SlickTrackGod

Ramey, I would HIGHLY suggest you refer that everyone weld it. The single bolt hole area (*OEM shock bolt location) is outside the strength of the spring pocket. Now all the weight of the car's rearend is directed right into those single bolt holes on each side of the rear chassis rather than on the stronger OEM uper spring pocket. By not welding that plate to aid support for the location next to the hole. the force will still be driected to the hole and the other end of the plate will in fact eventually teeter totter and progressively wobble faster and faster the more slop that results. It will come on quickly and then flop over and the OEM shock hole will punch right through. That plate has to be welded.

by making the plate larger, it gives a more spread out area to stitch weld the plate into the chassis sheet metal and not overheat the area trying to be welded- thus of course buckling it or even punching through it with excessive heat buildup when trying to weld it.

I would put 4 tacks about 1/2" llong around the centter circle and about 6- 1" welds around the perimeter of the wider plate style like spohn is showning. He laser cut the production run 10 years ago to fit exactly into the can area. My prototype was done by hand and almost that large but not as percise.

SlickTrackGod

stitch weld installation example

articwhiteZ

iTrader: (56)

Ladder bars.
9"
29 tall slicks
blown and injected big horsepower engines
rear coilovers
front coil overs
tubular K members
no sway bars.
pizza cutters up front
Candyman Candyman Candyman...lol
drag cars dont fall apart...we crush parts!

RaverRacerX

lol wut?

Alice89

iTrader: (6)

wtf? This is a needed part. Welding it would be cheap insurance.

The factory rear shock mounts pulled out on my old z28 after I installed kyb's. I had to weld the area up. Just because you have never seen it happen doesn't mean it has not happened.

Having an entire coil over in the same general area? Your going to need to beef up the factory shock mount.

STG's suggestions are valid.

SlickTrackGod

Read that and had no idea what arctic was saying- but from your interpetation it sounds like he is being condesending to me. Resaon I do not post here much anymore because too many childish *******s

I gave some first hand knowledge to UMI. If arctic doesn;t want to heed my caution for safety then he can find out the hard way.

bye

SlickTrackGod

In light of recieving several emails and a few pms telling me to disregard this guy, I find it funny I have to always remind a few somewhat seasoned individuals on here about my credentials. I happen to know quite a bit about chassis bracing in real world usage. I do alot more than most of you know about- but it seems people always want to trust a shop selling parts as more creditable than I- because hey- they build the stuff.

Here a little preview of what I have been building for someone the last two weeks. Its an old nova but I am building into a touring car street racer. I am fabricating the chassis support for scratch in the almost 50 year old unibody.
It's the white Nova on the lift to the right.

midnightfirews6

iTrader: (1)

Agreed. And how many people have had air shocks punch through throughout the years? I thought it was common knowledge that the rear shock mounts on most unibodies were suspect when putting that much force on them.

That "someone" is lucky. Looks great.

UMI Sales

We have a few other bolt-in parts that we recommend welding. I plan to do the same for the instructions included with the coilover kit. Sound advice.

Thanks Dean.

ramey

SlickTrackGod

As always, I am always here to help with facts and safety, and people spending their money wisely. I appreciate your courtesy. Please just understand the flucrum that develops with the double shear mount onto the plate as this oem hole weakens- the fulcrum will develop at the base of the mount nearest the edge facing the large side of the plate. The plate will then rock if not welded. As it rocks, the shock force will be dirrected off center of the OEM mount and the fulcrum will increase upon every compression and rebound stroke cycling it.

I hope I explained that comprehensively - I sometimes confuse myself in re-reading what I am trying to describe..lol

If a chassis is in good shape, this will last a while before this ultimately happens, but once theOEM bolt hole starts to elongate and this area presses upward, the fulcrum that develops will rapidly set in and failure will be quick. You will obviously heere noise back there, but the average person is not so savoy to jump right into diagnostic then stop the car and tow it home.

Unlike a conventional shock, this area is now holding the complete weight of the rear chassis. Failure would cuase the car to drop and an accident could easily ensue. As midnight stated above, this has happened may times with the use of airshocks that up the value of how much thethis area hold the chassis and reduces the spring carrying load.---however, the springs are still in tact upon failure of this area with an airshock. This is a coilover, with no more conventional spring to fall upon. I would still recommend 100% weld instulation.

SlickTrackGod

Yes in deed. If you look closely in that first picture- to the left of vetruck, you iwll see a 2 car garage inside of the main garage. Yes "a garage inside a garage". This is the lower service garage and also where he parks his greyhound motorhome. The upper house courtyard houses all the showcars in each of their separate garages that are climate controlled. Must be nice, but I could never srcew people to be that wealthy and sleep at night. Its a friend of a firend's house. This guy is ruthless. but generous if you are a friend. (I plan to stay in that later catagory)
Myself, Gary, and Lenny (Lenny is a lifelong friend. It's Gary's house- friend of Lenny's for 40 years) We are LennyHaulin'- But notice only the young guy is dirty. Too many bosses on this ranch with one worker...lol

92BLKL98

Sounds like a great bunch of guys to be associated with. Your advise is very much appreciated and should be heeded. I can't imagine driving very far without welding the plates in.

