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Old 01-01-2009, 06:51 AM   #1
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160* Thermostat Do i need a Performance Chip for it??

Do i need a Performance Chip if i put a 160* Thermostat in my car so it dont mess my computer up. I have a 1985 Trans Am 5.0 TPI Auto.
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Old 01-01-2009, 11:10 PM   #2
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Re: 160* Thermostat Do i need a Performance Chip for it??

The stock programming requires the coolant temperature sensor to reach 176ºF for full closed loop operation. A 160º 'stat probably doesn't quite get the temperature it should.
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Old 01-01-2009, 11:20 PM   #3
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Re: 160* Thermostat Do i need a Performance Chip for it??

There's no benefit to running a 160 degree stat. It sets the minimum temp, not the operating temp. It will just cause you to come out of closed loop more often. Run at least a 180.
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Old 01-02-2009, 02:20 AM   #4
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Re: 160* Thermostat Do i need a Performance Chip for it??

A thermostat that cold won't do anything for performance. It will just make it drink fuel like an alcoholic that just won on the bar's VLT machines.

The stock 195* is a little warm IMO, but the 180* is the best choice, especially for a stock-ish engine. This is what the LT1 and LS1 came with from the factory. The engines were designed and set up with tolerances and components designed for an engine running in the 190-210* range. A 180* thermostat will put it right around the lower end of that range.

(**just a little side note, the 160*/180*/195* rating is only when the thermostat starts to open... it is not fully open untill about 10-12* above that rated temp.**)
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Old 05-22-2011, 05:42 PM   #5
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Re: 160* Thermostat Do i need a Performance Chip for it??

Quote:
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The stock programming requires the coolant temperature sensor to reach 176ºF for full closed loop operation. A 160º 'stat probably doesn't quite get the temperature it should.
Vader, idk, but i watched my car go into closed loop at 161.2*. I waited and waited and thought for sure closed loop did not happen until 166*? Seems like they go into closed loop on a "timed" basis?
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Old 05-22-2011, 05:44 PM   #6
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Re: 160* Thermostat Do i need a Performance Chip for it??

What benefit would i exp. going to a 180* thermo vs my present 160?
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Old 05-22-2011, 05:45 PM   #7
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Re: 160* Thermostat Do i need a Performance Chip for it??

I am changing to a stock chip too vs my current hypertech stg.2.
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Old 05-22-2011, 06:44 PM   #8
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Re: 160* Thermostat Do i need a Performance Chip for it??

I tried a 160 in my tbi, but it drank gas, so I switched back to 180. I know you have a tpi, so take it for what it's worth. I also have my cooling fan hooked to a toggle switch so I can keep my coolant temp at 180, and not let it go to 225 degrees. I just reach under and flick the switch.

On the other hand, my carbed 305 seems to like the 160. Mileage didn't change, and I have better throttle response when warm. I have a fan switch for it also.
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Old 06-14-2011, 07:01 AM   #9
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Re: 160* Thermostat Do i need a Performance Chip for it??

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Originally Posted by Stevolwevol View Post
I tried a 160 in my tbi, but it drank gas, so I switched back to 180. I know you have a tpi, so take it for what it's worth. I also have my cooling fan hooked to a toggle switch so I can keep my coolant temp at 180, and not let it go to 225 degrees. I just reach under and flick the switch.

On the other hand, my carbed 305 seems to like the 160. Mileage didn't change, and I have better throttle response when warm. I have a fan switch for it also.
what year is your tbi ?
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Old 06-14-2011, 03:46 PM   #10
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Re: 160* Thermostat Do i need a Performance Chip for it??

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what year is your tbi ?
92
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Old 08-27-2011, 01:46 PM   #11
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Re: 160* Thermostat Do i need a Performance Chip for it??

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92
what are you using for a 180 thermostat?
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Old 08-27-2011, 03:05 PM   #12
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Re: 160* Thermostat Do i need a Performance Chip for it??

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what are you using for a 180 thermostat?
What am I using? Please be specific.
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Old 08-27-2011, 04:27 PM   #13
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Re: 160* Thermostat Do i need a Performance Chip for it??

Stock programming, temperature dependent parameters:

CTS < 14.7̊C (58̊F) for 75 seconds;
CTS >14.7̊ (58̊F) and < 40.7̊ (105̊F) for 51.4 seconds;
CTS >40.7̊C (105̊F) for 12.5 seconds;
O2 >0.699V & O2<1.99V for 10 seconds;

Coolant Temperature Sensor Related Parameters
BLM enabled between 50̊C (122̊F) and 140̊C (284̊F)
Cold spark advance disabled above 56̊C (133̊F)
Hot spark retard begins above 116̊C (240̊F)
Highway Mode spark advance > 59.8̊C (140̊F)
Knock sensor disabled below 66.5̊C (152̊F)
Power enrichment at base A/F ratios > 56̊C (133̊F)
Target IAC idle RPM >80̊C (176̊F)
IAC multiplier at 1.0 (base) > 32̊C (90̊F)
Knock Control enabled > 67̊C (153̊F)
EGR Duty-cycle enabled at 56̊C (133̊F)
EGR Duty-cycle at MAX >80̊C (176̊F)
TCC lockup enabled >50̊C (122̊F)
SHIFT light enabled >50̊C (122̊F)
Diagnostic communication enabled at 70̊C (157̊F)
DTC 43 enabled > 90̊C (194̊F)
Cooling fan #1 enabled at 107̊C (226̊F)
Cooling fan #1 off at 104.7̊C (220.5̊F)
Cooling fan #2 enabled at 115.2̊C (239.5̊F)
Cooling fan #2 off at 110̊C (230̊F)
Cooling fan duty cycle at 100% at 80̊C (176̊F)
Acceleration enrichment multiplier at 1.00 below 80̊ C (176̊F)
Acceleration enrichment multiplier at 0.75 above 80̊ C (176̊F)[/color]
Acceleration enrichment multiplier at 0.50 above 104̊C (220̊F)
Acceleration enrichment decay factor at 25% below 80̊ C (176̊F)
Acceleration enrichment decay factor at 40% above 80̊ C (176̊F)
Acceleration enrichment decay factor at 50% above 104̊ C (220̊F)
Acceleration enrichment decay factor at 60% above 128̊ C (262̊F)
Fuel limiting factor timer at 217 counts below 80̊ C (176̊F)
Fuel limiting factor timer at 169 counts above 80̊ C (176̊F)
Code 13 (oxygen sensor fault) enabled above 70̊C (157̊F)
Code 14 (CTS high fault) enabled above 130̊C (266̊F)
Code 32 (EGR fault) enabled above 30.5̊C (87̊F)
EVAP canister purge enabled above 70.3̊C (158.5̊F)
Hot closed-loop timer enabled above 70.3̊C (158.5̊F)
Rich/Lean O2 offest at 16 counts between 20̊C (68̊F) and 92̊C (197.5̊F)
A/C clutch disabled above 150̊C (302̊F)

