up at the strip, where conditions are somewhat controlled, and dial them down to a safe level for the trip home. If i get caught in the rain, i can dial them all the way down.
With an adjustable prop valve comes great responsibility. Too much rear brake can be very dangerous. Always be ready. A panic stop w/ gravel on the road could be just around the corner. It's why the OEM's always seem to have too much front brake. The cars they sell have to be safe in poor conditions too.
For a street/strip car, an adjustable prop valve can be useful, but it can get you into trouble too. I use mine to dial the rear brakes up at the strip, where conditions are somewhat controlled, and dial them down to a safe level for the trip home. If i get caught in the rain, i can dial them all the way down.
With an adjustable prop valve comes great responsibility. Too much rear brake can be very dangerous. Always be ready. A panic stop w/ gravel on the road could be just around the corner. It's why the OEM's always seem to have too much front brake. The cars they sell have to be safe in poor conditions too.
granny
totally agree with you 100%, but the orignal poster only uses his car on the track, and it's trailered there, so i don't know if it applies necessarily.
Just wanted that info there for someone doing a search on installing a linelock. There's a lot of monkey-see/monkey-do out there, especially when it's a no-buck mod like gutting a prop valve. My point is, if you have plates on your car, I feel an adjustable is NOT a waste of money, much safer than gutting the valve.
I don't know if IHI's car is street driven, but his avtar does have plates.
Just wanted that info there for someone doing a search on installing a linelock. There's a lot of monkey-see/monkey-do out there, especially when it's a no-buck mod like gutting a prop valve. My point is, if you have plates on your car, I feel an adjustable is NOT a waste of money, much safer than gutting the valve.
I don't know if IHI's car is street driven, but his avtar does have plates.
granny
It is and has been street driven since purchased, been on many cruises again this year...and i'm tellin ya, the factory prop valve does'nt do a heck of alot. What the first thing guys did, tell other guys to do when they go from a disc/drum set up to a disc disc set up???.....gut the prop valve and you'll get better braking since the calipers require more clamping psi than the old junk drum set up's.
Originally when i swapped to a rear disc set up i gutted mine and was blown away at the stopping power increase. When i really changed things over with upgrades and replumbed everything, i did install the adjustible prop valve, and guess what, i cranked it wide open for the inital test drive. Got'r upto speed on the interstate, not 120+mph, but fast enough and laid into the brake pedal like no tomorrow..guess what, instant safe stopping power. I've logged thousands of passes standing on the brake pedal at the stripe going over 120mph, have locked the fronts up more than once unintentionally, guess what fronts locked, rears did'nt, car still stopped/slowed straight as a string.
What i'm getting at is that the optimum stopping bias on dry pavement in a straight line is much different than optimum safe bias for stopping in a curve on a wet public hiway w/ big fat low-void tires on the rear. If you drive on the hiway, you are not always in control of the conditions.
What i'm getting at is that the optimum stopping bias on dry pavement in a straight line is much different than optimum safe bias for stopping in a curve on a wet public hiway w/ big fat low-void tires on the rear. If you drive on the hiway, you are not always in control of the conditions.
granny
Dont want to get into a debate since it'll go nowhere, but it all boils down the driver. So long as you drive within your cars ability you will be fine.
When i went with 90/10 struts, it says not for street use, it took me some time to readjust my driving habit
When i went with a full locker it took me some time to readjust my driving habits
When i went to manual steering, i had to readjust since steering took more turns lock to lock and the car did'nt respond as fast as it did with the quick ratio box and pwr steering
When i bought my first (and only type of tires since) set of slicks to run out back, i had to readjust my driving habits
When i went to a TH400 with reverse manual valve body with the Tbrake i had to readjust my driving habits since the car no longer has engine braking/compression braking
Could i go out and hang through a road course with a stock F body of my generation-nope, when it comes to twisties, but i promise i'd blow it away going straight....it all just boils down to readjusting how you drive and it's that simple. Do i still drive the **** out of it ont he road-yep, am i concious of what my car can and cant do-yep, so you just prepare yourself to stay away from those situations...if i know it's going to rain, i know i'm not driving my car, i gambled on rain ONCE, and in town it sucked, interstate was fine...
You sound like a guy that has not fully experienced having too much rear brake
I agree that it does boil down to the driver. He has to recognize that stopping fantastic w/ hot sticky slicks in a straight line is much different than driving home at night on possible damp roads w/ cold tires. If you don't have the adjustable valve in your S/S car for at least that possibility, then i guess yours is a huge waste of money.
