Just curious what do you think would be the ultimate all-around fbody if you had the necessary time, money, resources.. here's my idea.. whats yours? Fiberglass body from vfnfiberglass.com weighs 115lbs. put some speedglass windows on there chop the top a couple inches and drop it onto a custom titanium or alum. chassis, alumminum small block with a dual carb blower,rear mounted T56 (like the corvette) or Th400 with gear vendors overdrive or a lenco, tubbed rearend/custom wheels 20x15, pirreli pzero tires, 4link out back? mustang 2 frontend? The car would remain "stock" looking on the outside except for the wheels and cowl hood, the engine/transmission would be mounted as low and as far back in the chassis as possible (dry sump setup). Keep the blower hidden under a 4-6" cowl hood.

Ummm.....if I had that kind of money I sure as hell wouldn't put it into a 3rd gen F-Body. I think I would have to buy a Porsche.

Because they have such good brakes huh?

Twin Turbo LS1

All-Wheel Drive

:hail: :hail: :hail:

Now that would be one bad@ss thirdgen.....

and coming right back down to reality....



depends.
id probly do several since you cant have one thats great at everything.

street
my vert... get a nice deep candy/metallic orange paint job. nice 400+ci FI SBC or a modded new larger displacement LS1... make it handle well, lower it a tad, some nice rims.... shave the handles, antenna, locks, gascap, do the tailight refil trick. LED rear lights, blackface/white number/ red needle stock 91 gages with a blue number/red needle at night..... ect.... a sh!tload of lil things. glass rear window, stereo system, but a nice enjoyable car to drive around everywhere that looks and goes good.

open road race.
this is where id get intresting.... a probly turbo big motor car... in a low drag firebird.... everything for high (220+) speed. goal is to get the world records for the open road races. the AVERAGE speed must exceed 220+ id like to have a car that i can maintain at 250-270 so that i can avg 235 and whomp the record. i think it could be done. if i had money..

drag.
the formula is pretty well set here. nothing too special, just your avg sub 9 sec street appearing all out drag car.

autoX
id probly use the street car for this, but otherwise, take a hardtop 91-92 car, and tweak it out for handling. minor mods on a rebuild L98 would work... goal is drivability, not all out power.. having a smooth motor with no "hit" is ideal coming out of the corner.





anyhoo, you need to be more specific. one mans "ultimate" is anothers crap.

something along these lines...

Turbo GTA

as seen in This Thread

91 or 92 Z-28

Single turbo (30 lb. boost) intercooled 422 ci LS-6 stroker, T-56, C4 IRS with 3.73 gears, ALL suspension upgraded, Mini-tubbed with 335/35/18's tucked under the rear fender wells 275/40/17's in the front, nice paint, recaro heated (full optioned) leather seats.

This one's going to be a T-tops or a vert (I already have a nice hardtop Z ).


Look for debut of the above project in late '04 - early '05



:lala:

Woah yeah that car looks like fun ;-) He should hit up bonneville sometime.

FLYNLOW92RS-an allwheel drive LS1 car will be more possible once those new gtos come out there will be parts available.

hmm a dreamt up 3rd gen.

id start with a 1992 Hardtop 5spd 305 TPI Z28.

have the unibody acid dipped, every seem stitch welded.
painted ultra blue metallic, underbody ford gray

custom alston/spohn subframe connector setup.

chromolly tubular K member w/ 4th gen power rack provisions
chromolly tubular A arms w/ spring perches & sway bar provisions
chromolly tubular adjustable torque arm
chromolly tubular adjustable lower control arms w/reloc brackets
chromolly tubular adjustable pan hard bar
chromolly tubular upper panhard bar
built 9 bolt rearend
1LE fuel tank w/ 255lph pump
bilstien sport struts/shocks
intrax 2" lowering springs
Corsa Exhaust
Fikse 17x10 FM5s
LS6 powerd
JBA headers
custom off road y pipe
tremec 5 speed
carbon fiber drive shaft
carbon fiber iroc/91-92 clone hood fitted with power blisters
aluminum inner bumpers
BeCool radiator
full MSD ignition with 3 stage rev limit
Mr Mikes black leather kit with matching black leather door skins
over head console
pro 5.0 shifter
white face 90-92 145/5500 gauges
custom chromolly strut tower bar
top of the line baer brake kit on all four corners

thats all i can think of right now

my dream camaro would be a 383 stroker with a supercharger, 4" cowled hood and 17" z-06 rims along with 3" exhaust.. oh and still be able to pass cali smog laws..