That third to the last line shows why your scanner is reporting "Closed Loop" but it is not FULL Closed Loop as I stated several years ago.
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Old 08-27-2011, 04:56 PM   #14
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Re: 160* Thermostat Do i need a Performance Chip for it??

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stevolwevol View Post
What am I using? Please be specific.
what brand of 180 thermostat are you using?
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Old 08-27-2011, 05:16 PM   #15
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Re: 160* Thermostat Do i need a Performance Chip for it??

Quote:
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what brand of 180 thermostat are you using?
I am using a 180* thermostat made by "Stant". I don't remember whether I got it at advanced auto or NAPA.
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Old 08-27-2011, 05:20 PM   #16
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Re: 160* Thermostat Do i need a Performance Chip for it??

is motorad fail safe themermostat any good?
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Old 08-27-2011, 05:29 PM   #17
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Re: 160* Thermostat Do i need a Performance Chip for it??

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Originally Posted by KITT1983 View Post
is motorad fail safe themermostat any good?
I don't know which is better. I just know mine doesn't stick... yet. I have heard of thermostats that are designed to stick open if they fail. I am skeptical. I just watch my gauges, and I will pull over before I fry the engine.
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Old 08-27-2011, 06:23 PM   #18
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Re: 160* Thermostat Do i need a Performance Chip for it??

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vader View Post
Stock programming, temperature dependent parameters:

CTS < 14.7̊C (58̊F) for 75 seconds;
CTS >14.7̊ (58̊F) and < 40.7̊ (105̊F) for 51.4 seconds;
CTS >40.7̊C (105̊F) for 12.5 seconds;
O2 >0.699V & O2<1.99V for 10 seconds;

Coolant Temperature Sensor Related Parameters
BLM enabled between 50̊C (122̊F) and 140̊C (284̊F)
Cold spark advance disabled above 56̊C (133̊F)
Hot spark retard begins above 116̊C (240̊F)
Highway Mode spark advance > 59.8̊C (140̊F)
Knock sensor disabled below 66.5̊C (152̊F)
Power enrichment at base A/F ratios > 56̊C (133̊F)
Target IAC idle RPM >80̊C (176̊F)
IAC multiplier at 1.0 (base) > 32̊C (90̊F)
Knock Control enabled > 67̊C (153̊F)
EGR Duty-cycle enabled at 56̊C (133̊F)
EGR Duty-cycle at MAX >80̊C (176̊F)
TCC lockup enabled >50̊C (122̊F)
SHIFT light enabled >50̊C (122̊F)
Diagnostic communication enabled at 70̊C (157̊F)
DTC 43 enabled > 90̊C (194̊F)
Cooling fan #1 enabled at 107̊C (226̊F)
Cooling fan #1 off at 104.7̊C (220.5̊F)
Cooling fan #2 enabled at 115.2̊C (239.5̊F)
Cooling fan #2 off at 110̊C (230̊F)
Cooling fan duty cycle at 100% at 80̊C (176̊F)
Acceleration enrichment multiplier at 1.00 below 80̊ C (176̊F)
Acceleration enrichment multiplier at 0.75 above 80̊ C (176̊F)[/color]
Acceleration enrichment multiplier at 0.50 above 104̊C (220̊F)
Acceleration enrichment decay factor at 25% below 80̊ C (176̊F)
Acceleration enrichment decay factor at 40% above 80̊ C (176̊F)
Acceleration enrichment decay factor at 50% above 104̊ C (220̊F)
Acceleration enrichment decay factor at 60% above 128̊ C (262̊F)
Fuel limiting factor timer at 217 counts below 80̊ C (176̊F)
Fuel limiting factor timer at 169 counts above 80̊ C (176̊F)
Code 13 (oxygen sensor fault) enabled above 70̊C (157̊F)
Code 14 (CTS high fault) enabled above 130̊C (266̊F)
Code 32 (EGR fault) enabled above 30.5̊C (87̊F)
EVAP canister purge enabled above 70.3̊C (158.5̊F)
Hot closed-loop timer enabled above 70.3̊C (158.5̊F)
Rich/Lean O2 offest at 16 counts between 20̊C (68̊F) and 92̊C (197.5̊F)
A/C clutch disabled above 150̊C (302̊F)

That third to the last line shows why your scanner is reporting "Closed Loop" but it is not FULL Closed Loop as I stated several years ago.
So according to your data the engine leans out at 197.5??
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Old 08-27-2011, 06:23 PM
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