Vette heads have 58cc chamber....

haha, i recognize a lot of those parts, i got all the same except the cam, very happy with it, you'll have fun

im in the middle of building my 305tpi too in my 85z28. what does everyone think with this combo here.... i want to get atleast a 13.5 out of it. stock bore 85 305 block cleaned and honed, stock crank, new main rod and cam bearings, cleaned and polished 305 stock rods, new kb 10:1 pistons with new rings, zoom double roller chain, crane compucam 2050 series cam, freshend 416's, ported and polished, fresh valve job, 3 angle on the valves, new z28 .480 lift springs and retianers, comp cams 1.5 roller tipped rockers, new pushrods, ported tpi base and runners, asp crank pulley and some old cheap shorty headers, 2 1/2" y with a dynomax bullit dumped by the rear end, full ignition upgrades, accel cap,rotor,wires,coil, going through a T5 with a posi rear with 3:42's what does everyone think

"My goodies came in. Cam specs are 212 218 sep.112
lift .449 .456 With everything ported and .040 pistons.

Im dreaming of mid 13's
Drool"



hey no offence but why not get a 350 short block from a yard for that stuff
to me it really dose not make a ton of sence to do a 305

just my 2 xcentsa

rick

hey no offence but to me it really dose not make a ton of sence to do a 350. Wy donet you go billd a 427 smal blok?

Are you giving out donations?


John

LOL, my thoughts exactly...

TunedPort 335, thanks for your replies. I see what you are saying with the larger valve size, I think 1.84 valves are ideal for a 305, but i doubt 1.94 is hurting it that much. I have not measured the actual chamber diameter so I can not argue that point. However many other people on here run the L98 heads on their 305s, Willie is one of them and his car was quick with them before the blower was installed. He and I PM'd back and fourth back when i bought the heads, i'll check and see what he ran before the blower. another issue is that IF the chamber is larger than the bore where the valves are, it is only by .11" which again is small enough that I doubt it is hurting a measureable amount. 4.00 - 3.78 = .22/2 = .11" there is also a very slight chamfer at the top of the bore which would lessen the effect of this. It still just doesnt make sense to me how you guys are going that fast with nothing but cam, exhaust, and driveline mods.

hey tunedport, we're not the only ones going fast on small valves. Tim Burgess is doing it too. makes me wanna keep me small intake valve, go to a 1.50 exhaust valve.

what is involved in "grinding and polishing" valves?

Yes, mw66nova, the smaller intake valves are probably the best setup for a 3.78 bore.

TunedPort 335, here is a quote from Willie when i got my heads...

"Well, all I can tell you is that I changed my cam at the same time I installed the 113s. My heads were ported. With these being the only change, I gained 0.8 seconds and almost 8 mph (1/4-mile). I can't remember exactly what my times were then. That was a long time ago. At that time, I did not change the EPROM and I didn't know anything about burning them. I'm sure that would have resulted in even a better improvement."

doesnt sound like the heads are hurting him to me. Also, my car ran a 14.8 at 93mph before the mods, so like him, i lost .9 sec and still gained 5mph even though i have a stall converter which usually robs 1-2mph. It should also be noted that my 60' times only went from 2.19-1.93 when I installed my converter due to traction issues. TunedPort 335 cuts a 1.7 60' which is stellar, if I cut that kind of 60' that would take .2-.4 sec of my ET as well.

I am not trying to be a jerk here but the times you guys are cutting with stock UNPORTED heads, are the same times that it takes every one else with unported heads a 100hp shot of nitrous to run. mw66nova, your 100mph trap speeds with unported heads are unheard of.

I just cant figure out how you guys run what you do when everyone else with stock heads is in the mid 14s.

I was mocking the idiot that posted before me...

If you read my other posts in this thread you will notice that I also have a built 305.

Keep in mind that they are also way lighter than the run of the mill thirdgen. General rule of thumb is one tenth for every hundred pounds. So if your car weighs 3500 without driver, and his weighs 3000 without driver, and assuming everything else with the car is the same, he will already have .5 et on you.

So assuming you can get traction and get down to a 1.7 60ft, and you do some weight reduction that will be 7 tenths total off your et.

yeah, my car is skinny. hehe

I already have a good 350 bloc that I could build. I also have other engine cores to play with.
Thing is I already have new rods, pistons, machined block and milled 305 heads with full porting job and valves done. It would cost much more to buy all that stuff for a 350 that I already have.

My car is hardly light though. Its actually a pig. It's a TTop car, automatic, FULL emissions, A/C, backseat, etc ... when i ran the 13.4 @ 98.7 i had 3/4 tank of gas and a full-size spare in the hatch along with a jack and a few tools. Yep a full size spare 215/65/15 on a Z28 wheel.

1MeanZ- I bet the Vette heads aren't particularly bad for a 305 motor, but i think other options could be better. Like you said, the .11" on each side of the chamber doesn't seem like alot...but when you are trying to get air/fuel through there at 5000rpms it could make a significant difference.

