in the June 08 Car&Driver pat Bedard has a scary article. It seems that impounding vehicles is the new cash cow for cities. It started in Oakland Ca (of course) and now has spread faster then the west nile virus. impound fees are $1000 and up. Chicagos impound lot holds 7200 cars. Loud cars and carrying a can of paint "with intent to ... deface are grounds for confiscation. In central valley CA one womans vette was impounded from her driveway on a sunday morn. It seems they had evidence it has been street racing. Rockford, Il can impound cars for emitting loud music. "Hearsay evidence shall be admissible" the ordinance says. Oak Forest, IL sieze cars for 37 different offenses unrelated to driving including shoplifting and vandalism. Grabbing cars is easy money for another reason: Most of the enabling ordinances require the defense to prove innocence. Which means there's no defense.

The government is doing anything it can to get into your wallet. Everyday they dream up a new scheme. I hope some day the populace has a belly full. I'm not holding my breath.

If only we could get Jay Leno to become the next California Governor.
I've had a code enforcement officer treaten to tow my car after I concreted my easment getting appoval from the building department and development commity. And spending 2,000 to concrete the easment. I dislike thier "take no responsipility for thier actions" additudes.

Typical govt, they can screw up and its still your fault. I think they were called the "untouchables". I have another name for them fing idiots.

How can a code infraction (despite your legit in doing the concrete) even br grounds for taking your car?

2 totally unrelared items...Might as well just evict a perso from their house...take away their kids into foster care, because they bounced a check!

Sounds like a mere money maker for the states doing that. My advise? MOVE!! Leave them states empty & screw tgem really it hurts....No incoming taxes!

And what happened to innocent until proven guilty? Your last line leans towards the government claiming your guilty, unless you can prove otherwise.

impounding by law enforcement or by wreckers and average joes? well if thats the case im waiting for someone to get shot trying to drive off with a vette or anything at all.

evidence of street racing? how the hell would they be able to prove **** like that? well i know for a fact no ones getting on base to impound my car.

seems like the only people its hurting are the ones that can afford to get their cars out, but then again im sure they sell them after a certain period

There's always another side to the story. That lady might be the neighborhood idiot (we all have one don't we?) who screams her Vette down the road no matter that it's a residential area and your kids are playing and you've personally complained to her to please slow down and she just looks at you with that 100 yard stare. Then you complain to the cops who go to the city council who enact an ordinance and her car FINALLY gets impounded and then we complain that the government is coming for us.

And the Chicago area that has the carrying a can of paint with intent to deface??? Good I'm sick of punks rolling around and spray painting my neighborhood with their south-of-the border gang B.S. Why do I have to live in their filth? If the cops can prove that they had "intent to deface" then good, take their car.

If you take a real look at the issues, the ordinances aren't meant to get your car and money. They're in reaction to citizen complaints. Rocklin Il, Noise ordinance to stop idiots with their 10,000 decibel bass blowing up your house when they roll low and slow or try to intimidate you or your wife and kids at the intersection.
Oakforest IL ? 37 offenses unrelated to driving? So what? It's forever been the law that if you're arrested from your car your car goes to jail too. The reason being, if the cop were to leave the car on the side of the road the State, City or County would be liable for when the other idiots cruise by and smash out the windows or steal the stereo.

Thats only if you are arrested not cited and most of those are offenses that only require a citation so they should not be impounding the car.

Here's the article; http://www.caranddriver.com/features...vehicle_column

There's no mention of anybody's car getting impounded for a non-driving related offense that could have been resolved with a citation. And the lady with the Vette, the city that impounded the car had to go to Superior court and get the judges permission after a hearing. No cop just heard about her racing and went to her house and impounded her car like the author of the article would have you believe. The amount of money the city spent pursuing that case far exceeded the amount they received in towing fees.

Everybody is fine with the towing as long as its not your car. I can gaurentee that if this was your car you would be angry as hell. I can tell you that if i had spray paint in my car it would probably get towed, not because I was going to tag something because I don't but because I'm a kid with a camaro. I don't see how they prove intent. And this doesn't touch on innocent until proven guilty, which is a joke in our court system. And since when has hearsay been admisable? The whole concept is ludicrous, and is "the law" was followed is illegal. What happened to no unreasonable search and seizure?

