XonyaZ28

anyone know how much it costs to rebuild a 3.1liter ?? or know of a site i can look at >?

Camar_Hunter_c

I cannot find my Northern Auto parts book off hand, but I know the 3.1 Turbo rebuild kit costs 334-336 something. So I would imagine the regular 3.1 is around 3-310 area.

The machine shop costs for boring, honing, and other machining can run anywhere, as they all charge something different. If there are alot of shops in your area you can price match, but other wise if your like me and only have like 3 your kinda stuck. I would go with the one with the best reputation though, even if it is a little more.

The one I go to around here will charge 10-13 bucks per cylinder to bore, so its not that bad. Hell I had them resurface my flywheel the day before Christmas eve and they only charged 20-30 something and had it done before I got the 12 miles home... Which kinda sucked cause I had to drive right back...

XonyaZ28

ok thanks... i have no idea how much this cost.. i would rather do it myself, or watch someone do it ... .. but i know that would be impossible....


thanks Camaro hunter C

Camar_Hunter_c

No prob lil Bro...

KED85

I paid $800 for a used 1995 Camaro 3.4 44K motor swapped it into my Firebird.
I've paid $900 for the 1995 Camaro 3.4 50K motor I just bought to install in my 1985 S-10 Blazer.
Check out my swapping thread 2.8 3.4 Long Block Swap Boogie.
Honest, It's, cost wise, 6 of one half dozen of the other.
With the 3.4 you get so much more power & torque it's like a freight train under your hood!
Ask around for a 1993-1995 used long block low milage 3.4 from a Camaro-Firebird.

XonyaZ28

KED85:

i am going 3.1 b/c i have it already.. plus i am having it rebuilt to handle a turbo and 75 shot of juice ...


thanks for the help though





Xonya

KED85

IF you are doing any research you always check out the options.
Just cause you have a classic 265 small block Chevy doesn't mean you should build it up, since it can easily be overshadowed by a less costly replacment from the get go.
Ask your machinist if his bill to you will be over $800 or $900, including the "rebuild" engine parts, NOT NOS or new injectors.
You're replacing the cam, bearings, valve springs spring locks, retainers, rods, crank, block, pistons, heads, exhaust...........
by purchasing a used low milage running 3.4 for only $800 to $900.
AND others here have gotten their 3.4 long blocks for LESS!!
I get, instantly, 200 foot pound of torque (2800RPM) & 165 HP (4400RPM).
Search around for a 3.4, it's a WAY better value.
NO you can't make a 3.1 into a 3.4
The 2.8/3.1 blocks are to thin on any metal for boring.
That's why I said 3.4 has a completly different engine block.
The money saved goes to rebuild your tranny.
All 3.4 swappers (about 25+ now, last count) report ruining their tranny after the swap.
Too much fun or power?
You decide when you waste the old tranny!

XonyaZ28

i do like the 3.4 engine... but i am only using the 3.1 b/c i got it for free.. ..

KED85

Again, since you're investigating, ask around.
You could score alot better than a 3.1 needing a rebuild.
It's worth your effort to seek a better cost effective solution.

CaliCamaroRS

I just visited www.northernautoparts.com to get info on the 3.4 kit. They quote $371.96 for a 90-92 3.1L Master Kit including:
-Federal Mogul rings
-FD pistons (std. or oversize)
-FD rod bearings
-FD main bearings
-Clevite cam bearings
-Melling oil pump
-FD camshaft
-FD lifters
-Melling timing chain/gears
-Pioneer freeze plugs
-Victorgaskets

I might buy the 3.4 kit from them, minus the camshaft. Though, for some reason, it's about $100 more than the 3.1 kit.

TomP

I was told by guys on the tech board to buy the rebuild kit from the joint doing the machine work; they say that places the burden of getting the correct over/undersized parts on the shop, and that they might care a little more about their machine work to the block. Obviously tho, the kit would be more expensive.

XonyaZ28

ok do you have a 3.4 you can sell me ?

KED85

I sent ya an email with a few suggestions for your search.
Do open the Yellow pages and ask others, also.
Ask here for wrecking yard suggestions, too!
Overclck found one recently in Texas, too.
Keep searching
USE the 3.1 as the old motor core if they ask for it.
You can do this!
Ask & search.
LA searching is different that Texas searching.
BUT you've got lots of land out there to cover!
If you want one, expect to pay mondo for the shipping from LA to Texas.
You can find a 3.4 in Texas!
I do TORQUE, not turbos.
I have other cars for going faster (old Camaro's & a Corvette).

