gta_knight

Hey guys,

Im doing my first ever engine swap over the coming months, theres nothing wrong with my 5.0 but i was offered a 5.7 cheap from a friend who had an arguement with a truck and lost in his Trans Am, so i thought yeah this sounds like a plan.

Once i get the 5.0 out of the car im going to strip and repaint the engine bay and weld up any holes that arent needed to make it cleaner.

the 5.7 is out of another 87 GTA which was the main selling point as its a straight swap, i know i will have to put the other ECU in though, and while the engine is out im planning on sending the transmission off to be rebuilt and uprated

So here is my engine bay as of now



Fairly tidy, all AC removed, all emissions gone, just stuff we dont need here in the UK, its got hooker headers and a full stainless exhaust.

Ive got a colour scheme im going with for the 5.7, black with red accents, just to follow on that Knight Rider theme. Ive already painted some parts with VHT satin and im pretty pleased with how they have turned out. Im just waiting for some red to arrive to try out





As for the engine itself, it was running great before the crash, and still was after the crash actually but im replacing most parts on it anyway, the only thing that needs doing is the valve stem seals, but everything else im doing for piece of mind like the injectors, thats a new water pump in my picture thats been painted, new gaskets, new oil pump etc etc. And ive got a lot of new parts on the 5.0 that will transfer over to this engine.

So, on with a long labour intensive winter !

Scott

racerx520

iTrader: (1)

i'm getting all the parts for a 350 swap too this spring (just had my new summit aluminum heads delivered, now i need a new cam and then slp intake runners)

One idea, while you have the intake manifold off, maybe take a shot at port/polishing it with a dremel.

Also: these late model GM small blocks had a problem with cracking in the water jacket near the roller lifters. might be a good idea to bring the motor to a machine shop and have them just take a look to make sure its not cracked. I bought a 350 TPI 3 years ago, the car was wrecked and the motor was "fine." Well, after hurricane sandy ruined it, we figured we'd rebuild it and bore it out to a 355 (the motor was clearly high mileage, and cylinder walls were basically misshapen from wear). After paying $200 to have the motor hot tanked, the machine shop noticed a very tiny crack, and it turned out i was sitting on a no good motor for 3 years. The machine shop told me these motors were very common for cracking there since they didnt add enough metal when they were cast. just food for though....

gta_knight

hmmm, thats the first time ive heard that about them cracking :/ i will have to look into that then thanks.

As for the porting, do you literally just enlarge the square ports until you are happy enough ? obviously not too big or the gasket wont seal ?

eseibel67

You do not need a new computer, only the PROM. If your buddy's car was an 87 or 88 it should work as is.

Also, is that a real GTA (Y84)? It was difficult, however possible to order a GTA in 1987 without A/C.

gta_knight

It is yeah, i deleted the AC myself and fitted the box. I had my doubts about my car when i got it, as it was already undergoing the knight rider conversion when i got it, but im pretty sure it is, 305 TPI factory t-top, it had all the GTA trim on the inside, and i found the lines for the power lumbar seats etc when i took the interior out.

The only thing i wasnt sure of was the rear end, its got drums and not discs, but its got an LSD, after a bit of researching it turns out you could get GTA's with drums in 87. But i feel like im rambling on a bit now !

The 5.7 is indeed from another 87, a hardtop GTA he even gave me the ECU and wiring harness, which doesnt look in much better condition than my own cars.

However ive got an engine harness from an 88 which is in fantastic condition so im hoping that will just plug in and sort out my wiring problems ive had for years

gta_knight

Well i started taking the 5.0 to bits at the weekend, I got the rad out, starter off, Y pipe off, alternator etc etc. Still quite a few things to undo and take off before its ready to come out but its getting there

gta_knight

Ive finished painting the intake from the 5.7 and im really happy with how it turned out, im going with red and black to tie in with the knight rider theme.

The colours have turned out crap in the picture but the red is a really nice deep red

Jim85IROC

iTrader: (2)

Looking good so far. If I could make a suggestion, it would be to take the hood off. It's going to have to come off before you pull the motor anyway, and it'll make all of the fooling around that you're doing now go so much easier.

gta_knight

Dont worry, the hood is certainly coming off, ive been doing everything myself so far so i need an extra pair of hands to take that off, hopefully my dad can pop round one night and help me take it off

gta_knight

Got the engine and transmission out last night ! it went pretty smoothly, so now its a case of stripping my engine bay and tidying it all up before painting it.