Yes, but it took over a year to get that court order. And then, the police didn't say how they suspected her of street racing. They just said they use tactics they didn't want to reveal. Also, notice it says that they associate the car to registered owner, not the driver.

So, if someone else uses your car and gets "suspected" of a violation, they take YOUR car and ding you $1100 to get it back. No questioning you to try to determine who was at the wheel or what the possible circumstances were.

And what happened to sending you a citation in the mail and letting you have the opportunity to fight it in court? After all, if they are using photographic evidence or undercover "eyewitness" officers, that would be the better thing to do. Just like the traffic light cameras.

There is mention that this can happen, and where, and why.

[quote] Yes, but it took over a year to get that court order. And then, the police didn't say how they suspected her of street racing. They just said they use tactics they didn't want to reveal. Also, notice it says that they associate the car to registered owner, not the driver.[quote]

The officer in Stockton wouldn't tell the author about the tactics. believe me, they would have told a Superior court judge everything. And again, can you imagine what was going on with the driver of the Vette for the cops to get a superior court order? Thats a @#$* pile of trouble to get one car....

I dont think CA has municipal courts anymore. I think the superior court system took them over.

[quote=Kevin84Z28;3826710]That is a possibility, that they had witnessed her Vette street racing on multiple occasions. Rather than bust her on the spot, they sought the court order. There's definitely some pieces of the puzzle missing as to what all went down.

Must live in Monrovia. They have a code that won't allow cars to just sit there not being used in view of the public or your neighbor.

There are a lot of towns with a vehicle abatement ordinance. Usually it has nothing to do with the car being used or not, it's wheather it's operable, registered or has a non-op on file. If it's an inoperable vehicle, it has to be in the garage. They can abate for inoperable vehicles in backyards and sideyards wheather there's cement or asphalt. Doesn't matter. The ordinace is allowed by the vehicle code which borrows from the Health & Safety code which has determined that inoperable vehicles are harbingers of rats and insects.

And is yet another worthless law we dont need. I know people who have rats and they arent in their cars, and the city will do nothing about it. So much for Health & Safety being a prime reason to handle issues, they'd rather have inane laws that dont do anybody any good.

So you'd rather have the car go to the crusher rather than be restored? What I have under a tarp in my backyard is not the government's business.

I wish they would pass, or enforce one of those laws where I live. I don't care about the rats and the bugs in those inoperable cars, its just the space they take up!

Almost nobody on my street uses a garage for their cars. People rent them out sometimes to whole families, and the neighborhoods aren't designed to hold so many people, which just causes more problems.

Someone across the street runs a body shop. His garage is a paint booth. Sounds cool in theory, but it's annoying to LIVE near someone hammering out dents day after day, (or using a truck and a rope to pull it out) usually in the street because his driveway is full of non running cars.

As a result of the crowding, there are always cars bumper to bumper on the street. Sometimes you have to tell people not to block your driveway. Some people actually put cones in front of their houses to save a space! And somebody always pauses in the middle of a street to talk to their friends, blocking your way.

The driveway holds 4 cars and we only have 2, so I have no trouble inviting friends over, but it is difficult when your loud neighbors and their friends park in front of your house, and then hang out there, at all hours, because thats the only place they can.

What a difference it is on street cleaning day, when everyone has to move! You can actually see when you drive around the corner. I think there are reasons for some of these laws.

And as for the street racing laws, it sounds unfair, and I'd have a conniption if somebody towed my car, but if that lady with the vette was me, wouldn't you say I had it coming?

I don't think the backyard is the problem. Sounds like they are talking about what's in the front yard, since that is in public view.

Tom K. got a ticket once because his truck wasn't pulled far enough into his driveway. If you've ever seen Tom's house, the driveway is very short. With the garage shut, I doubt the truck could pull in any closer.

Officer driving by sighted him for blocking the sidewalk. Lame.

I already had the same problem with the area parking where I live. My garage door broke so I had to park on the street, your given 8 days a month to park on the street. My car was towed and cost me over 200.00 to get it out.

Tustin wants to institute a city wide no parking from 11pm to 5am.
Chris's neighbor lives on a corner and his driveway is about 10 ft long. He wants to remodel the house but the city says he needs to move his garage back to provide 20 ft of driveway.