oh just remmebered, a 6-speed with 3.73 gears.

not much but i'd be very happy with that setup.

otherwise with all that money i'd invest in a dodge viper (dream car)

All you have to do is call up Kenny Dutweiler and ask for a 1500hp twin turbo 434, put it in a aerodynamically enhanced 3rd gen with a bulletproof drivetrain. Then beg Goodyear or Bridgestone to build you a set of ultra high speed capable tires. Buy a big insurnace policy and try for 300. Upgraded brakes and suspension would help also.

thats it? wow...


now will you fund my lil project?

TPIS Mini Ram 400+Stroker SBC with T56 and 3.73 12 bolt would be just fine with me! Biggest problem would be exhaust, fuel system and patience. Gotta have a clean install!!!!

Thats not an f-body anymore, thats a race car with 3rd gen body panels.

How about An 87 SC with lexan all the way around, stock body, fiberglass hood (lighter the better), the lightest suspension components on the market, stock interior minus the useless A/C, And a REAl nice Twin turbo 231 mated to a beefed up T5. Maybe a nice 150 shot for close encounters, True duals runnin off some 1 5/8 hedders, Flip switch cut outs, No ground kit, no spoiler, No visible exhaust means (turn em down).

You've already got 1 garage queen, do you really need another?

*poke poke*

Seriously, if I had a ton of money, my car would probably be very similar to Mike's (1bad91Z)

My Idea of a Ultimate F-body is a perfect balance of straightline, cornering performance,comfort and style. A car that can blow the doors of your best european supercar in a drag race, then take them on the track too. The exterior would be sleek, and mean looking. 91-92 ground effects with 18 inch rims, 10+ inch wide in back (possibly Z06 style with 10.5 inch rear)(also a second set of 2 piece billet wheels with slicks)(1st set for style and street, second for racing) 2inch drop, SS hood, dark tint, deep beautiful blue or black paint. Custom 1 piece headlights and clear headlight colors to increase aerodynamics. billet grille with center section removed for maximum airflow to the intercooler. Possibly some type of fender modification. all body pannels would be replaced with fiberglass equivalent pieces. I'd retain T-tops because I like them.

The front subframe would be replaced with a tubular setup with stock mounting locations. fully tubular front suspension of the best type. 13" front brakes with custom offset for 4thgen style wheels. Rear suspension will also retain is stock geometry with 12inch brakes, however will be completely replaced with new race style suspension. Wheel wells modified for wider tires. Fuel tank will be fuel cell style, custom made.

Engine will be LS-1 twin turbo fully redone internals for high PSI operation. Since there is SOOOOO many things you can do to an engine, I'll just say its top of the line, probably around 800hp.
Transmission would be modified T56.

Interior will be 98+ Z28 or SS interior, with reverse glow guages, and nice sound system. Also would have stand for a laptop. Racing seats, roll cage, racing harness.

So there we have it. a car that pulls 1.1+gs on the skidpad, 10 second 1/4 times, while retaining a full interior.

it would look roughly what my photoshopped sig looks like

ultimate 3rd gen F-body? in my humble, but extreme, barely streetable opinion.....

Assuming "unlimited" money, this would be the ultimate all-around:

Chassis:

-Interior stripped and seam welded
-Ed Quay 14-point cage
-Custom chromoly 3+ point STB
-Spohn & Alston SFCs
-welded doors

Suspension:

-custom chromoly front K-member
-adjustable anti-roll bars
-chromoly, spherical joint control arms, panhard bar, etc.
-Penske race shocks/Eibach ERS dual spring system
-AP Racing or Brembo huge front and rear brakes
-Speedline forged magnesium wheels, 17"
-Pirelli P-Zero Corsa tires, 275 front, 345 rear

Engine:

-CN Billet cross-bolted water cooled forged aluminum cylinder block, BBC pattern.
-4.5" hot torque plate honed finished bore size
-Crower or Callies fully counterweighted, 3.5" stroke, lightweight fully machined crankshaft, EN40B steel
-Mahle ultra-light Pro-Stock style strutted-skirt pistons, lightweight titanium pins
-Pankl titanium lightweight connecting rods
-Batten Corp. billet, 4 valve, DOHC heads; titanium valves, springs, hollow cams, roller followers, belt driven (yes they exist)
-Kinsler individual throttle body velocity stack intake manifolds, carbon fiber trumpets, individual injectors for each intake valve and port
-Motec engine management
-Burns Stainless custom made titanium 4:2:1 headers and dual exhaust dumping out of carbon drag muffler/collectors after trans

Trans and Drivetrain:

-Hewland 6-speed straight-cut sequential shift box, magnesium case.
-Quartermaster carbon fiber bell housing
-Tilton triple plate carbon fiber clutch and aluminum flywheel
-carbon fiber driveshaft
-Moser 12-bolt rear end

Body, Weight reduction:

-no A/C, interior, or luxuries of any kind; only power lexan windows that lower with keyhole switch from outside (welded doors, I've thought of it all except for how to make the money)
-custom carbon fiber hood, minimum cowl, with NACA ducts to feed each bank of individual throttle bodies
-custom metalworking of rear fenders to accomodate 345 tires (professional, old-school flaring job)
-replica of 1989 RS front bumper in carbon fiber, with strakes left in bare carbon fiber
-highest quality black paint job; deepest, slickest, wettest black

I figure I could rev it to 9500 every once in a while

Be naturally aspirated for blitzing response, no lag or bottle

Pull a supercar embarrassing amount of grip in my lowly live-rear axle dinosaur

And make a more evil engine note than all of them...

id get teh last ss but it would be a berger with a sc 427 all aluminum like the c5r or the 3rd stage but alot better. maybe the new zl1 stroked to 540 or so with 2 nice turbos or a nice centi charger. 6 spd of course t tops. it would have a shaker hood or the formula ram air 2 hood. 8 pt cage custom swing out bars. nice 12 in wide drs because yes i would be sponsored by mt. 12 bolt with 411s some nice houndstooth print recaros or sparcos full custom dash side mounted exhaust. and it would come with a lifetime warranty for everything. a nice stereo and alarm system too.

Well, if we're going to get totally crazy...I'd want to build a tubular chassis completely out of aircraft aluminum that could use all of a modern vette's suspension and engine and then I'd cover it all with carbon fiber body panels made to look exactly like a third gen Firebird. The interior would be done completely in leather, tweed, and aluminum and carbon fiber accents. About the only stock things I'd want to retain would be the front bumper/headlights, the rear bumper/tailights, and the dash. On the outside, everything would look completely stock.

The ultimate f-body is one that has full interior and a/c- basically retains all creature comforts- and wil out corner a C5 Vette in g's and slalom.

I have that.

I'm just lacking slightly in the HP deparment but am working on plenty for street use.

nice

Ultimate F-Body? CrazyHawaiian's 91 Z!

'73 Z28 with a 540" big block with a 8-71 on top with two Holleys, and a "rock crusher" 4 speed and big Cragar SS mags.

89irocz hardtop,
cage and full leather interior.
destroked 400, w/ a twin turbo setup and all forged bttom end. then going into a vettes trans axle for better weight displacment.

completly shaven and 100% carbon fiber body
have the rear end and front end tubed,
18"x10.5 and 19"x12" rims,
HID's in the front and true dual exhaust coming out of the turbos. one that is completled the car wopuld be painted candy blue and would sit so sweet and so nice that not a enzo would think of changling it.

I'm getting closer to this definition. But I'm going to clone the 92 Firehawk's 350.

Fully upgraded suspension, I mean everything, poly, tubular, etc.

Nice, beefy engine that gets 25+ MPG @ 500hp or so, and idles smooth.

Completely leather wrapped interior with ice cold ac with a fan that blows hard. Power everything with a LCD readout with engine diagnostics. Computer built in to house thousands of MP3's, movies.. etc. Sound deadened interior also. I mean, this car needs to be more like a E55 AMG, but with a thirdgen body.

Thats my ultimate thirdgen.