XonyaZ28

well i dont have another car to go fast in.. thats why i want this one to be fast....


i will do a search though .. thanks ked85

KED85

Ask anyone who has done a 3.4 swapped if they are not pleased with the 3.4 power, as is, just swapped in.
My 40 to 95 MPH blasts are pure pleasure.
I can't wait to do cap/rotor change, it'll be smoother at idle.
Keep asking for places to find a wrecked 1993-95 Firebird.
You will score one!!!
Keep checking ebay, too!
One from LA area got his 3.4 delivered to his door from Florida.

XonyaZ28

how much horsepower does the 3.4 put out ? along with torque ..


the reason i am doing the 3.1 is b/c

1: it was free
2: i am going to rebuild it for use of a turbo... ..


i know a guy that has a shop thats willing to help me i believe...


this is my goal for the 3.1 ... i would have it bored to a 3.4 but that wouldnt be good for the turbo....


xonya

KED85

May I assist ya this way.
1. You cannot bore out a 2.8/3.1 block to become a 3.4. You cannot.
2. Re-read number 1. Again.
3. Go to ANY GM DEALER and spend the measly $6 for the GM Performance Parts Catalog.
You will see exactly what I am saying is true.
This publication contains every spec (like the 3.4 engine, too!) you seek to be informed on.
4. Get another mechainc. He's experimenting/throwing away your money.
You'll loose only money and time with him.
5. No one, has SUCCESSFULLY added a "Turbo, Supercharger, nor Nitrous" to their daily driven street legal 3rd Generation F-body V-6.
NO ONE.
Lots of talk and some solid PLANS AND IDEAS.
No one has done/added any external powerplant additives yet.

Go for the least expensive way to have fun and a solid reliable quick/peppy ride.

Please invest the time and effort to obtain, read, digest the specs in that GM publication.

GM engineers are some the highest paid, smartest people whom designed these powerplants.
NOT IN EVERY DETAIL, tho
But, they do know a thing or two. Use their knowledge, they designed it, they built it.
We abuse it

PS
Wanna tip?
Jon Moss head of GM powerteam experimental unit (his job is like stuffing a GM 502 into a late model Monte Carlo and making it a rear wheel drive, just to see.....
Doing same thing to S-10 series vehicles, etc...
He makes the GM Corvette cars competitive in the American LeMans Series....
etc
etc.....)
Recently unveiled a turbo'd FWD 3.4 (bumped up to a 3.5 only!) vehicle (can't recall what car).

Made only 205 HP. Big deal.

Go get/read the GM Performance Parts Pub and starting meeting people with more intelligence, to execute your (MONEY) battle plan.
YOU CAN DO YOUR IDEA BETTER AND SPENDING LESS MONEY!

camaro-mayhem

is the 3.4 the same block as a 3.8 and 4.3?

and another question just out of curioisty is the 3.1 turbo rebuild kit include forged parts?

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

i believe that the 3.8 and 4.3 are 90* engines, the 3.1/2.8 is a 60*, ked85, am i right?

camaro-mayhem

oh yeah huh.thanks for that i forgot,they are just a 350 with the front cut off or whatever and use the same pistons and stuff as a 350 would.

one day i will twin turbo a v6,just wait!

KED85

A Buick 3.8 is a COMPLETLY different animal.
I BELIEVE it's the V-6 of the Buick Aluminum V-8 sized 215 (Anyone know what a 215 CID motor be in litres?
It's a 90* block design, tho.
The 4.3 is the good ol Chevy 350 (5.7) minus two!
It's a 90* block design, too.
BOTH options NOT AN EASY SWAP under a 60* V-6 original engine vehicle hood.
YET logic dictates a 3.8 turbo'd swap is a "natural" until you get into the specifics (head or removal of AC stuff-you make the call).
Lots of Turbo's 3.8 mills & GM did do a 3.8 under the 3rd gen hood & the 4th gen do have 3.8 in there.
SO....
A 3.8 Turbo "NON-1989 Firebird Turbo Trans Am Specific drivetrain" swap under your current 60* V-6 car hood is also a detailed $$$wap.
How deep your wallet?
How fast need you go?
You may really need a V-8 car.
Honest SO MANY tales of "I'm gonna do this & that".
They don't seem to make much further that a computer generated image on a computer.
For the extra power & ease of installation (you reuse so many of the old 60* V-6 engined parts), it works out very well ($ wise).
Power IS increased.
Longevity of vehicle IS increase
For minimal effort & minimal dollar amount.
But ya gotta love the car & think it's worth this effort.
IT's alot
It's detailed.
No fibbing.
No engine swap is ever easy.
BUT some projects work together, very well, with what ya start with.
Lots of research and a Plan.
You're getting closer.