Argh, what have i done..... lol

gta_knight

Engine bay prep is coming along nicely, although its freezing cold in the garage now which makes it a real chore getting it done.



Ive also been talking to Brian (Tuned Performance) hes told me i can get rid of my EGR valve and is going to re-programme my Memcal for me, so off it came last night, then i made a steel blanking plate, RTV'd it and bolted it back in place, i just need to paint it and thats the intake sorted

gta_knight

The intake is pretty much done now, the more i do the more im liking the colour scheme too, the 'Tuned Port Injection' plate will be getting swapped for a custom one at some point but theres more important things to do first !



I also finished up painting the front crossmember and the steering linkages, all looks nice and tidy

Joe Tag

iTrader: (4)

So glad you went to Brian for help. Even though the shipping across the pond will be a pain, you won't regret it. I have seen and read nothing but good about the man. He is truly awesome.

gta_knight

Thanks Joe, yeah the postage shouldnt be too bad as its quite small but it will be worth every penny if it makes my car run smooth ! Brian has even offered to send the chip to south bay injectors to be sent with my new injectors to save on postage on the return trip

Tuned Performance

iTrader: (92)

I wanted to thank you joe for the shout out
subscribed mate looking real good, hope you get your compressor soon and get the paint layer down.

gta_knight

Thanks Brian, i have a new compressor ! hadnt exactly budgeted for one right before Christmas but oh well, i need it. Im so busy at work in the run upto Christmas too so when i get in from a 10-12 hour day everyday i cant be bothered working on the car, lol

I will hopefully get the memcal posted out to you in the new year though Brian

gta_knight

Guys, im looking for some input on a new camshaft for the 5.7, i was planning on having the transmission rebuilt but i think it would be more sensible to get the engine done instead.

I was assured it was a strong runner, ive seen the car in videos too hauling *** so no doubts there, i just feel now is the time to take it to an engine builders shop and get it properly looked over and parts replaced while its out the car.

And with that in mind, whenever i replace something, i generally like to upgrade where possible so ive been looking at these Comp cam kits on ebay, it looks like you get everything in the box like a new timing chain, hydraulic lifters etc etc

Are these Comp cams any good ? im not looking for huge uprated performance, but if the car goes faster then i will certainly not complain

http://www.ebay.com/itm/COMP-CAM-CHEVY-262-TUNED-PORT-INJECTION-TPI-CAMSHAFT-K-KIT-305-350-/171194835299?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item27dc01e163&vxp=mtr

gta_knight

Guys, im looking for some input on a new camshaft for the 5.7, i was planning on having the transmission rebuilt but i think it would be more sensible to get the engine done instead.

I was assured it was a strong runner, ive seen the car in videos too hauling *** so no doubts there, i just feel now is the time to take it to an engine builders shop and get it properly looked over and parts replaced while its out the car.

And with that in mind, whenever i replace something, i generally like to upgrade where possible so ive been looking at these Comp cam kits on ebay, it looks like you get everything in the box like a new timing chain, hydraulic lifters etc etc

Are these Comp cams any good ? im not looking for huge uprated performance, but if the car goes faster then i will certainly not complain

http://www.ebay.com/itm/COMP-CAM-CHEVY-262-TUNED-PORT-INJECTION-TPI-CAMSHAFT-K-KIT-305-350-/171194835299?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item27dc01e163&vxp=mtr

gta_knight

sorry for the double post, not sure how thats happened

MoJoe

iTrader: (5)

The 87 350 should have a roller cam. The ebay auction you listed is for a flat tappet... No need to downgrade during a cam swap!

The LT4 HOT cam is a popular swap. Just make sure your heads (spring strength and lift clearance) can handle it.

Whether EBay, summit, or your preferred speed shop.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/GM-Performance-LT4-Hot-Cam-Hydraulic-Roller-Camshaft-Chevy-LT1-5-7L-24502586-/190984965013?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item2c77974b95&vxp=mtr

gta_knight

damn this upgrade business can be confusing, the listing even says in the description its for a TPI engine !

