Quote: Originally posted by rx7speed what all is done to this truck of yours? and how much power do you think it's puttind down? I'm putting down probably 215 or so whp and 260+ ft. lbs(without nitrous)....but the truck doesn't just take off at the line, no matter where I launch it I either spin or bog....there is just no median....but the truck just starts pulling, hell...If I had much more done, I'd have to shift into 5th. Ok, my mods are, "x" vin motor converted to 2wd(x 4wd engine has 10 more ponies), I have a custom made y pipe, polish/ported heads, CAI, flowmaster out back, stock exhaust size from the cat back, hypertech programming, had a centerforce clutch in it when I bought it, brand new lighter driveshaft, A/C delete(factory), a shorter throw shifter(off a newer s10), and 4.10 gears out back. Weight with me in it, 3280. BTW, I love the sound of the 4.3L, especially at redline shifts....scared the crap out of my buddy I was racing...he said I get a pop out the exhaust at those rpms....he should know.....his bmw can no longer compete( he ran a 15.5 last time he was out, and I beat him by 3.5 lengths.) Andrew

if u want to get serious into racing or whatnot, 4bangers are not the way to go, for the average joe schmoe.

unless you have the money and knowhow to fix a DSM after every race.....lol
Andrew

4 Bangers Everytime I see one I think of that site that had the ***** on the left side and the Camaro SS on the right side. It was like 320 stickers for the 4 banger, 320 hp for the Camaro. 160 hp modded, 160 mph stock. You guys must have seen it somewhere.

actually, that was a shirt that you could order a few years back... dont know if they still make it anymore. on the front it said "Us vs Them"

glad i bought one when they were around. people get a kick out of it when i wear it at the track

You guys talking about this? Someone on teckademics has it as thier sig....lol

Andrew

I have that table on my wall. I read a report that says a Cobalt SS will out run an SRT4. THe bottom end of those things is unbelievable too. I wanna put an Ecotec into my 93 sunbird le just to catch people by surprise.

Which ecotec? The base 2.2 is enough to run with a stock LO3/LG4.

There it is

The base 2.2 is enough to run with a stock LO3/LG4.

My 2.2 Ecotec in my saturn ION 4dr out ran a 95ish mustang V6, 05 corolla, 97 eclipse RS and 05 Neon. Pretty kick *** little engine.

all those cars you listed are slow
the 95 stang is about as fast as the v6 camaro in the thirdgen. the 97 eclipse rs is slow as well. the neon might break 18's if it is a base model. and the corolla I actually don't know about

all those cars you listed are slow

Well Yeah! They are slow and so is the stock L03/LG4.
My 95 eclipse RS out ran a L03 easy and I know my ION has more power than the eclipse. The Ecotec is just a fun engine to drive with kind of like a V-tech honda. I just think its one of the best engines in its class thats all.

definately. I was taking about the 2.2L Ecotec. There was an Ion with the stock bottom end pushing 800 hp or something rediculous. That's my main motivation for wanting one of those, and maybe subaru AWD suspension ::drools::. Back to cobalts, they have the potential to take some serious abuse with mods to the top end.

your rs must not be stock or your l03 just really sucks.
sorry
but N/A eclipse cars aren't too fast. my rx7 has given a beating to a few of them and the best thing thing would prolly run is a low 16 in the 1/4.

i drove an 03 ecplise and i swear i was absolutely shocked when i floored it. I had found something that was actually slower than a Ford Probe!

When someone ran into my GLI I had a new Nissan Sentra rental car with a automatic. It was slower than two old people having sex.

Incorrect. A Cobalt SS will corner with more than a few Mazda cars. And I highly doubt that ANY Mazda will outcorner a new Impala SS.

And as those of us who see these things in the shop day to day know, your reliability argument is laughable. Mazda's powertrains are junk.

I've got this feeling that very few of the people on here have any more clue what they are talking about than I do. Impala SS? Post up some stats.

Yup.....

Sorry dude, but I'll put my Miata up against an Impala SS on any auto-x course, anytime. You can't be serious??? And the engines in the Miata routinely go well over 200,000 with just routine maintenance. All engines should be such junk.

Any GM powertrain will easily do that, old or new. Just take care of it. That goes for any brand really.

I agree with you on the Miata vs an Imp. I like the Imps but the Miata was built with very specific attention to handling. The imp is just a semi-fast nice sedan.

