Power AdderGetting a Supercharger or Turbocharger? Thinking about using Nitrous? All forced induction and N2O topics discussed here.
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we had the v6 turbo car on the dyno today @ 10 psi
with the problems we had car only put down 268.0 rwhp and 367.6 ftlbs @ 10 psi
the 2 issues we had were
#1 had no ignition advance and timing was locked out to 8* btdc
#2 prolly not really 2 but related to one is the motor would not rev up over 5,100 no matter how long we stayed on the throttle
im going to revert timing control back to my standalone instead of the stock ecm and am heading back to the dyno this wensday for accurate pulls
ill have the vids of all 4 pulls and the pics of the duno sheets posted up in a lil bit
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__________________ PRO FAB ENGINEERING - comming soon turbokits, supercharger kits, directport nitrous, cyl head porting, custom intakes, suspension parts ++ much more FORMER 60* V6 FBODY RECORD HOLDER 13.008@104.65@9 psi
NEW GOAL = 11.90
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yeah its cause the timing was locked at 8* btdc without being able to advance the timming the motor just wont rev,as well as the timing being that far retarded will also kill off alot of power
fter talking with the guy at the dyno and doing some quess work we estimate that once i fix the timing issue the car should make about 80-100 rwhp more then it did and an additional 80ftlbs of tq with no other changes to the setup
so i should be able to hit my 450rwhp goal at high boost once i get this combo squared away
im going back to the dyno this comming wensday @ 2pm
ill have vids from today up soon hopefully, nother member of the boards came out and yook vids for me today so im just waiting for him to get them up for me
__________________ PRO FAB ENGINEERING - comming soon turbokits, supercharger kits, directport nitrous, cyl head porting, custom intakes, suspension parts ++ much more FORMER 60* V6 FBODY RECORD HOLDER 13.008@104.65@9 psi
__________________ PRO FAB ENGINEERING - comming soon turbokits, supercharger kits, directport nitrous, cyl head porting, custom intakes, suspension parts ++ much more FORMER 60* V6 FBODY RECORD HOLDER 13.008@104.65@9 psi
sweet vid.. question though. is it the dyno or is your drivers side rear rim bent?
im not sure, i dont think its the rim, i think the slicks i have on the car are out of round,or i could possibly have a bent axle.ill find out before i go back on wensday though
__________________ PRO FAB ENGINEERING - comming soon turbokits, supercharger kits, directport nitrous, cyl head porting, custom intakes, suspension parts ++ much more FORMER 60* V6 FBODY RECORD HOLDER 13.008@104.65@9 psi
i ended up making 4 pulls, when i went yesterday they had a dyno day so it was only 60 bucks,normally its 75$
__________________ PRO FAB ENGINEERING - comming soon turbokits, supercharger kits, directport nitrous, cyl head porting, custom intakes, suspension parts ++ much more FORMER 60* V6 FBODY RECORD HOLDER 13.008@104.65@9 psi
Thats not a bad price for 4 pulls. When I was in japan, They have a dyno shop a few miles away from the base, 200,000 yen to do 2 pulls "thats like 200$"
the guys there is really cool, it was supposed to be 3 pulls and i prolly could have got a 5th in but there was no real point with the issues i was having
__________________ PRO FAB ENGINEERING - comming soon turbokits, supercharger kits, directport nitrous, cyl head porting, custom intakes, suspension parts ++ much more FORMER 60* V6 FBODY RECORD HOLDER 13.008@104.65@9 psi
when all is said im done im shooting for 450rwhp if i can hit that tq numbers should be in the 525-600 ftlb range
__________________ PRO FAB ENGINEERING - comming soon turbokits, supercharger kits, directport nitrous, cyl head porting, custom intakes, suspension parts ++ much more FORMER 60* V6 FBODY RECORD HOLDER 13.008@104.65@9 psi
__________________ PRO FAB ENGINEERING - comming soon turbokits, supercharger kits, directport nitrous, cyl head porting, custom intakes, suspension parts ++ much more FORMER 60* V6 FBODY RECORD HOLDER 13.008@104.65@9 psi
That big hairdryer's really kicking out some numbers. I'm impressed you've been able to do as much with the iron heads as you have. Can't wait to see the real numbers.
That big hairdryer's really kicking out some numbers. I'm impressed you've been able to do as much with the iron heads as you have. Can't wait to see the real numbers.
yeah it deff is , im expecting to bring that hp number up 80-100rwhp hp once the ignition is fixed @ the same boost level , i have no idea how much more tq its gonna make when its fixed
You know, I predicted ~275whp to Ben when this whole deal started, but didn't think i would see that kind of TQ.
iron head port has more velocity then the 3100/3400 heads, can't speak for the 3500 stuff though. i really cant wait to see what the hp/tq number is gona jump to once the ign is fixed
im a lil pissed about the timing issue but nothing i can do about it now, i thought my apointment to go back was today its actually tomorow.But im gonna have to call and cancel as i still have some repairs to do,including replacing that bent ds axle
iron head port has more velocity then the 3100/3400 heads, can't speak for the 3500 stuff though.
