TPITuned Port Injection discussion and questions. LB9 and L98 tech, porting, tuning, and bolt-on aftermarket products.
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Hi all, for the past 3 hours ive tried searching and to no avail i didnty find an answer.
Last year the car ran with P.O., i get it and buy all the correct things for the 90-92 specific Speed Density setup. (p.O. pulled built motor/trans/ECM for his s10 swap...but left me a non hacked harness)
I go to fire up the project up last night and noticed no drop in fuel rail PSI(pull pump fuse and crank over). So my thought is computer isnt firing the injectors. After a few tests, i know im getting spark to each plug so thats not it.....
When i turn key on i dont get a SES or CEL light at all. No blinking no steady light...where do i start testing?
When keys is turned on i get this light sequence
1.air bag light(blink few times and goes off)
2. sercruity light(vats?) comes on for a second and then goes off....
So im getting spark...motor rolls over...no smell of fuel and no SES/CEL light
im hoping someone has a clue why im tearing hair out of my head
BTW....new fuses EVERYWHERE
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__________________ High rev'n TPI......wait oxymoron?
CURRENT--1991 trans am--333ci TPI/700r4 :P--
PARTING--1985 TRANS AM--LG4/700r4--full bolt ons--
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Hi all, for the past 3 hours ive tried searching and to no avail i didnty find an answer.
Last year the car ran with P.O., i get it and buy all the correct things for the 90-92 specific Speed Density setup. (p.O. pulled built motor/trans/ECM for his s10 swap...but left me a non hacked harness)
I go to fire up the project up last night and noticed no drop in fuel rail PSI(pull pump fuse and crank over). So my thought is computer isnt firing the injectors. After a few tests, i know im getting spark to each plug so thats not it.....
When i turn key on i dont get a SES or CEL light at all. No blinking no steady light...where do i start testing?
When keys is turned on i get this light sequence
1.air bag light(blink few times and goes off)
2. sercruity light(vats?) comes on for a second and then goes off....
So im getting spark...motor rolls over...no smell of fuel and no SES/CEL light
im hoping someone has a clue why im tearing hair out of my head
BTW....new fuses EVERYWHERE
try this. on a 91 computer if there is a shorted injector it will not operate. unplug each injector and with a ohm meter check the injectors they should read 14 to 16 ohms. under 10 is ng. this is only a good test if the factory multecs are still in the engine. i am assuming they are. if you find a bad 1 or 2 keep them unplugged and try to start. if you need injectors call Jon at fuel injector connection.
good luck
don't you have an lt1 intake on an old school 327?
Thats what I remember from a previous thread of yours.
If everything swapped fine,it might possibly be the ecm.
If you know someone with a speed density car,a swap of ecms might give you your answer.
Keep us posted man!
BTW, got that surface rust fixed on the roof yet?
i have not done the lt1 intake swap yet...TRYING to get a baseline of car b4 mods....
yes the fuel pump is "priming" or cycling
weird thing is the SES light is working now and im getting only code 12(i know what it is though)
car keeps wanting to pop though intake even though ive set the dizzy in 5 times at number 1 cylinder TOP DEAD CENTER
ive got 43psi of rail pressure but wont drop when cranking (like inkectors are not working)
i ohm'd the lt1 24# injectors out and they all came to 12.1 to 12.3
im about to light this piece of shite on fire and roast marshmellows on it. Ive spent a ton of money trying to get this tpi crap to run and its not working. I dont want to hack the car and go carb but it looks like i might have to.
BTW...no the roof hasnt been touched...too busy figuring this junk out
TIMMY....just be glad you didnt buy this ecm....it came wityh tar and goo on it
is there power at the injectors unplug one and probe the plug one pin should have 12 volts when the key is on the other one gets earthed by the ecu to fire the injector
is there power at the injectors unplug one and probe the plug one pin should have 12 volts when the key is on the other one gets earthed by the ecu to fire the injector
ill try to see ifthere is 12volts to the connector
if you look at it from another point of view..... a 91 car with a ecu reco'd in 1995 points to maybe something thats causing the ecu to short or blow capacitors.
but who knows.
can u get another ecu to test out?