You must not be familar with the following cars then:
Cavalier
Sunfire
Impala
Malibu
Camaro
Ford
Chevy
Many Hondas
A lot of Toyotas
A few more Mazdas

so you say ANY mazda car can be out cornered by an impalla SS?

that comment alone shows your ignorance. I'm sorry to say that but it is true. that or you are saying the impalla handles just as good as as the C5 vettes preferably the z06.



as far as the drivetrain on mazda cars some are junk some aren't. about as much as I can say with them

Just to be fair, this is what most import owners think of thirdgens when they hear about them.

You can't possibly think GM cant do 200k? There's one in my front yard (an '88, runs f*cking great), I used to own another one ('85 Camaro, just hit 211k) and the one I just sold was at 171 (my T/A that still trapped 100mph with just a catback). Newer cars havn't had enough time to really get that high, but when they come in our shop and they're well maintained, they usually look great and have no problems.

I've personally driven two hondas that had over 300,000 miles!! and I've seen *** knows how many with over 200k. I know hondas can last. Same thing for toyotas and mazdas. It depends entirely on how you take care of it.

We've owned a shop for over a decade, I think I have some insight into how cars of various brands respond to different levels of maintenance.

Of course there are a few problem parts out there, but every brand has those. And like most things in life you can just replace them and move on. I'm not saying every car is going to last like that, but if you take care of them you'll sure get close.

Of course I don't really think that. The only cars I really think that way about are Cavaliers. When I used to sell used cars, I hardly EVER saw one that ran with anything over 90,000 miles. In fact, we sold one with 90,000 miles once, and it threw a rod through the block the next day leaving the guy stranded on the highway with his baby, friend, and five quarts of oil for 5 hours.


He wasn't very happy. lol

Any car can last, but sometimes you just get unlucky...

Worst vehicle we ever owned was a 1983 Cavalier. Bought the car off the showroom floor, drove it and mantained it (my dad likes keeping his vehicles nice), and at 60,000 miles the car was headed to the junkyard! Thats right, with regular maintenance, and care the car was leaking oil badly, losing exhaust peices (lost the muffler a few times) and basically falling apart by the time we junked it. Granted we have owned some great Chevys and some junk other vehicles, but that car sticks in my mind as the worst vehicle I have ever ridden in, or known! The car overheated, leaked and burned oil, peices literally fell off, and the car was just a total lemon!

As far as handeling goes, I couldnt tell you, and as far as acceleration goes, I drive one of the slowest cars on earth, so again not my strong point!

I think if I ask my parents what the crappiest car they've ever owned was, they'd say their old Mercury Grand Marque.

I've only had 4 Hondas and a 73 Super Beetle. One thing that sucks about Honda (or did in the late 80's early 90's) was the auto trannys and their power windows.

Oh yeah, I've NEVER owned a car with less than 100,000 miles.

Until I buy my Miata.

Thats right, with regular maintenance, and care the car was leaking oil badly, losing exhaust peices (lost the muffler a few times) and basically falling apart by the time we junked it.

Thats because the caliver knew it was owned by mustang lovers! I would have ran sh*ty too!

Until I buy my Miata

Stu you still going to turbo charge a new Miata? I plan on getting a turbo for my engine any advise?

Here what I'm looking at.

http://www.bbsdesigns.net/cgi-local/...b30+1139727123

Oh and sorry I'm off topic since its been off topic for so long anyway.

They made a factory turbo Miata in 2000. I'm buying a 94-96. You can get one with 50,000 miles for only around $6,000. People LOVE those cars and take care of them like they are a collectors item or something. Yes, I plan on turboing the ever loving **** out of one, I just have to build a budget so I can afford it.

I went to the link. Tell me what you are looking for as an end result first. Just like anything, the less corners you cut, the happier, and poorer, you will be.

That first kit is pretty cheap, but I'm sure it's because it doesn't come with any fuel management or an intercooler, both of which are two of the most important pieces in the entire system in my opinion. This is going on your third gen right?

At the most I'm looking for is 450 to 500hp, my car is already right at 400hp or less. All I what to run is 6psi because I want a all around daily driver and not a drag car. I figure 6psi should be safe to run an not have to worry about getting forged parts. My engine has been rebuilt with better than stock componets.

I am worried about overheating. Also how long will a turbo like that last without a intercooler? Will any good size intercooler work I see a lot of them for sell on ebay. What does a fuel management consist of? I'm running a HSR intake with adj fuel regulator. My engine is a 327 with 9.6.1 compression.

Thanks for any help you can give me Stu.