Red91Bird

Thats not entirely true

TomP

A few guys from v6fbody.com (when it was around) had nitrous on their 2.8/3.1's.

But I've never seen (and never will) a turbocharged/sc'd 2.8/3.1

XonyaZ28

you about to see one bro...dont cash in your chips yet....

me and camaro hunter each have projects going

KED85

Alright,
let's clarify..
I have seen that twin turbo's pic of that Datsun 510
I have seen CHVEY BACKED projects (AND their budgets).
B & M projects, too
Even the K & F unit, ALMOST BOUGHT ONE MYSELF

I have YET TO SEE OR HEAR OF ANYONE HERE HAVING DONE DONE DONE DONE DONE DONE DONE
a successful STREET LEGAL SC OR TURBO installation
that is street diven
AGAIN
lots of plans and talk.

My 3.4 swap is one of the best ideas and street driven reliably going on this board.
Done at a realistic cost and project wise, easy.
All ya do it remove, mix & match stuff, reinstall using 95% of your original parts in the car & then go.

NO
machinist bills
no MASSIVE parts bill

I've coached about 25-30 people to start and finish/complete & drive their swapped 3.4 rides.


NO ONE HAS DONE THAT WITH ALL THE TALK AND PLANNING of a turbo or sc unit.

ANYONE WANT TO PROVE THEIR CLAIM?

And I'm not braggin,
just passing a fact.
I have the CA smog sticker to prove my point.
Not having smog laws enforced in your area, doesn't count to be able to make it "smog legal". I let my Wife drive my 21 month Son, ALONE, in this 3.4 '85/'95 Firebird every day.

PROVE me wrong by matching the power of
165 HP
200 Foot pounds of Torque
from installing a 3.4 for about $800-900 initial cost of the complete low milage engine.

Spend the time enjoying your ride, not trying to make it work correct.

But it is your effort & dollar.
just offering a strong solid suggestion
that works out well for your "foot" ego & wallet.

These lousy 6's were INTRODUCED IN THE 1980 CITATION!
ENGINE introduced DURING THE SECOND GAS CRISIS HEIGHT (1979) and designed during the DARK SMOG POLLUTION LAWS ON CARS of the late 70's.

It's your effort.

AND I AM NEVER PUTTING DOWN ANYONE!

I WANT SOMEONE TO PROVE ME WRONG AND DESIGN AND DRIVE DAILY REGISTERED AND SMOGGED, A turbo/SC installation deal that works at a turn of a key.

I just don't see it happening, for the low cost of the 2.8->3.4 swap boogie, that I offer/help others attain.

Beyond their computer screen.

Someone prove me wrong, because I (warmly & encourage ya) challange ya.

Again, your turbo'd/SC swap using a 60* V-6, THAT, ANYONE/EVERYONE, HERE CAN DO! for ONLY $800 (total cost of my 3.4 Firebird swap, including the engine & needed gaskets/parts).
That is 50 state smog legal.

TomP

:sillylol: Yeah, sure. I've heard that one a million times before! I honestly do hope that someone proves me wrong- and shows VALID PROOF, in the form of pictures and timeslips. And you damn well know that if the person claims to have "done it myself"- but they have NO pictures of them doing the work, then I'll know they took it to a shop.

But, I know it will ever happen. So go ahead! Prove me wrong!! (Seriously!)

Think about it: Whoever actually shows proof of a turbo'd 2.8/3.1 will be the first ever person to do it- that's instant "head cheese" status. Talk about fame!

I Cant Drive 55

I'm trying my best to see if I can get my SC to work. The problem is finding room to do it. I can put it where the smog pump would normally be(mine didnt come through with one) , but I have to make my own brackets and ducting. I also have to make a new serpentine belt pulley on my lathe. I have all the resources to do it but just not the time.
If my car didnt have A/C it would be much easier.
Another thing I run into , is if I go through all this trouble will the car run right, will it have more power or would it just be a waste of time on a perfectly running car with not that many miles on it.
It would be much easier if I knew of someone that has done something like this to their car to get some input. Theoretically it should be better and more powerful but that is not always the case.
But as most mechanics and car enthusiasts are we always have to push the envelope and try new things.
Im going to do my best to get this thing to fly , but it will take time and alot of calculating first.