Gen 3 is Gen 3, just because it's a v6 doesn't mean GM put any less thought into them. Until you can hold a velocity meter to the botom of the valve and tell me otherwise...
don't you thin the v8 guys would LOVE to bolt a set of LSx heads on a Gen1 V8? Well, we have that advantage, and I'll tell you what...
You give me that 260 cam back I sent you, I will send you a set of 3100 pistons/rods (free) that will compliment the Gen2 60 degree heads you have, and re-dyno. You won't look back, promise.
12sec with a FWD aluminum heads in a FWD car, put that in a RWD body it will be much faster...
just cause the heads are later model dosent mean there any better, hell i can show u heads that look beautiful and have high flow numberst but have no velocity and are total dogs.
one day ull actually learn flow numbers dont mean everything
maybe u should take a close look at some gn heads and ported gn heads that only flow 150 cfm, those guys go into the low 10's with them
but anyways im done arguing with you
heres the spark table im going back to the dyno with,
ill be using that table upto 21 psi on 93 pump gas/ no meth
__________________ PRO FAB ENGINEERING - comming soon turbokits, supercharger kits, directport nitrous, cyl head porting, custom intakes, suspension parts ++ much more FORMER 60* V6 FBODY RECORD HOLDER 13.008@104.65@9 psi
Port velocity is a function of flow restriction. Too little and it'll run like crap down low but make fantastic numbers up top, too much and it'll choke up top (regardless of foced induction) but make excellent torq numbers. Port velocity is very important to a na engine but not as big a concern for forced induction because the system isn't relying on vacuum for air delivery. However high boost levels to deliver a given power level is usually a good indicator of an overly restrictive induction tract.
The 3100/3400 on a flow bench will make iron heads look bad but the 3500 stuff is amazing. But with a turbo shouldn't you want more top end flow? And I think that because the aluminum head burn more efficiently couldn't you run more boost on them?
I have seen some very impressive numbers from these engines and I wouldn't consider doing it unless I could get the oil tubes on #5 and #6 at the crank.
Port velocity is a function of flow restriction. Too little and it'll run like crap down low but make fantastic numbers up top, too much and it'll choke up top (regardless of foced induction) but make excellent torq numbers. Port velocity is very important to a na engine but not as big a concern for forced induction because the system isn't relying on vacuum for air delivery. However high boost levels to deliver a given power level is usually a good indicator of an overly restrictive induction tract.
Kinda. You have to take the valve size, throat size, port volume and minimum cross sectional area into consideration (and in the case of the Gen 3 heads, valve angle vs lift). Cross sectional area is what causes velocity, and if you take a real close look at the Gen3 lower manifolds, you will see what I mean. The runners actually get smaller right before the entrance to the head, causing the air to move a lot faster.
Now if you can use texture in the runner/port to cause a boundary layer, you can have large volume and still maintain velocity
Quote:
Originally Posted by daverr
i dont if u know alot about gen 1 sbc but there are gen 1 sbc heads out there that would smash lsx heads.
Of course there are, but I'm talking about a set of stock heads...
The 3500 heads IN STOCK FORM flow over 125cfm more than the iron 60* heads. That's an excellent upgrade for something you can pull out of the junkyard.
That's like saying there are Gen 1 SBC heads that outflow Vortech, but not without a lot of work
Not only that, but it's not about flow either. You want to get in a discussion about fluid dynamics, flame front, chamber shape, swirl etc?
There is no comparison with the iron to 3500 heads when you take the rest of the design into consideration. We have been able to run as much a 13.6:1 SCR on pump gas with the uber efficient 3500 chambers.
Wait until you guys can see the 3900 heads I have here :P
Quote:
Originally Posted by Street Lethal
.... smash would be an understatement, it's more like annihilate;
Yeah, but those aren't heads you can get at your local wrecker for about $400 are they now, Rob? :P
Last edited by firstfirebird; 04-24-2009 at 03:32 PM.
Yeah, but those aren't heads you can get at your local wrecker for about $400 are they now, Rob? :P
True, you can't get these heads from the local bone yard, however, they were meant to show that the LSX cylinder head simply isn't as supreme as many people like to believe. The SB2.2 heads come with a heavy price tag, but hey, you get what you pay for, and then some....
well im setting up for a new dyno appt.
i moved upto upstate ny a few months back and havent done anything with my car since its still in jersey.
but i just schedualled the car to be shipped up here in 2 weeks.
since the last time ive run the car ive picked up some new parts
i have a p-trimed t76 turbo to replace the 60-1 unit i previously dynoed with.
also due to the fact i wounded the old block and couldnt get a replacement my only option was to goto a 3.4 block, so i have a fresh 3.4 shortblock to install
and the last and final change will be going to a mechanical 276/272 grind cam.
car should put down some really nice numbers this time around
I love eye candy ! 
