Could have something to do with running 26 degrees of advance at idle and about 36 at the 25mph dyno test area... LOL. Forgot to retard 8-10 degrees before the test or to put in the OEM ASDU Prom... oops. I really thought I could pass, what was I thinking with all that advance. Duh HC = 9.0/195.0 = PASS CO = 0.0/2.43 = PASS NO = 1356.9/1273.0 = FAIL [This message has been edited by fast_broker (edited December 11, 2001).]

26 degrees of advance!! Are you running 150 octane or what? Seriously, how can you advance that much without knock? I thought I was pushing it at 12.

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91RS convertible 355 TBI 65# inj. custom compcam grind .480/.480, Edelbrock TBI manifold, open element, hedman hedders, Y-pipe, flowmaster single chamber, cop car chip, Accel coil, wires, vacuum controlled FPR. 2.02/1.6 cast iron heads. Engine specially made by Pflugerville machine shop. Forged bottom end, balanced. Coming soon: , Torque converter, DIY PROM, bigger TB.

Practice...

My stock 350 truck idles at 22 degrees. Many of the TPI engines idle around 20-22 degrees.

Even my OEM truck TBI PROM is at 16 or 17 BTDC with swirl-poop heads and the mellowest cam in existance. Most the the SBC's I run with HEI's have about 22-24 (initial) advance at idle with manifold vac to the 10-12deg advance canister.

NO gas through the roof without EGR in there with all the advance, I don't run EGR.

[This message has been edited by fast_broker (edited December 11, 2001).]

Jroy you are probably thinking of base timing, your total timing number is higher because you have timing added in

Maybe I'll just dump in a gallon of dry gas (or rubbing alcohol) and go through with no other changes as an experiment. Anyone think it'll work?

Three words for you- "denatured alcohol solvent" -Randy

xylene, works eveytime, dont run around too long on it.

Looking at your HC and CO emissions you could easily do 2 things to pass that car. Either run a little more fuel or run the engine cooler. The NO gases are because of the hot combustion temp. This is usually because of high engine temp and no EGR. I just ran my engine a little more fuel pressure, retarded timing 2 degree's across the board and ran it a little cooler and I passed the test with my engine which has no EGR, no air pump and vortec heads. If I can do it anybody can do it.

I am quite sure it was my timing. 36deg at the 25mph dyno test is just too much. Not enough of a load on the engine to get the advance a bit lower. I'll retard the timing 10 degrees (16 at idle, 26 at dyno test) and that should cool things down a lot. I'm in closed loop during all the testing so not sure how a FP change would help... 180 high-flow stat in there, running pretty cool all the time. I guess I could ask them to point the cooling fan thingy at the radiator instead of pointing it mainly towards the ground, like they did during the testing... idiots.

retard timing
block PCV
Denatured alcohol, too???

One thing you guys must remember is that CT does not care if I have a Chevy V8 in the vehicle, like CA did. It must pass the emission standards of the OEM in-line 116hp 6-cylinder... Maybe I should move the car back to the CA house?

You are so close to passing I would give it a couple more trys. Does CT have a back door policy like NJ does? When I failed on the dyno, all I had to do was come back to get it re-inspected at idle. That would help you because then your timing won't advance itself when they bring it up to 25mph. I used a gallon of the "den-alc solvent" and had my timing at -2* and I passed. 24 hours later I chopped the muffler off, and guess what I found in it...PIECES OF CAT! So I basically passed NJ inspection with a broken/clogged convertor using that $h!t. It works. -Randy

My custom PROM has at least 8-10 degrees too much advance just about everywhere in the curve, ie it is not emissions-friendly at IDLE and at the 25mph area. Not emission-friendly anywhere, actually, just power-friendly!!!


I'll retard it 10 degrees and not do anything else just to see what happens, see if I can pass. I just BARELY failed the NO part... I don't think I need any IN-TANK help... Hopefully. Now, if I fail again, I'll kick myself in the arse for not putting something in the tank...

No other BREAK, unfortunately. Same test as a retest...



[This message has been edited by fast_broker (edited December 12, 2001).]

That's the same thing I did- do one thing at a time, beginning with mechanical adjustments. You can keep going back as long as you need to. I like how you put it- "in tank help". That should be a last resort. Nice terminology though, keeps the EPA guys from learning our secrets. -Randy

Those guy's know every legal thing we can do, trust me.

