Bilstein Vs. Koni vs. each other - Third Generation F-Body Message Boards

slow_90firebird · 05-18-2008, 08:03 PM

Alright, I am confused, so lets clear this up for once and all.

First of all, how do bilsteins and koni compare? Like, in terms of quality, performance, life, and ride comfort (yeah that is important to me).

Now-

Bilstein offers the "Sports" and the "HD" shocks. What is the difference?? I believe the price is the same.

Also-

Koni offers the "Red" and the "Yellow." Besides the yellow's being adjustable, is there any other difference? Like does one do a better job with controlling stiff springs, does one last longer, does one ride better?

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racing geek · 05-19-2008, 12:35 AM

I wish I could help answer some of these questions but I dont have the first hand experiance needed to help you.

I never really considered Bilstein because they can't adjust from a softer ride on the street to a really stiff ride for the autocorss events I attend. That left Koni and KYB. I like the lifetime warrenty on the Koni's so I figured I would pay the extra for the lifetime service from Koni and have a part that is better suited for what I plan to do. That, and everyone on here is going nuts about how great the Koni Yellows are.

If I'm not mistaken, aren't the Bilsteins more expensive than the Koni Yellows?

tilstad · 05-19-2008, 06:33 PM

I believe you could put the Koni's and the Bilsteins in 2 different categories. Bilsteins being the maximum handling for a street vehicle, not totally compromising comfort, while the koni's are the full race, not considering comfort at all.

I have only had bilsteins, so, I cant say anything other than the handling was the best I've ever experienced, in any car. And the comfort level was very good. the short stiff springs I had at the time, was the biggest contributor to uncomfort when going over speedbumped roads. All other driving, it was awsume. Note that this was not a thirdgen vehicle.

I currently consider getting bilsteins/and/or airbags. Koni's is said to be too harsh by some, for street use. THe construction of them is quite different as I understand it.

Maybe some Koni drivers could chime in?

jjlabinski · 05-19-2008, 06:51 PM

They are adjustable...dont run them dead soft though you will feel it. A good set of tires will compliment the Koni's

Jeff

racing geek · 05-19-2008, 07:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jjlabinski

They are adjustable...dont run them dead soft though you will feel it. A good set of tires will compliment the Koni's

Jeff

What do you mean when you say "dont run them dead soft though you will feel it"?

2.8RS · 05-19-2008, 08:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by racing geek

If I'm not mistaken, aren't the Bilsteins more expensive than the Koni Yellows?

Actually I believe that they are about the same prize.

tilstad · 05-20-2008, 04:41 AM

I think the OEM car manufacturers, when dveloping a "sport" kit or hndling kit for a car model, often end up with Bilsteins if they want the best handlig, and also some level of comfort. That should say something. Same as the Eaton compressor vs the Roots I guess.

slow_90firebird · 05-20-2008, 03:56 PM

Well, thats why I ask these questions. Because, arent the koni reds supposed to be made for daily driving?

And I imagine that the yellows, being adjustable, would be able to soften up a certain amount.

I have also heard that bilsteins have a 2yr life, and no warentee.

tilstad · 05-21-2008, 02:39 PM

From Bilstein.com pages;

"ThyssenKrupp Bilstein of America warrants its gas pressure shock absorbers against defects in workmanship and materials for as long as you, the original purchaser, own your car.

If at any time after purchase or installation, the shock malfunctions and Bilstein determines it to be defective, we will either replace it or repair it."

Good enough for me, I don't plan on selling the car.

http://www.bilstein.com/warranty.php

TheScaryOne · 05-21-2008, 03:45 PM

Don't the Blisteins need to be modified to fit? I remember reading where someone had to do some clearancing to get them not to rub.

91_5.7_TPI · 05-21-2008, 08:30 PM

If you use anything other than stock springs and don't revavle them, you'll have some pooie shocks in a short time. I think that the KONIs/Pro-Kit are little too stiff for most people on the street, but I love the handling. I think with the right springs, they would be ok. I am going to try the stock WS6 springs I have and see how things go. I like the adjustability with them though. I use mine on full soft when I'm on the road, and bump them up when I want to play or go auto-x. I think that the Reds may also be adjustable, but I'm not sure. If you want a 'nice' riding car with nice handling, I would get a set of IROC Moogs and the Bilsteins (which ever is the ones more tuned for handling). I'd actually be interested in seeing how my KONIs work with the WS6 springs. Once I get this done, I'll report back. Might not be a bad combo.

slow_90firebird · 05-21-2008, 10:56 PM

Well the reason I want the Pro-kit is because the stock springs sit wayyy to high for my taste. The 1" drop will help that enough to look good, however should retain some ground clearence. I wish they made springs with the same type 1" or 1.25" drop, but with similar rates to the WS6 springs. Then I could have nice wheel gap, and still have a nice ride with decent handling.