The engine is stock, stock heads so i was looking for something to just swap in to give a bit more power without having to do any major mods ?

something like this sounds alright, i dont want a cam that gives you that loud choppy muscle car idle, i like the smooth quieter idle if im being honest

http://www.ebay.com/itm/COMP-1987-98-305-350-CHEVY-258-THROTTLE-BODY-ROLLER-CAM-/200975635357?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item2ecb14d39d&vxp=mtr

MoJoe

iTrader: (5)

The previous, flat tappet cam would be correct for 85-86 TPI. While the second cam is a roller cam for the 87+ engines. (Although truck engines did not get roller cam until '95-ish).

This cam lists 206*/212* (Intake/Exhaust) measured at .050" lift, and lift is .480/.488" with Lobe Separation Angle of 112*.
This is a minor step up from the stock 202*/207* with .431/.443" lift with 114.5 LSA, you can lookup here.
The LT4 hot cam will make a bit more power with 218*/228* .492" lift, 112* LSA.
Note: all listed using 1.5 for rockers.

Honest with your goals is important so you know to ignore someone who recommends a cam with 240* (@.050") timing and .650" of lift with 108* LSA!

gta_knight

Most of that went straight over my head, lol, basically, is an LT4 cam a straight swap or will i need to change anything else when fitting it ?

MoJoe

iTrader: (5)

The cam will swap straight into the block, and you can reuse the stock roller lifters. The heads I cannot guarantee. When you have the engine apart and freshen the heads, your machine shop will be able to tell you how much lift the heads/springs/valves will be capable.

Lift - this is how far the cam will open the valves. More lift will make more power*, without making the engine less streetable.
* The heads/ports determine how useful the extra lift is. Useful airflow in a stock head maxes out around 0.500" lift. You would be wasting money to get a cam with .600" lift, and the machining and springs to get the valves to open to .600". 0.500" lift is usually good for "strong stock" while going bigger transitions to needing aftermarket heads going more toward "full-race".

Duration - This is "how long" the valves are open in relation to crankshaft rotation. 206*, where the * means degrees of crankshaft rotation. 206* is stock. 210* is not much bigger, and will hard to tell a difference. 220* will make more power still, and be more noticeable. While 230* is getting to the "lopey idle" range that you've stated is more than you want.
These numbers are measured when the valve has (barely) opened @ 0.050", and are useful for apples-to-apples comparison. The "advertised duration" will likely be in the 260-270* range.

Two numbers - whether for lift (.480/.488") or duration (206*/212*) specifies the Intake then the Exhaust. In your ebay example, the Intake will open .480" and be held open for 206 crankshaft degrees. The exhaust valve will be opened a little higher and longer. These "split" lobes favor the exhaust to overcome more restrictive exhausts (manifold, stock y-pipe, cat, muffler, etc).

LSA = Lobe Separation Angle = the number of crank degrees between the exhaust lobe and intake lobe. 112*-115* has less overlap (when both valves are open at the same time) and makes for a smooth idle. 110* or less is a side effect of longer durations, makes for a lopey idle, less vacuum.

If I haven't explained well enough, do an online search for camshaft tutorials, and search here on TGO for recommendations. Your ebay cam gets you 4* or 5* more and .050" more lift. From my reading/research the LT4 hot cam (218*/228* .492" lift, 112* LSA) is as big as you want to go for the most performance, while still maintaining good idle and street manners.

86T/A_Ram_Air

keep in mind you do have to shorten/tap in the dowel pin on a LT4 cam but otherwise its a straight swap

gta_knight

Really good explanation MoJoe thanks, after reading that im wondering if i should just leave the stock one in.

If there was a cam that would give me a bit more power, say 220* as you have said, without having to worry about the stock heads then i might go for that but i dont want this getting to expensive.

Ive got a set of Hooker 2460's for the engine and my full stainless exhaust too which made quite a difference to my 305 engine, so it should benefit this 350 too.