But what about grandma and grandpa who go for a walk and then have to walk in the street? or kids on bicycles who can't use the sidewalk? It's never the one car thats blocking the sidewalk is the 3, 4, or 5 and then you don't have a sidewalk anymore that people can use, you have driveway extensions. And backyards are a major concern. Too many people collect cars and store them in the backyard where they become nuisance's. Rats, bug, weeds,fire danger, loss of neighborhood home values.

There are a lot of areas that dont have sidewalks and people have to walk on the street. In residential areas it really shouldnt be an issue. Many areas use the driveways as ADA paths to access other streets and such, and add ramps as time and money permits. They're allowed to consider them as ADA, making the driveway blocking thing an inconvienence not illegal.

So is it possible to do? Hopefully that parking situation wont happen. In my area of Tustin is of course Assoc private property sorta and I found out if I get a disabled plate I can park outside for as long as I want and also my registration could also even be expired and they cant tow me. Found that out the other day but I only have to cars anyways but in certain situations I may someday need that parking outside.

Yeah please keep me informed on that new Tustin parking law, I would always love to be safe than sorry. 200.00 is 200.00 I could have used that money to get my Iroc back on the road .

This is very much a viable source of revenue for any city. For example: A while back I acquired an early 64 bug with a dry clutch. The tow truck driver parked it right in front of my house. No mystery of whom it belonged to. I have to say, the body needed some work like sanding it down and painting it but really had no visible rust unless to inspected it as the paint was still holding up. So I got my people's car secured (locked the doors and rolled up the windows) and left that afternoon for a 3 day business trip. As I am coming home excited to do some mods and see what this dry clutch is all about, I arrive to see it gone!! The city of Costa Mesa towed it because someone called it an eye soar. They didn't even knock on my door, call me, send a letter or any kind of notification to indicate that this should be removed to my garage or back yard.

I guess its just more bureaucracy to add to the list. Of course there are good applications to this law but it comes down to the police/city workers to apply it justly. The reality of the situation is that the city has a budget to look after and one way to create revenue is by implementing these kinds of fees. Another one is streetsweeping tickets oh those streetsweeping tickets. I'm sure we all have had at least one in our life time. Then there is parking meeters which seem to give you less for your quarter than you used to get and never underestimate the swiftness of the parking patrol with their hand held electronic ticket printer. Just to name a few.

The hungry beast needs to eat and it only has an appetite for dollars (tried to bribe him with a sandwich didn't work) !


Rabi C.

The city council doesnt really care if its possible or not, they are dead serious about passing that ordinance. I was at one of their meetings on a different subject a few weeks back and a guy was there wanting to complain about the proposed ordinance and that his property uses street parking as parking for his apartments as was agreed to when the place was built. A lot of the city is like that, but they dont care. They want residents cars off the street at night and thats the only people its going to hurt. I dont think any of the council was against it so you might want to get used to it or find a different city to live in.

They're having the meeting on September 2nd:
http://www.tustinca.org/documents/Pa...ceRevision.pdf

You sound like someone who LOVES HOA's.

This isn't a response to anyone in this post, it's just a response to people in general.


It shouldn't matter what or how many of something sits on your property. If something is sitting in a public right of way thats a different story, private property should be exactly that, private. And as far as something being an eyesore to someone else, that eyesore to you may be a thing of beauty to someone else, so get over yourself and leave others alone. Live and let live!

No, my house cost me, or is costing me $700,000. I don't want my neighborhood to become a ghetto, with everybody's "restorations" Put it in the garage. I get tired of seeing the cars on jackstands for months or years, Three family residences with 9 cars so they have to routinely park in front of my house. I know it's a public street, but give me a break. What it comes down to is if there were no rules or ordinances it would be even worse, even though we're complaining that it's a money maker for the city, don't do the crime if you can't do the time.

Really?, and if your next door neighbor wanted to raise his house and put in a tow yard, or gas station or mini mart or open a body shop on the side that would be O.K.? The fact is, in the pursuit of happiness you have to be considerate of your neighbors too.

Lol, don't you think you are blowing my statement abit out of proportion? For one thing to do any of those things you mentioned you would have to hire an civil engineering firm to draw up a set of plans for a zoning change to allow for the change in use to be submitted to the local planning & design commission for approval, lol.

I was speaking of uses allowed by the rules and regulations stated by a residential zoning development. Plus it would be really hard for my neighbor to do any of the mentioned considering I live in an apartment complex.