You sound like a guy that has not fully experienced having too much rear brake
I agree that it does boil down to the driver. He has to recognize that stopping fantastic w/ hot sticky slicks in a straight line is much different than driving home at night on possible damp roads w/ cold tires. If you don't have the adjustable valve in your S/S car for at least that possibility, then i guess yours is a huge waste of money.
granny
Granny- look at my sig/car...does that look like something i take out and drive in anything but nice weather?? I've never seen streets get dewey/damp in the spring/summer/fall unless it rained, and i dont take my car out in the rain or after a rain until the roads dry up
I live on the wet side of WA state, and typically drive 85mi to the track and another 85mi home. If i waited for guaranteed nice weather, i'd miss half of the shows.
I live on the wet side of WA state, and typically drive 85mi to the track and another 85mi home. If i waited for guaranteed nice weather, i'd miss half of the shows.
I don't need no stinkin' trailer...
granny
You dont think you need a stink'n trailer until your 85 miles from home and you car breaks something at the track.
I started with a trailer since you never know when things are going to break, but we go every weekend and have for years so our chances are much better at breaking stuff that a test and tuner. And now with the enclosed, we save ourselves alot of money per season by living in the trailer vs getting hotels at least once a month for out of town races.
Mine's a REAL street car, not a pampered race car w/ plates. Strict diet of common pump gas. I own a trailer, but since i sold the Dirt Late Model, a friend uses it for his sprint car.
Mine's a REAL street car, not a pampered race car w/ plates. Strict diet of common pump gas. I own a trailer, but since i sold the Dirt Late Model, a friend uses it for his sprint car.
I "progressed", but now i'm headed the other way.
granny
LOL, i'll drive tit for tat with ya anytime, my junk is anything but pampered, in fact the track is probably the place it gets less abused since it's smooth instead of driving over heaved/pothole riddled streets. But personally, i like to think about the BIG picture, and i am grounded enough to know if i'm going racing, there's a better possibility of breakage than if i'm just street driving since i'm turning up the wick for 9-13 passes per day for two days straight, I've never lost an engine/tranny on the street, but i damn sure have at the race track, and since i'm kind of a control freak and master of my own destiny, i prefer to be self sufficent, in that i can take car of any and all needs when i go racing for the weekend, I have tools, microwave/coffee pot/fridge/toilet, A/C, air matresses/fans, radiant oil heater (for the spring/falls camping sessions) and the every important winch...just in case. That way i'm not paying hotel fees, not paying wrecker bills to get my stuff home if something breaks/goes wrong and is unfixable at the track.
Maybe someday the rest of us that race every weekend with our cars will be able to build a bullet proof street terror like yours, and not have to worry about having things at our disposal for personal useage, or if there is a racer in need, or a place to let the wife/kids, the kids freinds, wifes freinds/family hang out when the summer sun is beating down..wish i was as cool as you to be able to just sit in the sun all day, or tell everybody that comes out/pits with us to sit in the sun, eat over priced track food/drink over priced track beverages....maybe if we raced as much as you did all over every weekend i'd finally "get it" and go back to driving my junk to the track....which i have on a number of occasions for fun nights/get togethers/organized cruises the locals put together...oh well, someday i'll own a real street car...someday
These are from one of our annual "Steak Cruises" just over an hour on the road there and then back, gravel roads and all thrown in the mix (not fast mind you) then followed up by the parade out to the local cruise spot.
The meeting place
Steak house parking lot
not trying to prove a thing, just wondering what i'm lacking that you think my junk is'nt a real street car that does'nt get driven?? That has been the whole premise behind my car build, build it, and then beat it.
i would drive mine to the track on friday night's also.. and i broke rear ends alot also.(going for a 1.40 60" time). most the time i could limp home with them wining all the way... sound like Bad feedback from the radio.. you could tap out a tune with your gas pedel... then the day came at 105mph when the rear end broke..BOOM!! ya just cant stop right there...lol and lucky for me i have buddys who have trailer's.. WELL it's time i Buy one also...i could not sleep at night thinking my car would spend the Night with out me... that fix was $4500. ( my work ripped me off for $480 Wendle Ford in spokane WA)
they charged me $480 to fix replace the sprag in my 700R4 when the rear end let go it took out my tranny to..took it out 4 times.. they could not get it right..they would not fix it. told me to.. forget it..and i worked for them..
took it to another shop and paid him $400 he fixed it in 1 hr..
Wendle Ford sucks.. sorry back to what i was yammeering about..
the hack at Wendle (Mike abney) ripped the Valbody gasket.and missed it 4 times..lol i took my 2 weeks vacation 3 weeks later and never when back..Hacks...
after this nexed fix $7000 im getting a trailer.. roll back's let you sit for about 30 min some times..LOL. if it's a true street car.. you will have the tow bills to show it.. or it's not FAST!..LOL
HOW ABOUT PHOTOS OF BROKEN PARTS like ring gears sprags torkcoverts. axles..anybody can brake an eng...lol
think of the trailer as a EMT for your Car..
you would want one for you..Right?
after all try walking home with a broken leg!
(another story)tibia and fibia..Duck tape and cardboard is your Buddy!
Last edited by articwhiteZ; 10-14-2009 at 04:11 AM.