Im not really looking to go super fast so the cam was just a thought really, so if the heads arent uto the job then thats more money etc etc

86T/A_Ram_Air

an LT4 cam or similar will help and you should be able to use it on your stock heads. you should swap out valve springs which you should be doing anyway. the LT4 cam is a very nice streetable cam that was designed to be in a street car. it will make power but not crazy power. It's a good upgrade

gta_knight

hmmm, can you get one of these in a kit like the other comp cams listed above for a 350 TPI ? depends how much its all gonna cost really

MoJoe

iTrader: (5)

Using Summit as an example: LT4 hot cam only for $239 plus springs: either GM ZZ4 $8 x 16 = $128 or Comp model 981-16 springs for $60.

Or the kit with: cam, springs, shims, retainers, locks, 1.6 aluminum rockers and locking nuts for $660:

86T/A_Ram_Air

the kit is pricey yes but it comes with everything you need pretty much

gta_knight

Ive been reading through someone elses build thread and they are skipping changing the cam all together and changing the gears in the diff instead which sounds cool, i will look into that.

Anyway, i havnt touched the car for nearly 2 weeks now with working a lot in the run upto xmas, then being ill on xmas day right through until today, urgh ! hopefully pick up where i left off tomorrow.

Im thinking of sending the engine off to a shop to have it all stripped down and cleaned, re-gasketed and they will grind valves etc

gta_knight

Well i havnt touched the car since before christmas due to work and then i was ill the week after, and now im repainting my aunties Yamaha trike, hopefully i will have the last parts painted by next week then i can get back to the Trans Am

Ive been ordering stuff though my Memcal has been reprogrammed by Brian, then he kindly sent it over to SouthBay to ship with the new injectors i bought, so that should be here really soon.

And now ive just bought a new coolant bottle, new washer bottle and the 9th injectors block off kit. Bye bye money !

Tuned Performance

iTrader: (92)

Can't wait to see more progress mate, sorry the states ate all your money

gta_knight

Ha ha, yeah its a killer, all the stuff i just got from hawks had free shipping in the US....for me though, 75 dollars, then no doubt i will get stung by the tax man when they get here

Never mind, needs must !

JohnnyT/A

Hey GTA, how's your project coming along?

gta_knight

Hey, ive just started getting back into it last week Johnny. I took the engine to a shop on Monday and they phoned me on Thursday to say the engine was apart and its been checked over and its in fantastic condition, the heads are straight as anything and they also checked for hotspots etc but its all good The only thing wrong with it was the valve stem seals which will be getting changed anyway. I did get a new oil pump, flywheel and a full new gasket set though, but obviously didnt want to buy anything else until it was apart so i told him to order anything they think would be good to change now while its apart as RockAuto only sent one box of headbolts when i ordered two so they have sent the missing one out last week and should be here by Monday or Tuesday. So all being well i should be able to pick it up next week.

As for the engine bay. well its nearly ready for paint, just a few more areas that need a bit more smoothing out,



I probably would of had it all done and painted by now but after i finished painting my aunties trike my friend Simon who lives just 5 minutes along the road from me decided it was time to part his 84 TA out so ive been helping him take parts off his car, its a bit heartbreaking being a Trans Am lover but hes let the car sit for over 4 years with the intention of getting it back on the road but it wasnt to be, and the body is now really rough, as is the chassis :/

But ive bought a few bits off the car for mine so it will live on in other peoples cars i guess, but it was a beast of car which i drove a few times

RIP !

Tuned Performance

iTrader: (92)

Wow what a beauty ;( , I wanted to thank you again for having alan contact me. lmk if you need ant tech help or anything else. cant wait to see the swap done

gta_knight

No problem Brian, as soon as he said he took his EGRf of and had worries about it not running right i told him to get in touch with you straight away, lol

Yeah it was a great car, its got a 350 crate motor and rebuilt transmission, aluminum rad etc etc, so hes hoping to get good money for that. I had already commited a lot of time and money into my engine otherwise i quite possibly would of taken it

gta_knight

I made a start at removing the eibach springs from my friends 84 to go in my car, i got one of the fronts off which went quite easy, then it started pouring with rain when i started on the other side so i called it a day, hopefully i can get the remaining 3 off next weekend

gta_knight

Hi all,

Well i got the engine bay painted...sort of, during the last coat of paint my spray gun failed !! it constantly kept blowing air through so it caught me right off guard which resulted in blowing some dust into the paint and some runs. I was so pissed off ! anyway whats done is done so ive already rubbed the paint back down ready for another go with my new gun i just got today.