I know it can be hard to beleive but my heads are completely stock except for the valve job and planed. They had to get that done since they had 176k on them when I rebuilt the motor. Valves/ports/everything are all bone stock untouched. Same with the intake. Injectors have 180k on them.

Alot of factors can account to 1/4 times, when I ran my car it was about 65 degrees and cool. For instance when I had my stock slipping 700R4/stock converter i could only muster 14.1 @ 99.7 mph. The tranny alone helped me drop 7 tenths of a second and theres still more i could crank out of it.

Good discussion here guys

High 12's N/A......

tunedport, you know, with all that you just told us about how much you weigh, it makes me seriously reconsider the stroker motor deal. maybe i will go and get that junkyard 305 i found the other day and start building...i am all about building this small bore motor, and with the new found info on the smaller valves, i am very interested in seeing what they can do.

when i rebuilt my motor, i used a lighterweight forged rod(needed new ones anyway and they only cost me like $120), do you think that may be helping some? man, i can't wait to get the new tranny/converter combo in the car next month! watch out low 13's!

Cool
I respect your option to do the 305--

It is funny how ones opion can cause such utter dishing here is ones reply

Wy donet you go billd a 427 smal blok?

this is really a know brainer if you know about head flow and bore to stroke ratios.

I have seen quoted " Never argue with an idiot, they will bring you down to there level."


yes u can have your opion and i don't really care, but dam relax

GB

rick

do the 416 305 heads have 1.50 exhaust's stock or 1.40's. im confused now. i thought they had 1.84 int and 1.50 exh. if they dont will it be worth my time to swap in a good set of manley 1.50 exh valves now that i got it tore down

You can say what you want, but your previous reply was about as unintelligible as it gets. The reply was completely off topic, and your grammar and spelling were horrible. Every other post I have read of yours is the exact same way. What else am I to think?

And while there are better bore/stroke combos out there, we are all working with what we have. Besides, it's nice to be the underdog sometimes.

Rick, I understand your point, but you gotta admit, that was a good burn.

To help answer your original question:
I also had a new 305 crank ready to go for 7 years now. I came across my 86 TA for a good price and all my 305 stuff would bolt up since it had the older manifold and heads. I just wanted to use what I had. My 305 stuff was all #s matching and waiting to go in a SE 5 speed with t-tops and HO. That would have been a nice collectable car had it not gotten smashed up 2 years ago. That SE was what it was originally intended for and was a good enough reason for me to build a 305.

305 and tpi do work well together

i got another ques guys. on my build im looking at using a set of keith black pistons #KB143. in the description for them it says i will have a 10.0 comp ratio with the 58 cc heads. but it was calculated using a .030 overbore. im using a stock bore though. will the comp be even higher then? i would think so because its a smaller bore and more air is being compressed in a smaller spot. i guess i dont understand? can anyone explain to me

also what does everyone think of the crane compucam 2050 camshaft. the specs are here. i want to get this cam because i liked the way it responded in zepher's car when he had it.
int dur @050 = 216 exh dur @050 = 228
advertised int dur = 272
advertised exh dur = 284
int lift .454 exh lift .480 with 1.5 rockers
lobe seperation 112
operating range 2200-5200rpm

what does everyone think?

v6camaroman:
the stock exhuast valve on a 416 or 081 head is 1.46" my theory is that if you put a 1.5" exhaust valve, and keep the smallish 1.84" intake valve, the head will actually flow more

the pistons are made to have the c/r for whatever overbore you buy. if it says 10:1, it will be 10:1. the piston is smaller in the standard bore size than it is for the .030 bore. you cannot put a .030 over piston in a standard bore. although i am not sure how your getting away with the standard bore. must have been a clean block.

the cam sounds good to me, with emphasis on the exhuast, i think it will be a good torque cam. which is what the 305 really is any how, a torque motor. i really don't know much about the computers and stuff though, so i am going to leave the decision up to those who know there stuff a bit better.

TrickFlow p/n 3030005

175cc intake runner
58cc combustion chamber
1.94/1.50 valve combo

Price: $1005.99 for a pair from summit (i called to verify)

what do you think of them apples? you could easily sink $700+ into a set of stock cast heads.

Rick, I understand your point, but you gotta admit, that was a good burn

yea it was thats ok--but who cares as I said hell use the 305 I am doing one for a guy with a lt1 cam--told him the same thing because he wants to run 11's NA in a 2600 lb car maybe, but he needs a better cam and heads in my opion
use what you got---but sometimes for a few pennies more one can do a lot better and be more reliable--I understand doing things on a budget-- heck I have a 327 with 8000 dollars into it and it needs different heads

personally, the "use what ya got" excuse is way over used. i want a 305 in the 12's for bragging rights. it's about pride for me.