I'd take a 85-90 RS T-top car and do this:

all stock body panels
Moser 9" 35 spline 4.11
built TH400
Bill Mitchell 632 big block - 925HP 750 ft/lbs tq.
Weld Pro Star XP 17 x 9.5 in back 17 x 7 up front

believe it or not, i wouldnt want anything too wild

i also want the stock fx on my 89 RS

with a factory viper red paint job and the most heavy built chromed 350 i could get

along with a 6 speed and 17" tires

Stock-looking '83 Z28 with:

- '69 Corvette ZL1 (427ci) aluminum big block
- T56 Trans.
- 4.56 geared 12-bolt rear
- Big 4-wheel disk brakes
- '70 Challenger TA-style side exhaust

Ahh... most of it doesn't seem too hard to do... the engine might prove difficult to find though

A 89 formula with a 455 all the normal stuff, running a ati procharger, along with a twin turbo setup, with about a 150 shot of nos transplanting that to a rockcrusher pontiac 400 or possible the new manual trannys comming out, allready produced in the audi tt the twin clucth style trannys, one clucth does 1,3,5 gear and second clucth 2,4,6 what you get is a smooth shiffting

with a corvette independent transplanted rear , maybe chop the top 2 inches, semi tub it , big enough to run viper size tires,

yeah that be something :hail:

I've been building dream thirdgens in my head for 12 years now...

Using my 91 GTA:

Bored/stroked twin turbo Buick V6 1000+ hp
built TH700R4

or

427 SBC all-aluminum twin turbo 1000+ hp
T56 6-speed

C4 Dana 44 IRS
built adjustable suspension
huge Brembo brakes
Extensive lightening for sub-3000 lb curb weight

Admiral Blue exterior
Fiske FM10 Profil wheels Gloss Black powdercoated with polished lips (17x9f, 17x11r)


Basically, something completely street legal that corners like a Lotus in the turns and will easily embarrass McLaren F1s in accerlation at any speed. Top speed isn't that big of a priority, but probably around 220mph. A hyper-exotic car killer.

There's some pretty good ideas here Here's mine:

Drivetrain:
LS1 built to 427ci
2 turbos
True dual out the back
Cotes spherical rotary valve heads
10,000rpm redline (sick aren't I?)
HP and TQ - enough
99+ plastic gas tank
C5 rear transaxle
T56
ZeroShift mod on trans (www.zeroshift.com discussed on camaroz28.com's 5th gen board)

Chassis & sus:
Rollcage, stitch weld and SFC to stiffen things up
Biggest brakes behind stock wheels (sleeper)
Tubular front K-member, custom double A-arm suspension w/ coil overs
1" drop
EDIT: forgot to say I'd replace the steering box with a rack!!

Body:
Taken down to metal, repainted and all panels put back to factory shape, replacing as possible w/ fiberglass or carbon fiber
Carbon fiber hood - that look stock
Lighten thing down to a max of 3000lbs w/full tank w/o driver
accurate gauges in stock location + boost, egt, etc
Redo interior, replace cracking/ broken interior trim
race harness


It can corner, go straight (really fast, more highway racer than 1/4 mi), and pick up grocerys just for fun

T56 and trans axle would make a killer set up 12 gears. lol. tough that would be something unqe to drive if it was done.

I was reading through that site and it seems more theory and vaporware than anything else.

Hmmm, while I admit 12 gears would be cool, what I meant to mean was the T56 version of the transaxle as opposed to the autocrapic version.


If you look here over at camaroz8.com's 5th gen disscussion board, there was a huge thread/ picking apart of it. Basically I'll take the guy's word for it b/c
a) he's not trying to sell it to people sight unseen
b) they're still getting the patents in order, so they understandably can't divulge all the details
c) the guy drives a TVR, how cool is that??? (well thats not really a reason, but its still cool )
d) once you got past the marketing fluff everything sounded legit.

only time will tell I suppose

All i want is maybe 350 horsepower and a T-56 transmission. I like my car how it is.

Rather than focus on the build-up here's what I want.

1000 HP (at 4k lbs. same power to weight ratio as a Ferrari Enzo)
0-60 in the low 3s
1/4 in the 11s (not a strip car, but can hold its own)
pull redline (6500 or more rpm) on a T56 .52 sixth gear and a 3.23 rear
lateral acceleration of 1.2 on a 200 ft. pad
60-0 in 100 ft. (as quick as any Porsche)
Structural reinforcements that don't impede access to the back seat (otherwise why have a Camaro - get a VETTE!)
30 gallon fuel cell in the rear (we ain't carrying NUTHIN'!)
Nice stereo for those days when I let folks look

What's the best way to accomplish this? Who knows. But if I could I surely would.

