massaku

Hey guys I just got a new car and I am trying to get this dang engine to run.
Engine is a 305 TPI and has been sitting for a long time.
I know the car was started fairly recently because it was moved from its usual spot I normally saw it. SO the starter cranks over the engine fine and with just the key on I hear the fuel pump prime. I checked all fuses and they are good. The car wont start no matter what I do and I dont have someone to turn the key while I check the spark so I am kinda in a rough spot lol. I know its kinda vague but does anyone have any ideas?

**EDIT**
Had a friend come over and it appears I am not getting any spark so I will do a search.

92RSMoneypit

iTrader: (1)

You can purchase a remote starter switch at auto zone or kragens it clamps to the starter relay you turn your key on then you can check if you have spark while standing over the engine.

hotrodln

if it's been sitting for 5 years, the gas is going to be nasty too. My neighbors dragged home an 85 with a v-6, and when they pulled the gas tank it had some nasty looking gas/rust/sludge......these cars aren't the most fun to get a gas tank off, but if the fuel smells bad it might need it.....but sounds like you've got some spark issues as well... a new cap/rotor and plugs would probably help to start.....wires too if you've got the extra cash!

massaku

Yeah I am planning on getting all of that stuff this week so I guess I will see.
On the bright side though the cars gas tank was left empty so there isn't a problem there.

hotrodln

that's great about the gas tank...too bad our cars don't have a nice little drain plug....my 62 caddy has one!

massaku

Wow way to think ahead! lol
I had no idea any car came with that.

9014josh

iTrader: (1)

The way gas prices are right now i wouldnt wanna drain plug in my gas tank,id wake up in the morning with my tank empty and a trail of gas leading out of my driveway lol

massaku

But think of the prank possibilities!

88formula305tpi

maybe jump the fuel pump relay with the line disconnected and see how much comes out. Ive done it before for people that filled up with diesel, but never on a thirdgen.

Ive seen some drain plugs on improrts. If the pump is bad I think i would cut the hole instead of dropping the tank.

I always end up opening a can of worms, I took my front tires off to mount new ones and ended up replacing calipers hoses and painting behind the inner fenders since my car has chips and rust starting from rocks. New York dumps salt like crazy and even summer cars get rust

massaku

Well I guess I will try it but I am 90% sure I am getting gas. I will just replace the coil and do a tune up ect and see what happens.
Sometimes I do the exact same thing though lol. when I took my doors off my delorean to do some minor maintenance I ended up replacing the whole roof lol.

Grumbles

You could always just take the DeLorean back to before it was parked....

massaku

But then I would have to pay more for it
There is also the problem of finding plutonium lol

Grumbles

Where is a libyan terrorist sect when you need it right?

Still, I'd be wary around 88 MPH, bad things have been known to happen and the LAST thing you want is your moms crushing on ya!

massaku

I would be more worried about a speeding ticket

massaku

Alright guys I just replaced my ignition coil and that was not it!
It just keeps turning and turning and does not start.
What else could it be? Also I rechecked and it appears I am
getting a really small spark from the plugs but I dont think its enough
to fire the plugs. I could be wrong but I am just putting it out there.

hotrodln

ok did you replace the distributor cap? and rotor? they get crudded up pretty bad from sitting for years....if you confirm that you have gas getting up there AND spark....then it sounds to me ( as in my opinion ) that maybe the rings are slightly stuck from sitting.....i've had a few carsin the last twenty years that would NOT start after sitting for years....the only thing that got them going was in one case to tow it behind another car in gear.....the other one i rolled down a huge hill and popped the clutch in 2nd gear...in BOTH cases the cars finally started running good after a short time and then i was able to get them started on the starter just fine after that....now neither one of these solutions may be applicable to your situation, BUT if you have gas and spark .....it may just be compression your lacking.........

massaku

See the thing is that I dont want to spend alot of money on things like the cap and rotor wire plugs ect. until I know that I can get it running properly. I have a contract with the person I bought it from that the car was in good running condition or it would only need minor things to be. I am thinking about replacing the engine control module but should I just get a cap and rotor first? Also I have based my assumption that I am getting gas from the gas smell coming from the engine bay lol. Is there a better way to check?

92RSMoneypit

iTrader: (1)

You can ground one spark plug wire with your finger have your friend turn it over if you jump up a few inches off the ground and you say something like son of a b**ch you proudly have enough spark and it doesn't cost you a dime.

massaku

Lol I have done that before... thats why this time I stuck a screw driver in there and grounded it lol. I think I got a really small spark but it only did it once and I couldnt get another one. how do I test if I am getting fuel pressure? also are there any tests to see if my whole ignition system is working? (besides the spark wire test lol)

hotrodln

well you could pull the cap and see if there looks to be corrosion in there.....if it's really clean, then maybe you don't need one....but chances are you do...alittle bit of crud could cause allot of resistance......gotta get good consistent spark before you go further.......any wires get chewed by mice while it was sitting?

massaku

vb

I will pull the cap in the morning but I dont think there is any problems with the wires... they almost look new.

dan22742002

I had the same problem with my iroc, but it only sat for three years...The problem was that my pump went bad, and my ignition control module was also bad, those two replaced, and it fired right up, not a problem.

massaku

Good to know! I am planning on replacing those things so I will see how it turns out. Oh and welcome to the boards

dan22742002

Well, good luck, and thank you.

massaku

Alright...I am really stumped now. I replaced the coil, the ignition control module, Rotor and dist cap and still nothing. What the hell could it be?
And I still don't know how to check if I am getting fuel pressure.

massaku

*EDIT* irrelevant

Jim Berry

A set of NOIDS test lights from Oreillys might help you determine if you are getting pulses to the injectors also.