UMI Performance

Can we please keep this thread on track regarding the actual product?

I would really appreciate it.

Thank you.

articwhiteZ

iTrader: (56)

Some guys just dont under stand the English language..lol.
i would like to say. you guys at UMI have made some Fantastic parts for us guys who do have Race cars. and Nice street cars.
and some of s do drive 9 and 10 sec cars on the street....and they dont fall apart...

robertfrank

iTrader: (27)

I have a question regarding the upper mount. Like Dean said welding would be preferable when installing the upper mount but couldn't holes be drilled in all four corners of the mounting plate.and it be bolted in that way?

UMI Sales

I'm sure Dean will chime in but I'll mention. There's a bunch of folds up top there that are hard to get to. You could drill the holes easily but they go into a cavity that you can't access...

robertfrank

iTrader: (27)

Ah gotcha. Of that i was not aware.

Gregs_GSXR

silly kids, coil overs are great for the track not the street or for summer DD. All your cars weight on a single bolt...

SlickTrackGod

You could not have made a more rediculous statement. The lateral forces on the A-arm bolts.....the torque thrust and braking thrust on the LCA bolts, the lateral force on the panhard bolts-

...which are all the same diameter bolts as the coilover bolts in the same double shear mount position...on millions of OEM street car applications.

Gregs_GSXR

these cars are not designed for coil overs.... like i said they are fine for the track, and race cars, that usually get tore down, inspected either after every race or a race day. Today cars are designed to run coil overs.

I've seen what happens on coil overs that are ran on a street car...

FRMULA88

HENCE THE NEED FOR THE ADDITIONAL REINFORCING PLATES

I plan to make this conversion in the near future.

I like this double shear design and a few minutes with a MIG to stitch weld the upper support plates is not big deal.


When will UMI bring a front kit to market? Otherwise I will have to use another brand.

I am going to taller rear & front tires, so this will help adjust & fine tune the ride height a lot better than cutting coils on my drag car.

Regarding the rear end: what kind of settings would I be looking at to establish a 50/50 baseline like my Lakewood rear shocks. is it as simple as setting each dial to the "halfway" mark?

Regarding the front end: I am very happy with my 90/10 drag struts, but I don't like the lack of ride height adjustment. ( I would like my front end 1-2" higher) would the front kit be offered as a retrofit so we can re-use existing struts?

UMI Sales

We have a front prototype kit on our IROC but it's pretty low on the priority list at the moment.

With a double adjustable damper you can make it 50/50 comp/reb on all 19 clicks. For example a 3/3 or a 14/14. You can also split them for various handling disciplines.

FRMULA88

great to know, but the only handling characteristics I care about are the 60' times and keeping the car in the groove.

If I do the rear to coil overs, obviously I want to do the fronts as it will help
dial in the ride height.

DBLTKE

iTrader: (1)

Would it be possible to order this kit minus the dampers if we so choose to supply our own?

92BLKL98

I'm sure the UMI guys are partial to their kit for obvious sales reasons but, you guys who do have 3rd gens with coil over set-ups how do you like them as a daily driver?

articwhiteZ

iTrader: (56)

Are you doing anything to stop rust under the powder coat.the smallest chip the stuff just rust away.

UMI Sales

We can use the double adjustables to fine tune. For example, if you need the "weight transfer to stay back longer", you can add rebound two clicks at a time. A Viking (or other brand of DA) will allow this type of tuning.

Homer23

Are there Viking front struts for sale now? I would like to buy Viking front struts and rear shocks, not a coilover system if I can help it.

UMI Performance

I will have to check and find out. I haven't heard anything from Viking on them so I am guessing not yet. I will see how far out they are.

Thanks for asking,
Ryan

92BLKL98

UMI Guys,

OK after much deliberation over selling my Z I decided to keep it and install the Viking coil over kit. I have installed the kit as part of the replacement of my rear end. I do believe the upper bracket will tend to rock fore and aft in service, I can see it moving to some extent with me under the car horsing on it. Remember these cars are the flexible flyers. First off guys interested in this kit asked about welding in the upper support bracket, if so the spring/shock assembly is no longer serviceable. There is no clearance to remove the upper shock bolt. I believe this kit needs a little more engineering to remove the welded upper shock mount from the upper support bracket so it can be welded in the spring pocket then the mount is to be bolted through the bracket and original shock hole. There was a question about bolting the bracket in (with this kit a better idea). You mentioned drilling into an inaccessible void. There is a weep hole in the center of the original spring pocket. I am going to investigate using a hole saw to open this hole to access the upper void to install about four bolts around the perimeter of the bracket. The bracket is 3/4 inch wide in this area and with 1/4 bolts it has enough material to still have fastener diameter edge distance. This may be a viable solution to this issue.