I thought these ecu's had a backup mode that would run on a closed loop or something if it died?
if you look at it from another point of view..... a 91 car with a ecu reco'd in 1995 points to maybe something thats causing the ecu to short or blow capacitors.
but who knows.
can u get another ecu to test out?
I thought these ecu's had a backup mode that would run on a closed loop or something if it died?
to my understanding the car SHOULD run in limp mode if ecu dies......
but no...out of all my local 3rd gen buddies that are still TpI they are MAF
all the ecu grounds and 12+ are good........looks like i got screwed over buying a junk ecu
hey toyata,does the memcal mount to an adapter board inside the ecm?
Possibly someone had the vats disabled in the ecm before you got it.
That keep you from getting the desired 12v to the inj.
--the SES light comes on when it feels like it wants to....
The SES light should come on EVERY time, if it isn't, you only have intermittent power to the ECM, or the ECM is possibly bad.
The next thing I suspect is that the VATS may be screwing with you, but I haven't done tons of reading on that. If you get a chip and an adapter from www.moates.net, I'll come over and we can disable the VATS in the chip and try that. We can also then mess around with fan temps and whatever else you want changed.
Hey I'm a local thirdgen guy in the area and I have a SD '91 Trans Am, I feel left out! I'm mounting and balancing the tires for it today, and I'm going to tie up the loose ends and start driving the week of the 6th. Don't set your car on fire yet. Once mine is done I'll come up and help out. Do you have any wiring diagrams or trouble shooting flow diagrams for the car?
The SES light should come on EVERY time, if it isn't, you only have intermittent power to the ECM, or the ECM is possibly bad.
The next thing I suspect is that the VATS may be screwing with you, but I haven't done tons of reading on that. If you get a chip and an adapter from www.moates.net, I'll come over and we can disable the VATS in the chip and try that. We can also then mess around with fan temps and whatever else you want changed.
Hey I'm a local thirdgen guy in the area and I have a SD '91 Trans Am, I feel left out! I'm mounting and balancing the tires for it today, and I'm going to tie up the loose ends and start driving the week of the 6th. Don't set your car on fire yet. Once mine is done I'll come up and help out. Do you have any wiring diagrams or trouble shooting flow diagrams for the car?
i need all the help i can get......i have a cable for aldl to USB for our 3rd gen and datamaster for 90-92...just my laptop is dead now(blue screen of death)
i have a chilton wiring diagram for wiring...but it sucks and i wish i could find better.
1MeanZ...i tried locating that black box and no avail....no fuses thing inline on the positive cable coming from the drivers side of car.
UPDATE for people that dont read though previous posts...ill give you the jist of the issue
--great spark
--43.5 psi of rail psi
--12 volts are present to the injector
--apply 12 volts to the injector and they release pressure
hey toyata,does the memcal mount to an adapter board inside the ecm?
Possibly someone had the vats disabled in the ecm before you got it.
That keep you from getting the desired 12v to the inj.
ill have to take a pic of the chip when you take the door off the ecu........looks stock to me.....nothing like the adapters from the moats.net site
i think someone told me a bullshite story about the computer being modded for 24# injectors and stuff.....
Don't worry about your tune, injector size, etc. If you have a good ECM, chip, and adapter, I'll help you burn a tune that will suit your needs.
I just got my rims and tires mounted and balanced today. I'll swing by Dad's tomorrow night and drop them off and see if I can find the ECM fuse on my Trans Am, then I'll report back on what I find.
Keep the faith!! You'll get it! YOu'll be glad you went TPI this summer when the car starts good and you're getting 20+mpg.
turns out buddy/neighbor put dizzy in 180* out and i didnt question his setup due to hes a engine builder LOL. i never did a check due to being alone i couldnt bump it over and check if piston was up
But big issue was ecm wasnt getting 12 volts.....even though every fuse and link and such was getting good 12 volts.....
so i put 12 volts to the ecm and BAM SES light came on...cranked it and the sweet sound of a 333ci tpi open header monster rang aloud!
so now im rigging a kill/run switch to put power to the ecm....the IAC is bad and motor is running at 1900rpm idle......the motor is VERY snappy. Im stupid happy and not long til this thing is driving. I have to figure out how to bypass the Hot H2o valve and TB for heater core.