Jim Berry

massaku

ALRIGHT... I checked the spark plugs again and they ARE wet so I am getting fuel. I also checked my coil and I am getting voltage to the coil and from the coil to the distributor. There are two plugs on the back of the engine control module one being a 2 prong from the coil and another one that has something like 4 or 5 prongs. I am getting voltage from the coil to the dist but the other connector I am getting nothing I don't know if I am supposed to be getting voltage to it but I am not. Still no spark.

massaku

I did a ohm test on the pickup coil and I am a little confused as to what it did. The reading spiked to 2000 then just slowly kept going down in random increments and kept going into the - range. I am just going to go ahead and replace it anyone think this could be the problem?

88formula305tpi

I think if you are getting spark even tho it may look weak then you should clean the plugs, reinstall with a fuel pressure gauge hooked up to the fitting with a silver cap on the passenger fuel rail (i think). Turn the key on and record the fuel pressure and see if it bleeds down within a minute or so. If it does then you have a problem with an injector flooding the cylinder out which would only cause a long crank unless several leaked down, or it could be a bad regulator dumping gas back to the tank.

If the pressure holds around 45-50 then I would say you need to replace your weak coil unless you have already. once you verify this then you know there is adaquete fuel and spark which would lead to engine firing or more diagnosing other issues. compression tests would be helpful even tho its more likely not the case.

88formula305tpi

Also if it flooded make sure you crank it with no plugs and injectors disconnected or disabled to clear flood. change the oil when it does start.

massaku

I replaced my spark plugs and changed the oil and nothing happened...
The pickup coil didn't do anything either.
Now the starter died on me... (there is also a tooth missing from the flywheel)
This car is really going to be the end of me. I am having a buddy come over again tomorrow to see if I am getting spark so I guess I will check everything again. Also 88formula do I have to depressurize the fuel rail before I hook a gauge up to the schrader valve? If so how do I do that? and if I didnt crank the engine with the plugs out would it still not start even if the old plugs were not wet?

88formula305tpi

If the cylinders are full of gas from cranking you will have to pull all the plugs and blow the fuel out without the injectors plugged in or I beleive there are injector fuses under the dash. This is the only way to make sure that fuel isnt going to foul the plugs you just cleaned.

to properly de pressurize the fuel lines you have to pull the pump fuse and crank it untill the engine starts (which in your case floods it out more) and stalls and will not run. I would skip this step and use a rag around the fitting when tightening it and make sure you have no sparks or loose connections or backfiring that could ignite the fuel.

Did the starter cook itself from cranking or did the gear grind on the missing tooth? I would get a starter and see if it grinds?

The five speeds arent hard to pull I pulled mine 6 times (once with a lift) (five times on my back) since I bought the car due to problems I dont have time to describe.

Just remember you may be pulling the fuel pump and maybe its bad gas or fuel filter.

massaku

Alrighty! had some progress today!
I tried spraying down the engine with starter fluid and I got a huge firebreathing backfire from the front which means I am getting some spark.
The bad thing is that the car still wont start... so I am guessing it is a fuel problem now. I will go buy a fuel pressure tester tomorrow and see if I am getting good pressure. only things in the system are fuel pump, fuel filter, regulator and injectors right? anyway thanks for all the help so far guys!

88formula305tpi

I would buy a filter too since it is cheap unless you can remember when it was changed last.

Thats about everything in the fuel system.

You can check the pressure regulator by unplugging the vaccum line and seeing if fuel is present (faulty), as vacuum is applied to the regulator the fuel pressure shoulld decrease and then increase with no vaccum. If this doesnt happen it is faulty.

If you have low pressure I would put the filter on and recheck.

massaku

Ok I will check that... What I have read is that if I get full pressure and then it bleeds off quickly it is either the regulator or the injectors right? if it stays steady what could be the problem then?

five7kid

iTrader: (14)

A bad check valve in the fuel pump can also cause pressure loss when the engine is off.

massaku

ALRIGHT! it started! with some more starting fluid and taking the distributor back out and adjusting the timing its started up with a little bit of coaxing. But now it is still running like complete crap... it sounds like its missing alot. now that I got it started I want to replace the spark plugs and wires again to make sure they arent flooded out as well as run some injector cleaner and stuff like that through it. It is also leaking a crap load of transmission fluid so I am not going to be test driving it anytime soon Thanks for all the help guys!

88formula305tpi

at least your making some progress!