XonyaZ28

ok i will prove you wrong then ...

KED85

Again
GM just released specs for a FWD 3.5 (from a 3.4 block) GM Motorsports Shop did this.
Their GM backed budget.
Woopee-
big 205 HP.
Why spend the effort.
Do a cost effective motor swap & be done with it.
I did & I am doing it again.
I just turn the key & go.

Not computer generated SC or turbo's either.
Take an unbiased 3rd gen person for a ride.
I did
Ask Fast RS.
He still couldn't believe there is a 3.4 under there.
It looks just like the 2.8/3.1
Part of the plan.
Good luck with figuring out ways to spend the unnecessary money.

I'm done offer my help.

The radial SC would be ok, I'm sure, as long as the rest of the engine holds up under the added pressure.

I Cant Drive 55

KED,
Do you think the SC would be too much on the engine . I will tell you I dont drag race (anymore that is ) I would think a little extra power would be nice. If you dont think the rods ,crank or pistons would hold up than I probably wont try it. I trust your judgement . Ive never had a 60* apart , so I dont really know what they are made of inside. We always raced with the SB Chevy. And I have seen the inside of them , even from the outside when I really didnt want to.

XonyaZ28

uhhh ok


dude just chill out on me ... this is something i want to do and i will be damned if you or anyone else can stop me .. ....

3.4 are ok i guess... but i want an underdog that will give v8s a run for their buck



xonya

KED85

Many here have read the tales of those that want to do a turbo/SC.
That's what it ends being
Tales
Continued tales
Again,
Please prove us wrong.
Please be the first to make a street legal turbo/SC on your F-body and enjoy winning races.
IF that's what does it for ya.
Honest I cheer ya on.
It IS your money your mechainc your ride
Only suggested away to make your ride better faster for quicker & cheaper.
But, you keep us informed how you'll be doing.
Nice hearing from ya
TTFN
AND HAPPY FIRST DAY OF SUMMER

stuart69427

if I were you, i'd learn the boogie real quick

camaro-mayhem

:hail: x0nya:hail:

XonyaZ28

thanks man. .. when i get started on the work pics will flow like water..

KED85

I'm also waiting for someone to toss a 150HP NOS system on their ride and tell us what happens after they use it the first time.

Serious, turbo sound?
We tried them back in the 60's
Corvair
Oldsmobile
Did I forget any?
We tried them back in the 70's on anything that ran (cough cough-smog controls-cough cough).
Don Yenko (Vega)
Zora Arkus Duntov (Corvette)
Jim Ingles (Corvette)
The 80's
Masaretti Bi-Turbo
Chevrolet 3.8 V-6 Turbo'd Monte Carlo (1980)
Pontiac 301 Turbo Trans Am (1980-81 correct?)
Honda Motorcycles!!! (guy I knew had one)
Wasn't worth it.
Nothing like a Proper factory engineered turbo car.
Like Porsche 911 Turbo
Saab
The Buick Turbo Program (include the 1989 TTA!)(ASC & Garret Turbo teamed up, am I correct?)
The GMC Syclone/Typhoon (Same team?)
Want a reliable turbo sound in your ride?
Get a CD.

PLEASE
NOT REALLY BEING SARCASTIC
BUT
for what you'd like to do/$pend with/on a lousy V-6 designed back in the smog dark days of 1970's Detroit...


Know how bitchin' you'll look in a really nice Corvette from the 80's!!
Those Corvettes are BARGINS RIGHT NOW!
Like only $3500 to $7K for a beauty!
1985 to 1989 Corvettes are at the low price ownership entry curve right now.
Just avoid the 4+3 tranny models.
Avoid the 1984 models, too.
Unless you are collector.

XonyaZ28

too bad your not me.. huh ?

XonyaZ28

haha yes !

KED85

All right......

How long do you plan on having your car down, to create this powerplant?
You seemed to be concerned about the length of downtime to swap in the 3.4 under your hood, when you emailed me about doing this engine project.

Be honest.