Otherwise I am going to cut the shock mount from the UMI piece and bolt a new mount through the support bracket so I can weld the bracket in the car. I agree with SlickTrackGod and others on this thread about the issues involved.

This is not really a big deal to me at this time since the car is down for an LS1 engine upgrade and I am restoring a lot of the car. I don't plan on driving it for about a year.

This is a pretty nice kit but I feel there could be a little more engineering to be a great product, I bought this over the Spohn kit because his lower brackets were not as quality a part as I felt yours is. If you could combine your lower bracket design with his weld in upper bracket you would have a well designed kit.

One question I have: When servicing the car on a two post jack can these shocks take the abuse where the suspension hangs out of the car. I have been careful to support the axle since installing the coil over kit but Joe Bob at the tire store will not be so careful.

UMI Sales

As with any 1st design product, we are always learning and considering upgrades (although far away at this point). Think iPhone 5 --> iPhone 5s.

We routinely let our cars hang by the shocks when up on jack stands but don't abuse them when doing so. I'd have to check with Viking to be sure. Of course the more careful you are the better. We've never had a problem.

ramey

92BLKL98

OK Ramey, how 'bout this, after spending a little time under my Z tonight I realized bolting in the mount to be too much on the car. Either 1. I cut through the original spring pocket and then a second hole through the sub frame to access the top side for fasteners, not an option. 2. Cut through the upper floor pan for access, um no. or my preferred: 3. You guys send me a pair of upper bracket assemblies without the welded on shock mount (at no charge to me) for me to weld in the car with a set of shock mounts to mount the coil over and I send back the complete upper mount assembly I have. As it stands like it is I agree with you about 1st design products, time for version 2 of the design.

One more issue you need to look at the hole that fits around the spring pocket, it needs to be opened up maybe 1/16 of an inch or at least chamfer the inside to allow the bracket to lay flat against the spring pocket for welding otherwise getting a sound weld is difficult.

92BLKL98

I have decided to go ahead and run the coil-over kit as designed and after a couple of thousand miles remove them and inspect everything in the spring pocket area and go from there. It's not like the car is going to be trail riding (ie Dukes of Hazard style) but I need to get off this and move on to the rest of the restification.

articwhiteZ

iTrader: (56)

HHuuummm zink. no rust.


just powder coating dont cut it anymore. ya need to plate and powder coat.
to zink plate a tube K member was $25.(cheap!) then had it re coated..good for the life of the car at this point.

//<86TA>\\

iTrader: (14)

You could use swedgeform screws to "bolt" the upper plate in. The metal is thick enough to use them.

Bradlyj8Z28

iTrader: (2)

I have a mini tub. No spring cup anymore. Can I cut the plate to fit and weld the remaining piece in place?

UMI Sales

The upper teardrop mount is mild steel so any fabrication you'd want to attempt would theoretically be possible. Really what you need is material around the original upper shock hole. If part of the spring cup is gone you'd have to make sure there's enough structure in that area to support whatever part of the double shear bracket you weld in.

ramey

customblackbird

iTrader: (15)

Is there a part number break down for your QA1 kit? I like those brackets and wonder if they can be purchased separately?

articwhiteZ

iTrader: (56)

i would have to take a look tonite. and see.
i have picked up QA1 and UMI's rear Mount brackets.as i like parts from both. and put together a set ill use on my car.

this is untill i back half the car. ($12.000) sending the car over to fife WA
To Mr art morrisons shop..soon

88bullet

How much can you lower the rear end with these over the stock ride height

UMI Sales

The standard p/n kit can sit on the bump stops or go almost to stock ride height. We have the base kit crowded more in to the slightly lowered range.

To get the perfect shock length we can also send in stages. Brackets first. Then you measure center to center at perfect ride height then we follow up with the correct length shock. This method works great with drag cars with big slicks or ultra low cars.

ramey

support@umiperformance.com

TEDSgrad

iTrader: (4)

Rear Coilovers:
Stock is the DS703 specs.
Jri specs listed are DSE's 3rd Gen designed specs.

Generally, per the operating range of the shock, you can get 1/2"-3/4" adjustment either way and still be in operating range of the shock. Buy the proper shock for the intended range!
Please don't think you can buy a stock spec coilover, lower the ride height 2" (to 14" 'cause seller says you can), then have the collapsed height at 12". Not only will you get poor performance, you're likely to blow the seals.
People will always sell ya - NOT saying Ramey will. Make an informed choice. For disclosure, I have the RideTech's.

QwkTrip

iTrader: (22)

The guy protects a fuel line by wrapping it in rock guard, and then just zip ties an unprotected, constant live B+ wire to a conductive fuel line all the way from the front of the car. freakin' Darwin Award coming right there....

UMI Sales

That's actually an unused nitrous line but agree.