Finding center bolt cover bolts locally is a pita......another thing holding this buildup back
great news, we knew you'd get it. keep being meticulous and get all the issues fixed, including the IAC motor and such. You can't properly tune the engine unless everything is working like it should.
great news, we knew you'd get it. keep being meticulous and get all the issues fixed, including the IAC motor and such. You can't properly tune the engine unless everything is working like it should.
im trying to search and find how to test the IAC and wires to IAC....
im trying to search and find how to test the IAC and wires to IAC....
cool toyota! Glad to hear shes alive!
on the IAC thing.
when I swapped my 305 tpi to the alum. head vette tpi I kept the stock 305 memcal and purchased 22lb. inj. from fic.
You know I was looking for a 350 memcal just like you!LOL
I found a local buddy that programmed my 305 memcal to run correctly with my 350 and even was able to reset some of the settings in the IAC.
maybe someone can point me in right direction...i need to test my IAC motor to see if its good...i dont want to buy one for 80 something dollars and turn out to be ecm issue.
But timmy...The ecm and memcal is for a L98 and thats basically what im running
thats the chip...looks weird...but nothing like the MOATS.NET adpaters?
Shelby, that is just a factory computer chip. The moates adapter allows you to run that chip (called a memcal) and also add a chip that you custom burn. Go to www.moates.net and look for chip adapters and you'll find them. I think they are $40 or something. If you need more help with it, let me know, I'll send you the exact link of what you'll need to buy. Get the car running and all the bugs worked out, then if you want to make changes, just buy the adapter and a few chips and I'll come mess with the tune. We can easily disable the VATS, lower the fan temps, change idle speed, etc.
the adapter goes to that spot and the memcal will plug into the adapter, that's one way to do it anyways..
what's a "dizzy"?
my 91 RS with the TPI swap won't start either... have fuel pressure and good spark, injectors just aren't firing
okay...heres a check list a friend gave me and i ended up finding out my ecu wasnt getting 12 volts...your maybe something esle:
--Check engine light coming on at all?
--Sercuity light coming on and then goes away?
--12 volts to the injectors with key on?
--apply 12 volts to the injectors one by one with fuel rail pressurized and listen to hear if they "bleed off"(just do one with pressure in rail or you will hydro lock your motor.....and thats not good lol)
--try applying 12 volts to the injectors quickly...like a tap tap tap...listen for clicking
1meanz,I don't think hes going to need the vats disabled now since the car is running.lol
Heh, he will this summer when his car won't start in the mall parking lot because his VATS module crapped out on him and the car is stranded because of a stupid key.
Heh, he will this summer when his car won't start in the mall parking lot because his VATS module crapped out on him and the car is stranded because of a stupid key.
haha!!So true!!
Thanks for that one 1meanz!I needed a good laugh today.
So toyota,you want a set of free valve covers?Just send me $15 to cover the cost of shipping.
Heck,I'll even throw in a vats module!LOL!!
haha!!So true!!
Thanks for that one 1meanz!I needed a good laugh today.
So toyota,you want a set of free valve covers?Just send me $15 to cover the cost of shipping.
Heck,I'll even throw in a vats module!LOL!!
are they the grey ones? if so then sometime this weekend ill send you paypal
but yah im gonna have vats taken out....more i think about it...i dont want it leaving me somewhere. Most likely will be taking GF out to movie or MALL LOL and car wont crank
so now im rigging a kill/run switch to put power to the ecm....the IAC is bad and motor is running at 1900rpm idle......the motor is VERY snappy. Im stupid happy and not long til this thing is driving. I have to figure out how to bypass the Hot H2o valve and TB for heater core.
No need for a kill switch, C207 pin F is the ECM to fuse box 12v
You can see they all use the same pins on the C207, only the number of injectors and ECM pin assignments change
Depending whether your RS was TBI or V6 your VSS assignment will change
TBI has the VSS going thru the C100 bulkhead connector, V6/TPI goes strait to the ECM
V6 will have no change, TBI you will have to bypass the buffer box or your Speedo/cruise will not work
Quote:
Heh, he will this summer when his car won't start in the mall parking lot because his VATS module crapped out on him and the car is stranded because of a stupid key.