Buying a "guaranteed to pass" emissions fluid for in-tank use is legal, that's why they are for sale. Proper use of the fuel additives is another story...

[This message has been edited by fast_broker (edited December 12, 2001).]

Ever read the fine print on the "guarentted to pass" stuff by the way? I failed with it, and they demand so much information that you'll never get your money back for it if it doesn't work. Not like I ever thought I had a chance to begin with.
They basically say that you need to prove to them that your car is in optimum running condition before using their product. Well guys, if my car passed emissions before I used your product, I wouldn't even have a need for it. I hate sales ploys. Not to say that their product doesn't help at all, but they sure do cover all basis with their "guarrentee" -Randy

nothing works in nj to pass, I wizzed by emissions perfectly, and they failed me for the 3rd brakelight (loose bulb), gas cap (stupid) and a laminated insurance card (WTF?)

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1991 Firebird (GT40)
-LO3 305 TBI
-5 speed
-Open Element Air Filter
-Edelbrock Tower Strut Brace
-Kenwood Excelon Headunit w/ 10 Disc Changer
-Alpine MRP-F256 Amp
-Polk EX 4x6's, DX 6x9's, and EX Tweeters
-Kicker ZR240 amp (bridged)
-Dual JL W0 12" Subs

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My page with pics and stuff, and car stereo help.
http://members.aol.com/deadtrend1/index.html

My story passing NJ emissions with my engine:
1st trip in poped hood, guy shakes head and lets me go on the visual. Failed emissions because car overheating to about 240 degree's and so failed the nitrous oxides test. So they tested everything else and passed me for everything, didn't even notice my broken rear view mirror! So I come back and have the car cooler at around 200 for the testing, passed the emissions this time but failed because didn't have the rear view mirror. I told them it just fell off since yesterday when they first tested me and the guy was an jerk about it. So I go home, glue the mirror on according to the directions but it was a cold nite. I go to the reinspection line just for small stuff (back entrance, no line) and they pass me so I'm good to go. Good thing because if no pass I wouldn't be driving to school the next day and that's a 10 hour trip! So on the way back home the rear view mirror falls off again , lol. Obviously somebody up high in the sky was looking out for me. Now if I want to pass emissions in a couple years I know I'm going to have to do an engine swap. I guess that's the price you pay for making a slow car fast.

Put the ASDU chip in yesterday. what a DOG now!!!!!!! Thank *** for PROM burning! Spark advance is more emissions-friendly, now, Sat is d-day. We'll see what happens. Also going to put in a 180 high-flow stat, have a 195 high-flow in, now. Only gets to 190 when idling for a while but not helping my cause... I remember the 180HF only reached 180 on the hottest Summer days when idling, about 170 otherwise, which was a little too low for my liking.

EDIT, also put the two Flowmaster 30's after the dual cats. Not too loud with cats. But, the exhaust in my wrangler bolts-up to the underside of the BODY, which resonates the heck out of my ears at certain rpms! Gotta find a way to rig it to the frame and isolate it from the body. Too much!

[This message has been edited by fast_broker (edited December 14, 2001).]

Didn't get to anything this wekend... After conversing with some folk, here's all I'm gonna do:

o Super Unleaded in tank
o Use ASDU pickup PROM (not my custom PROM, oops), straight up (~8deg retarded from my custom PROM)


That's it. tonight's the night. The delayed burn from the spark curve and the slower gas will lower my NOX, which I barely failed. Super Unleaded with 5 degrees of retard MAY have done it, but why not get it done right?

PASSED:

HC = 12.0/195.0 = PASS
CO = 0.0/2.43 = PASS
NO = 856.8/1273.0 = PASS


Slight HC increase, drop in NO, just as expected. Essentially I only did TWO THINGS:

1 retarded timing about 8 degrees (ran OEM ASDU pickup PROM straight up, no EGR but EGR spark/fuel corection active, genuine OEM prom) to reduce cylinder pressure, thus reduce NOx.

2 Ran Super Unleaded to slow flame/reduce cylinder pressure, thus further reduce NOx.

Nice and easy.

EDIT: Let me just say that I was running the 350 TBI truck TB with 55pph injectors at 14.5psi. Man it ran like fork and ice hole until it got into closed loop. I gave the cats quite a beating until it warmed up the last couple days. My PROM back in, nice again.