Sorry, I can get fired up sometimes.

700k sounds like an average home around here, I dont imagine its a whole lot different north of the bay. If you want to live with the rich, buy something more expensive or in a HOA. The cities need to stay out of it. Let the people who choose to live under strict rules live together in their own little perfect world and stay out of mine. NIMBY's are what is destroying things around here. When everyone has the same attitude and dont want certain things near them there are no places left and you end up with what we have today, lousy economy, high prices/cost, and uncontrolled pollution that the stupid and worthless EPA cant control anymore.

No Problem.

If we didnt get fired up, nothing would ever change. How boring.

$700k isn't special here in N.California, it's a little better than average. But I want to protect it. The items you point out, High prices, uncontrolled pollution, lousy economy are because of lack of goverment oversight not because of too much oversight. Take a look a cities that don't enforce any ordinances, they're usually pretty crappy, with poor schools, low property values and blight.

Unfortunately, Julie, that's a product of the wonderful people who live in your city.

But you can certainly call the AQMD and the EPA to report an illegal paint booth operating in your neighborhood. Think of all the children those harmful paint fumes are hurting!!!!

AQMD: http://www.aqmd.gov/phone/imp_phone_numbers.html

EPA: http://www.epa.gov/region09/lib-hot.html

Lack of government oversight? I dont think the EPA has any lack of oversight. The EPA is solely responsible for creating more pollution than we had, all in the interest of cleaning things up. They just chased it past our borders and made things worse.

We dont need government to protect us, thats really the root of the problem. Fact is, they cant. People are way too reliant on having someone else solve their issues, rather than just going over and talking to their neighbor and saying "Hey, that car has been sitting there a while. Mind moving it or selling it or something since you arent doing anything with it?" Communcation is an amazing tool, stay locked up in your house and just complain doesnt do a whole lot when nobody who needs to hear it does.

I don't know what you mean by the EPA causing pollution since it's an agency and not a corporation. In terms of air and water quality there is no question that things are better in the U.S. than say, 1975. I used to think that less government was key to successful business in America. But now that I look back to the deregulation of airlines, oil companies, energy, etc. I wonder, how did ENRON and TYCO get away with what they did? lack of over sight. I agree with you that you should ALWAYS try communicating with your neighbor to see if your issue can be resolved, but that doesn't always work and there has to be some kind of recourse. The rules have to be clear, consice and on the books so that everyone knows the rules. I imagine that most people agree because I don't think there is a city or county in California that doesn't have these ordinances.

The EPA is increasing pollution by chasing business out of the USA. The business dont go out of business they just cross the border into mexico or outsource the work to China.
The Salton Sea is polluted because of the pollutiants flowing into it from mexico.
Neither mexico or china or any of those third world toilets we are supporting have any kind of pollution controls.
If there is any such thing as man made global warming blame china and some others for screwing up our air.
A business in the USA has to contend with OSHA, Fed & State employee taxes, has to dedicate a 8 foot long wall for all the required posters for employee info, Workmans comp ins, and then along comes the EPA and here CARB.
If this business goes to mexico all they have to do is pay some mexicans one tenth of US wages to do the work. And with NAFTA the products come in duty free. So the business can rid itself of a mountain of paperwork, higher paid employees, and increase their profits by going to mexico. Doesnt take a rocket scientist to know the best deal there.
China, right now is the worlds biggest polluter and is firing up a new coal fired power plant every month and plans to do so for the next 5 years.
FYI, a local powder coating company, that has zero pollutants, has to have a nusience water collector tank and is inspected by the EPA every 3 months. The same testing that the EPA does is alos required by CARB. But guess what, CARB and EPA cannot share info this business owner has to have the tests done twice every quarter. He also hired a attorney to keep him abreast of new pollution laws so he doesnt get caught violating some new obscure law.
The EPA is the biggest cause of lack of manufacturing and high unemployment this country has.

Dont know about Fremont, but CARB is why GM closed South Gate and Van Nuys and Ford left CA too.

Enron, Tyco, and the current oil issues were caused by loopholes in Congressional laws created by lobbying money from people like... Enron, Tyco, Shell, Chevron.

The EPA forced production to places where its cheaper and easier to do business, China. They overregulated pollution so business just relocated to where the EPA cant control them. They're the problem.