KiLLJ0Y

iTrader: (1)

Hey Allen, honestly, you should really think about marketing it. Even Edelbrock has its own foundry in CA. Just do all the necessary flowing and testing. Also get a test mule, a stock L98 TPI car and run some tests, this is where it will come in handy to sell to the general public, what it will do over a stock long block

there is serious money to be made from this, hate to see you pass it up.

1989GTATransAm

iTrader: (3)

Seeing as it is an Edelbrock TPI base they would have no problem modifying the one they have. For the general market they would probably have to narrow the base to head opening down to a Felpro 1204 gasket. Right now it is just under the size of a Felpro 1206. The end user could then open it up to what ever size opening his head has.

I bet the manufacturers think this is old technology and would not sell. The BBK turtle intake did not do what they thought it would and it appears that they have dropped it. I really don't know how big of a market there would be. If someone wants to market it they have my blessings.

therain2008

if it iliminates the air restriction of a standard TPI and generates alot of torque because of the long runners like a standard TPI does, i'm sure it would sell! I sure would buy it!

Chevy86 IROC-Z

iTrader: (17)

1989GTATransAm, it's official. My vacation has been approved. My family and I will be going to Universal Studios in April, 9th through the 11th. So can I get the adress to Dyno Dons shop to see your incredible project?

1989GTATransAm

iTrader: (3)

Here is his address and information.

Don Lorentzen
2831 White Star Ave #A
Anaheim, CA 92806
(714) 630-1502

Chevy86 IROC-Z

iTrader: (17)

Awesome. Thank you.

Chevy86 IROC-Z

iTrader: (17)

Well there was no time to visit Dyno Dons shop. Bummer. Any updates?

1989GTATransAm

iTrader: (3)

Waiting to get into Don's shop myself for the install.

Chevy86 IROC-Z

iTrader: (17)

Really? damb.

TT 68

Any updates on this project or have all your efforts gone into the cross ram?

1989GTATransAm

iTrader: (3)

The intake system is being installed on the car right now. Probably pick the car up on Tuesday. We had to put a small dent in the runner for injectors 4 and 5 to clear. Not sure what happened as it seemed to work fine on the bench. I hope it does not screw things up to much. Should have chasis dyno number around the first of the year. Waiting on some other projects to come to fruition so we can all dyno together.

TT 68

A small dent shouldn't mess things up too much if at all. I saw testing where they showed that small clearance dents in header tubes don't show much if any flow restriction. Should apply to your intake runners as well.

Hope all the other projects get done soon so we can all see the results of all your hard work.

1989GTATransAm

iTrader: (3)

Got the car back with version 2 of the LTR project installed. I have to say it sure looks nice sitting in there. Only thing now is a chasis dyno run and some tuning on the dyno. By the way I am considering selling version one of the LTR project. It would sure make a nice intake system for someone. It put down over 400rwhp in my car and has instant torque. It just peaked a little lower than I wanted but would probably be just right for most. Anyways here are some pictures of the install.

Passenger side:



Straight ahead:



Drivers side:

lb9 GTA

most people wouldn't even notice. LOVE IT!

Twin_Turbo

iTrader: (25)

How much would you take for it?

1989GTATransAm

iTrader: (3)

PM sent.

David 91RS/Z28

I've been reading this post for two days while working, lol! I applaud you and your drive to improve a long runner TPI system! I still think it's one of the coolest intakes that was ever developed and for you to take it up many levels with your R&D is awesome! Can't wait to hear the results!!

TTOP350

iTrader: (8)

Very well done!

1989GTATransAm

iTrader: (3)

Just got back from a little drive over to the gas station to fill it up. Drives pretty good and one does not really feel the large cam. Even the guy who did the manifold swap was surprised as to how docile the car is considering all that has been done to it. I want to get on the throttle some but the roads are wet today. Believe it or not we are getting some rain here in SoCal.

kad5118

well how does it perform

cuisinartvette

I know someone who could help you get a patent pending and possibly production on your piece. Working on a few products right now.
All USA made too. @%@ China

kad5118

ok well what are their known price

1989GTATransAm

iTrader: (3)

Performs very well. It just keeps pulling and pulling and puts you further back in the seat the faster you go. Only went up to around 75+mph in 2nd gear. When we get it on the dyno next Saturday I will have some numbers to put up.

1989GTATransAm

iTrader: (3)

Let me know if there is any interest. I would be glad to help out. From a production stand point it is not a whole lot different from what is out there.

1989GTATransAm

iTrader: (3)

Found the lone good dyno pull from the first long tube runner project. I did not think there was one. So here it is.

1989GTATransAm

iTrader: (3)

Here is a dyno pull from yesterdays 2nd version of the long tube runner project. This version was to move the torque curve up which it did and add some horsepower which it did not. One difference is this run does not have the exhaust termination boxes on it. I will put them back on and see what difference it makes. Also the run where I got 420 rwhp with the First and modified SLP runners had the exhaust termination boxes on it.

One thing we did prove is that a long tube runner TPI intake system can make power past 6500 rpm. Don let off around 6700 and it was still riding out on the power band. I am to chicken to have tried for 7000rpm. I have never taken the motor up that high. So putting my Yank SS4000 stall back in with maybe a shift point at 6700 rpm outside of the initial launch the motor would never see less than 405rwhp going down the track.