There are numerous VATS disable articles on this site and others
are they the grey ones? if so then sometime this weekend ill send you paypal
but yah im gonna have vats taken out....more i think about it...i dont want it leaving me somewhere. Most likely will be taking GF out to movie or MALL LOL and car wont crank
Yeah man,they are the grey TPI covers.
If you want pics,pm me your email and I can get some this weekend.
I have a bunch of parts kicking around here so,if ya need anything else,
just ask.
Hi Folks
this may sound dumb but check your battery - I have a 87 TPI that sits for a long time, when I go to start it does the same thing, dies, restart, after a couple of tries, it runs. I have noticed once the voltage is above 12 v it run ok, below 12 it will not run long. I replaced the battery it run a lot better after sitting for a while.
thanks
Bill
Hi Folks
this may sound dumb but check your battery - I have a 87 TPI that sits for a long time, when I go to start it does the same thing, dies, restart, after a couple of tries, it runs. I have noticed once the voltage is above 12 v it run ok, below 12 it will not run long. I replaced the battery it run a lot better after sitting for a while.
thanks
Bill
Yeah I keep a battery charger on it when im going to be working on it for any amount of time, thanks for the input.
BTW, could a bad injector cause a closed circuit, sending 12v to the signal wires from the PCM (blu/grn wires)
well...it revs really good but wont drive worth a crap
misses.......pops....spits....will not accelerate at all!
but while coasting or just pressing gas enough to keep at same speed you blip the gas and sounds like a race car and you think its gonna race off.....wrong. it acts like its out of time or something but everything is new and timing is dead on at 6*BTDC with est disconnected.
i did see that i have the MAP line hooked up to the wrong port on the plenum. I have the map line hooked to the LARGE port out of the 3.
What would it do if the map line is too long and too large? I thought it would have better throttle response. When doing a free rev it, it revs right up to redline....but like stated before when in gear it runs like crap
MAP doesnt care where it gets vacuum, only that it gets some ()
Check for other vacuum leaks
Did you ohm the injectors?
How old is the fuel filter
welp....my cars done for a few weeks
fuel pump took a dump today while out driving.....tried to put new fuse in the fuel pump fuse holder under hood and blows it instantly....motor shorted out.
i was running 23psi.....then i adjusted the regulator back up to stock psi level and car ran a lot better......then pump died out...
im not looking forward to changing a fuel pump out
fuel pump took a dump today while out driving.....tried to put new fuse in the fuel pump fuse holder under hood and blows it instantly....motor shorted out.
i was running 23psi.....then i adjusted the regulator back up to stock psi level and car ran a lot better......then pump died out...
im not looking forward to changing a fuel pump out
Hi
The fuel pump isn't to bad, just drain the tank before you try lowing it. I had to disconnect the rear end and move it forward. Once you do that, why don't you put back the stock tuning because your engine is pretty much stock anyway. Get it to run with the stock tuning than go for the enhanced tuning.
thanks
Bill
Last edited by 92 Z-28 Camaro; 03-30-2009 at 06:01 PM.
Reason: typo
Hi
The fuel pump isn't to bad, just drain the tank before you try lowing it. I had to disconnect the rear end and move it forward. Once you do that, why don't you put back the stock tuning because your engine is pretty much stock anyway. Get it to run with the stock tuning than go for the enhanced tuning.
thanks
Bill
well after talking to a lot of people i dropped tank correctly and swapped pumps.....
only to put new fuse in and it blows! turned out this whole time a wire had melted to the header that came from the oil pressure sending unit this in turn shorted the circuit out for the fuel pump. I was so pissed when i found that wire melted........and to add to my mental stress....i pulled a brand new WALBRO 255lph pump out.
SO! car runs and drives again...LOL
I did find out autozone radiator caps dont work at all....car came to temp and coolant started flowing out around the cap. I took cap off and bent the tabs that hold it on the neck and it holds pressure now.
CLIFFS: now i know why people cut their cars up to change fuel pumps....pulling it right way is retarded
