TBIThrottle Body Injection discussion and questions. L03/CFI tech and other performance enhancements.
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A buddy of mine has a '92 rs hardtop, gray with a 5-speed. 80k on the car, I like to cruise the strip with him on weekends. his car has a 305tbi motor, but it is really fast. people have even seen it pull the wheels!!! he is one of those guys who doesn't talk about his mods and is very mechanically inclined. I rode in the car once, he had bad plugs at the time and it was only running on 6 cylinders, but it was faster than any tbi i've been in running on 8...
last night I ran into a friend of his, and he knew his mods...it has a stock t-5 and 3.08 rear so I didn't think he could be too modded, especially with how he launches that car around. he is a very good driver, so that helps a lot... here are the mods:
454 throttle body,
454 tune,
327 rotating assembly,
and he runs straight 104 blue gas in it.
How do you fit a 327 rotating assembly in a 305? I had heard he had to mod a 307 assembly to get it to fit right...
now, as for the 454 tb and tune, do you need to upgrade the fuel pump for that? what else needs to be done to make it work?
my last question...how do you run straight 104 octane in a lo3 without it frying the engine?
he's had the car for years, and it runs great...
but how much hp gain are we talking about with these mods? I saw him beat a 357 powered thirdgen, and his car walks all over everything it races... he even has the stock exhaust manifolds on it... just an upside down open element on top.
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Last edited by J91Camaro; 10-18-2009 at 08:43 PM.
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Not knowing the guy or his car, but knowing the street racer mentality and how you never tip your hand to what is under the hood, I'd be willing to venture a guess that your friend is running more than a destroked 305 (which is what you get when you go from the 3.48" inch stroke 305 crank to the 3.25" 327 crank.)
I forget the actual CID of an engine with the 305 bore and 3.25" stroke......I believe it is in the 287cid area.
Running 104 octane will not hurt your engine. Contrary to the myths that circulate, too much octane will not damage anything other than your pocketbook. Too little octane will lead to detonation/pre-ignition and that can wipe out an engine really quick.
Find out more about this guy's car, someone might have an alternative opinion to mine. I know if I wanted to make a street sleeper, I'd likely go with a destroked 400 or something similiar. If I wanted to be super sneaky, I'd build a 400 with an internally balanced crank so I could use a normal 305/350 harmonic balancer, get some really good flowing cast iron heads that had the perimeter valve covers, and mild street cam, and then I'd tell everyone it was a 305 and watch them scratch their heads.
The 454 tune part is what makes me think you got a snow job. I have to head to work, and will elaborate more when I get home in the morning as to the "why" of what I just said.
__________________ 1993 Chevy Z/71 with Vortec 350, ZZ4 cam, GMPP 1.6 roller rockers, TBI mods. Switching to TPI next year I hope
1999 Monte Carlo Z/34
1989 Trans Am GTA, 350, Trick Flow Super 23 Degree heads, LT4 HOT cam kit, Holley StealthRam, BBK 58mm TB, RamAir hood with cold air induction
No reason to put a 454 TBI unit on a 305 - it would be wayyy too much overkill. He's not running a factory TBI 305 motor. I'd bet it's a 350. Even aftermarket heads ported and polished, headers, gutted cat, hi flow mufflers, running a good cam, and a much better intake, roller rockers, larger intake valves - the whole nine yards - and massive custom chip tuning, won't get a TBI car to run much better times than a 350 stock motor with TPI. You can't tell the difference between a 302, 305, 307, 327, 350 block - they are all the same on the outside (unless you get a peek at the driver side top, where the casting number is). Are you sure it's a 5speed? Where is 1st in relation to reverse when he shifts? Maybe it's a T56 (a 6 speed), because a 5speed won't hold up to much power for long. And if he's running redlight to redlight with alot of neck snapping, he's got better than 308 gears, probably 373's or 342's - 308's are an improvement, but don't do much over stock 273's.