1989GTATransAm

iTrader: (3)

OK, I have had a few days to think about this and I also posted the results on Speedtalk for some review. It appears that the motor is running out of air around 5300rpm. It is just basically flat lining from there on up. I have seen this with some of my other builds with identical results when I run out of cam or the ports are to small.

Remember I had to slightly dent two of the runners for the injectors to clear. The guys at the shop who did the install had to dent the runners even further for the injectors to clear. The injectors I used to measure with on the bench and the ones on the car are apparently a little different. So this could be part of the problem.

The other is I don't know how much care was taken to position the base on the heads so that the ports line up in the best possible manner. Also I don't know how well the 1206 intake manifold gasket was placed on the heads and did it move. So the bottom line is I need to partially take this thing apart and start doing some investigating. Any intrusion into the ports will make the ports act smaller than they are.

If it comes to it I may have to re-do the runners so that they clear the two injectors without denting or maybe try and find a thinner injector.

Dyno Don

iTrader: (7)

You could be on to something there, I was looking
at the graph and it looks like turbulence.

1989GTATransAm

iTrader: (3)

Don, I sure hope so, otherwise it just does not make any sense.

TORN

iTrader: (17)

Get a camera like this and have a look inside without taking it apart.

http://www.ridgid.com/tools/seesnake-micro

This is the exact camera I used to line up my intake ports.

1989GTATransAm

iTrader: (3)

Couple of approaches to solving the dented runner problem. One is I am looking into some thinner injectors. South Bay is doing some research for me. The current injectors are about .775" wide. I think I can get some that are .600" wide.

The other is I might "miter" cut the affected runners so I can bend them over ever so slightly. I think the width of a hacksaw blade would be enough. Then weld them back up and grind everything smooth again. Also I will make a tool to take out the dents. So things are slowly moving forward once again.

Anti-Venom

I have to admit, I usually pay no attention to projects like this, and tend to write them off as being overzealous, and usually failing to deliver as a finished product. But man you delivered. I really like what you've done here. Props!

TTOP350

iTrader: (8)

Anything new to report??

1989GTATransAm

iTrader: (3)

Nothing new to report. Things are on hold with the TPI projectt until I get done with my current project. It is taking up all my resources and I mean all. I am putting a L92/6L80 into a 1965 Buick Skylark. A resto-mod if you will.

wulff

Would love to see you get back to this, being a TPI guy (I LOVE the looks of TPI runners!) I am kind of outside looking in as my ride is a 1987 Monte Carlo SS with 6-speed and a TPI, I am running a 406 and the torque is awesome! All I ever hear from guys is how terrible TPI is and I would like to go beyond the mild porting I have done and bore out the butterfly's etc.
Good luck with your new project!

1989GTATransAm

iTrader: (3)

I have had a few inquiries about my large, long tube runner project. As of right now I probably would not be able to get back on the project until later this year. However the problem with that is I have to pass smog later this year or in January at the very latest. I don't want the car to be down during that time so maybe January will be when I get back on the project.

cuisinartvette

you know you could hit up Edelbrock to cast stuff for you too.

Youd be surprised whose stuff is cast at their foundries.

Chevy86 IROC-Z

iTrader: (17)

A hefty fee may be imposed. On top of that, if mass production is done, Edelbrock would probably receive 95% of each sale and 1989GTATransAm get only about 5% . This is a possible figure. For musicians, each cd sold, the artist receives about 5-25 cents from each cd costing aprox $15. Sad reality.

IROCgiraffe

iTrader: (3)

Won't know until you ask. Sometimes one may be surprised.

cuisinartvette

Anythings negotiable. So can we have half his 5%

Chevy86 IROC-Z

iTrader: (17)

I do know. It's how business is done. First steps are to go Edelbrock to be able to obtain written permission to modify and patent one of his products. Once approval is granted, the next step is to get a patent and perform the steps to have the work copyrighted through the Library of Congress. Then once it is patented, if Edelbrock sees potential capital gains, it will take the "master". The. Negotiations begin with lawyers present to go over dollar figures and costs of mass production. The end result? The inventor will get a percentage per piece sold or agree to a buy out of the product and release all interests of goods. The end result can go either number of ways. A good example of how stuff is produced and marketed, but in a small scale would be the Doscovery Channels "Pitchmen" where people present their products, but get only a fraction of the sales.

1989GTATransAm

iTrader: (3)

A little update on this thread. I have the large long tube TPI back in my hands. I am going to install it back on the car and do some dyno pulls with it. I have no issues with the ECM like I did the last time out.

khulsebus

iTrader: (2)

Glad to see that you're still working on this. I thought you gave up.

TTOP350

iTrader: (8)

Great news, can't wait !!

no new tires

sbd-

InfernalVortex

iTrader: (4)

Silent but deadly?

1989GTATransAm

iTrader: (3)

Thanks guys. I am also going to add a 4th gen radiator fan assembly while doing the install. I am looking forward to it. Dyno Don has a few cars that are ready to be dyno'd and I want to get in on the action. Remember, this unit flowed 335 cfm on Joe Sherman's flow bench. Here is a current picture of it as it sits in my den.

no new tires

-SuBbeD-

galactica53

Really want to see what this will do.... I'm looking to build another 3rd Gen from the ground up and always looking at what others are doing to make the cars just a little bit better. It amazes me when you add all those little bits together you can come up with some wonderful stuff.

Thanks for sharing
Cameron

1989GTATransAm

iTrader: (3)

Hopefully we will have some results in the next 60 days. I am waiting for Dyno Don to have some room in his shop. Then a club dyno day will be set up.