I still think you guys are runnin nitrous

Heh...show me the plate or solenoids

PS i think once you get rid of that 2.5" catback you will gain alot. Possibly a couple tenths

I ran a 12.757 @ 109.50 mph without the bottle back in '99.....Had the stk T5 trans & stk 10 bolt with 3.73:1 gears & a Auburn Pro series posi....

friends don't let friends race w/ the bottle

I was just kiddin about the nitrous. yah i just installed my edelbrock cat back, it really fits the car well, and so far sounds pretty sweet too. now i jsut need to finish my 13" brake swap on the front (the 12" setup is done on the rear) and get it tuned, maybe i will be with you guys then, hopefully faster!! lol

Wow, i've read all the post's here and i'm just amazed that the 305 can do as well as it is for you guys. I was always under the 350 or larger mentality but I agree it would be fun to be the underdog, anyway the only thing i wanted to know was tunedport How did you make a 335?

Thanks Matt

Matt, my 305 had a spun rod bearing so i bought the Powerhouse 335 stroker bottom end kit.

Technically speaking its a 400 crank (3.750 stroke), 5.7" rods, and keith black pistons into a 305 block with a .030 overbore.

Buy a set of 16" wheels (15s prob won't work with that brake setup) and a set of slicks and run deep 13s

Thanks tuned port, that is wild the reason i have to rebuild my motor is that it has a bad rod bearing.

Matt

mw66nova it said in the description that the pistons would give a 10.0 comp with a 58cc head and a .030 overbore. i know that i couldnt put a .030 piston in a stock bore block. they have the piston available in a stock, .020, .030, .040 and .060 over bores. the cam does sound good then. im going to order it

I had a choice shortblock 305 laying around with all new parts and heads just waiting for a cam & valvetrain. It was almost ready to go. He11 yeah im gonna see how far the 305 will go. My 350 Is waiting for a car that is a little more vintage, im thinking 73 or older.....

Mine is .40 over + 305 = 309 I guess. How silly would that sound: "hey everybody, come check out my sweet 309"

i don't know bro, call the people that your looking to buy the pistons from. heck, i am running 9.5:1 compression, it's not going to hurt you much if it's a tenths of a point.

the crane 2050 compucam is a good choice then? im making the order on monday. the only main ques i have is will it work fine with the stock 85 tpi computer? im still 100% sure it will run good.

ok fellas, listen up. i am in the process of a very serious 3.74" bore motor idea.

335" stroker kit from power house with 10:1 pistons
new trickflow heads with 58cc chambers 175cc intake runners and a 1.94/1.50 valve combo
comp XE 274 (to keep it streetable)
my holley street dominator intake
holley 600 double pumper
my exhaust from current motor

all of this through a freshly rebuilt transgo shift kit fitted th700r4 with my new ATI converter that i am guessing will stall around 2800 (haven't gotten it in the car yet to see for sure) 4.10's and 28" tall drag radials. think that will net me some streetable 12 second passes?

i should be able to build that motor for less than $2500 which is no more than any of the other 12 second motors on the board. i can spray it or force it and go faster, just like anything else here.

mw66nova there should be no reason that motor shouldn't put you deep into the 12s with a car as light as yours.

Those heads/intake/carb combo are far better than my stock head/TPI setup and i'm already deep into the 13s and have the 1/8th ET for 13 flat already.

Although, why go with drag radials, i would just grab some Hoosier Quick Time Pro's for the track

because they are more stable on the top end and i can drive it too and from the track without issues. the cops down in Podunckville, GA really like to stop you when you leave the track, and to them, a street et type of tire isn't legal. besides, after some research, the new mt's drag radials actually have a better compound then the so called "street slicks"

Ahhh, i do like those new MT et street radials...

me too

I wont laugh at anything fast anymore :-)

That being said, I woldnt rebuild a 305 from the ground up when I can snag a 350 block for 100-200$ and go from there.

Last engine I rebuilt for my Formula was 383, still in process of putting together, but if this thing hooks, its gonna scream.

But...... however I want to say it I like the gooffy stuff(like as in you cant go fast with "fill in the blank"). I would be lying if I said I didnt have secret desires to build a 305 or 335 stroker car with tpi, maybe like a 5 spd one :-)

Let people always bash you, just make sure you do it right and you can whomp on them. Half the people talking trash would get walked by any 13 sec car lrt alone one that will hit 12's. 305/derivitive or not.

U guys that are running 12's low 13's should explain to some of the mooks here how u got their. Might enlighten some of them.

I forget the class, back in the day(might still run today?) there were some lightened injected factory 305 camaro's in the deep 12's. They were attractive to the class because they had v8's and a low rated engine. Let them blueprint them to scream and added some gears and lightened the car per the rules and had deep 12 and I believe a few 11 sec cars. Thats always a trip to see.

later and good luck
Jeremy

1989 IROC 305 TPI 5 speed

weight w/ me: 3350

mods:

free mods
headers
off road y
cat back
ac delete
emissions delete
ported plenum


13.952 @ 97.08 w/ 2.02 60ft on 205 75 15s, 35* air in oct of 02

see sig

I beleive a member of this board runs in a class like that, his name is Mod313.... he has a drag camaro with a 305. They have some weird rules which makes them retain stock lift, but they can go wild with duration. I beleive they also have to run stock heads/intake too. I want to say he runs high 11's with his car.

the class is an nhra class called STOCK