No reason to put a 454 TBI unit on a 305 - it would be wayyy too much overkill. He's not running a factory TBI 305 motor. I'd bet it's a 350. Even aftermarket heads ported and polished, headers, gutted cat, hi flow mufflers, running a good cam, and a much better intake, roller rockers, larger intake valves - the whole nine yards - and massive custom chip tuning, won't get a TBI car to run much better times than a 350 stock motor with TPI. You can't tell the difference between a 302, 305, 307, 327, 350 block - they are all the same on the outside (unless you get a peek at the driver side top, where the casting number is). Are you sure it's a 5speed? Where is 1st in relation to reverse when he shifts? Maybe it's a T56 (a 6 speed), because a 5speed won't hold up to much power for long. And if he's running redlight to redlight with alot of neck snapping, he's got better than 308 gears, probably 373's or 342's - 308's are an improvement, but don't do much over stock 273's.
Are you being serious? Properly built a 305 TBI car will have no problem out running a "STOCK" 350 TPI car. Even a mildly built 305 could do it. not trying to be a prick but come on man. Hell I bet it can be done with an LT1 cam w/1.6's, Vortec's, an S10 stall and some 3.42 gears. And ofcourse the proper tuning. Very mild in deed and it would have no issue.
__________________
305 tbi, Ultimate TBI mods, March UD pullies and Brackets, Proform Electric WP, ACDELCO EP241 Fuel Pump, TNT Spacer, Inj Pod Spacer, Gasket matched and 2" Bored Edelbrock tbi intake, Xtremefi AFPR, Gasket matched and Ceramic Coated 2055's, Hooker 3" Aerochamber catback, LS1 Aluminum driveshaft, Homemade Open element, Comp 1.6 roller tip rockers, Edelbrock STB, Tubular LCA's & Panhard bar, E.S. Bushings, UMI LCARB's, Wonderbar, Eibach Pro-kit Springs, MSD 8.5 wires, MSD 6A Ignition Box, MSD blaster coil, A/C & Smog delete, Excessive weight reduction (2860lbs), GM 3.42 gears, Moser 26 spline axles, Powertrax noslip locker, Summit diff cover, TH700R4 transgo shift kit, Corvette servo, Permacool tranny cooler, Sonnax TV Spring kit, Aluminum Drums, Nitto NT555R Drag Radials, EBL and Zeitronix ZT-2 for the tuning.
Future plans are a Edelbrock RPM intake, 46mm Xtremefi TBI, ZZ4 cam, Ported ZZ4 heads and an EDGE 3200 stall going in after I learn how to tune.
I guess anything is possible - especially now that someone makes tuning software and proms worth a hoot - 5 years ago I couldn't see it happening though. I built the 305 with 416 heads ported and polished, 1.94 intake valves, LT1 cam, 1.6 rollers, carb intake, VaFPR, 350 injectors, TBI mods, headers, gutted cat, hi flo muffler, and 3.08's, and even after I slapped a carb on it 'cause I could never get the tuning done right, it would still never out run a 350.
I hear talk about them all the time, but I never see it here (NC) - guess no one ever wastes the time/money for a 305 (except me, and I didn't get it where I wanted in the end lol)
BTW Robert - I like the hood scoop - always have - it looks nice and I think matches the car's lines well!
It is a stock t-5. he lauches it everywhere and slams gears. I know a lot of people that have taken three hour plus trips in his car to street race in chitown and he is really hard on the car, all the time. he never shifts before 4,500 and doesn't even let the thing warm up before he starts beating on it. I feel bad for the car lol. it is a non posi 3.08 rear end and it throws you around pretty good on WOT. he always drops it into first when coming to stop at lights at around 20 and the trans makes this whiney noise when he does. it sounds like a stockish 305...
It is a stock t-5. he lauches it everywhere and slams gears. I know a lot of people that have taken trips to street race in chitown and he is really hard on the car, all the time. he never shifts before 4,500 and doesn't even let the thing warm up before he starts beating on it. I feel bad for the car lol. it is a non posi 3.08 rear end and it throws you around pretty good on WOT. he always drops it into first when coming to stop at lights at around 20 and the trans makes this whiney noise when he does. it sounds like a stockish 305...
Absolutely NO WAY a non-posi 3.08 open, is gonna lift the front tires. Impossible.
I don't care WHO says it has. Just not possible.
SOMEBODY is lieing about the car about SOMETHING.