An ego is a destrictive thing.
Look what it did to Richard Nixon, the ultimate example!

I did my first 2.8->3.4 swap boogie working with a guy addicted to Herion in under a month. I couldn't wait to get away from him.
He changed, for the worst (knew him for over 10 years..stupid drugs).

I/My Wife have driven this car & racked up atleast 8,000 miles so far. In a little over a year.
One time was going a steady 85MPH (over an hour LA to SD), getting close to 30 MPG, the car never breaking a sweat.

I never did a truly successful swap prior to this project.
I had done three engine swaps, but they failed.
Didn't know every detail and no one offered to show/help me. They worked, but not reliably well.

This 2.8->3.4 swap I discovered is a dream simple swap.

Why do you want to reinvent a wheel
instead of enjoying your summer?

Texas has lots of great things to discover, go enjoy them!
I did when I visited, it was a great interesting place to explore. Austin, Houston, Washington County Summer Fair, BLUE BELL ICE CREAM!!, THE LARGEST FOOTBALL STADIUMS, Longhorns!

Hell, with the budget you're gonna discover, I would throw away all of your 3rd Gen stuff, let someone else "enjoy it" (let your "mechanic" buy it he knows SO much) & go buy a good used Corvette.

Let them chase after you!

Reward them by going skinny dipping with them, sneak out of the water, drive away with their clothes.........

HELLOOOOOOO SUMMER!!!!!

stuart69427

you always know how to create a laugh karl

KED85

Might as well make ya chuckle.
Some people get so serious about this BS
It's only a car
You are young
Do something to make your youth special/memorible.


It hurts to see so much wasted talk, anger, ideas, etc....
wasted money on a car for an ego thing..........


GO HAVE FUN
IT'S SUMMER
CRUISE.....
to the creek and go skinnying dipping!!!!!!!
Full moon soon!!!!!!!


Take Richard Nixon as a primo example of what an ego will do to your life......
Sad, shame, he was once smart......
Sad, Shame, he could have been one of the greatest minds to have run/helped this country.


GO SKINNY DIPPING WITH A BEAUTIFUL BEATING HEART

Promise, you'll have one wicked smile on your face.........
FULL MOON SOON!!!!!
Get!

camaro-mayhem

HELL YES!!!

GREATEST ICE CREAM EVAR!!!!!!!!!!!


eh i think ked85 as a good point in the 3.4 thing,but ive beent alking to xonya for a while about htis and i thikn he really wants to try it,so im gonna support him

KED85

OH MAN
I SUPPORT ANYONE GIVING IT THEIR BEST
BUT
Hell I'd rather see hear of wasted money on a hobby (who doesn't have that sickness)
then buying/using Herion like a friend of mine has.

Beside's for only $6 (GM Perf. Parts Catalog-ANY GM dealer) ya can see lots of tips for a good deci$ion.

Keep us informed.
We do want to find/see someone who will put thier auxilary power plant battle plan into action.

I did, doing my 2.8->3.4 long Block Swap Boogie,
now doing it Double-Time
Blue Bell Ice Cream really is some of the Finest Ice Cream I've ever had.
The atmosphere of Washington County Fair July 4th only made it better.
Really wish that was out in LA.

How much ya willing to spend on shipping to get a 3.4 long block high milage or low milage block, to Texas?

camaro-mayhem

ill give you 10 bucks to send one to arizona

now i just need a car to put one in...

KED85

How about a 1997 White V-6, T-tops loaded
White with Black Z-28 stripes, polished factory wheels?
$7K
Drive it home worry free.
Shipping really can kill a deal sometimes.
I've paid the piper, too!
I can get high milage complete 3.4 motors.
What's it worth to ya?
Know any shipping connects to from LA?
Beside UPS & others?
The yard connection is right at the LA railroad track area.
Again a guy I know in CA got his 3.4 motor for $500, off the internet, delivered to his door step.
Shipping originated from Florida

Seriously you can do a nation wide search from many wrecking yards
IF THEY WANT A CUT OF THE DEAL too.
I know of SO MANY wrecking yards in Texas.
How, I can see them in a publication called Hemmings (MANY newstands). Ya got lots of land out there, few rules. Kinda fun.
What person DOESN'T WANT YOUR CASH RIGHT NOW!!!!
Right now I have a Chrysler 440 motor vintage 70's (pre-74), intact, complete, running.
Who wants it?
$750 plus shipping.....