---

From what you guys say, the Bilsteins sound like the way to go. If they ride nice, I dont need the adjustability. Which ones are the better ones though, "sport" or "HD" ???

Also, why would I need to re-valve them? I thought that being nice shocks, they were supposed to be able to handle the 1" drop?? If not, then I will get the KONIs. I am not gonna pay $700 for new shocks, just to have to send them to someone else to get re-valved! Thats crazy talk!

TheScaryOne · 05-21-2008, 11:50 PM

Or you could go at it the old fashioned way and have a local shop start slicing off coils from a new WS6/IROC spring until you're at the height you want! If you go this route, do not use the CC### springs from Moog. They're variable rate, and if you cut them, it messes things up.

RacerX13 · 05-22-2008, 12:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slow_90firebird

Well the reason I want the Pro-kit is because the stock springs sit wayyy to high for my taste. The 1" drop will help that enough to look good, however should retain some ground clearence. I wish they made springs with the same type 1" or 1.25" drop, but with similar rates to the WS6 springs. Then I could have nice wheel gap, and still have a nice ride with decent handling.

---

From what you guys say, the Bilsteins sound like the way to go. If they ride nice, I dont need the adjustability. Which ones are the better ones though, "sport" or "HD" ???

Also, why would I need to re-valve them? I thought that being nice shocks, they were supposed to be able to handle the 1" drop?? If not, then I will get the KONIs. I am not gonna pay $700 for new shocks, just to have to send them to someone else to get re-valved! Thats crazy talk!

The Koni reds are adjustable too. Here's a chart that illustrates the difference between the yellows and the reds-

http://www.tirerack.com/suspension/k...ialvssport.jsp

Don't waste your money on the prokit, and don't buy the Moog springs either-the rears aren't right for any of the high-perf cars (IROC,WS6). Here's a little logic for you-if your cars springs were worn out it wouldn't sit so high. Cut a half a coil off your stock springs and get the Bilsteins or the Koni reds and maintain the balance of the WS6 spring rates, and save some money. As long as you don't get the springs too hot while cutting them they will be just fine(don't use a torch).

Matthew91-Z28 · 05-23-2008, 01:40 PM

I run Koni reds and prokits in my kidney-busting convertible. I have them on the softest setting here in Austin texas because the streets suck. There are some streets I wont even drive down in certain residential areas. What previous people have said, it can be a rough ride.

I cant say what bilstein/prokit would be like compared to soft setting Koni/prokit. I havent run them.

I can tel you my car handles like a beast (but thats along with every other suspension mod in my sig).

slow_90firebird · 05-23-2008, 06:35 PM

Well, I definately dont want to cut springs. Especially not the ones that are stock. The stock springs would be my last resort if I dont like the eibachs.

So what is the concensus on the bilsteins / koni's needing to be re-valved? Do they, or will they work right out of the box?

2.8RS · 05-23-2008, 06:38 PM

I think that Konis are fine with lowered cars, may want to double check on that. But I do know that the Bilsteins need to be revalved for sure.

91_5.7_TPI · 05-23-2008, 09:02 PM

The Bilsteins are designed to operate with at stock ride height. Changing that makes them wear out like any other shock, just not as fast as the cheaper brands. Their vavling would be better as well, I assume. I'm pretty sure the KONIs are designed to work with different ride heights and stiffer spring rates than the Bilsteins. That's why they are prefered by auto-crossers and road course drivers. I would get them if I were you and see how you like them with the stock springs. Cutting the stock springs is fine as long as you do it correctly. I would get a spare set or two for cheap and experiment.

RacerX13 · 05-23-2008, 09:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slow_90firebird

So what is the concensus on the bilsteins / koni's needing to be re-valved? Do they, or will they work right out of the box?

Only for racing applications.

For what you're doing and what you want you would probably be happier with the Tokiko Illumina's, and you can buy them with the matched lowering springs for about half the money of the Konis and Eibachs.

Kennerz · 05-23-2008, 10:28 PM

I have the pro-kit and Bilstiens. It hugs turns but I believe the handling to be a little off. I had a choice between the two (koni and Bils.) and chose Bilstien - I wish I would have gotten the Koni's, as they would do a much better job of controlling the pro-kit springs.

I have koni's on my SS, and they are way better than the bilstiens it came with.(I know not apples to apples)

either way I have the bilstiens made for a lowered car (sports I believe, the only difference between sports and HD's is the rear shock is like 3/4 shorter I think - the fronts are identical according to shox.com)

and yes Konis do ride hard but very controlled, but the handling they provide is worth it IMHO. Off the shelf Bilstiens are not in the same league as Koni yellows.period.

I'm actually gonna eventually call sam strano and see if he has a better option than the pro-kit springs. They look good on the car but def. don't handle as good as stock Iroc springs. Anyone who tells you a pro-kit handles better than a stock spring/bilstien set up is either lying or doesn't have experience with anything better IMHO.

If you go pro-kit get the Konis.