I got the engine back from the rebuilders the other week, they said the internals were excellent, no scoring or anything of the sort which was nice, so they fitted a new oil pump, flywheel, new headgaskets and bolts, replaced the valve stem seals then put the rest back together with new gaskets.

I got that painted with engine enamel, i just need to finish off the red bits on the TPI intake

86T/A_Ram_Air

nice work man. its coming along nicely

Javier87z28

iTrader: (1)

suscribed!

gta_knight

Engine bay painted and.........oh yeah, its in the car !

Bolted the transmission back to the engine, gave it a good clean and a couple of coats of VHT as i had some left over from doing the engine then me and my dald got them installed in about 40 minutes which was pretty good, now ive got all this week to start bolting everything back on the car, new starter, new water pump, propshaft, exhaust etc etc and i will leave the TPI setup till last.





My new Bosch 3's are yellow too, which doesnt fit with my black n red colour scheme so i VHT'd them too

gta_knight

Fuel rail is on, with adjustable regulator and injectors from South Bay



Then tonight i started putting the intake on and im really happy with the colours now i can see it together and on the block.



Only thing is i cant bolt the intake down at the minute as the adjustable bolt that sticks out of the fuel pressure regulator is hitting on the underside, i could turn it more to tighten it but i dont want to over tighten it as the intructions say turn the nut until it makes contact with the disc, then one full turn, and thats about where it is now :/

gta_knight

Been a while since i checked in here, tonight was a big step, i fired the engine for the first time ! it started first time no problem, it ran but felt like it was gonna cut out unless i reved it a bit, then the revs came down slowly on their own.

Bearing in mind the only thing i checked before starting it was the TPS, so the timing is probably off, i will have to re-learn the IAC and ive also got a couple of vac lines that need plugged after deleting things.

Its so weird as yes its my car, but its a different engine etc so i dont know any of its noises or anything now !

Im not sure about the tapping noise though, i cranked it over first for a bit with the coil unplugged to get the oil flowing around a bit.

1991sleeper

iTrader: (-3)

Is this a hydraulic roller or flat tappet can and lifters ?

91' bird 305 TBI T-5, trick flow 175 cc heads, 4.10 gears, lots of suspension upgrades. 24mpg @ 2500rpm hwy. 8.80@ 84mph 1/8th on street tires... 8.000's soon

gta_knight

It will be the stock hydraulic lifters. I think i need to take the valve covers off tomorrow and check the valve lash

gta_knight

Ive spoke to the engine place that rebuilt the engine and he thinks it might just be the valve lash that needs adjusted, which they have offered to come to mine and do it for me as it should of been all good when it left their place.

Im hoping thats all it is and nothing else otherwise im never going to get to drive it this summer

gta_knight

well the engine guy came to mine today and he adjusted all the valves as per my factory service manual, put it back together and i fired it up and although the engine isnt idling, its surging up and down, i could tell the actual engine sounded nice and smooth now so fingers crossed thats one more big hurdle out of the way.

So the short time we let it run i know i need to adjust the fuel pressure as it was just over 60psi, so i need that at around 45 ?

then check the timing, reset the IAC, ive already set the TPS but i will check it again and then if it doesnt run good after that..............burn it to the ground i think

Oh yeah, as ive deleted my AC the fuel pipes looked rather untidy just sort of floating in mid air, and i also needed rubber hose in order to fit my pressure gauge inline, so i local firm made me some nice tidy looking fuel hoses so i could fit my gauge. I might still make a bracket to held them secure incase the flap around while im driving

MoJoe

iTrader: (5)

Fuel pressure is 45-ish psi, or 43?, with the vacuum line unplugged.

You can use the 88-92, serpentine style fuel lines. They don't stick out nearly as far than the -87 fuel lines... I google'd 88 camaro tpi fuel lines.

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/engi...0055875-a.html

http://www.ebay.com/itm/like/371061382960?lpid=82
The feed line is still available NOS... http://www.ebay.com/itm/like/360473889671?lpid=82