My "ultimate" would be more for street than some of the monsters you guys are building.

- Nice and strong 3500hp/350ci Gen 1, maybe even keep the TPI
- A professionally built 700R4 and 9" that can take a bit of abuse but not done so they're too much for everyday use if need be
- True dual exhaust
- Boxed rear LCAs
- Tubular panhard rod
- Larger discs, and discs all alround
- Spohn SFCs
- Excellent paint job: white, with maybe the silver gfx like the earlier TAs

91-92 Triple black convertible trans am.

427 small block
single turbo, twin intercooled at around 25-30 psi mac boost
HSR manifold, small shot (75-100) for purging and looks
BIG AFR heads, all forged internals

Adjustable tubular everything I can get my hands on
2.25-2.5" lower ride height with 900lb/210lb fr/r springs
C5 IRS/Transaxle
18x10 fr, 18x13 rear Black Z06 wheels/polished lip and fender well clearencing
Rear roll pan, flat door handles, shaved locks

10pt cage/covertible specific SFCs; 5pt simpson harness

2 12" speakers mounted where rear seats go. 5-7" LCD screen mounted in console w/ diagnostic and stereo controls.

Quad Bi-Xenon Projector conversion.

Molding rear spoiling endcaps from metal.

Blah blah blah blah...

a 91 Trans am Hard top (black)
383 TPI t-56
lowered 1.5 all around 17x10 chrome 5spoke wheels

Ok, I'm assuming we'd all start with our own cars, so mine would be a 91 Firebird, ghost flamed jet black, or cobalt blue, with the GTA body kit and ram air hood, aero belly pan and full ground effects, with a few lightweight replacement panels, like hood, rear hatch and fenders, and a full cage . Huge flaming chicken decal of course. Frame would be beefed up with aluminum box members, and suspension would be full racing tubular pieces. Got to have racing seats, and harnesses.

Stump pulling rear gears and posi, Brembo brakes all round, and extra wide chrome Centerline Torq Thrust whees, fatter in the back to handle a 1200hp supercharged LS1 (there was one featured in Hot Rod magazine a couple of months ago), with 200hp of nitrous on tap. Ideally the car would do 8 sec. quarters, and be able to hit 200+mph. Of course, the guy that had the 1200hp motor also had wheelie bars and a parachute, so I might need those as well--make the wheelie bars retractable for when you get on the freeway. Don't forget the insane sound system from hell, and the cup holders.

Ok, I could go on and on. Even if I never got all that stuff though, I'd stll love driving my car. Saw a few 3Gs on the freeway tonight, wide low and fast, something cool in a sea of boring metal boxes. Made me proud, dang it.

ok well id have it maxed in hp and to some it up in a few words A LOT OF CHROME! maybe some blue flames and it would be really awesome if the chrome couldnt get fingerprins or anything on it

Hmm, you're going to need a LOT of decals to get 3500HP out of a 350 TPI

Very nice indeed. Do those even exist?

Anyways, since we're all dreaming, I'll do the same:



92 Camaro Vert
Black ext / gray int / Blk top
LS6 w/ a turbo and matching auto tranny
Ford 9" with 3.42's
Sportlines with Boyd's wrapped with some BFG KD's
Bilstien HD's
Spohn susp.
Wilwood brakes
Kenwood sound w/ Sirius
and the red taillight mod

What can I say, I'm a simple man to please.

hmm the unitmate f-body, 91-92 z28

ss-hood, full 4th gen interior, c5-r twin turbo, 6 spd, ford 9 " ,fully upgraded suspension and brakes, draglites, painted either jet black, or sunset orange metallic, fully function A/C cruis control, and got 100 mph while running 9's in the 1/4

single turbo ls1 bored and stroked with a shot of juice....water cooled....about 15psi....some sorta custom 6 speed...prob a custom C5-like ind. diff. .... ehhh forget it.... ferrari with a camaro body customized to fit it.... hehe

Something like this...
Screw it, I can't get it to the web.

Ultimate F-body you ask-



This should be a conversation ender- Here's my choice:

http://www.zap16.com/images/hvh_f16_...birds_no_8.jpg