Its funny, because up until then my dad had never owned a fast Mustang. He only owned a 71 rusted out one that kept getting hit in parking lots. At that point in his life he was a GM man, having owned a Big Block vette, GTO and a few other nice Chevys. After junking the Cavalier we bought a Mustang, and since then have owned 10 of them or so! ALL had more mileage than the Cavalier, and were abused a lot more!

After junking the Cavalier we bought a Mustang, and since then have owned 10 of them or so!

Wow 10 of them! What happen they kept on braking down so you just went and bought another? Just kidding why so many?

Most of the third gens on the road today are **** boxes cause there 20 or so years old. You really dont see to many third gens in mint condition these days.

1. A turbo doesnt care if you have a intercooler. Your engine will when that air causes detonation.

2. We use ebay intercoolers at work. No problems thus far. Some of our cars are in the 500's..

3. You have too much compression. 8.5-9.0 is about the best for FI.

I think 6psi is about all you can run unforged, but I'm telling you right now, that after about a month, you'll be ready to crank up the boost.

A turbo will out last your car if you take car of it properly and make sure you've got a BOV. The turbo doesn't care if there is an intercooler, it's your motor that cares. An intercooler helps the efficiency of the blower itself. The cooler the intake charge the better.

By fuel system, I mean something to control how much fuel you are getting. With forced induction, the flow the engine receives changes with load and rpm, so you need something to compensate for all of that. A full stand alone system is best, but the AEM system starts at around $1,000 for example. There are probably some free softwares that would be perfect for your needs. Just understand that it's more than just larger injectors and a higher flowing fuel pump. You need to make sure it's not going to advance your timing at the wrong time, that you're not running 190psi of pressure in your fuel lines, etc. etc.

The cheapest way is just and FMU which increases your fuel pressure based on boost, but that's a good way to get 195 psi of pressure in your factory fuel lines.

I'd do some research on the FI forum of this board. There has got to be some affordable products and knowledgable people to help you.

EDIT: Also, if you've got a lopey cammed street motor, you can't just slap a turbo on it without addressing your compression and your cam. Turbos HATE overlap.

Thanks guys I plan on getting a holley 950 commander setup and some bigger chamber AFR heads too. I'm not too sure about my cam its a single pattern hyd tappet .230 dur .480 lift. with 1.6 rocker with puts me at about .512 lift.

So it's carb'd? That's a whole different story because you have to decide if you want to presurize the carb or not. I've got very little experience with carb'd turbo'd cars, but I looked into it when I had my '73 Beetle.

Basically, if you have a pull through set up, the carb puts fuel in the intake, then the mixture has to travel through the turbo to be compressed. I was under the impression that this caused the fuel to just pool up in the bottom of the turbo and create horrible driveability, basically, either your car is barely running, or you are flooring it. That's not really an option when you have 400-500 hp and are driving on the street.

Otherwise you have to seal the carbuerator so the whole thing can be pressurized (they make special carbs for this that aren't that much more than normal ones). This gives you more normal driveability, and is the way I'd do it.

I'd assume that carbs made for boost are also made to control fuel based on boost, but I don't know for sure.

No I meant the 950 commander ecm and wire harness instead of a Tpi harness. The 950 is fully programable with a laptop.
Sorry I wasn't more specific.

Oh, no problem. That sounds like just what you need actually. Good luck.

I apologize, you misunderstood what I said.

I meant that not just ANY Mazda would outhandle a new SS, as in, not every single Mazda would, there would be more than a few that wouldn't.

Didn't mean it in the sense that an SS will outhandle ANY Mazda, lol. I'm sure an MX-5 wouldn't have any problem ditching a W-body in the twistys, lol.

In regards to powertrains, Miatas in general are one of the exceptions to the rule, as people rarely buy a Miata to tear into and use for a daily driver, due to impracticality. When it comes to larger midsize sedans, Mazdas are at the bottom of the pack in the Japanese imports in terms of reliability.

lol, I meant that not just ANY Mazda will outcorner it.

So....what you're saying is....is that the Mazda MPV minivan can't out corner an Impala SS? Well...I'm just flabergausted.

You guys confuse me

Given that you said "Any Mazda car will out handle anything in the Chevy line lesser than a Z28 as well", you don't have much to be sarcastic about...

protege vs a cavalier though think the protege would win :-p

Mazda Speed Protege won Car and Drivers best handling car of the year award with its .90g on the skid pad from factory. It's even front wheel drive.

Man this thread wont die.

This thread has no more dead horses to beat.