Ronny

if this is of any help? i wanna say 7/2003 i swapped in my 7747 as my mods disallowed use of stock tune. i worked on getting the car drivable. it was a sad tune situation. choke function-idle speed-data logged when in closed loop, tip in, accelleration enrichment, etc. after about 60 days of logging(with Doms help TY) and burning(with Doms help TY) mutiple chips(20?) i took car to dyno. they logged HP/TQ and most importantly WOT A/F as i did not own WB. it so happens my PE was commanded to 12/1 and the WB showed 11.9 and 12.1 on two runs. that was 10/2003. very warm day and high humidity. some of that was luck. FP at 13 lbs BUT had 80 lbs injs. so lack of FP offset buy large injs? had i not optimized my underlying CL tune i would not have been able to hit the commanded PE. so if you have the bases covered and have a grasp as to fueling needs(FP/inj size)i will presume the PE may fall in line. today(car stored nov) my tune is off on PE. 13.3/1 on WB. running 17.5 lbs FP. but general drivability is pretty good. and car moves out OK. underlying tune optimized yet PE off? so that just goes to show i can fuel Ok at lower rpms but not 6000. prior mods car spun 5000(phase 1). i need to up FP to 20 and start over. need to work on that PE in spring!

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Dominic Sorresso

Ron,

Great point. I had a great tune using 10.5fp. But we put Grumpy's WB on the car at a PowWow and it showed over 14AFR starting at 4000rpm. Now the FP is at 20psi. Re-tuned the entire VE table and couldn't have done the WOT tuning without the WB and RBob's extended VE tables.

Ronny

it is difficult to tune WOT on xway. telephone poles look like a picket fence. for some of us anyway !!

cars get in way and all that. maybe the dyno or dragstrip is the safest route.

Dominic Sorresso

Ron,

I picked out a couple of straightaways, particularly following an on-ramp. Several have fairly long merge lanes. Make sure I'd be there in third gear at about 2000rpm and a steady TPS, then slammed it to redline.

TierAngst

I knew I could get a close tune without a WB but I was talking a near perfect tune. I didn't know if a NB was just a slower WB or if it was something different I really don't know the difference between the two, can someone supply a good link that will get me up to speed on that? Right now I'm going to stick with a NB because WB's are expensive and I have a lot of other things I need to attend, besides I go WOT maybe 3 times a month so as long as everything else is good I'll be fine for a while, this is a daily driver WAGON not a sports car. WOT is not that important, unless of course I'm missing the importance of WOT tuning?

If I seem at all annoying it may be the fact that I'm 19 and you've all got years of experience on me and I'm trying to catch up so I can hold up on my own without looking stupid. Hopefully thats not that case, I don't want to offend/bother anyone here.

Thanks for clearing things up Dominic

Ronny

NB is engineered to provide A/F info(voltage) to ECU only at stoich or 14.7/1 for emishions and to work in harmony with cat convert. cat convert cannot tolerate anything but 14.7 on a regular basis.
WB is engineered to proovide to ECU or another onboard computer approx 8/1 and as far as 40/1 as far as i know.
someone will surely correct me

Ronny

Quote: WB's are expensive

why not build your own? search. the 02 sensor is about $50(bosch VW) and i bet there are cheaper from other manufacturers.

i dont have a clue as to how but i know of people your age that possibly do or have resources available to them.

TierAngst

What cats? I'm ditching mine as soon as the headers come in. What all is the O2 sensor there for besides helping the cats, I know the engine runs like crap with a bad one but thats all I know about it Do I need it? Can I hook up a WB in its place? I've got to get a new O2 sensor when the headers come in, getting a heated one as recommended by Brian at TBIchips.com

Dewey316

The O2 sensor is how you computer compensates for fueling. You do need it. A WBO2 is not swapable into the stock place, unless you made MAJOR code changes. The WB that we all use to tune, is suplementry, we use it while tuning and that is it. then when in closed-loop operation, the factory O2 operates as normal, to keep us at the proper AFR.

TierAngst

Cool, thanks for the quick reply.

M1tch

can you guys give the direct links to the 3 programmers because the sites are too damn confusing

http://secure.transtronics.com/EPROM%20Programmer.html

e006683

Dominic- i'm glad I was able to locate you. I remember you from the old Crossfire web site. I need some help on the heads on my 84 vette on which I'm installing an X-Ram. My mechanic wants to port match the heads and he said there a large dimple in the intake runners he wants to remove but we're not sure how much material is there so we're afraid to grind down the obstruction. I'm going to email you with an illustration. If you could cantact me @ robert.krafft@honeywell.com I would greatly appreciate it. I know you have lots of experience with these engines. Haven't the X-Rams been installed on stock heads with good results? Thanks Bob krafft

Dominic Sorresso

Bob,

I never did anything with the stock heads. Not worth bothering with IMO. I did port match the Xfire manifold to the original heads and then to the
TFS 23D heads I had. I don't think there's much diff between a ported Xfire and an Xram.

__________________
92 Aqua ZR-1
84 Z51Xfire SOLD

Ronny

Exactly. Not worth the expense. Especially considering there are Vortec heads available from $500+ a pair. Granted you will need to be creative on intake choice. How about a Vortec 2 barrel intake with a GM 7.4L TBI on top!