Taking your car to the race track on a trailer means it's not a street car you fool, I mean...WhyTF would you wanna be able to take care of yourself in the event of something possibly going wrong??? Jezzus, that's comparible to having a savings account...why not just spend every penny you get when you get it and then deal with any problems that may "just happen" when they happen....thinking ahead, being prepared....waaay over rated
Usually the guys trying to say you dont have a "street car if you cant drive it to the track and back" are "usually" the ones with no truck and no trailer, no place to park one at mommy and daddy's house, and no funds to finance a rig if mommy or daddy did allow them to park one there....just what i've seen round here anyhow...but willing to bet it's the same scenario country wide?? But give it time, if they keep dinking with cars they either-
A. get a truck and get a trailer so when they know they're going to beat the snot out of the car they can get it home without any issues
or
B. they eventually grow out of beating on their cars and move onto other things in life...so it becomes a non issue.
Trailering mine has saved me a handful of times as well as a friend of mine who trailers. I broke 2 push rods some months apart, starter issues and a water pump gasket failure. Friend has had a fuel pump go out, distributor cap and rotor destroyed plus a water pump gasket failure on his too. The one time he did drive his car, he ended up being stranded over night with a broken rocker. We both drive our cars around on the street, he doesn't in the rain though since he has no wipers lol I drive mine rain or shine.
__________________ Best times to date, motor pass: 11.81 @ 114.55 1.63 60' 10/18/08
nitrous pass: 10.49 @ 126 mph 1.42 60' 10/18/08
350, AFR 195 heads, Eagle H-beam 6" rods, Victor Jr,
750 Race Demon, ProMagnum RR's, Hooker LT, TH400, Spohn T/A and C/M
i love to drive my car on the street. pretty much any given sunny day i'll drive the car instead of my truck (as long as the car has the street tires on, and doesn't have a hurt motor). i hang out with a lot of folks who are into the "fast street car" thing as well. i like to think my car fits into that category. but as soon as i could afford to get a trailer, i did. since i've gotten my trailer, i've had to tow my "street car" friends home more times then i've had to actually trailer mine home. i will not go to a track without having a way to get home, no matter what.
__________________ Matt
370ci LSx, "Close Enough Racing" th400, Transmission Specialties XHD9" 4500 stall converter, Moser 9" 4.30's, Mickey Thompson 28x10.5S's rollin' on BS Street Lites. Pump gas and street driven...doin' it all motor!
Don't get so defensive guys.
What's wrong with me driving my street car to the track? If it breaks, i deal with it. It's exactly what i built this car for. Had i wanted this one to be a trailered race car, I would have built it differently.
In my opinion, a REAL street car gets you home too.
then either you have an unlimited budget to keep the drivetrain in one piece, or you have a SLOW street car.
__________________ Matt
370ci LSx, "Close Enough Racing" th400, Transmission Specialties XHD9" 4500 stall converter, Moser 9" 4.30's, Mickey Thompson 28x10.5S's rollin' on BS Street Lites. Pump gas and street driven...doin' it all motor!
I just enjoy having a street car that's impressive for what it is.
I spent quite a few years chasing points, sponsors, and thrashing to make the next race. Many nites the cars came home in more than one piece. I feel i've paid my dues more than enough to see both sides on the trailer issue. Now i'm enjoying not having to deal with one. Here's a link to one of my homemade cars that needed my trailer... http://grannys.tripod.com/4rotor.html , there's another one near the bottom of that page.
i was forced into buying the house im living in now.
i did not have a trailer to get my broken car out of the shop in back.
after renting the house for 6 years.. he asked if i just wanted to buy it..
so I did... for what it sold for in 1970.. (he was a nice Guy)
now i need a trailer. for my car... even if a roll back fit's in my driveway.
I did my line lock on my 92 Z28 back in 93/94.when there was only one maker.. hurst...and the only metric brake lines to be had.
well..there was no kits with them...lol mine works Fantastic!!
Last edited by articwhiteZ; 10-14-2009 at 04:00 PM.
it's 8 or 10 miles from my driveway..to the all New Updated Dragstrip we have in Spokane....and i have a .8 mile all new test strip at the end of my block. with no cross streets!!!4 LANES wide!!
side note:
the first of all my new parts came intoday..
Lingenfelter
and summit.
I like the look of the hooker 2210's
Last edited by articwhiteZ; 10-19-2009 at 01:15 PM.
I drove 40 minutes ran 2 12.22 passes and drove home then my tranny broke when not racing now my car gets the opportunity of either making the trip or being trailered. Either way a trailer is a good choice. As for the the line lock you need to install one of the adjustables when using the stock proportioning valve being as the rear drum brake setup doesn't require as much pressure. I switched to a willwood master cylinder and deleted all stock crap ran and flared the new brake lines and fittings.
87 GTA 355/700r4
427 SBC