Besides that, a T5 is not strong enough for any car to lift the front tires. The tranny would be history.
and if it does somehow lift the front tires that's not a stock t5
__________________
67 project Camaro, 468 bbc, th350
89 Trans Am, ls1, 4l60e
91 z28 Camaro - sold
92 base stealth
There are only 10 kinds of people in the world, those who understand binary and those who don't
Last edited by yevgenievich; 10-20-2009 at 03:05 AM.
IMO it sounds more like someone new tring to see if it'll work. it's all just to rediculous to be true. but thats my opinion. and all I can say is with my build between my tranny and 2.73 open diff if I lucked down and loaded up to about 2.2k and flat out launched with my slicks on the body would twist up to the point the driver seat and console shifted away from eachother. so if I had a 3.42 posi I coulda pulled just the left front off so pullin 1 is MAYBE possible but not both.
I promise, this car is real..... I have a 3.1, I dont have any use for a those mods lol. This car is insane... maybe it is a 350??? but how does a stock t-5 hold up to that power?
I rode in the car once, he had bad plugs at the time and it was only running on 6 cylinders, but it was faster than any tbi i've been in running on 8...
wow really? guys name is zach and there are a few threads on this car. it is what it is, and is very fast, just wondering what it could be. aarons camaro is an automatic. he knows the guy pretty well actually. hes the one that really wants to know what is done to it!
I just want to know if what that 92 has done to it is enough to make it up to what the claims were. I saw him racin a gt/cs supercharged mustang and he got smoked, so its no 500hp sleeper, maybe he's just a good driver. his girlfriend and I are friends and she claims he has scared her by going 130 on the freeway. I text zach and told him I knew he had a chip cause the stock chip limits to 110 and he said he would tell me that, but the other mods he wont say lol.
.........I text zach and told him I knew he had a chip cause the stock chip limits to 110 and he said he would tell me that, but the other mods he wont say lol.
Gimme a on/off toggle switch, 2 wires & a few minutes & the speed limiter is EASY to defeat in a TBI car, on a stock chip. Been there, done that.
He won't say, because he can't. He's blowing smoke up your a$$ about everything.
my 350 tbi with 3.23 mini spool rear won't hardly lift even the suspension with big block springs... and it just took out the stock tranny last week so i definately say bs to any "stock" t-5 and 3.08 open rear
Gimme a on/off toggle switch, 2 wires & a few minutes & the speed limiter is EASY to defeat in a TBI car, on a stock chip. Been there, done that.
He won't say, because he can't. He's blowing smoke up your a$$ about everything.
I figured he was, I have heard a lot of both, him sayin the car was stock with a huge grin, some of his friends sayin it is stock and others listing his "supposed" mods... maybe I should get aaron to race him and see if zach wins and by how much...
I still cant think of a good reason of why it shakes on WOT...bad plugs?
other thing I guess I am confused by is how a stock trans or any trans can take the constant launches and hard shifting... maybe he swapped to a wc-t5...
oh and I am sure it is a 3.08... he told me and he does one wheel peel launches all day long lol
I figured he was, I have heard a lot of both, him sayin the car was stock with a huge grin, some of his friends sayin it is stock and others listing his "supposed" mods... maybe I should get aaron to race him and see if zach wins and by how much...
I still cant think of a good reason of why it shakes on WOT...bad plugs?
other thing I guess I am confused by is how a stock trans or any trans can take the constant launches and hard shifting... maybe he swapped to a wc-t5...
oh and I am sure it is a 3.08... he told me and he does one wheel peel launches all day long lol
I think you made the point, can we move on. Nothing of your information in this tread is useful for anithing else then wasting time and giving the TBI owners a stupid, stupid reputation.
hey primarily in the actual mechanic world TBI owners start out with a stupid rep. and u keep it tell u can prove the peanut gallery wrong. I was laughed at daily about keepin my tbi and not goin to carb till I did the brake stand that blew my motor now 2 of the main people that ran their mouth are helpin me get together the parts for the 350 and 1 of them has a buddy that owns a speed shop in the next town over that is gonna do the tune on it.
so honestly I take back what I said about j91......it is seeming more like he is some fresh fish who is getting his leg pull by someone who thinks he's cool cause he has a v8 thats on it's last leg from tring to be cool and just beatin the crap out of a crap build.
